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Arrow 1983

If the Canucks Can't move Eriksson look for them to buy out these 2 players......And some other thoughts

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I didn't read after Ferland - buying out a "healthy" Ferky is not only rude, it doesn't make sense.

They signed Ferland knowing everything that came along with him. It's the teams obligation to support and care for the players.

The ethics are way too awful to even consider on so many levels. 

If he can actually get healthy he's an upgrade on Pearson, if he can't continue to play he he's not taking up any cap space.

 

I just found the thought of buying out Ferland disgusting and responded to that only. Sorry if it's been addressed.

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4 minutes ago, mll said:

 

Bettman this week (2nd tweet):

 

I guess I'm not as wrong but still wrong 

 

At least 50% still a big number 

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25 minutes ago, luckylager said:

I didn't read after Ferland - buying out a "healthy" Ferky is not only rude, it doesn't make sense.

They signed Ferland knowing everything that came along with him. It's the teams obligation to support and care for the players.

The ethics are way too awful to even consider on so many levels. 

If he can actually get healthy he's an upgrade on Pearson, if he can't continue to play he he's not taking up any cap space.

 

I just found the thought of buying out Ferland disgusting and responded to that only. Sorry if it's been addressed.

buyouts are a reality of the game nothing disgusting about it he still would receive 67 % of monies owed to him

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2 hours ago, mll said:

The buyout period opens on 25 September and will close on 8 October - 1 day before the opening of free agency.

 

It's not possible to buy out injured players and Ferland might still be considered injured.  

Ferland can be put on LTIR or maybe see him retiring before concussion issues go any further and affect him worse for life.. if that's the case I'd rather him retire, it was worth a try.. 

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2 hours ago, Arrow 1983 said:

I hope Eriksson retires to however, that said I still would buyout Ferland and Roussel if no other alterative was remaining and here is why

The Canucks would still be holding 6.5mill after next season if you can not trade them this season and it cost them a higher cap hit if they where to buy them out after next season. Getting rid of both plus Eriksson gives the Canucks even more flexibility after next season and truly this is all about next season. Benn means nothing to me he is gone after next season so is Sutter. I would never argue with anyone if you can trade Roussel or even Ferland and it cost the Canucks nothing then absolutely do it. But not at the cost of picks or prospects.

There's no reason to buyout Ferland. Its likely that he will just stay on LTIR for the rest of his contract.

 

Roussel adds more to this team than most people realize or want to admit. You need someone who stirs things up.

 

Eriksson is either going to agree to mutually terminate his contract or wind up sent to AHL for the remainder of his contract. We won't buy him out, doesn't save us enough, at least not this summer.

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6 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

There's no reason to buyout Ferland. Its likely that he will just stay on LTIR for the rest of his contract.

 

Roussel adds more to this team than most people realize or want to admit. You need someone who stirs things up.

 

Eriksson is either going to agree to mutually terminate his contract or wind up sent to AHL for the remainder of his contract. We won't buy him out, doesn't save us enough, at least not this summer.

lol eriksson is not going to mutually terminate his contract nor is he going to play in the AHL lol. with limited cap space... if we fail to re-sign toffoli.. and let virtanen be traded or walk.. you really think Green is going to go with a forward group of Kole Lind or Mackewen which lack nhl experience the entire season? even hoglander.. none of them are going to be playing the full season.. especially with a condense schedule. Eriksson will be rotated in and out of the lineup due to the compressed schedule.. so you guys can keep dreaming about Eriksson mutually terminating or going to the AHL lol

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1 minute ago, wai_lai416 said:

lol eriksson is not going to mutually terminate his contract nor is he going to play in the AHL lol. with limited cap space... if we fail to re-sign toffoli.. and let virtanen be traded or walk.. you really think Green is going to go with a forward group of Kole Lind or Mackewen which lack nhl experience the entire season? even hoglander.. none of them are going to be playing the full season.. especially with a condense schedule. Eriksson will be rotated in and out of the lineup due to the compressed schedule.. so you guys can keep dreaming about Eriksson mutually terminating or going to the AHL lol

This year, they will demote him if he's not able to perform and stay with the rest of the group.

 

If he's sent to the AHL, there's a strong possibility that he will refuse to report. He came to Vancouver because he wanted stability for his kids in school. Winding up in the AHL does not provide what he wanted here.

 

I'm not saying this is absolutely going to happen, but I think the Canucks will play hardball with him this year. He's only owed 1 million this year and 4 million next. Don't be surprised if Canucks grant his agent full right to not only find a trading partner, but to also explore what he could get in a new contract from another team as a stable / dependable defensive forward. If its in the 1.5 million range, he may choose that option as opposed to being stuck in the AHL for the rest of his career.

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3 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

This year, they will demote him if he's not able to perform and stay with the rest of the group.

 

If he's sent to the AHL, there's a strong possibility that he will refuse to report. He came to Vancouver because he wanted stability for his kids in school. Winding up in the AHL does not provide what he wanted here.

 

I'm not saying this is absolutely going to happen, but I think the Canucks will play hardball with him this year. He's only owed 1 million this year and 4 million next. Don't be surprised if Canucks grant his agent full right to not only find a trading partner, but to also explore what he could get in a new contract from another team as a stable / dependable defensive forward. If its in the 1.5 million range, he may choose that option as opposed to being stuck in the AHL for the rest of his career.

lol so who's replacing him? virtanen is most likely traded.. toffoli who knows.. ferland may or may not play again.. sutter and rousell are injury prone.. the bottom 6 have more holes than swiss cheese going into next season. Hoglander is not a bottom 6 player plugging him in there for the sake of filling a hole is just gonna ruin the kids development. kole Lind couldn't beat out Eriksson in the play in training camp i don't see him beating him out next season either. like it or not he's going to be the 13th foward and he's far more effective in a defensive role than any of the AHL options.

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Edited by mll

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Edited by mll

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7 hours ago, Arrow 1983 said:

I have search and I have not been able to find out if there is a new buyout period for this season. As the league was suspended during the original buyout period I would assume that there will be a new one prior to the NHL draft. If I'm right I believe they could or should buy out Ferland and Roussel and I am positive that this sounds crazy at first glance so let me explain.

 

Ferland (cap hit 3.50mill) has 3 years remaining and is due no bonuses in those 3 years and has been paid 4.5mill in the first season. He is owed 9.5 million of 14million contract. If he where to be bought out this year it would be spread out over 6 years for a total of 6.333 million. This year would cost the Canucks 1.5555 million instead of 3.5mill on the cap and next year would only cost them .805mill on the cap the year they have to re-sign Hughes and Pettersson. After those two seasons they get Eriksson Luongo cap hits 9mil+ off the books and owe Ferlend 1.055mill on the cap over the next 4 seasons.

 

Roussel (cap hit 3.0mill) has 2 years remaining and is due no signing. He is owed 4.4mill. If bought out this year 2.9333mill would be spread out over 4 seasons. This season cap hit would be 1.233mill the next season after 1.833mill and the next 2 season would be .733mill.

 

So what does it all add up to, this seasons total for the 2 players would be 2.788 million instead of 6.5mill a savings of 3.712mill. Next season saving (Hughes and Pettersson re-sighing year) 2.638mill a savings of 3.862 mill. Then 2 years of 1.788mill a cap cost of 1.788 and 2 years at 1.055mill a cap cost of 1.055mill. Taking into account that Spooner's cap hit of 1.033mill comes off at the end of this coming next season and Eriksson and Luongo's come off the season after this scenario doesn't look as crazy as it did at the start of the post IMO.

 

What I think the team Should look like next season and Why

 

Forwards

 

Miller 5.25  Pettersson 0.925 Toffoli 5.25 (4-6 years)

Pearson 3.75  Horvat 5.50 Boeser 5.875

 

Bottom six in any possible order

Hoglander 0.891 (Eriksson AHL if Hoglander wins a spot (Eriksson NHL salary 4.925)) Gaudette 1.250 (2 years ?) Virtanen 2.75 (2 years ?)

Motte .975 (2-3 years)   Beagle 3.00  Sutter 4.375

MacEwen .925 (1-2 years)

 

Defence

 

Hughes 0.916  Tanev 5.00 (4-5 years)

Edler 6.0  Myers 6.00

Benn 2.00 and 2 of (Juolevi 0.863 Rafferty 0.700 Rathbone 0.925)

 

Goalies

 

Demko 1.050

Crawford 2.250 (2 years) Meets expansion draft requirement 

 

Other Cap hits

 

Baertschi  NHL cap hit 2.291

 

Luongo cap recovery 3.035

 

Buy outs 

Spooner 1.033

Ferland  1.555

Roussel  1.233

 

Cap overages from bonuses 1.700

 

Total Cap Hit  81,270,767

Cap Space 229,233

 

Not much of a change from last season other then the losses of Marky and Stecher and in coming of Hoglander if he can make the team and 2 rookie dmen. Some might ask why is this ok. My response is simple first, flat cap most of the competitive teams are in Cap trouble and will not be as good as they where this year due to it and if you disagree with this at least I can not see them getting better. Second, I would consider Toffoli an addition this coming season and one that I would consider a better addition then some other UFA as we already can see he has chemistry with the rest of the team.

 

Third, a lot will disagree with me about the loss of Marky but the truth is he was going to be hard to re-sign prior to covid and I would say almost impossible to re-sign now without dismantle more of the current team. Furthermore, this decision is going to have to be made now or next season with the expansion draft coming. Demkos next contract is most likely to be a better cap hit then Markys this just makes it easier to decide now with the flat cap. Plus why dismantle more of the team If down the road Marky is the one they are going to get rid of anyways. It really comes down to this if they are going to sign Marky Benning really has to trade Demko now well his stock is high because as Markys back-up his stock will just start to decrease. 

 

Forth and most important, to re-sign Hughes and Pettersson the Canucks are going to have to have cheap options on defense and forward we need to keep introducing young players into the lineup and having 2 of Juolevi, Rafferty, or Rathbone make the team as 6th and 7th defensemen gives them a spot to play and the experience in the NHL they need and the 3rd one out is the first call up. Hughes is the clear predecessor to Edler but this team needs a 2nd pairing left hand Defenseman after next season. On forward we can slot Holglander in on the left side, the Canucks need to do this so when Pearson is lost after next season we have someone to fill that left wing spot.

 

The importance to all this is to insure the rebuild stays on track Benning has drafted well. Now is the time to slot guys in get them experience and let older and more expensive vets go. This year it is Marky next year it will be Edler, Sutter and Pearson. This year coming in will be Juolevi, Rafferty, Rathbone hopefully (1-2 of these guys can stick) on forward Hoglander next year Podkolzin, year after Dipietro. They sign Tanev and Toffoli because they fill roles now that no one else can.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

gross crawford is a sieve and u want a injury prone tanev for 5 more yrsno thanks 

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Ferland is a guy who could carry a $3.5M cap hit for 3 years, that teams might not have to pay (salary on LTIR covered by insurance). He actually may be an asset in this economic climate, if/when he’s willing to be traded.

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11 hours ago, oldnews said:

I'd put those at about option(s) #?   8?  13?  I dunno - way down the list of preferred alternatives imo.

 

I'd look at moving players long before buyouts.  my 2 c.

its not a great option, but its there, if the cash flow works better for the next two years. Putting Loui in Utica, buying out Bear and Sutter opens up 4.71 is cap space for next season. but it also eats 2.4 mil two season from now. If Edler isn't re-signing then they can absorb that even with Petey and Quinn's new deals. 

 

So maybe thats a better decision to spread out some salary depending on what happens between now and Oct. 8th. 

 

If magic agent JP Barry can convince Loui to terminate his deal or find a sucker... er, i mean a willing team, for Loui then things get exciting for Oct 9th since theoretically with the Sutter and Baer buyouts you could go up  8 mil for a new player in free agency and not have to worry about the -2.4 mil impact of the buyouts. 

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4 hours ago, D-Money said:

Ferland is a guy who could carry a $3.5M cap hit for 3 years, that teams might not have to pay (salary on LTIR covered by insurance). He actually may be an asset in this economic climate, if/when he’s willing to be traded.

He’s a guy that actually wants to play which negates that LITR attractiveness option to a prospective team to a degree (depending on the diagnosis from the doctor).

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5 hours ago, D-Money said:

Ferland is a guy who could carry a $3.5M cap hit for 3 years, that teams might not have to pay (salary on LTIR covered by insurance). He actually may be an asset in this economic climate, if/when he’s willing to be traded.

He has a NMC clause this year so would have to agree to any trade, next year it is the NTC to deal with.  He wants to return to play still reportedly, so isn't one of those phantom medically retired guys who can't officially retire so they can keep getting paid their insurance.

If he decides to hang up his skates, then it would have to be determined whether his contract is actually insured or not.  Not all of them are, and there was an issue a few years ago where players with concussion histories couldn't get their contracts insured... or it was prohibitively expensive to do so.  Unless that was resolved, I can't see any insurance company having insured Ferland's contract due to his pre-existing concussion issues.

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No way the Canucks should sign Tavev for 4-5 more years.  We already have Edler on defense as a traffic cone.  Go with the youth, speed and grit.  

How many players can a team buyout in a season?  One?

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Would not buy out Roussel. He single handedly dragged our young team along with him into a dog fight this playoffs. Without that I don't know if the kids learn what it takes to win. 

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Cred to the OP for opening the buyout conversation.

 

I agree with @oldnews that the buyout is down the list for options.  

 

Remember that burying a player in the minors saves $1.025 off the cap so unless you're saving that, it's a non-starter.  Who then is a candidate?

 

                  Present      Buyout cap hit..........................................

                  Cap            Yr 1        2         3          4          5          6

Baertschi  (1) 3.36       1.76     800

Beagle      (2) 3.0         1.36     2.36     566      566

Benn         (1) 2.0         933      533

Eriksson    (2) 6.0        5.66     3.66      666     666

Ferland      (3) 3.5        1.55     805      1.8      1.05      1.05     1.05

Pearson    (1) 3.75       1.18     1.28

Roussel     (2) 3.0        1.23     1.83     733      733

Sutter        (1) 4.375     2.04     1.16

 

I think that Pearson  is the best candidate at a savings of 2.595 in year 1 but he is marketable and they would like to keep him

The next best and most likely would be Sutter at a savings of 2.335

 

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