2021 NHL Entry Draft

[Canuck Surfer]

9 hours ago, Wolfgang Durst said:

 

Regarding the ongoing discussion about Lysell I am going to fully trust Shane Malloy, author of the art of scouting. Dhali asked Malloy about Lysell at the 7:03 minute mark in this video. Anyway Canucks can pick another player who plays an inconsistent game like Jake Virtanen and they can hope for a time span of several years that he finally become consistent, but this hasn't happen with Jake and this won't happen with Lysell.

 

 

I have no doubt, Naa Na Naa, that Shane knows much more than most people about scouting & prospects. Wrote a book, has a radio show...

 

But he is not a scout? Does not travel to Europe on behalf of teams. Where Mackenzie's list  has Lysell is 12; a reflection of rankings from ten pro scouts working for NHL teams.  Right in our wheelhouse. Shane says he has him lower than actual scouts rank Lysell? Who sit in on games,, and practices, and informal workouts of Swedish players.  Where Shane might have access to OHL and Q players who played a hand full of games this year. 

 

Shane says he does not work hard enough?

 

Lysell, who won a spot on an SHL team, earned minutes and shifts against trained professional athletes 5 and ten years older than him at 17. I doubt those SHL coaches gave him shifts if he was not busting his @ss!! 

 

This is a thoroughbred athlete. Who is faster, slicker, has more endurance, agility than all but a select few guys in the draft. Than many, even most NHL players. If you want a chip and chase, NA style battler for your 3rd line. No doubt Lysell is not Shane's your man.  If you want a guy who can fly up the ice, keep pace & handle passes with Nate Mackinnon Kucherov Brad Marchand Elias Pettersson?  Lysell is a guy an NHL coach would deploy with such players!

  

[HighOnHockey]

6 hours ago, Off_The_Schneid! said:

I don’t think that Detroit makes the trade if they are targeting Walstedt because SanJose would select before 9th. 

 

Which works out perfectly for us, the fear of SanJose picking Walstedt will force Detroit to take there guy at 6 giving us more options at 9 

 

 

On top top of that 

Theres always it least one head scratcher pick in the top ten, I’m predicting Lysell goes before our pick as the one reach from a team. Maybe SanJose. It’s proven that work ethic goes a long way in player development 

 

Powers- Buffalo

Beniers- Seattle

Clarke-Anaheim

Hughes- New Jersey

Mctavish- Columbus

Walstedt- Detroit 

Lysell- Sanjose

Edvinsson- LA

 

Van- Eklund, Guenther, Johnson, 

 

keep the pick, going to get a good player 

 

 

 

 

San Jose is the one team I can't imagine taking Wallstedt (or Cossa). In more than 20 years with the Sharks, Doug Wilson has never taken a goalie earlier than 83rd overall (Timo Pielmeier, 2007).

 

One thing that might come into play that I haven't seen anybody mention: the fact that there are two elite, bluechip goalies in the first round will mean some teams who may have been desperate to beat other teams to pick a goalie, may be a little less desperate. Detroit is a great example - they are sitting with picks 22, 37, 47, 51, 69. Loaded with trade ammunition and in perfect position to move up to the mid-to-late teens to take one of the goalies.

 

Also, on your point about "always one head scratcher in the top ten". More often than not the reason teams will reach like that is because it is a center or defenseman with size.

[Googlie]

Skip to the 9 minute mark unless you are interested in Cam's background with Dobber and Elite Prospects

 

 

[JustABandwagoner]

1 hour ago, Beary Sweet said:

I’m curious to see who we’re targeting with our 2nd rounder. Really interested in Cossa if he’s somehow still available at our pick.

No way will he be there for our 2nd round pick. IMPOSSIBLE. If he was in the 2nd round, BUF or another team will snag him up with a super super early 2nd round pick.

[zimmy]

4 hours ago, 4petesake said:

You could be right, the article was behind a pay but the title said mock draft.

I found his rankings quite interesting particularly with Kent Johnson taking the second spot. In all the mocks I’ve seen there have been almost no prognostications with Johnson going as high as two. Such a variance of opinion with this draft. 

[JustABandwagoner]

DAMNN the NBA draft lottery has FOUR lottery picks while NHL only has 2 :O 

[Guest]

5 minutes ago, DontMessMe said:

DAMNN the NBA draft lottery has FOUR lottery picks while NHL only has 2 :O 

Basketball players getting drafted are more of a sure thing.  You'll often see 19 and 20 year olds stepping in and dominating from the get-go.  Hockey players take a lot longer to develop and aren't as sure of a thing.  

 

I feel that for these reasons tanking is more of a thing in the NBA then in the NHL, especially when you have a special talent coming up in the draft.  

 

Just a couple of subtle differences.  

[HighOnHockey]

7 hours ago, HKSR said:

If any GM is gonna go off the board with a head scratcher (but usually pans out) is good ol Jarmo in Columbus.  He'll end up picking Aatu Raty or something lol

 

Edit:  Just wanted to see how off the board he usually goes...

 

2020 - 21st OA - Yegor Chinakhov (not even ranked in the Top 93 on Bob McKenzie's list lol)

2019 - No 1st round pick

2018 - 18th OA - Liam Foudy (ranked 29 on Bob McKenzie's list)

2017 - No 1st round pick

2016 - 3rd OA - Pierre Luc-Dubois (good choice in hindsight, but over Puulujarvi back then was a shocker)

 

Anyways, go Jarmo!!  There's a guy ranked 92 on Bob McKenzie's list called Riley Kidney!  Cool name!  Pick him Jarmo!

 

Yeah I'm a huge Kekalainen fan since his days with Ottawa. If there' one thing about Jarmo is he has his ear to the ground in Europe more than any other GM in the league. They're one of the only teams in the league whose head scout is European. Only other one off the top of my head is Seattle now with Robert Kron, although I feel like there may be one or two others. You mentioned them taking Chinakhov super early after he got off to a ridiculously hot start in KHL (when the draft was in October). Bringing over Mrzlikins with no AHL was another rare move. Finding Texier out of France is looking like a masterpiece. But yeah, very new school. He has no time for traditionalism. But Wersenski was a pretty vanilla pick. Maybe he's getting bolder with time. Dubois and Chinakhov were guys who had been flying up the rankings close to the draft though, so Raty doesn't fit the M.O. My best guess is Mason McTavish. But given how wide open this draft looks to be, I wonder just how far "off the board" he might actually go. Heimosalmi? Chibrikov?

 

I do think one way or another there's going to be some major shocks early on in this draft in general. I'm betting a lot more than people here are expecting. Cossa, Sillinger, Svechkov, Coronato are a few names I could imagine going top ten.

[hammertime]

38 minutes ago, HighOnHockey said:

 I wonder just how far "off the board" he might actually go. Heimosalmi? Chibrikov?

 

I do think one way or another there's going to be some major shocks early on in this draft in general. I'm betting a lot more than people here are expecting. Cossa, Sillinger, Svechkov, Coronato are a few names I could imagine going top ten.

Simon Robertson could also be a sleeper. 

[J.I.A.H.N]

9 hours ago, NUCKER67 said:

BUF - Power

SEA - Beniers

ANA - Clarke

NJ - Eklund

CBJ - Raty (then all hell breaks loose...)

DET - Wallstedt

SJ - McTavish

LA - Cossa

VAN - Lysell

 

(with Guenther, Hughes, Edvinsson and Johnson still on the table)  

 

Benning:  Daaaah, we needed more skill in our Top 6 to play with Petey and Brock, and uhhhh, we still felt we could get real good players in later rounds

I am not sure why people are taking Clarke 3rd when they have Drysdale, and no LHD, so I see one of Hughes or Edvinsson being picked by Anaheim 

I see a much better chance of NJ taking Clarke to go with Smith, but is the BPA at 4? With Eklund, Guenther, and one of Hughes and Edvinsson still on the board?

Same goes for Columbus?

[Sean Monahan]

4 hours ago, HighOnHockey said:

San Jose is the one team I can't imagine taking Wallstedt (or Cossa). In more than 20 years with the Sharks, Doug Wilson has never taken a goalie earlier than 83rd overall (Timo Pielmeier, 2007).

 

 

In that same time frame they’ve also drafted only two NHL goalies- Greiss in ‘04 and Stalock in ‘05. 

[HighOnHockey]

34 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

I am not sure why people are taking Clarke 3rd when they have Drysdale, and no LHD, so I see one of Hughes or Edvinsson being picked by Anaheim 

I see a much better chance of NJ taking Clarke to go with Smith, but is the BPA at 4? With Eklund, Guenther, and one of Hughes and Edvinsson still on the board?

Same goes for Columbus?

If there is any team that knows the value of having two elite defensemen play on different pairs so that one or the other is on the ice 50-55 minutes a game, it would have to be Anaheim. Pronger and Niedermayer, both left shots. Brian Burke was GM, but Bob Murray was his AGM for both of those acquisitions.

 

P.S.: also a perfect example of a team that knows as well as anyone that positional needs can be filled by trade and free agency, as long as you draft for the best value.

Edited June 23, 2021 by HighOnHockey

[HockeyHarry]

if any of the top 8 teams are thinking of drafting goalie Wallstedt, I believe they will trade down to do so. They will get their goalie and more. 

 

that being said could Canucks be the team that trades up? Number 9 pick Wallstedt will still be available. So how high could Canucks move up and what would be the cost? Detroit or Sharks for example ,people here saying they need a Goalie. Canucks could move up to 6 or 7. Or it could be another Team trading up to 6 or 7.

 

All in All i don’t see a Goalie being picked ahead of Canucks 1st pick.

[204CanucksFan]

7 hours ago, HockeyHarry said:

if any of the top 8 teams are thinking of drafting goalie Wallstedt, I believe they will trade down to do so. They will get their goalie and more. 

 

that being said could Canucks be the team that trades up? Number 9 pick Wallstedt will still be available. So how high could Canucks move up and what would be the cost? Detroit or Sharks for example ,people here saying they need a Goalie. Canucks could move up to 6 or 7. Or it could be another Team trading up to 6 or 7.

 

All in All i don’t see a Goalie being picked ahead of Canucks 1st pick.

I'm not so sure. Not many teams are willing to trade down and hope that their guy is still there anymore, especially early in the first round. For most GMs the philosophy has become, if your guy is there and you like him just take him with the pick instead of risking falling back and losing him and having to take someone much further down on your board.

 

Just look at 2019, instead of trading back and acquiring more assets, Yzerman used the 6th pick to draft Seider, who absolutely no one had as a top 10 pick, he was on everyone's list as a mid to late first rounder (he was also the guy I desperately wanted Vancouver to pick but I didn't expect Podkolzin to still be there at 10). Yzerman knew that at the top of the draft it's best to just grab the guy you think is the best prospect instead of dropping and hoping. 

 

I can definitely see Wallstedt going top 10 especially after the last 2 drafts and how well the top goalies in those years, Knight and Askarov, did in their draft years and after. Knight is already playing in Florida and could very well take the starters role from Bobrovsky as early as next season and Askarov dominated the KHL this season. Granted, neither of these goalies were top 10 picks but I think that it is going to show teams that goalies are less of an enigma than they used to be and teams are going to be less gun shy with using top picks to get the best goalie in the draft. Plus, as Cam Robinson mentioned in the video Googlie posted a page or two ago, all four starting goalies left in the playoffs right now are 1st round picks including a 1st and a 5th overall.

[BPA]

I'm sure Wallstedt will be a priority pick for some teams.  You can't go far without a true #1.

 

Just look at EDM and TO for example. 

[Alflives]

13 minutes ago, BPA said:

I'm sure Wallstedt will be a priority pick for some teams.  You can't go far without a true #1.

 

Just look at EDM and TO for example. 

There will be teams (perhaps?) trying to trade up to get this goalie.  

[Nucker 67]

Wallstedt will be gone early, and I can also see Cossa going in the Top 20. This isn't a great Draft for the skaters really, there are a few really good prospects who could have great NHL careers, but I think only a hand full.  

 

Wallstedt and Cossa will be starters in the NHL one day, and look what Price is doing for MTL. We might even see something crazy where both goalies go in the Top 10. 

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, 204CanucksFan said:

Just look at 2019, instead of trading back and acquiring more assets, Yzerman used the 6th pick to draft Seider, who absolutely no one had as a top 10 pick, he was on everyone's list as a mid to late first rounder (he was also the guy I desperately wanted Vancouver to pick .

Pretty sure Hockey Prospects had him in their top 10 (as did I). As apparently did Detroit (and likely at least a few other NHL teams).

 

I think that just illustrates that actual team lists can vary greatly from scouting services, not that teams won't necessarily move down. This is one of many reasons that I think it's hilarious how adamantly some will people argue about 'consensus BPA!'.

 

I for one would LOVE it if Clarke's still available at 6, for the Canucks to seriously kick tires at moving up to Detroit's pick. Shouldn't be THAT cost prohibitive to move from 9 to 6 and we get our right D prospect.

[204CanucksFan]

2 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Pretty sure Hockey Prospects had him in their top 10 (as did I). As apparently did Detroit (and likely at least a few other NHL teams).

 

I think that just illustrates that actual team lists can vary greatly from scouting services, not that teams won't necessarily move down. This is one of many reasons that I think it's hilarious how adamantly some will people argue about 'consensus BPA!'.

 

I for one would LOVE it if Clarke's still available at 6, for the Canucks to seriously kick tires at moving up to Detroit's pick. Shouldn't be THAT cost prohibitive to move from 9 to 6 and we get our right D prospect.

The cost to move from 9 to 6 will be 40OA at the absolute minimum, probably have to add another late pick or B prospect on top of that. In 2019 it cost Arizona the 14th and 45th to move up to 11th.

[J.I.A.H.N]

11 hours ago, HighOnHockey said:

If there is any team that knows the value of having two elite defensemen play on different pairs so that one or the other is on the ice 50-55 minutes a game, it would have to be Anaheim. Pronger and Niedermayer, both left shots. Brian Burke was GM, but Bob Murray was his AGM for both of those acquisitions.

 

P.S.: also a perfect example of a team that knows as well as anyone that positional needs can be filled by trade and free agency, as long as you draft for the best value.

Hi HOH

 

Of Course there are always reasons, and of course it is BPA

 

But this is a flat draft, where there are 3 or 4 players who all could be considered for #3 OA

 

Aka..........Clarke, Guenther, Eklund, Edvinsson and Hughes could all be a candidate for #3

 

But where nothing is certain, and we are on a forum, where most look at the various draft lists

 

I find it silly to have Anaheim pick another RHD.......not that it could not happen, because it could

 

But I find it not very likely.........but I am just expressing an opinion.

 

As I have said repeatedly, this is a flat draft............meaning that there are multiple choices in certain tiers

 

In this case as, I have already spelled out in another thread

 

the tiers as follows

 

1. Power and Beniers

2. Clarke, Guenther, Eklund, Edvinsson and Hughes

3. Wallstedt, Johnson, and McTavish

 

I actually think that is changed somewhat, but the point is the same