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@hammertime

 

I think we have to ditch the Hughes bro storyline in the evaluation of Luke.

 

That's not saying we shouldn't draft him, he'll probably be in our range, just that we should imagine his name is Joe Smith when making an evaluation on if he's the best player. 

 

I'm curious about Lambos, seen him talked about as a minute muncher, but bust potential? Is he a 'safe' player in the sense of limited upside or more of a boom/bust type?

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35 minutes ago, Smashian Kassian said:

@hammertime

 

I think we have to ditch the Hughes bro storyline in the evaluation of Luke.

 

That's not saying we shouldn't draft him, he'll probably be in our range, just that we should imagine his name is Joe Smith when making an evaluation on if he's the best player. 

 

I'm curious about Lambos, seen him talked about as a minute muncher, but bust potential? Is he a 'safe' player in the sense of limited upside or more of a boom/bust type?

I see Lambo as a safe pick in the same light as Juolevi was. Thats not throwing shade or light at either player. He makes good players great but himself doesn't carry play enough for me to consider him great. He could be a good top 6 or a great top 4 either way I think he will be a player  I'm doubtful of him having franchise D upside  as Luke, Power and Edvinsson do. I also think there is more risk with those players. 

 

Storylines are great. also in this case having a 1 2 punch of these 2 kids on the ice 45 mins a night is probably too hot for most teams to contain. unless you're the 90's devils. 

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4 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said:

@hammertime

 

I think we have to ditch the Hughes bro storyline in the evaluation of Luke.

 

That's not saying we shouldn't draft him, he'll probably be in our range, just that we should imagine his name is Joe Smith when making an evaluation on if he's the best player. 

 

I'm curious about Lambos, seen him talked about as a minute muncher, but bust potential? Is he a 'safe' player in the sense of limited upside or more of a boom/bust type?

 

You're absolutely right about Hughes. Should be a given.

 

Like you say, "safe pick" seems to be the general opinion on Lambos. But I don't think we need to oversimplify things so much.

 

The idea that prospects are either "boom/bust" or "safe but limited upside" has some value to it, but it's an oversimplification. I would assume the idea of Lambos being "safe" comes mainly from the fact that he's an excellent defensive shutdown defenseman. There are some similarities to Braden Schneider from last year's draft, who I saw play quite a bit, including in person a few times, and I never thought was a first round talent. He was arguably the best defensive defenseman in the draft for sure, and he was even pretty good in the offensive zone. But he was terrible with the puck under pressure. So I mean, safe? Maybe. He'll almost certainly be an NHL defenseman in some capacity, but I believe he'll be the kind of guy that coaches love because he kills penalties and does all the right things away from the puck, but fans are gonna hate him because he's always turning over the puck. Cody Ceci was a perfect example of this in Ottawa.

 

But I don't believe it is pressure that Lambos struggles with. Honestly I haven't quite figured out what it is. He just makes bad or questionable decisions with some regularity, both with and without the puck. The big question - and this is what the NHL scouts have to decide - is whether the problem is with his hockey IQ, or if he was just a young defenseman playing huge minutes against top CHL players and was trying to do way too much. It is worth noting that most of my viewings on him were from last year in CHL and at U17 Challenge. I have seen him twice this year in Sarja though, and the bad decisions seem far less frequent, but he's a year older in a somewhat significantly weaker league.

 

And the other reason I disagree with the "safe but limited upside" narrative on him is... I think his upside is tremendous, mainly defensively, but he's also very good offensively. I see his upside as a workhorse who plays 23-26 minutes a game, gets all the matches against top lines, top PK, an option for the PP, and puts up 30-40 points a year, maybe even more in his prime. But again, it all comes back to decision-making and hockey IQ with him.

 

I'd be interested to hear other opinions though.

 

Edit: after reading HammerTime's post, I can see what he means, where limited upside here just means as an absolute ceiling he's probably not a franchise defenseman, which I can basically agree with.

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I watched a couple more games from Michigan. I'm gradually liking Owen Power more and more. Noticing a bit more physicality from him. Still not what you'd like to see from a guy his size, but I guess to be fair he's 18 in a league of 21 and 22 year old men. Still a little worried about the quickness and skating agility, but I guess that's pretty normal for a guy this size. He's not the skater that Byfield is, but I like Power's quickness in reaction time better. Power's stick skills are kinda meh, but he really knows how to use his body to protect the puck, and once he gains steam coming through the neutral zone it is really tough to knock him off the puck. Shows some impressive vision at times. I'm becoming more impressed with his defending, but still not blown away; has a good stick and uses his reach well.

Noticed a couple of pretty silly plays with the puck by Kent Johnson. I still like him better than I did Perfetti, but then he's also a season older than Perfetti was so it's tough to say. But even assuming they're about even, Johnson should go earlier since it's a bit weaker a draft class.

Beniers just still doing Beniers. But I remember noticing in one of my first viewing on him last season that he tried to spin back on a guy in the corner and blew a tire. It happened again one of these last games. Might be something to keep an eye on, but most of the time his edges look pretty slick. Would be nice to see a little more creativity and/or stick skills from him though.

I also caught another game from Brandt Clarke, and the stream was perfect for once. Man oh man, he's been starting to put up numbers, and you can really see his confidence coming along and he's starting to make some plays. First couple games I saw him with Zamky he looked pretty solid, but you'd never know he was anything special. The most impressive thing with Clarke as far as NHL potential is that based on his play in junior we know he has really high end skill, but then you see him play pro and you'd barely know it since he respects the competition and he looks like just such a smart, safe, responsible player. But this last game I saw he's starting to stand out. And he's picking his spots wonderfully - still the safe, responsible D first, but makes great plays when they're available.
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12 hours ago, HighOnHockey said:
I watched a couple more games from Michigan. I'm gradually liking Owen Power more and more. Noticing a bit more physicality from him. Still not what you'd like to see from a guy his size, but I guess to be fair he's 18 in a league of 21 and 22 year old men. Still a little worried about the quickness and skating agility, but I guess that's pretty normal for a guy this size. He's not the skater that Byfield is, but I like Power's quickness in reaction time better. Power's stick skills are kinda meh, but he really knows how to use his body to protect the puck, and once he gains steam coming through the neutral zone it is really tough to knock him off the puck. Shows some impressive vision at times. I'm becoming more impressed with his defending, but still not blown away; has a good stick and uses his reach well.

Noticed a couple of pretty silly plays with the puck by Kent Johnson. I still like him better than I did Perfetti, but then he's also a season older than Perfetti was so it's tough to say. But even assuming they're about even, Johnson should go earlier since it's a bit weaker a draft class.

Beniers just still doing Beniers. But I remember noticing in one of my first viewing on him last season that he tried to spin back on a guy in the corner and blew a tire. It happened again one of these last games. Might be something to keep an eye on, but most of the time his edges look pretty slick. Would be nice to see a little more creativity and/or stick skills from him though.

I also caught another game from Brandt Clarke, and the stream was perfect for once. Man oh man, he's been starting to put up numbers, and you can really see his confidence coming along and he's starting to make some plays. First couple games I saw him with Zamky he looked pretty solid, but you'd never know he was anything special. The most impressive thing with Clarke as far as NHL potential is that based on his play in junior we know he has really high end skill, but then you see him play pro and you'd barely know it since he respects the competition and he looks like just such a smart, safe, responsible player. But this last game I saw he's starting to stand out. And he's picking his spots wonderfully - still the safe, responsible D first, but makes great plays when they're available.

Brandt Clarke is my top target this draft. What a thought to add him to Quinn for our defensive core. He might even be able to start in the nhl next season. 

 

Hughes - Tryamkin 

Schmidt - Clarke

Juolevi - Myers

 

I'm not sure if Clarke and Quinn would be a good pairing, based on their play style. 

 

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On 2/19/2021 at 12:13 PM, KKnight said:

Brandt Clarke is my top target this draft. What a thought to add him to Quinn for our defensive core. He might even be able to start in the nhl next season. 

 

Hughes - Tryamkin 

Schmidt - Clarke

Juolevi - Myers

 

I'm not sure if Clarke and Quinn would be a good pairing, based on their play style. 

 

Clarke and Hughes would be an unbelievable pairing. I know everyone says it’s not a big deal, LHD can play the right side, blah blah. Positionally on defence it’s actually easier to play the right with a left shot along the boards. When in the offensive zone it’s a completely different  dynamic. Those 2 would have a mini cycle going on at the blue line that would cause a great amount panic to the opposition. EP, Brock shooting down low, Clarke, Hughes at the point, they can all interchange during a cycle. It would be so awesome. Right shot on the left, left on the right, up and down and around. 

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53 minutes ago, Convincing John said:

Clarke and Hughes would be an unbelievable pairing. I know everyone says it’s not a big deal, LHD can play the right side, blah blah. Positionally on defence it’s actually easier to play the right with a left shot along the boards. When in the offensive zone it’s a completely different  dynamic. Those 2 would have a mini cycle going on at the blue line that would cause a great amount panic to the opposition. EP, Brock shooting down low, Clarke, Hughes at the point, they can all interchange during a cycle. It would be so awesome. Right shot on the left, left on the right, up and down and around. 

Based on the rumours, Green prefers to play players on there designated side...

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5 hours ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Based on the rumours, Green prefers to play players on there designated side...

 Not agreeing one way or the other, but the current coach should have absolutely no bearing on your draft picks. Coaches have short shelf lives in today's NHL. Even a top five pick in this draft might not make the NHL for a year or two, and won't approach their prime for four or five. I guess since we're talking about Brandt Clarke specifically, I do think there's a pretty decent chance he could be in the NHL next year, but you're still looking at at least three years before the question comes up about playing him on the top pairing.

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Also, Clarke plays the right side. KKnight was referring to their playing style, not their position. I'm not sure I understand that either though. Perhaps he thinks Clarke is a high-risk offensive defenseman? This would be false. Clarke is highly skilled sure, but he is easily the safest, most dependable two-way defenseman in the draft.

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Clarke IMO, is the best player in this Draft, from what I've seen so far anyway. It's also impressive that, for a Canadian kid, he went to Slovakia to continue playing in a men's league and getting better. This kid will not see a second of Utica. Good size and speed, hands, hockey IQ, confidence. I don't know if there are any negatives.  

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2 hours ago, HighOnHockey said:

 Not agreeing one way or the other, but the current coach should have absolutely no bearing on your draft picks. Coaches have short shelf lives in today's NHL. Even a top five pick in this draft might not make the NHL for a year or two, and won't approach their prime for four or five. I guess since we're talking about Brandt Clarke specifically, I do think there's a pretty decent chance he could be in the NHL next year, but you're still looking at at least three years before the question comes up about playing him on the top pairing.

Good chance the Canucks will be moving on from Green based on this season (but who knows) and the next coach will be less rigid when it come to the roster - good point and I was just making a statement with the assumption that Green is signed long termed...

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Whether we look at a d man or a forward we need players with:

1.  Size.  Our current defensive star gets knocked off the puck too easily.

2.  Ability to skate with speed and power.  Every other team has forwards not afraid to go to the net or stand in front of the net without fear.

 

 

Guess Godzilla or King Kong on skates aren't available.  

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13 hours ago, Tyndall2 said:

Whether we look at a d man or a forward we need players with:

1.  Size.  Our current defensive star gets knocked off the puck too easily.

2.  Ability to skate with speed and power.  Every other team has forwards not afraid to go to the net or stand in front of the net without fear.

 

 

Guess Godzilla or King Kong on skates aren't available.  

We need a JJ Watt on our team. Has enough speed to take away time and space, while working his size in the intimidation game.  Do you really want to go through a player like that?  It was a question like that the Sedins intimated that some European players had playing against Chara. Cannot blame them. 

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On 2/14/2021 at 6:55 PM, Smashian Kassian said:

@hammertime

 

I think we have to ditch the Hughes bro storyline in the evaluation of Luke.

 

That's not saying we shouldn't draft him, he'll probably be in our range, just that we should imagine his name is Joe Smith when making an evaluation on if he's the best player. 

 

I'm curious about Lambos, seen him talked about as a minute muncher, but bust potential? Is he a 'safe' player in the sense of limited upside or more of a boom/bust type?

After the Sedins I think this market is always going to be a bit prepossessed with having a pair of brothers on the same team.

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2021 NHL Draft: Zator’s Top 64 February Rankings

February 6, 2021 by Matthew Zator

 

2021 NHL Entry Draft Rankings

 

 

First Round

1. Matt Beniers, C, Michigan Wolverines (NCAA)

2. Brandt Clarke, D, HC Nove Zamky (Slovakia) On Loan

3. Kent Johnson, C, Michigan Wolverines (NCAA)

4. Jesper Wallstedt, G, Lulea HF (SHL)

5. William Eklund, C/LW, Djurgårdens IF (SHL)

6. Owen Power, D, Michigan Wolverines (NCAA)

7. Luke Hughes, D, USNTDP Juniors (USHL)

8. Fabian Lysell, RW, Lulea HF (SHL)

9. Simon Edvinsson, D, Frolunda HC (SHL)

10. Matthew Coronato, LW, Chicago Steel (USHL)

11. Carson Lambos, D, JYP U20 (U20 SM-sarja) On Loan

12. Aatu Raty, C, Karpat (Liiga)

13. Dylan Guenther, LW, Sherwood Park Crusaders (AJHL) On Loan

14. Corson Ceulemans, D, Brooks Bandits (AJHL)

15. Prokhor Poltapov, RW, Krasnaya Armiya Moskva (MHL)

16. Chaz Lucius, C, US National U18 Team (USDP)

17. Cole Sillinger, C, Sioux Falls Stampede (USHL)

18. Brennan Othmann, LW, EHC Olten (SL) On Loan

19. Oskar Olausson, LW/RW, HV71 (SHL)

20. Francesco Pinelli, C, HDD Jesenice (Slovenia) On Loan

21. Zach Dean, C, Gatineau Olympiques (QMJH

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On 2/22/2021 at 1:15 AM, Convincing John said:

Clarke and Hughes would be an unbelievable pairing. I know everyone says it’s not a big deal, LHD can play the right side, blah blah. Positionally on defence it’s actually easier to play the right with a left shot along the boards. When in the offensive zone it’s a completely different  dynamic. Those 2 would have a mini cycle going on at the blue line that would cause a great amount panic to the opposition. EP, Brock shooting down low, Clarke, Hughes at the point, they can all interchange during a cycle. It would be so awesome. Right shot on the left, left on the right, up and down and around. 

Soooo who plays defense the forwards? Clarke will be busy trying to pull Michigans behind the net.

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*Edit deleted

 

I have come around on Brandt Clarke after further thought. This draft class has me all turned around upside down. every time i dig deeper on a player I'm changing my mind one way or another.

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