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Hang onto your hats (Proposal)


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Ok, lets look at our last 2 RFA's and what it will cost us.................Virtanen ($3 Million), Gaudette ($2,000,000)

 

Are they worth that.............the simple answer is yes

Can we afford them?..........the simple answer is no!

 

Here is the solution.

 

Trade #1 ......................................Jake Virtanen, Adam Gaudette and Loui Eriksson for NYIers 2021 - 2nd + 2021 - NJ 3rd

 

New Jersey is short on players and is generally in a youth movement. Ericksson is cheap defensive help.

 

OUT: Gaudette (2M) + Virtanen (3M) + Eriksson (6M)..........out $11,000,000

 

Now under normal circumstances, I would not advocate moving youth, however, these are not normal circumstances, and you will never see another time, where there is so much quality hanging around, nor so many teams wanting to move assets for cheap.

 

Now the second part of this is pretty basic...................................

 

Trade #2.......................................LW/C/RW Tyler Johnson + Tampa's 2022 2nd + Tampa's 2021 3rd for Future Consideration ($5,000,000 X 4)

 

Johnson plays all 3 positions, much like JT Miller. Johnson's role has diminished in the past few years, much like Millers......his buy out is approx 1,500,000 per year.

Now remember we got rid of Eriksson, and Johnson's buyout is a acceptable cost, if needed at any point. I certainly would not think we would have to buy him out  in the first or 2nd year. And he is a 40 point player, with a solid plus minus.

 

Signing: #1....................................Travis Hamonic 3 years @ $2,500,000 per.................Hamonic played big minutes last year 21:11 per game

 

This allows for Schmidt to be moved to either LHD and or RHD, when the need arises

 

 

IN: Johnson and Hamonic ($7,500,000)

 

Vancouver ends up with a net positive Cap of just around $500,000 while adding 2 - 2nds and 2 - 3rds.

 

The key, IMO with moving In Johnson and moving out Eriksson is the buy out is cheap and the addition is a positive one.

 

 

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42 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

Ok, lets look at our last 2 RFA's and what it will cost us.................Virtanen ($3 Million), Gaudette ($2,000,000)

 

Are they worth that.............the simple answer is yes

Can we afford them?..........the simple answer is no!

 

Here is the solution.

 

Trade #1 ......................................Jake Virtanen, Adam Gaudette and Loui Eriksson for NYIers 2021 - 2nd + 2021 - NJ 3rd

 

New Jersey is short on players and is generally in a youth movement. Ericksson is cheap defensive help.

 

OUT: Gaudette (2M) + Virtanen (3M) + Eriksson (6M)..........out $11,000,000

 

Now under normal circumstances, I would not advocate moving youth, however, these are not normal circumstances, and you will never see another time, where there is so much quality hanging around, nor so many teams wanting to move assets for cheap.

 

Now the second part of this is pretty basic...................................

 

Trade #2.......................................LW/C/RW Tyler Johnson + Tampa's 2022 2nd + Tampa's 2021 3rd for Future Consideration ($5,000,000 X 4)

 

Johnson plays all 3 positions, much like JT Miller. Johnson's role has diminished in the past few years, much like Millers......his buy out is approx 1,500,000 per year.

Now remember we got rid of Eriksson, and Johnson's buyout is a acceptable cost, if needed at any point. I certainly would not think we would have to buy him out  in the first or 2nd year. And he is a 40 point player, with a solid plus minus.

 

Signing: #1....................................Travis Hamonic 3 years @ $2,500,000 per.................Hamonic played big minutes last year 21:11 per game

 

This allows for Schmidt to be moved to either LHD and or RHD, when the need arises

 

 

IN: Johnson and Hamonic ($7,500,000)

 

Vancouver ends up with a net positive Cap of just around $500,000 while adding 2 - 2nds and 2 - 3rds.

 

The key, IMO with moving In Johnson and moving out Eriksson is the buy out is cheap and the addition is a positive one.

 

 

Current space, gnats hair under 2 million

 

Ferland to LTIR = +3,500,000

Loui to Utica = +1,050,000

Baer to Utical = +1,050,000

Rathbone to Utica = +925,000

Spread Carryover Bonus Overage across next 2 seasons +850,000

 

Sign Virtanen 2,750,000 million, 1 year show me contract

Sign Gaudette 1,750,000 million per season, 2 year term

 

Remaining cap space, 4.875 million.

 

OJ Joins team - 865,000

Sautner joins team 7th D - 700,000

Hoglander joins team - 890,000

 

Remaining space, 2.42 million buffer to add one more minor depth signing like Leivo

 

To answer your earlier question, "Can we afford them"

 

Yes, We're good!

 

PS: I actually don't have any issue with your trade solutions either. Its a complicated situation, its going to take lots of juggling to create some space.

Edited by VegasCanuck
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About Trade #1, if Canucks were sending Virtanen and Gaudette without Eriksson, they'd probably not get much more than what you suggested coming back our way. Including Eriksson in the trade with both Jake and Adam means Canucks would probably be more likely sending picks with the players to NJ and not receiving anything back just to dump that much cap space.

 

For Trade #2, I think the Canucks might be able to get a little more in return than what you suggested for taking on 4 years of Johnson at $5 million per. 

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Virt will not get 3m he will sign before arbitration for about 2.6. Gaud will not get 2m He will get 1.5.

 

That is 4.1.

 

Canucks have 2M available plus 1.075 X 2 for sending Baertschi and Eriksson down.  That is 4.15m available.

 

So I would say the premise is we can sign both Virt and Gaud without doing anything other than sending Baer and Eriksson down.

And  if I am wrong  on what Virt and Gaud sign for we have 3 guys in the minors who each have 700k counting against our cap.  Move any one of them for futures  and we clear 700k more space. This is not impossible to do as they are all decent prospects.

 

I think people need to actually do math for a living to understand this. But I like the OP's effort.

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1 hour ago, fanfor42 said:

Virt will not get 3m he will sign before arbitration for about 2.6. Gaud will not get 2m He will get 1.5.

 

That is 4.1.

 

Canucks have 2M available plus 1.075 X 2 for sending Baertschi and Eriksson down.  That is 4.15m available.

 

So I would say the premise is we can sign both Virt and Gaud without doing anything other than sending Baer and Eriksson down.

And  if I am wrong  on what Virt and Gaud sign for we have 3 guys in the minors who each have 700k counting against our cap.  Move any one of them for futures  and we clear 700k more space. This is not impossible to do as they are all decent prospects.

 

I think people need to actually do math for a living to understand this. But I like the OP's effort.

I think you are going to have to tell us who these 3 guys are? Because I do not see them.

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6 minutes ago, fanfor42 said:

Wrong. Do the math it is clear on cap friendly. C'mon partner get with the program.

Haha ok believe what you want. None of the players under "Non-roster" contribute to the cap, except those NHL players that have been buried in the minors, like Baertschi was last season. In those cases the cap hit to the Canucks is the players AAV less $1.075m.

 

If you used the amazing maths skills that you talked about earlier you could add up the subtotals from the roster from capfriendly, plus the buyouts, plus the recpatures and you will see it magically adds to about $79.5m, approx $2m below the cap limit of $81.5m.

 

P.S. i recommend you try the "armchair GM" section of capfriendly, have a go at moving players around and see how it affects the cap.

Edited by BigTramFan
Added P.S.
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Just now, BigTramFan said:

Haha ok believe what you want. None of the players under "Non-roster" contribute to the cap, except those NHL players that have been buried in the minors, like Baertschi was last season. In those cases the cap hit to the Canucks is the players AAV less $1.075m.

 

If you used the amazing maths skills that you talked about earlier you could add up the subtotals from the roster from capfriendly, plus the buyouts, plus the recpatures and you will see it magically adds to about $79.5m, approx $2m below the cap limit of $81.5m.

Buddy you are wrong.  Go to cap friendly and look it up.  Those three contracts all count against the cap.  They are clearly identified as such.  Please don't comment further on this until you actually do your homework. 

 

 

 

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3 hours ago, VegasCanuck said:

Current space, gnats hair under 2 million

 

Ferland to LTIR = +3,500,000

Loui to Utica = +1,050,000

Baer to Utical = +1,050,000

Rathbone to Utica = +925,000

Spread Carryover Bonus Overage across next 2 seasons +850,000

 

Sign Virtanen 2,750,000 million, 1 year show me contract

Sign Gaudette 1,750,000 million per season, 2 year term

 

Remaining cap space, 4.875 million.

 

OJ Joins team - 865,000

Sautner joins team 7th D - 700,000

Hoglander joins team - 890,000

 

Remaining space, 2.42 million buffer to add one more minor depth signing like Leivo

 

To answer your earlier question, "Can we afford them"

 

Yes, We're good!

 

PS: I actually don't have any issue with your trade solutions either. Its a complicated situation, its going to take lots of juggling to create some space.

Hey Vegas,

 

I think the main issue JB faces now is: Ferland and is he on LTIR?

 

If he is on LTIR, then this creates enough cap space for us to afford both Virtanen and Gaudette.

 

If he's not on LTIR, and he is by all reports healthy and keen to play, then we are not going to be able to afford both JV and AG. If this happens then we are going to have to try and move another contract, buy out Sutter in the second buyout window, or lose JV or AG for next to nothing.

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3 minutes ago, fanfor42 said:

Buddy you are wrong.  Go to cap friendly and look it up.  Those three contracts all count against the cap.  They are clearly identified as such.  Please don't comment further on this until you actually do your homework. 

 

 

 

Hi buddy. Below is a screenshot of our current roster. You will see that it doesn't list the non-roster guys like Teves, Michaelis and Rafferty. Now add up the subtotals of forwards, defense, goalies, buyout & recapture. This will come to $77.8m (i.e. $46.591 + $21.791 + $5.350 + $1.033 + $3.035 = $77.8m).

 

Now don't forget to add the $1.7m in carryover bonuses. These are the ones we didn't pay in 2019/20. This brings the total to $79.5m.

 

None of this includes the non-roster guys. Trading them does not help our cap situation.

Canucks 2020.PNG

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4 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

Ok, lets look at our last 2 RFA's and what it will cost us.................Virtanen ($3 Million), Gaudette ($2,000,000)

 

Are they worth that.............the simple answer is yes

Can we afford them?..........the simple answer is no!

 

Here is the solution.

 

Trade #1 ......................................Jake Virtanen, Adam Gaudette and Loui Eriksson for NYIers 2021 - 2nd + 2021 - NJ 3rd

 

New Jersey is short on players and is generally in a youth movement. Ericksson is cheap defensive help.

 

OUT: Gaudette (2M) + Virtanen (3M) + Eriksson (6M)..........out $11,000,000

 

Now under normal circumstances, I would not advocate moving youth, however, these are not normal circumstances, and you will never see another time, where there is so much quality hanging around, nor so many teams wanting to move assets for cheap.

 

Now the second part of this is pretty basic...................................

 

Trade #2.......................................LW/C/RW Tyler Johnson + Tampa's 2022 2nd + Tampa's 2021 3rd for Future Consideration ($5,000,000 X 4)

 

Johnson plays all 3 positions, much like JT Miller. Johnson's role has diminished in the past few years, much like Millers......his buy out is approx 1,500,000 per year.

Now remember we got rid of Eriksson, and Johnson's buyout is a acceptable cost, if needed at any point. I certainly would not think we would have to buy him out  in the first or 2nd year. And he is a 40 point player, with a solid plus minus.

 

Signing: #1....................................Travis Hamonic 3 years @ $2,500,000 per.................Hamonic played big minutes last year 21:11 per game

 

This allows for Schmidt to be moved to either LHD and or RHD, when the need arises

 

 

IN: Johnson and Hamonic ($7,500,000)

 

Vancouver ends up with a net positive Cap of just around $500,000 while adding 2 - 2nds and 2 - 3rds.

 

The key, IMO with moving In Johnson and moving out Eriksson is the buy out is cheap and the addition is a positive one.

 

 

Hi Janis...back to your OP...

I don't think NYI have enough cap space to go through with your first proposal, they have $8.9m space currently but they are going to spend that on resigning Barzal.

However, if we DID manage to move Loui's contract and clear some space I certainly wouldn't spend it on TJ from Tampa (even for all those picks!). He will basically end up being another Loui for us. We either need cheap vets on 1-year deals or youth IMO.

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, BigTramFan said:

Hey Vegas,

 

I think the main issue JB faces now is: Ferland and is he on LTIR?

 

If he is on LTIR, then this creates enough cap space for us to afford both Virtanen and Gaudette.

 

If he's not on LTIR, and he is by all reports healthy and keen to play, then we are not going to be able to afford both JV and AG. If this happens then we are going to have to try and move another contract, buy out Sutter in the second buyout window, or lose JV or AG for next to nothing.

Just remember, someone is ALWAYS on LTIR on Vancouver. Can't remember the last time we didn't have someone there.

 

So, there's a chance that Ferland will figure it out and come back (doubt it), but he'll be replaced by someone else. It is the way of the Canucks...

 

I think, you break em, you bought em, is our team motto...

Edited by VegasCanuck
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45 minutes ago, BigTramFan said:

Hi buddy. Below is a screenshot of our current roster. You will see that it doesn't list the non-roster guys like Teves, Michaelis and Rafferty. Now add up the subtotals of forwards, defense, goalies, buyout & recapture. This will come to $77.8m (i.e. $46.591 + $21.791 + $5.350 + $1.033 + $3.035 = $77.8m).

 

Now don't forget to add the $1.7m in carryover bonuses. These are the ones we didn't pay in 2019/20. This brings the total to $79.5m.

 

None of this includes the non-roster guys. Trading them does not help our cap situation.

Canucks 2020.PNG

You are ridiculously wrong but I don't care to go on with this.

 

If you go through the website and add up the sections it is clear that Teves Michaelis and Rafferty all count against the cap 700k each. They are included in the Canuck total of 79.5M.    If you click on their names you can see that their individual cap hits  for next year are 700k each. Can you please just go and do that?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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5 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

Just remember, someone is ALWAYS on LTIR on Vancouver. Can't remember the last time we didn't have someone there.

 

So, there's a chance that Ferland will figure it out and come back (doubt it), but he'll be replaced by someone else. It is the way of the Canucks...

 

I think, you break em, you bought em, is our team motto...

No question, but we have to start the season compliant too

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3 minutes ago, fanfor42 said:

You are ridiculously wrong but I don't care to go on with this.

 

If you go through the website and add up the sections it is clear that Teves Michaelis and Rafferty all count against the cap 700k each. They are included in the Canuck total of 79.5M.    If you click on their names you can see that their individual cap hits  for next year are 700k each. Can you please just go and do that?

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

You are just embarrassing yourself now, calling me wrong when you have no idea what you are talking about. I am also finished with this conversation.

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