Travis Green Contract Extension

[Mackcanuck]

 

[JM_]

On 12/2/2020 at 12:58 PM, Lazurus said:

Green has been hampered by these guaranteed contracts, if he benches them the GM might can him for making him look bad and once canned there is no coming back so he coaches to the safe side, keep the GM safe and blame poor play on a few.

but he did bench Loui this year, many times. Not sure how Green was 'hampered' by anyone else? 

[The Lock]

A little late to the party but I voted yes, for 2 years. We've only seen what he's like in 1 playoffs so far and I think 2 years is short enough to hopefully give him that extra momentum to prove he's who we need in the long run. I also think it'd be a potential mistake not to extend him at all since we're still technically in a transition period going from a bad team to a good team. Bringing in another coach at this point could be seen as more risky as you don't know if the new coach will motivate in the same way.

[ShawnAntoski]

9 hours ago, The Lock said:

A little late to the party but I voted yes, for 2 years. We've only seen what he's like in 1 playoffs so far and I think 2 years is short enough to hopefully give him that extra momentum to prove he's who we need in the long run. I also think it'd be a potential mistake not to extend him at all since we're still technically in a transition period going from a bad team to a good team. Bringing in another coach at this point could be seen as more risky as you don't know if the new coach will motivate in the same way.

Good points, I would assume it will the locker room that will ultimately determine how long his legacy will be with the Canucks.  Given the current circumstances with the virus & etc; a one/two year contract (imo) to see if he & his staff are able to evolve there strategy/coaching style to match this very competitive and maturing core.  Then if the locker room will play for him and succeed then he and the staff would had earned a longer contract (if they are willing to stay and win with this group of players).

Edited December 12, 2020 by ShawnAntoski

[Lazurus]

On 12/11/2020 at 5:32 PM, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

On 12/2/2020 at 8:58 PM, Lazurus said:

 

I constantly hear about how Virtanen and Gaudette are defensive liabilities, well used to be coaches taught players how to play.

 

If the player continues to fail is that not on the coach as well? Simply reducing ice time is not teaching, it trying to keep your job an win.

 

 

"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink."

 

The player has to want to do better as well.  Lecture them all you want, bag skate them all you want, bench them all you want - if they ain't gonna step up to the plate when the spotlight's on them, there ain't nuttin' y'all can do.  The other part of it is that you can't force maturity on someone - the maturation process comes from within.

 

For Jim Benning to have stated what he did during and since the Canucks got knocked out of the bubble, I think that's a sign that Green has shown signs he's about to wave the white flag in terms of Virtanen, which really - if he gives up on Virtanen, Virtanen might as well be gone.

How many times have any management personnel commented on bad play from Beagle, Roussel, Sutter or even Eriksson? All have guaranteed over paid contracts and are taking up roster spots. Even Pearson gets a pass.

 

Benching and constant using as a whipping dog can hurt confidence

 

But Jake plays for 10 minutes and is raked over the coals.  To take any of the above to task is a comment on the GM and his prowess or hockey insight, you decide if positive or negative. So the young guys get blamed, accused or just used for deflecting.

 

If this team is that fragile that Jake's 12 minutes of icetime makes the difference in as many games as they complain about his play then the problem is much bigger.Why not Pearson, he plays 5 minutes agame more, plays with one of the best forwards in Horvat regularly so they build a rapport call "chemistry", Jake plays with Roussel, Beagle, Sutter , Motte, MacEwen, Erkisson, a few minutes a game and you never know who he is lining up with but still he matches Pearson's point totals and plus minus wit players that barely get 15 points a year. Jake pulls the line with him, Pearson is along for the ride on Horvat's coatails. But Jake attracts more attention than Pearson so games are easier to deflect using him.

 

Jim Benning should have been all over the fact the team was outshot 127 to 54 the last three games instead of throwing Jake under the bus.

 

No matter what a coach is supposed to be a teacher and be able to create effective lines, strengths of one player combine with weaknesses of another, one guy is the trigger, another a forechecker with a defensive forward.

 

Green has done okay, his use of a rover caught quite a few teams by surprise as not many teams will abandon that much defence for offence, Markstrom's value attested to this style of game, many time over 40 shots. It was a calculated risk to increase scoring.

 

Last year was the best team iced in 6 years but 3 anchor pins have been removed, one really big one.

 

I hope fans actually look at the Cancuk record vs those other Canadian teams the last two years, it isn't pretty. This coming all Canadian season will be very hard on the Canucks IMO, they won't be getting 6 wins vs LA & SJ, apart from Ottawa, there are no teams going into a rebuild and every Canadian team improved except the Canucks.

 

IMO there are no long term contracts given out to management people this year.
 

 

Edited December 12, 2020 by Lazurus

[IBatch]

On 12/11/2020 at 12:32 PM, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't make them drink."

 

The player has to want to do better as well.  Lecture them all you want, bag skate them all you want, bench them all you want - if they ain't gonna step up to the plate when the spotlight's on them, there ain't nuttin' y'all can do.  The other part of it is that you can't force maturity on someone - the maturation process comes from within.

 

For Jim Benning to have stated what he did during and since the Canucks got knocked out of the bubble, I think that's a sign that Green has shown signs he's about to wave the white flag in terms of Virtanen, which really - if he gives up on Virtanen, Virtanen might as well be gone.

JB is on record saying since the bubble, that the LE line just works BUT that TG wants to give JV an opportunity in the top six.    So not sure what this even means.   Just for a little understanding check out NHL.coms recent blurb on the Canucks - it’s more or less all in there.

 

Others have parroted this - the Hockey Guy did in his video - another thread on this site just for that.   JB and TG have shown/proved that if a younger guy can take a spot on the roster that JB is willing to demote.   LE was a healthy scratch often enough already.   Who knows what’s going to happen, JV is in the catbirds seat given not much of blocking him....whatever happens next is all up to him.  

[Dumb Nuck]

I dreaming of a white Christmas.

 

(No Green)

[kanucks25]

So far this season:

 

- Terrible deployment

- Terrible special teams

- Terrible discipline

 

All the coach's responsibility. 

 

It's early but if this keeps on, el seato en fuego.

[DownUndaCanuck]

Green is brilliant with the players but so far it hasn't translated into wins. Let's see how the rest of the season goes, but if we miss the playoffs does JB treat this like a normal season? I think Green will get a lot of leeway because he is a well-liked coach, but this team on paper should be a playoff team (contender when Demko is in his prime).

[kanucks25]

5 hours ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Green is brilliant with the players but so far it hasn't translated into wins. Let's see how the rest of the season goes, but if we miss the playoffs does JB treat this like a normal season? I think Green will get a lot of leeway because he is a well-liked coach, but this team on paper should be a playoff team (contender when Demko is in his prime).

I agree that it seems that Green does a good job of handling his players, the media, the dynamic between the two, etc.

 

But being a nice/well-liked/good guy doesn't make you a good coach... not on its own, anyway. 

[DownUndaCanuck]

21 minutes ago, kanucks25 said:

I agree that it seems that Green does a good job of handling his players, the media, the dynamic between the two, etc.

 

But being a nice/well-liked/good guy doesn't make you a good coach... not on its own, anyway. 

Sadly agree.

 

To be fair though, there's not many options available, if JB wants to look around he might be best to do so after the Expansion draft where there's surely going to be lots of movement.

[kloubek]

I say 2 years. Gets us through covid, and gives Green a couple years to show he is more than a development coach.

 

Honestly, I like Green, but since he took over I've always felt our team has lacked defensive structure. Greener has been good at getting the most out of individuals, but maybe not as good with our systems. Obviously, assistant coaches can be (or are) a big part of that too. There is a reason we have relied so heavily on our goaltending, and putting the hopes of a season squarely on the goaltending isn't fair to the goalies, but is also clearly a dangerous game to play. We need to get better.

 

Really though, despite the losses we had in the off-season, this team isn't worse on paper than last year, yet the on-ice product has looked substandard so far. Green and co need to find a way to get this team gelling better and work systems that limit high-danger shots. If we don't see a meaningful playoff run inside the next two years, I think it'll prove time to move on.

Edited January 19, 2021 by kloubek

[Squamfan]

[JeremyCuddles]

Not very many GMs get to hire more than 2 coaches. If the Green experiment doesn't work that likely spells the end of Benning as well. I really feel we need a better special teams coaching staff. PP is absymal and we have too much talent for it to be sucking this hard. PK is hovering around 60%, if that isn't terrifying you something is very wrong.

[kanucks25]

30 minutes ago, kloubek said:

gives Green a couple years to show he is more than a development coach.

I don't know if he's even shown that. The only players that have "developed" under him are our high draft pick elite prospects that were probably going to be good anyway. Well, the goaltending, as well, but he probably has even less to do with that. Guys like Gaudette and Virtanen (even though he is a high pick himself) still have a lot to show.

 

23 minutes ago, N7Nucks said:

Not very many GMs get to hire more than 2 coaches. If the Green experiment doesn't work that likely spells the end of Benning as well. I really feel we need a better special teams coaching staff. PP is absymal and we have too much talent for it to be sucking this hard. PK is hovering around 60%, if that isn't terrifying you something is very wrong.

Spot on. It seems as though Benning has a long leash with Aquaman, but asking to hire a 3rd coach after like 7-8 seasons, doubt that's gonna fly. Benning & Green are likely tied together, or at least they ought to be.

Edited January 19, 2021 by kanucks25

[PhillipBlunt]

42 minutes ago, kanucks25 said:

I don't know if he's even shown that. The only players that have "developed" under him are our high draft pick elite prospects that were probably going to be good anyway. Well, the goaltending, as well, but he probably has even less to do with that. Guys like Gaudette and Virtanen (even though he is a high pick himself) still have a lot to show.

 

Spot on. It seems as though Benning has a long leash with Aquaman, but asking to hire a 3rd coach after like 7-8 seasons, doubt that's gonna fly. Benning & Green are likely tied together, or at least they ought to be.

I do agree that if Green can't right the ship, which is too early to tell 4 games in, and the team nosedives, I highly doubt Benning is spared if Green is canned. 

[warrchief]

I wouldn't say Green is on the hot seat, I think a lot his assistants are on it. Brown makes my head scratch when he puts Boeser as net front.

[FlyLow_]

Green is an excellent motivator and he lets players be creative. Unfortunately, that's about it.

[FlyLow_]

8 hours ago, N7Nucks said:

Not very many GMs get to hire more than 2 coaches. If the Green experiment doesn't work that likely spells the end of Benning as well. I really feel we need a better special teams coaching staff. PP is absymal and we have too much talent for it to be sucking this hard. PK is hovering around 60%, if that isn't terrifying you something is very wrong.

I can't say I'm against the idea. It just feels like the current status quo isn't going to take our stars where they need to be.

[Got the Babych]

Are we still doing this? Can we agree that Marky saved a lot of peoples' jobs in the last couple of years? The players keep getting better but the same product on the ice. What's missing? Our team "identity" is to give up shots and scoring chances and rely on individual performances, and otherworldly goaltending. Not a long-term strategy, and results in the mysterious injuries we are somehow plagued with every year. 4games in sure, but is any of this new? Buying high, selling for zero is probably for another thread.