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[Discussion] Canucks Orca.

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16 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

^ this is all firmly in the realm of the ridiculous, which is where these discussions always end up, imo because what gets forgotten is just having a basic level of respect for people. Which is clearly what the Canucks organization did with the orca logo, by discussing it with Reid and others, and also through other respectful engagement with the Salish nation.

 

Once everyone found out the real story, it popped the "progressive" balloon pretty damn fast.

 

 

 

I agree it's in the realm of the ridiculous. But in some cases claims of appropriation fall in the ridiculous like the Cardi B video or dreadlocks or rap music. But such claims do beg the question of where the line is. When the line is pushed, is it reasonable to say it should in turn be a two way street? I completely agree with changing the names of the Eskimos, Redskins, and Indians as they are all terms those ethnicities find offensive. Those are completely valid complaints. But when you push it to an animal print or hair style it is certainly heading into the ridiculous. 

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19 hours ago, drummerboy said:

So, assuming the Italians are ok with us going back to the spaghetti skate, I’d be super jazzed to do it.  The orca sucks.  
 

But I’d be so choked if we went with any kind of Johnny Canuck logo.   
It’s Jr team logo for kids.  

As an alternate third jersey it'd have made sense. The kids love Johnny Canuck and a lot of us adults do to. Even had they just do it as an alternate jersey for say ten games a season. You don't think this jersey looks sharp and wouldn't have sold? I'd have lined up to buy one had they gone with this and so would a lot of Canuck fans. The team can do whatever they want with their primary but do a Johnny Canuck one so everyone can be pleased as I see we Canuck fans aren't all in agreement on a proper logo and it isn't going to end anytime soon. I don't know what is so 'beer league' looking about it or junior team as you imply? In my US travels to go watch the Canucks play in Vegas, Arizona, etc. I have usually worn my green Johnny Canuck jersey and I've had other teams fans come up and ask me about the jersey that they have never seen it before. They tell me tell your team to throw it on a jersey and we'd buy one. The team should just do one to please those fans especially the little kids that like the Johnny Canuck logo. I mean you already see Johnny Canuck on a lot of the teams merchandise and it sells well so wouldn't it make sense to finally put it on a jersey already? In 2011 at the teams superskills competition they wore a Johnny Canuck practice jersey and people bought them up game worn practice worn right afterwards. Sold all of them out no problem. So do one finally and it'll please everyone that would like to see one done.

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Edited by vancouverbucsfan
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It's like people go out of their way to get offended.

 

Someday just having the sweater with only the letters:  CANUCKS

would be deemed offensive as using only the Latin alphabet isn't inclusive enough as it doesn't have Sankrit, Chinese, Japanese, Cyrillic, Persian, etc.  

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25 minutes ago, Lancaster said:

It's like people go out of their way to get offended.

 

Someday just having the sweater with only the letters:  CANUCKS

would be deemed offensive as using only the Latin alphabet isn't inclusive enough as it doesn't have Sankrit, Chinese, Japanese, Cyrillic, Persian, etc.  

It already has, by the people who rally against the flying skate design, and would prefer anything but.  :picard:

 

:lol:

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9 hours ago, Bitter Melon said:

Time to retire the "Canucks" name too. Its only a matter of time until somebody complains. Might as well get out of ahead of everything in one fell swoop.

Well it was a highly offensive term to French Canadians at one time. I've been told there's still some oldtimers in Quebec that still view it as offensive. As the logo issue failed miserably on to phase 2... the team name. :lol:

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Looks like this was just a rumor spread by Sean Carleton, a Manitoba professor who likes to speak out pretending to represent indigenous groups (even though they ask him not to) and then uses the subsequent outrage and publicity to peddle his books.

 

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1 hour ago, Duodenum said:

Looks like this was just a rumor spread by Sean Carleton, a Manitoba professor who likes to speak out pretending to represent indigenous groups (even though they ask him not to) and then uses the subsequent outrage and publicity to peddle his books.

 

Yeah, well wait until he finds that "jets" when pronounced in a certain way is some obscure phoenetic language's term* for genitalia doing what genitalia does best.  Think of the outrage then!

 

*Note - I am not aware of any phoenetic language (obscure or otherwise) that has a term that sounds like "jets" that carries the purported meaning.  This was only created out of my imagination, and should it happen to match any existing situation - local or foreign - it is hereby asserted to be an unintentional coincidence.

 

:bigblush:

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3 hours ago, Baggins said:

I agree it's in the realm of the ridiculous. But in some cases claims of appropriation fall in the ridiculous like the Cardi B video or dreadlocks or rap music. But such claims do beg the question of where the line is. When the line is pushed, is it reasonable to say it should in turn be a two way street? I completely agree with changing the names of the Eskimos, Redskins, and Indians as they are all terms those ethnicities find offensive. Those are completely valid complaints. But when you push it to an animal print or hair style it is certainly heading into the ridiculous. 

thats the thing, there really isn't one, and there can't be one. Its all subjective. 

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33 minutes ago, Mr.DirtyDangles said:

Orcas DO NOT belong to anyone ! Using the image of an animal is not cultural appropriation in any sense. Society is F@#$! ed

It’s more the style than the animal. It’s in no way offensive and the local indigenous have no problem with it but the art style is still their are style. This has nothing to do with an actual killer whale lol

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3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

thats the thing, there really isn't one, and there can't be one. Its all subjective. 

Which is a little concerning. There are various levels to it and people can get behind opinions, for better or worse, rather quickly. Especially when they believe they have the moral high-ground.

 

Sometimes it's pretty much 

High Ground GIFs - Get the best GIF on GIPHY

 

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My first thought was "maybe it's a good time to change the orca logo if some are offended by it", but then I thought of the complaining that would follow if they chose another art form. They'll have to have an Indigenous artist re-design the logo, otherwise they'll be considered racist, somehow.  

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1 hour ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Which is a little concerning. There are various levels to it and people can get behind opinions, for better or worse, rather quickly. Especially when they believe they have the moral high-ground.

 

Sometimes it's pretty much 

High Ground GIFs - Get the best GIF on GIPHY

 

I don't care what some prof from Winnipeg has to say, no moral hight ground there for me. It would bother me if the Salish were upset, but thankfully the Canucks were smart enough to talk to them way back when. 

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A lot of the articles I’ve read have had people saying “there are lots of Salish/native artists out there.  Let’s ditch the orca logo, and work with them on a new one”.  
 

After all this backlash, why would they want to do another native design?  Or even a new one?     
 

They have the skate, stick and rink, the Johnny Canuck (for the kids)....  

why would they want to make a new logo that might piss people off again 20 years down the road.  
 

Would it still be a victory for the complaining parties if the Canucks ditched the Orca, but didn’t go with a new Native designed logo? 

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2 minutes ago, drummerboy said:

A lot of the articles I’ve read have had people saying “there are lots of Salish/native artists out there.  Let’s ditch the orca logo, and work with them on a new one”.  
 

After all this backlash, why would they want to do another native design?  Or even a new one?     
 

They have the skate, stick and rink, the Johnny Canuck (for the kids)....  

why would they want to make a new logo that might piss people off again 20 years down the road.  
 

Would it still be a victory for the complaining parties if the Canucks ditched the Orca, but didn’t go with a new Native designed logo? 

It might be neat to have a 3rd jersey designed by a Salish artist, that might look awesome. As far as the orca goes, the Canucks org did it right, and no one that matters is upset by it. 

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2 hours ago, Petey40 said:

It’s more the style than the animal. It’s in no way offensive and the local indigenous have no problem with it but the art style is still their are style. This has nothing to do with an actual killer whale lol

So emulating a style is cultural appropriation go it.  I see you painting an Easter egg with out my consent I'm coming to your house......

Edited by Mr.DirtyDangles
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