Coronavirus outbreak

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

2 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said:

As the global number of confirmed Covid-19 cases surpasses 30 million, residents of Taipei seem relaxed in the knowledge there has been only one suspected case linked to local transmission in the city since mid-April.

 

And in Taiwan as a whole, an island with a population of approximately 23 million people, there have been around 500 confirmed cases and just 7 deaths since the beginning of the pandemic

Well, I asked....lol

 

But, to make my point...............these societies are much different than ours, and again...it is the people that make it work

 

WE, as in the 1st world (Canada/US/Europe)...are far too selfish

 

But you should look at Turkey/Iran etc, and see even in those Countries that have a different political system, are having huge problems, including Russia and now China again...

 

You look at our problems here in BC as if they are the worst in the world, where in actual fact, we are doing quite well.

 

and BC even better, and the Island even better.......................if you Bitched as much as you do in some those other countries I named, they would shoot you!

 

You talk, but do you phone your MLA?

[kingofsurrey]

8 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

 

 

You look at our problems here in BC as if they are the worst in the world, where in actual fact, we are doing quite well.

 

 

Fraser Health has over a 10% pos test rate.

 

New York just closed schools again with 3 % pos test rate....   We don't even have mandatory masks in schools and we don't even have mandatory social distancing either.....   Well maybe we have some soap.... but thats about it.   Our classrooms typically don't even have sinks......

 

 

You think we are doing that well ? 

 

 

[spur1]

Hasn’t the sky fallen yet?

[J.I.A.H.N]

5 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said:

Fraser Health has over a 10% pos test rate.

 

New York just closed schools again with 3 % pos test rate....   We don't even have mandatory masks in schools and we don't even have mandatory social distancing either.....   Well maybe we have some soap.... but thats about it.   Our classrooms typically don't even have sinks......

 

 

You think we are doing that well ? 

 

 

I do understand it is bad there, and I honestly feel for you all there..........my best thoughts are with you

 

But other areas do not have that percentage, and our kids are in school, so what is the difference?

 

Seriously...what is the difference, I do not know! Why is it happening there?

 

 

 

 

Edited November 24, 2020 by janisahockeynut

[kingofsurrey]

3 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

I do understand it is bad there, and I honestly feel for you all there..........my best thoughts are with you

 

But other areas do not have that percentage, and our kids are in school, so what is the difference?

 

Seriously...what is the difference, I do not know! Why is it happening there?

 

 

 

 

Now this is interesting discussion....

 

Why is Fraser and Van Coast regions the highest covid... ?

 

Some possible reasons....

 

Highest density living in BC

Smaller housing / apartment living 

Ethnic backgrounds with larger family - often sharing homes.

Older poorly ventilated schools and frequent poorly ventilated portable classrooms

Higher class sizes in schools of BC.  

Higher number of restaurants / bars.

Higher number of work sites / factories with close working conditions.

Many workers struggling financially / high housing costs. and have ZERO sick days to use when ill. So they work sick.

 

 

Just a few off my head.

I do enjoy discussing things with you. You seem to be open to considered all kinds of opinions. That is a very valuable skilll set. 

 

 

 

[Phil_314]

Crazy woman literally threw the kitchen sink and her Thesaurus at us in her ban on events:

"The new order includes gatherings at hotels, restaurants, bars, movie theatres, and cinemas. Henry added that popular seasonal holiday events are also included", yet strangely City meetings and school classes are not cancelled.  Oh the irony.

[Ghostsof1915]

Compare Canada to a similar population in Europe. Poland. They have more cases, and about 2000 more deaths. 

 

https://covid19.who.int

 

Not that we can't improve. But there is more one solution to this. 

Edited November 24, 2020 by Ghostsof1915

[kingofsurrey]

8 minutes ago, Phil_314 said:

Crazy woman literally threw the kitchen sink and her Thesaurus at us in her ban on events:

"The new order includes gatherings at hotels, restaurants, bars, movie theatres, and cinemas. Henry added that popular seasonal holiday events are also included", yet strangely City meetings and school classes are not cancelled.  Oh the irony.

Yup..   BC - the province where you are only allowed to gather in large groups at school / the PUB / a hockey dressing room  / or at a crowed Cactus club restaurant.

 

Heh, its the way we do science in BC.....

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

31 minutes ago, kingofsurrey said:

Now this is interesting discussion....

 

Why is Fraser and Van Coast regions the highest covid... ?

 

Some possible reasons....

 

Highest density living in BC

Smaller housing / apartment living 

Ethnic backgrounds with larger family - often sharing homes.

Older poorly ventilated schools and frequent poorly ventilated portable classrooms

Higher class sizes in schools of BC.  

Higher number of restaurants / bars.

Higher number of work sites / factories with close working conditions.

Many workers struggling financially / high housing costs. and have ZERO sick days to use when ill. So they work sick.

 

 

Just a few off my head.

I do enjoy discussing things with you. You seem to be open to considered all kinds of opinions. That is a very valuable skilll set. 

 

 

 

I would also add, that because of the high price of real-estate in the downtown core, most old age homes are out in the valley, which sadly accounts for 2/3 of the deaths in BC...................That and the early cross working old age home workers out there...............not as many homes on the island or in the north

 

8 minutes ago, Phil_314 said:

Crazy woman literally threw the kitchen sink and her Thesaurus at us in her ban on events:

"The new order includes gatherings at hotels, restaurants, bars, movie theatres, and cinemas. Henry added that popular seasonal holiday events are also included", yet strangely City meetings and school classes are not cancelled.  Oh the irony.

So, I asked myself.................what are the last things you want to close and what are the things that are just luxuries

 

I would suggest, that Government and Schools are the last things you would want to close.

The others just Luxuries

[J.I.A.H.N]

@kingofsurrey

 

This is a gift for you..............

 

Left me know what you think....LOL

 

Home | The COVID Monitor

 

This is solid ammo for your argument

Edited November 24, 2020 by janisahockeynut

[thedestroyerofworlds]

The Oxford vaccine is far cheaper, easier to produce, and can be stored in a fridge, unlike the other vaccines.  The UK already has 4 million doses ready to go.  

 

Interim data suggests 70% protection, but the researchers say the figure may be as high as 90% by tweaking the dose.

 

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-55040635

Covid-19: Oxford University vaccine is highly effective

By James Gallagher

[DarthMelvin]

4 hours ago, kingofsurrey said:

Both my rec ice hockey teams are back playing next week.

 

10 players per room sounds a bit riskier than my brother over by himself and social distancing at my house . 

 

Not sure how BC covid restrictions were drawn up. Maybe Dr. B wrote them up at a bar.... LOL >..

 

I guess i  have to go a crowded bar to meet my brother....   This is hard to understand....

 

And yet you blamed the NDP... lol. Leave politics out this one bud.

 

 

[StanleyCupOneDay]

I’m going to re-up what I said a few pages ago because I think people’s perspectives/expectations need adjusting. 
 

No one currently breathing on this planet has ever lived through and dealt with a deadly disease outbreak of this scale. Let that sink in for a moment: Billions of people on the planet, none to consult on their expertise. No one has the past lived experience either to say “I remember when x happened, no way I’m not taking precautions this time” or “my aunt died in x by doing this, so we won’t do that.”

 

What we are doing now is the equivalent of trying to put a meteorologist in charge of hurricane preparations and recovery. They have the expertise and the mechanics of how the disaster is created and works/moves, but little in the area of effective management to mitigate the damage caused by it. That’s the best option we have right now, but it’s obviously not a very good one in an ideal scenario.
 

The last time something like COVID-19 occurred was all the way back in 1917 from the Spanish Flu in a society that wasn’t globally intertwined and a far cry from how we live now. In 1917 in the US:

- 6% graduated high school

- Only 23% could read

- No flights existed, travel took days/months by boat

- 8% of people had landlines

- Getting around day to day was mostly by horse and carriage

 

To name only a few differences.

 

1/3rd of the world or 500 million people were infected and 50 million were killed globally. As we sit now after almost a year since the original outbreak there’s been 60 million cases and 1.4 million deaths on a planet of 7.5 billion people. That’s a remarkable improvement, hundreds of millions of lives have likely been saved due to our collective actions.

 

In times of crisis it’s about saving as much as possible. Every managed disaster could have been worse and could have been better, there’s no perfect answer when crisis comes, even less of one when it effects the entire world at the exact same time straining the same limited resources. Some managers do a better job then others obviously, but all at least have access to knowledge. Hurricanes, tornadoes, floods, earthquakes, volcanoes, droughts, forest fires, blizzards, I could list forever every type of disaster in which we have experienced people to rely upon to investigate/mitigate/manage the problem/s after the threat passes.

 

We currently have a crisis that is the worst of both worlds. The threat isn’t going to pass quickly, it’s long term so we can’t work on recovery, disaster fatigue sets in and we have no one’s experience to lean on for how things should/shouldn’t be managed. We are all flying blind. Even at the best of times during a disaster there’s confusion, mistakes, refusals to adhere to safety precautions and opinions from elected leaders/scientists to the people. Now imagine the disaster effecting the entire planet. Now imagine the threat being invisible. In a social media obsessed society this only exacerbates our problems.

 

Or put another more succinct way have you ever heard of someone who sees a tornado on the ground nearby or hears a tornado warning siren that doesn’t immediately get their families to the basement/shelter to hunker down until the threat passes? That’s easy to do. Would they do that for a whole day? week? month? longer? Most will go outside as time passes regardless of the potential danger. Now imagine asking people to do that for 8 months (and counting) for a threat that no one is able to see. It’s beyond human capacity for our ancestral hardwired brains fight or flight mentality to effectively handle the danger because we can’t do either.

 

Taking the situation all together we’re doing well. Could be better, could be worse, some countries doing worse/better then others, but given the changes to society over the last century, the infection number and death toll speaks to how most leaders/experts/businesses/people across the planet are taking this disease outbreak seriously.

 

The hard truth is people are going to die, people are going to lose their businesses, people are going to lose their jobs, this is the sad inevitable pain felt by people in every disaster. It’s not ok, one life, business and/or job lost is worth mourning. I wish it weren’t the case, but this is the reality. Mistakes will be made, solutions will be created and we will try to limit the damage as much as possible. Expecting anything else given our current unique situation is setting yourself up for disappointment throughout this long term global health epidemic.

Edited November 24, 2020 by StanleyCupOneDay

[TheRussianRocket1994]

Re: post above...

 

Very well put together / said, but at the end of the day, no matter how new / hard this is.....i feel it's not hard to be unselfish / follow some basic rules and if some people weren't so f'n selfish, entitled, ignorant, we could have done much better!!! 

Edited November 24, 2020 by IRR

[bishopshodan]

7 minutes ago, IRR said:

Re: post above...

 

Very well put together / said, but at the end of the day, no matter how new / hard this is.....i feel it's not hard to be unselfish / follow some basic rules and if some people weren't so f'n selfish, entitled, ignorant, we could have done much better!!! 

Agreed.

It's not hard to listen to the experts and do your part. 

Unfortunately, we have this internet to provide conformation bias for those that you describe. 

[-DLC-]

25 minutes ago, IRR said:

Re: post above...

 

Very well put together / said, but at the end of the day, no matter how new / hard this is.....i feel it's not hard to be unselfish / follow some basic rules and if some people weren't so f'n selfish, entitled, ignorant, we could have done much better!!! 

I don't even know that it's "selfish" for some....more narcissistic and ego getting in the way.  They have something to prove.  They're "bigger" than all of this and we're all the fools for being fearful.  It's like they think their stupidity is bravery and they have no self awareness.   Their acts are valiant in their eyes because they are going to stand strong and show everyone.  Defiance is their mask....as they go down with the sinking ship.  When everyone else is scrambling to help people put on life preservers, they laugh in the face of danger and won't put one on and would rather take others down to prove their point.  How.....ridiculous these fools are...seeing people in the news acting like asshats when the rest of us are uniting together to do what we can. 

 

I don't think they should get any news coverage because they are trying to send a message.  Stop the messenger (service).  

[aGENT]

29 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

Agreed.

It's not hard to listen to the experts and do your part. 

Unfortunately, we have this internet to provide conformation bias for those that you describe. 

Unfortunately, it is just as powerful at informing (the good) as misinforming (the bad).

 

Once we get this whole pandemic thing sorted out, we should really do something about that ^^^ problem.

[TheRussianRocket1994]

28 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:

I don't even know that it's "selfish" for some....more narcissistic and ego getting in the way.  They have something to prove.  They're "bigger" than all of this and we're all the fools for being fearful.  It's like they think their stupidity is bravery and they have no self awareness.   Their acts are valiant in their eyes because they are going to stand strong and show everyone.  Defiance is their mask....as they go down with the sinking ship.  When everyone else is scrambling to help people put on life preservers, they laugh in the face of danger and won't put one on and would rather take others down to prove their point.  How.....ridiculous these fools are...seeing people in the news acting like asshats when the rest of us are uniting together to do what we can. 

 

I don't think they should get any news coverage because they are trying to send a message.  Stop the messenger (service).  

Very well said!! This was said on the said on the radio the other day..."i'm so tired of people being willingly stupid and selish and wearing it like a badge". I think that statement pretty much sums it up! 

 

I just keep putting these peoples feet to the fire and i've def delete a few people off FB. 

Edited November 24, 2020 by IRR

[StanleyCupOneDay]

23 minutes ago, IRR said:

Re: post above...

 

Very well put together / said, but at the end of the day, no matter how new / hard this is.....i feel it's not hard to be unselfish / follow some basic rules and if some people weren't so f'n selfish, entitled, ignorant, we could have done much better!!! 

Also a valid point and one I agree with! It’s not hard to put on a mask, wash your hands and try to limit in person contact as much as possible. Beyond that though it’s a grey world. No one agrees on what does and doesn’t help/hurt the disease outbreak because of just how unheard of and complex a crisis this is that we currently face. Ask is x safe and you can find a point of view you support depending on who you get your information from.
 

It’s hard to expect all people to take any crisis seriously, many ignore orders during disaster, but even harder when it’s something that’s completely new to everyone and invisible with no agreed upon guidelines for what is and isn’t safe. I wasn’t really trying to make any particular point with my post other then the fact we all have unrealistic expectations of x (x could be politicians, people, scientists, businesses, health experts, take your pick) while giving context and visual imagery to the current global crisis.

 

Your sentiment is true for every disaster, there’s always room for improvement and again I agree with you we could have done better in this situation. Many more lives could have been saved. It could have been much worse too. Imagine 100% noncompliance in a world  where you can get to any country in a day with tens of millions of people traveling at any one time. Hundreds of millions dead, maybe more.
 

I’m grateful for how many people will get a chance to live a full life and saddened for those who unfairly don’t.