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8 hours ago, Sharpshooter said:

The thing is, Canada used to have vaccine production capability, decades ago. 
 

I haven’t looked into what happened as to why we lost that capability, but I’m betting on some kind of shenanigans. (Insert Super Trooper shenanigans gifs/quotes, if you must- - Note: I’ll reply to all of them with, “Shut up Farva”)

Here ya go!

Cheeky and Fun | Super Troopers | Know Your Meme   MRW too many people are saying "shenanigans" - GIF on Imgur

 

Super Troopers | The 70s 80s & 90s Amino  Shenanigans Super Troopers GIFs | Tenor

 

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11 hours ago, Amebushi said:

The rules as they sit make no sense

I'm thinking this more and more.

It's obviously a calculation of virus impact vs the strain on the economy. 

Schools are tax paid daycare and there is no argument that there is some risk to the children and their families. Sending a kid to school during this pandemic is a very heavy decision for parents. 

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Fraser Health COVID-19 infections among highest per capita in Canada, double average

https://bc.ctvnews.ca/fraser-health-covid-19-infections-among-highest-per-capita-in-canada-double-average-1.5205091

 

VANCOUVER -- The number of daily COVID-19 infections in B.C.’s most populous health authority far outstrip the national average, and per capita cases are in line with Canada’s hardest-hit provinces, according to an analysis by CTV News Vancouver.

 

 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Silky mitts said:

?

The quality (or moreso the lack of) care, staffing issues, inability to stem pandemic spread within the care homes because of the admin issues are all things that we as a society allowed to happen.  

The concept of long term care for seniors is a good one, but I think we've had the curtain pulled back on what has been a horrid experience for many seniors - if they can't afford the fancy private care homes, the government run care homes lack a lot.  

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3 hours ago, skategal said:

It will be interesting to see 5 years from now when hopefully this pandemic is behind us - what about our society and government has changed?  Certainly the issues we have come across have held up a mirror and what we've seen isn't pretty.  

 

Long term care is probably the biggest national disgrace that we as a society allowed to happen.  

Concerns about delivery of education are rampant - clearly things need to change.

In country development and production of PPE and Vaccines - we should never be at the mercy of external providers - especially when other countries can strong arm and hoard distribution and supply.  

Right wing conspiracy nutjobs - not sure that will ever wane, but it certainly seems to have been exacerbated with COVID.   Not that I like group think, I believe dissenting thought and opinion is good as it challenges all of us to look at different perspectives but complete selfishness with zero regard for how one's behaviour can negatively impact others I have no time for.  

 

What other things do you hope will change as an outcome of our experiences with COVID?  Are there positives that you have seen that you hope continue?  

On a smaller scale...I hope people start respecting personal space a bit more.  Stop crowding one another...trampling over each other for sales, etc.  Spitting and coughing everywhere.  I hope we're training people about good manners in public overall. 

 

Positives are that we're being forced to think about those things.  Also, to be grateful FOR that time with family that we're being deprived of...how we sometimes may take that for granted.  Grumble when we "have" to attend a function that we're not overly excited about.  To cherish every second of it.

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Privatized for profit care is a huge issue.  When people focus on making money first and foremost, some get cheap.  They don't want to invest in anything beyond the minimal and it becomes greed driven more than care focused.

 

There are great care homes.....but the costs are out of reach for many.  

 

Limited options and definitely needs an overhaul.

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Got news of my first indirect connection to a covid death......my sis in laws gf's dad died from it a while back, but just hearing about it now.........langley I think.  Died alone in an isolated room with no contact with family or friends.  I didn't know him personally, but still makes it more real.

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55 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

how do we "know" that? because thats their marketing? 

HI Jimmy

I probably should not have made that statement in this thread.........too political

 

But since you asked...........simply put, it is pretty much their platform

That and I know some very high ups and am confident in their integrity

Very human, very compassionate, very consistent .......I am a pretty good judge of character

and they impress me..........not that they are perfect

but I know 2 guys who ran for the Conservatives over here.........their opinions are

very Trumpolian, very much more big business...nice guys, but not my style

Again..........I should not have brought that here

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5 minutes ago, stawns said:

Got news of my first indirect connection to a covid death......my sis in laws gf's dad died from it a while back, but just hearing about it now.........langley I think.  Died alone in an isolated room with no contact with family or friends.  I didn't know him personally, but still makes it more real.

That is real, and very sad.

Poor family...poor man

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When will Dr. B and Horgan start telling us the truth.....  BC is just another province - not EXCEPTIONAL.

Covid behaves the same way here in BC as in all other provinces...

 

 

 

As the number of COVID-19 cases in Alberta soars, the number of children and teens being hospitalized has nearly tripled and fuelled fears that the province will see more cases of a serious inflammatory condition triggered by the coronavirus.

The total number of Albertans aged 19 and under who have been hospitalized with COVID-19 has nearly tripled since early August — from 13 to 37, according to statistics collected by Alberta Health. 

 

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/calgary/alberta-children-teens-covid-19-multisystem-inflammatory-syndrome-mis-c-1.5809783

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1 hour ago, skategal said:

The quality (or moreso the lack of) care, staffing issues, inability to stem pandemic spread within the care homes because of the admin issues are all things that we as a society allowed to happen.  

The concept of long term care for seniors is a good one, but I think we've had the curtain pulled back on what has been a horrid experience for many seniors - if they can't afford the fancy private care homes, the government run care homes lack a lot.  

Ah I see, I pick up nursing shifts occasionally at my side job at a care home, but it is private . Seniors are well looked after here, can't say for the government run ones. 

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2 minutes ago, Silky mitts said:

Ah I see, I pick up nursing shifts occasionally at my side job at a care home, but it is private . Seniors are well looked after here, can't say for the government run ones. 

Good to hear....hopefully this will ensure all care homes deliver care a little more attentively.

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14 hours ago, Amebushi said:

And you are the person that can’t hold a civil debate. I don’t bring the virus anywhere. I’m sitting in my house alone and annoyed. I wore a mask at work all day because I don’t want a fine. I am for the risk of seeing my family because they are what is important to me. If I can’t see my family why the hell can kids go to school???  I want fairness across the board. Why do some have to give more than other “for the greater good”?  You spout your beliefs without a single source as if you are the holder of all facts. Take your holier than thou crap and shove it. I want to protect all people equally. I wear a mask and follow the rules. Why don’t others?  Why don’t kids have to wear masks in schools?  Try answering a question for once instead of standing on a soapbox. More than many...how many more case in schools before it matters to you?  Why is it ok for men’s hockey to be going on right now? I thought you were scared for our elders but gosh...gotta have hockey. I’m sick of one sided arguments. The rules as they sit make no sense and any rational person can see that. Keep making personal attacks and tell me what kind of person I am. I follow rules I don’t agree with for the greater good while you preach about how good you are. 

Your comments weren't directed at me but thought I might take the chance to answer some of them.  

I think this sort of questioning is very reasonable and fair as opposed to some of the other crap about natural immunity that is being spewed here.

I think the best way to think about it is cumulative risk.  Everything you do adds a little risk and you need to manage those risks to keep the sum of them to an acceptable level.  Also need to look at increased risks of infection for some activities as well as the background risks of those involved.

Schools are a risk but in general the risks of kids under 14 transmitting the virus are less than adults and older teens.  It is about half the risk by best estimation.  Parents work and are frequently dependant on schools to be open to work.  The calculation is made that for kids development and for parents work that the reduced risk is more palatable but parents get to make that choice.  Kids can be kept home as full time virtual classes are available.  When the numbers in an area get high enough or when there are cases in a school these get shutdown.  

Ultimately the combination of reduced risk, parents agreeing to keep children home when showing any signs of illness and the benefits to the economy went into this calculation.  I am not saying it adds up but that is the thinking.

At this time men's hockey should not be going on IMO.  That is ludicrous and just not worth the risk.

Personally my job puts me at significant risk for exposure and those that live with me have to accept that and we have personal isolation plans in place fr when I get higher risk exposures.  I would not take the risk of exposing anyone who doesn't live with me to me without PPE.  I have seen two buildings over the last several months my clinic and my house and yes am getting very sick of these.

I don't go out in public because I don't want to add to my cumulative risk or add to the exposure risk of the high risk people I work with.  My work risks combined with two kids in school makes my cumulative risk quite high.

It is good that you have taken these measures for the greater good and even more important because of the ass hats who won't take reasonable precautions and feel the need to spew their crap all over the internet to try to spread their self centred philosophies.  The responsible often have to bear the cross for the selfish.

Ultimately, you and your family can look at your situations and decide for yourselves what risks to take.  One of the issues though with the virus is that it spreads at a very high level before you even know you have it so it is really very difficult to say that you don't bring the virus anywhere as even with you taking these precautions there is a fair chance though this also depends on a lot of other factors like rates and other potential exposures.

If it is just the family that you live with those risks are cooked in but if bringing grandma with COPD from the nursing home over for Christmas that is a whole different risk profile for her and risk profile for exposure of the rest of the family.

Edited by DrJockitch
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https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lancet/article/PIIS0140-6736(20)32478-8/fulltext

 

Obituaries for a small subset of health care workers who have made the ultimate sacrifice in caring for COVID patients and lost their lives.  For those who still think this is nothing but a flu, or it only creates significant harm to elderly, might want to reconsider your position.  If not for yourself, then for the people around you.  Wear a mask, physically distant and try not to be out and about unless necessary.  

"Greater love hath no man than that he lay down his life for a friend".  I doubt that most people go into health care with the notion that they are risking their lives to care for others health.  

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1 hour ago, debluvscanucks said:

On a smaller scale...I hope people start respecting personal space a bit more.  Stop crowding one another...trampling over each other for sales, etc.  Spitting and coughing everywhere.  I hope we're training people about good manners in public overall. 

 

Positives are that we're being forced to think about those things.  Also, to be grateful FOR that time with family that we're being deprived of...how we sometimes may take that for granted.  Grumble when we "have" to attend a function that we're not overly excited about.  To cherish every second of it.

Deb I love that you keep being a glad half full type.  

Nothing in the last year makes me think that we are learning to respect each other better but I fully recognize that this may be a bias engendered by the presence of the internet and social media amplifying extreme views.

I would like to see some leg term changes come out of COVID.  I think moving to a mostly cash free society would be great for public health, money is filthy.  Handshakes can go away permanently IMO.  A better recognition that minor illness should be isolated, not forced in to work or into doctor's offices for unnecessary notes, that would be great.

I also think that COVID could provide a blueprint for the revitalization of rural life and increase the shift of decentralization cities.  If the COVID recovery starts to include public works with a stress on equity of broadband access across the country to all communities, many companies can continue to have work at home policies which could lead to this sort of rural revitalization.  The increased incorporation of distance learning could also significantly improve the quality of rural education which has really truly gotten woeful in places.

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