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Stawns, sorry to hear about your former close friend, although I suppose this is a strong lesson in consequences.  There are still so many people who don't see the risk all around them.  I agree that we're probably going to end up in a shutdown now that it seems that much of the spread is in workplaces.  Hopefully it may not go to a full province shutdown, maybe more regional but no matter what, it's going to be a long winter since it seems a vaccine that is readily available is still a long way off.  

 

Now that so many of us are disgusted by the rash behaviour of COVID deniers and anti-maskers, next up will be the appalling behaviour of those who will try to fabricate reasons to jump the queue for vaccines.  I know we're all supposed to "love our fellow man" but damn, that's hard sometimes. 

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14 hours ago, debluvscanucks said:

WTH!?   So Justin's statement was that "we can expect to have half of us vaccinated by next September"??!!!

 

Sigh

IMO won't happen.  US/UK and some other countries have already secured essentially the first years supply with their orders last I heard, Canada was lagging behind as always.  If we get 1/4 done by next September I would consider that a success.  I have no interest in being vaccinated first round, I will wait till 2nd or 3rd round of doses to come out, rather let others be the guinnie pigs in this instance (but I will get vaccinated I have zero issues with that, just not going to be first round of these ones coming out, I will shoot for early 2022 hopefully).

 

And these restrictions are crap, if they were really serious maybe they would stop people from going on vacations to other countries.  Until that happens its hard to take the government serious. 

Edited by Russ
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4 minutes ago, Russ said:

IMO won't happen.  US/UK and some other countries have already secured essentially the first years supply, Canada was lagging behind as always.  If we get 1/4 done by next September I would consider that a success.  I have no interest in being vaccinated first round, I will wait till 2nd or 3rd round of doses to come out, rather let others be the guinnie pigs in this instance (but I will get vaccinated I have zero issues with that, just not going to be first round of these ones coming out, I will shoot for early 2022 hopefully).

Kinda feel that sentiment.  I'd prefer to wait a bit and see what the after effects are of the very rushed vaccine. 

 

Suppose I've watched too many zombie films.

Edited by FilthyRich
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Just now, FilthyRich said:

Kinda feel that sentiment.  I'd prefer to wait a bit and see what the after effects are of the vaccine. 

 

Suppose I've watched too many zombie films.

Yea not really worried about being a zombie (eventhough might make life more fun that right now to be honest) but still rather let others be the longer term testers as USA sounds like they will be starting pretty quick here, be interesting to see how people react to that first batch eventhough I do trust it will be safe for consumers.

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Good points....

 

I just hope we keep the border closed until we get vaccinated too...if the US is deemed "safer" and that allows for travel back/forth, we could be in even greater trouble.  We have to focus on limiting the spread and increasing the numbers of people won't support that effort.

 

I agree about travel...100%.

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16 minutes ago, debluvscanucks said:

Good points....

 

I just hope we keep the border closed until we get vaccinated too...if the US is deemed "safer" and that allows for travel back/forth, we could be in even greater trouble.  We have to focus on limiting the spread and increasing the numbers of people in that won't support that effort.

 

I agree about travel...100%.

Friends parents just went for a month long vacation down in Mexico.  If you're going to tell me they can do that even with a 2 week quarantine when they get back then to hell with a bunch of these restrictions that really make no sense.  You tell me I can't visit family the next city over where we all are careful as hell but I can go travel to a vacation somewhere just fine? Like comeon.....

 

Friend who works at airport said international flights really haven't ever dropped off, just domestics have.

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11 minutes ago, Russ said:

Friends parents just went for a month long vacation down in Mexico.  If you're going to tell me they can do that even with a 2 week quarantine when they get back then to hell with a bunch of these restrictions that really make no sense.  You tell me I can't visit family the next city over where we all are careful as hell but I can go travel to a vacation somewhere just fine? Like comeon.....

 

Friend who works at airport said international flights really haven't ever dropped off, just domestics have.

Yah, mexico for a month - then quarentine.    Then  back to twice a weeks mens rec hockey.  Cactus club dinners and a few  at the pub a few times a week. 

Suffering throught the BC pandemic....   BC's covid regs are a sad joke. 

 

 

 

 

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23 hours ago, DrJockitch said:

Your comments weren't directed at me but thought I might take the chance to answer some of them.  

I think this sort of questioning is very reasonable and fair as opposed to some of the other crap about natural immunity that is being spewed here.

I think the best way to think about it is cumulative risk.  Everything you do adds a little risk and you need to manage those risks to keep the sum of them to an acceptable level.  Also need to look at increased risks of infection for some activities as well as the background risks of those involved.

Schools are a risk but in general the risks of kids under 14 transmitting the virus are less than adults and older teens.  It is about half the risk by best estimation.  Parents work and are frequently dependant on schools to be open to work.  The calculation is made that for kids development and for parents work that the reduced risk is more palatable but parents get to make that choice.  Kids can be kept home as full time virtual classes are available.  When the numbers in an area get high enough or when there are cases in a school these get shutdown.  

Ultimately the combination of reduced risk, parents agreeing to keep children home when showing any signs of illness and the benefits to the economy went into this calculation.  I am not saying it adds up but that is the thinking.

At this time men's hockey should not be going on IMO.  That is ludicrous and just not worth the risk.

Personally my job puts me at significant risk for exposure and those that live with me have to accept that and we have personal isolation plans in place fr when I get higher risk exposures.  I would not take the risk of exposing anyone who doesn't live with me to me without PPE.  I have seen two buildings over the last several months my clinic and my house and yes am getting very sick of these.

I don't go out in public because I don't want to add to my cumulative risk or add to the exposure risk of the high risk people I work with.  My work risks combined with two kids in school makes my cumulative risk quite high.

It is good that you have taken these measures for the greater good and even more important because of the ass hats who won't take reasonable precautions and feel the need to spew their crap all over the internet to try to spread their self centred philosophies.  The responsible often have to bear the cross for the selfish.

Ultimately, you and your family can look at your situations and decide for yourselves what risks to take.  One of the issues though with the virus is that it spreads at a very high level before you even know you have it so it is really very difficult to say that you don't bring the virus anywhere as even with you taking these precautions there is a fair chance though this also depends on a lot of other factors like rates and other potential exposures.

If it is just the family that you live with those risks are cooked in but if bringing grandma with COPD from the nursing home over for Christmas that is a whole different risk profile for her and risk profile for exposure of the rest of the family.

Thank you!  This is one of the most thought out responses I have seen to anything through this pandemic. It is shining proof that people can discuss difficult topics with civility. Overall I agree with everything you said. While my opinion may be that schools should not be open if the risks are as high as they say I can understand and respect the fact that leaving them open allows others (such as health care professionals) can work and earn a living. My frustration is clearly part selfish...I don’t have children. This means when I come home I have no little fun factories to spend my time with. I have always had a very small close knit group of friends I spend most of my time with. The previous rules meant that I could follow them and stay reasonably safe. It annoys me that any household with children can interact with children, teachers and hundreds of people but I can’t see anyone except my wife. I admit this is a selfish approach but when hockey is being played at the arena (no I don’t play hockey, nor would I be going right now if I did) it seems wrong. Why can’t we all make decisions within some fair explainable boundaries of what is safe for us. I think 6 was enough...0 is draconian. I am generally a pretty level headed guy, but isolation is driving me nuts. Thanks again for a thought out response...I learned something today

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8 minutes ago, Amebushi said:

Thank you!  This is one of the most thought out responses I have seen to anything through this pandemic. It is shining proof that people can discuss difficult topics with civility. Overall I agree with everything you said. While my opinion may be that schools should not be open if the risks are as high as they say I can understand and respect the fact that leaving them open allows others (such as health care professionals) can work and earn a living. My frustration is clearly part selfish...I don’t have children. This means when I come home I have no little fun factories to spend my time with. I have always had a very small close knit group of friends I spend most of my time with. The previous rules meant that I could follow them and stay reasonably safe. It annoys me that any household with children can interact with children, teachers and hundreds of people but I can’t see anyone except my wife. I admit this is a selfish approach but when hockey is being played at the arena (no I don’t play hockey, nor would I be going right now if I did) it seems wrong. Why can’t we all make decisions within some fair explainable boundaries of what is safe for us. I think 6 was enough...0 is draconian. I am generally a pretty level headed guy, but isolation is driving me nuts. Thanks again for a thought out response...I learned something today

Truer words have never been spoken...yet at the exact same time you couldn't be more wrong.  

 

Ah, who am I kidding, you're right...just don't ask me 8 hours from now and have had a chance to change my mind :P

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15 hours ago, Sharpshooter said:

Yup. I mentioned that yesterday. Still don’t know why though. 

The PCs at the time were on a major privatization kick. Which would have been OK had the gov't supported the spin offs properly, which of course they didn't and we ended up being reliant on the US for most of our medial supplies. We're utterly dependent on the US now for everything from medical supplies to critical blood products to vaccines. 

 

We do have small start ups but as soon as they reach sales they typically get swallowed up by larger US firms. We incubate tech for Americans now. 

 

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