Coronavirus outbreak

[Alflives]

Holy crap!  People are so dumb, and allow the media to manipulate their thinking.  It’s sad really. 

Headlines are intentionally attention seeking.  They give you a presupposed view; it’s akin to brainwashing.  They lead you to interpret the article in a certain way.

The WHO is advising citizens follow the guidelines of their local health authorities.  Simple.  That’s the important information.

 

[BPA]

5 hours ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

Last two sentences depends on the office policy regarding working remotely, and whether or not enforcing the office policy (if 100% working remotely is not an option) can stand up against a challenge in court.

 

First two sentences are self-contradictory.  If she truly believed she could fight it off and gave that as the truthful reason for why she doesn't want the shots, she shouldn't be afraid of catching it in the office or anywhere else.  If she was truthful of fearing catching the coronavirus in the office, she should get vaccinated.  

 

Call her bluff.  It seems to me the real reason why she doesn't want to go into the office is because she doesn't want to go into the office (ie. she wants to continue working remotely 100%).  If performance is noticeably worse working remotely, that needs to be addressed through office policy and performance review.

Yep.  That seems to be the consensus by upper management.  It's going through HR to evaluate options.

[JM_]

12 hours ago, drummer4now said:

 I did and along with my original article and it says what I say.. 

 

No more plus 1's for you Jimmy boy.. 

I'll try to get over it. 

 

I don't think you understood the article, but sounds like you got the shot anyway so thats good. 

[JM_]

1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Holy crap!  People are so dumb, and allow the media to manipulate their thinking.  It’s sad really. 

Headlines are intentionally attention seeking.  They give you a presupposed view; it’s akin to brainwashing.  They lead you to interpret the article in a certain way.

The WHO is advising citizens follow the guidelines of their local health authorities.  Simple.  That’s the important information.

 

it really is. 

 

It sounds like the mRNA tech is going to be able to provide some really great new vaccines and cancer treatments sooner than later. I wonder if people are staring down cancer, if they will be quite as willing to let social media tell them what to do with their health? 

[JM_]

10 hours ago, UnkNuk said:

 

 

“There is limited data on mix and match. There are studies going on, we need to wait for that. Maybe it will be a very good approach. But, at the moment we only have data on the Oxford-AstraZeneca vaccine, followed by Pfizer. It will be a chaotic situation in countries if citizens start deciding when and who will be taking a second, a third and a fourth dose,” she said.

 

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Sure sounds to me like she's saying don't mix vaccines - for the time being, at least.
.

the full message was she thinks we need more info for individuals to make that kind of choice, and to follow what your local health authorities say. 

 

The problem is citizens deciding for themselves. People are skipping over that part. 

 

Also not surprising is WHO clarifying her statements today:

 

Swaminathan called mixing a "data-free zone" on Monday but the WHO clarified on Tuesday that some data was available and more was expected.

 

Its Strategic Advisory Group of Experts on vaccines in June said the Pfizer vaccine could be used as a second dose after an initial dose of AstraZeneca, if the latter is not available.

The results of a further clinical trial led by the University of Oxford that will look at mixing AstraZeneca and Pfizer as well as Moderna and Novovax vaccines is underway.

"Data from mix and match studies of different vaccines are awaited - immunogenicity and safety both need to be evaluated," the WHO said in emailed comments.

 

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/who-warns-against-people-mixing-and-matching-covid-vaccines-2021-07-13

Edited July 13, 2021 by Jimmy McGill

[KoreanHockeyFan]

13 hours ago, drummer4now said:

Your GF got AZ that is great bud.. but what about the people that got blood clots and actually died from it like one older gentlemen in Ontario.. 

I am sure they're thinking of your GF. 

 

 

Cost. Benefit. Analysis. 

 

Weigh the benefit (immunization) against the cost (rare blood clots). 

 

It's a really simple calculation that we all apply to our daily lives, not just with COVID vaccines.

[King Heffy]

31 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

the full message was she thinks we need more info for individuals to make that kind of choice, and to follow what your local health authorities say. 

 

The problem is citizens deciding for themselves. People are skipping over that part. 

 

Also not surprising is WHO clarifying her statements today:

 

Swaminathan called mixing a "data-free zone" on Monday but the WHO clarified on Tuesday that some data was available and more was expected.

 

Its Strategic Advisory Group of Experts on vaccines in June said the Pfizer vaccine could be used as a second dose after an initial dose of AstraZeneca, if the latter is not available.

The results of a further clinical trial led by the University of Oxford that will look at mixing AstraZeneca and Pfizer as well as Moderna and Novovax vaccines is underway.

"Data from mix and match studies of different vaccines are awaited - immunogenicity and safety both need to be evaluated," the WHO said in emailed comments.

 

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/who-warns-against-people-mixing-and-matching-covid-vaccines-2021-07-13

My main concern is whether I'll be considered fully vaccinated when I travel if I mix and match.

[JM_]

27 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

My main concern is whether I'll be considered fully vaccinated when I travel if I mix and match.

that'll all come down to effectiveness, which looks like from the AZ-Pfizer info so far to be really good. Should know pretty soon. 

[RUPERTKBD]

Say what you will about Emmanuel Macron (and I'm sure many will) but his "threat" of requiring proof of vaccination before entering restaurants, malls, planes and trains, seems to have been an effective strategy:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/lifestyle/smart-living/french-rush-to-get-vaccinated-after-presidents-warning/ar-AAM5GPS?li=AAggFp5

 

Quote

 

More than 1 million people in France made vaccine appointments in less than a day, according to figures released Tuesday, after the president cranked up pressure on everyone to get vaccinated to save the summer vacation season and the French economy.

Some bristled at President Emmanuel Macron’s admonition to “get vaccinated!” immediately, but many people signed up for shots, accepting that getting injected was the only way to return to some semblance of pre-pandemic life.

 

French government spokesman Gabriel Attal, noting the latest virus surges from South Africa to South Korea, and vaccine shortages in many poorer countries, appealed to his compatriots Tuesday to “look at what's happening in the world."

Macron also announced that special COVID-19 passes will be required starting in early August to enter restaurants and shopping malls and to get on trains and planes. The announcement raised questions and worries among foreign tourists and as residents of France planning vacations.

 

An app that centralizes France’s vaccine appointments, Doctolib, said Tuesday that 1.3 million people signed up for injections after Macron gave a televised address Monday night. It was a daily record since France rolled out coronavirus vaccines in December. People under age 35 made up most of the new appointments, Doctolib said.

Macron said vaccination would be obligatory for all health care workers by Sept. 15, and he held out the possibility of extending the requirement to others. Around 41% of the French population has been fully vaccinated, though the pace of shots being delivered has waned as summer vacations approached.

 

 

[UKNuck96]

2 hours ago, King Heffy said:

My main concern is whether I'll be considered fully vaccinated when I travel if I mix and match.

Depends if the AZ you got was Covishield from India and if you are planning on travelling to the EU, if so it’s not on The EUs approved list, so may cause some issues with their vaccine passport process, however it’s ultimately down to each country and some countries are using and allowing the Sputnik vaccine even though it’s not approved by the EU

[UKNuck96]

2 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

Say what you will about Emmanuel Macron (and I'm sure many will) but his "threat" of requiring proof of vaccination before entering restaurants, malls, planes and trains, seems to have been an effective strategy:

 

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/lifestyle/smart-living/french-rush-to-get-vaccinated-after-presidents-warning/ar-AAM5GPS?li=AAggFp5

 

 

He needed to do that considering he is a significant factor in the low take up rates in France 

[King Heffy]

Just now, UKNuck96 said:

Depends if the AZ you got was Covishield from India and if you are planning on travelling to the EU, if so it’s not on The EUs approved list, so may cause some issues with their vaccine passport process, however it’s ultimately down to each country and some countries are using and allowing the Sputnik vaccine even though it’s not approved by the EU

Didn't get AZ as frankly I didn't consider the efficacy to be good enough.  The concern for me is mixing Pfizer and Moderna.

[UKNuck96]

Just now, King Heffy said:

Didn't get AZ as frankly I didn't consider the efficacy to be good enough.  The concern for me is mixing Pfizer and Moderna.

For the EU travel that shouldn’t be an issue then 

[UKNuck96]

6 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Didn't get AZ as frankly I didn't consider the efficacy to be good enough.  The concern for me is mixing Pfizer and Moderna.

Also the efficacy isn’t a simple figure and the numbers initially were skewed by the type of people in the trials and vaccinated,

 

basically if you have an open rollout you will see better figures then if you have a rollout targeting the sickest groups.

 

based on the information I have seen for some danish studies for the over 85s AZ is actually the better one for them as it’s efficacy rate is quite a bit higher than Pfizer, around 80% vs 64%, however when you look at the under 50s Pfizer has significantly better efficacy figure. 
 

both though have a 90% effectiveness of reducing hospital admissions from COVID 

[-Vintage Canuck-]

 

[JM_]

6 hours ago, KoreanHockeyFan said:

Cost. Benefit. Analysis. 

 

Weigh the benefit (immunization) against the cost (rare blood clots). 

 

It's a really simple calculation that we all apply to our daily lives, not just with COVID vaccines.

^ this. Its what my wife and I did. We have aging parents that we look after and the chance of us bringing covid to them far outweighed the risks of us getting a clot with the AZ vaccine. 

 

[UnkNuk]

7 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

the full message was she thinks we need more info for individuals to make that kind of choice, and to follow what your local health authorities say. 

 

The problem is citizens deciding for themselves. People are skipping over that part. 

 

Also not surprising is WHO clarifying her statements today:

 

Swaminathan called mixing a "data-free zone" on Monday but the WHO clarified on Tuesday that some data was available and more was expected.

 

Its Strategic Advisory Group of Experts on vaccines in June said the Pfizer vaccine could be used as a second dose after an initial dose of AstraZeneca, if the latter is not available.

The results of a further clinical trial led by the University of Oxford that will look at mixing AstraZeneca and Pfizer as well as Moderna and Novovax vaccines is underway.

"Data from mix and match studies of different vaccines are awaited - immunogenicity and safety both need to be evaluated," the WHO said in emailed comments.

 

https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/who-warns-against-people-mixing-and-matching-covid-vaccines-2021-07-13

From the opening paragraph of the article:

 

**************************************************************************************************************************************************

 

The World Health Organization's chief scientist on Monday advised against people mixing and matching COVID-19 vaccines from different manufacturers, calling it a "dangerous trend" since more data is needed about the health impact.

 

*******************************************************************************************************************************************************

 

So we have the chief scientist at WHO advising people against mixing and matching COVID 19 vaccines and saying we don't have enough data to know about the health impact of mixing and matching.

 

Yes, there is some data suggesting it's okay to mix AZ with Pfizer.  But we have Canadian experts who told us some time ago that it was okay to mix and match Pfizer with Moderna.  So do the Canadian experts know of studies that the WHO chief scientist doesn't know about?

 

You can try to explain it away but the problem here is that we have conflicting expert advice.  And this type of conflicting advice can reinforce the reluctance of those who are nervous about taking the vaccine.

[bishopshodan]

My bro doesn't want to get vaccinated.

 

I mean, he's an over weight stress case in his 50's that smokes a couple packs a day. But you know, he's read some things and is concerned about his health.

[Russ]

1 hour ago, -Vintage Canuck- said:

 

I got to say I am surprised its that high.  I thought there would be enough people hesitant to get it, looks like lots of right wingers still believe in science.  Now to see the far right.....

[King Heffy]

25 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

My bro doesn't want to get vaccinated.

 

I mean, he's an over weight stress case in his 50's that smokes a couple packs a day. But you know, he's read some things and is concerned about his health.

I'm hoping my friend who is hesitant will have to quarantine in one of the hotels next time he comes back from the US.  Maybe money will motivate him.