24K PureCool Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 17 minutes ago, Sharpshooter said: The thing is though, is that the unvaccinated are ‘playing god’ not only with themselves, but with others. That level of willful callousness doesn’t deserve to be supported or rewarded with being put at the front of the line in an overburdened health care system. I don’t mourn and will never mourn the stubborn and stupid who don’t get the vaccine and then want our tax dollars to fund their healthcare because they got the virus. &^@# them. They don’t give a $&!# about &^@#ing anyone else. As a society, the needs of the many outweigh the needs of the stupid few that won’t do the simple things to protect the society they live in. Those idiots are more than willing to get shots for any numbers or viruses, but all of a sudden they’re against this one that will also save their lives. I have no sympathy for anti-vaxxers who die from Covid. I don’t care about how many death-bed videos and messages they send out wishing they got the vaccine after being on the front lines of spreading misinformation, actively discouraging others, and/or putting others at risk. That will go against the Hippocratic oath but I can live with prioritizing vaccinated covid patients rather than unvaccinated ones if they need the same level of care. Like I suggested, start charging or charge more premiums for those ant-vaxx for clogging up the system. This is one of the few instances that the free market insurance principle will 100% help our healthcare system with no downside. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashian Kassian Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 (edited) 14 minutes ago, 24K PureCool said: Goal is to get 100% vaccination rate for those eligible and not medically exempt. We can stop the testing once we hit like 95% vaccination rate. K maybe not for those under 12 when it get eventually approved as that is another can of worms there. This whole big can of worms is so tiring, definitely don't need to open another one. In the bigger picture 95% should be taken as a huge success - I'm sure many months ago everyone would've taken that gladly. Even 90% for that matter, honestly. I don't know... I hate all of this, I hate this 'debate', I hate having to debate fellow humans being classified as non-essential. And the heartbreaking part to me is that all the lives lost, all the businesses/livelihoods destroyed, the extreme division and hatred sown, exc. and there is probably never going to be a real explanation of the origin, or recourse for the suffering. Edited September 23, 2021 by Smashian Kassian 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 14 minutes ago, Smashian Kassian said: This whole big can of worms is so tiring, definitely don't need to open another one. In the bigger picture 95% should be taken as a huge success - I'm sure many months ago everyone would've taken that gladly. Even 90% for that matter, honestly. I don't know... I hate all of this, I hate this 'debate', I hate having to debate fellow humans being classified as non-essential. And the heartbreaking part to me is that all the lives lost, all the businesses/livelihoods destroyed, the extreme division and hatred sown, exc. and there is probably never going to be a real explanation of the origin, or recourse for the suffering. I have to say that I agree with pretty much everything you said. I hate that we are forced to have discussions about who should get priority treatment in hospitals. I hate that some people may lose their jobs. I hate that many of these needless deaths of the unvaccinated leave grieving families with young children behind. Most of all I hate that the gentleman I mentioned earlier likely got his death sentence handed to him when his cancer surgery was postponed because the hospital was filled with mostly unvaccinated Covid patients. His death will have been every bit as needless, but the only difference is that his will be because of the choices made by others, not his own. 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Smashian Kassian Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 3 minutes ago, 4petesake said: I have to say that I agree with pretty much everything you said. I hate that we are forced to have discussions about who should get priority treatment in hospitals. I hate that some people may lose their jobs. I hate that many of these needless deaths of the unvaccinated leave grieving families with young children behind. Most of all I hate that the gentleman I mentioned earlier likely got his death sentence handed to him when his cancer surgery was postponed because the hospital was filled with mostly unvaccinated Covid patients. His death will have been every bit as needless, but the only difference is that his will be because of the choices made by others, not his own. Thats so beyond awful, I don't really know what to say. Honestly I missed this post of yours, is there really not anywhere else he could theoretically be transferred too for this surgery? (Somewhere the hospital isn't as filled). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thedestroyerofworlds Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 https://www.citynews1130.com/video/2021/09/22/covid-party-send-edson-residents-to-edmonton-icu/ ‘COVID party’ send Edson residents to Edmonton ICU “It’s just unbelievable.” A number of Edson residents are in Edmonton ICUs following a gathering to try and get COVID-19– as a way to achieve natural immunity. One virologist explains why that’s a dangerous idea. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
24K PureCool Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 Just now, thedestroyerofworlds said: https://www.citynews1130.com/video/2021/09/22/covid-party-send-edson-residents-to-edmonton-icu/ ‘COVID party’ send Edson residents to Edmonton ICU “It’s just unbelievable.” A number of Edson residents are in Edmonton ICUs following a gathering to try and get COVID-19– as a way to achieve natural immunity. One virologist explains why that’s a dangerous idea. Thought this fad was over. Really want these people to pay out of pocket for medical expanses rather than the tax payers. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post Mackcanuck Posted September 23, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted September 23, 2021 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johngould21 Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 (edited) Pre travel Covid tests? My dil's two aunts from Sweden were supposed to arrive today. They got to the airport, and were told they didn't take the proper test that would have allowed them to fly. I would assume these tests cost approx. $200, so why is it that the testing people don't know which test to give? Or, is this an airline issue, with not giving this information to their guests? Has anyone experienced this? I've heard this twice now coming from Sweden to Canada. They were offered an instant test which would have allowed them to travel, cost approx. $450, it makes me think this is an outright scam, or money grab. Edited September 23, 2021 by johngould21 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 10 hours ago, Warhippy said: This....this is where people are now with this in terms of misinformation. How absolutely sad that people need to create such lies and falsehoods in a world where their opinions are being further squeezed out by fact. Edit** I don't know how to hide the post because it has some language issues in it. Please don't hate me Choices have consequences. He made a choice to flush his career down the toilet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said: This whole big can of worms is so tiring, definitely don't need to open another one. In the bigger picture 95% should be taken as a huge success - I'm sure many months ago everyone would've taken that gladly. Even 90% for that matter, honestly. I don't know... I hate all of this, I hate this 'debate', I hate having to debate fellow humans being classified as non-essential. And the heartbreaking part to me is that all the lives lost, all the businesses/livelihoods destroyed, the extreme division and hatred sown, exc. and there is probably never going to be a real explanation of the origin, or recourse for the suffering. Sorry, it's one small segment of society who are making the conscious decision to divide themselves off from the vast majority of society........there is no "stark" divide in our country. A huge chunk of us are united and pulling in the same direction and one small segment actively trying to derail the rest of us? Should we feel empathy for their deliberate attempt to create chaos? Not from me. If it comes down to having to decide who gets care and who doesn't, then those who wilfully choose to not listen to science I say Sorry, not sorry Edited September 23, 2021 by stawns 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 8 minutes ago, stawns said: Sorry, it's one small segment of society who are making the conscious decision to divide themselves off from the vast majority of society........there is no "stark" divide in our country. A huge chunk of us are united and pulling in the same direction and one small segment actively trying to derail the rest of us? Should we feel empathy for their deliberate attempt to create chaos? Not from me. If it comes down to having to decide who gets care and who doesn't, then those who wilfully choose to not listen to science I say Sorry, not sorry its like having a teen who does something dumb, and says you're dividing the family if you punish them 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johngould21 Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 30 minutes ago, stawns said: Choices have consequences. He made a choice to flush his career down the toilet I say good luck at that 9-5 job for the rest of your life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJockitch Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 9 minutes ago, JM_ said: its like having a teen who does something dumb, and says you're dividing the family if you punish them No doctor is going to be able to say we deny service because you made bad choices, we just keep patching you up and saying make better choices. The thanks for that is blame and protests. Yes, it is a lot like dealing with teenagers in that this is not in any way about logic, at this point it is emotional and often linked to other issues. A lot of what is going on is people that feel powerless want to feel they have power. Sometimes it is because of past traumas, sometimes they just believe they are outsmarting all the public health professionals with their lack of training and misunderstanding of the situation, sometimes they just watch Fox News and believe it is a plot to (fill inthe blank conspiracy theory). As a doctor I can’t fix stupid and can’t triage someone away because they fell into a conspiracy theory rabbit hole. As always we just try to do the best with the staff, facilities and supplies we have. Whether you decided to jump head first into an empty swimming pool or deny simple, safe preventative measures for a pandemic our job is to try to patch you up and send you out to do the next stupid thing. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 9 minutes ago, johngould21 said: I say good luck at that 9-5 job for the rest of your life. he's not likely to have many skills for the job market, that's for sure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RUPERTKBD Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 9 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said: This doesn't make alot of sense. All variants currently in our country have come from other countries - because the government has never taken travel bans seriously at any point, which has been an absolute ****ing joke. . I disagree. Regardless of where the variants originated, the "vaccine hesitant" are allowing them to spread. It's not a coincidence that infection rates are higher in areas where the total number of vaccinated people is lower. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJockitch Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 11 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said: I disagree. Regardless of where the variants originated, the "vaccine hesitant" are allowing them to spread. It's not a coincidence that infection rates are higher in areas where the total number of vaccinated people is lower. These variants aren’t something that just occurs once. Anywhere virus is replicating at high rates is at risk. The country names were just where they were first identified, they can occur spontaneously anywhere. This is a misunderstanding that it only occurs once in whatever country and that travel bans will stop it from occurring in your country. Best way to prevent re-occurrences of variants and development of new variants is to reduce viral replication. Only model for that is immunization and social distancing. Anytime there is a new variant of concern though lockdowns and travel restrictions are important but by the time it is identified, the cat is usually out of the bag. So unimmunized are a reserve for the development and spread of variants, not just the spread. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 8 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said: Thats so beyond awful, I don't really know what to say. Honestly I missed this post of yours, is there really not anywhere else he could theoretically be transferred too for this surgery? (Somewhere the hospital isn't as filled). If I’m not mistaken it was from Alberta so there aren’t a lot of options. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 18 minutes ago, DrJockitch said: These variants aren’t something that just occurs once. Anywhere virus is replicating at high rates is at risk. The country names were just where they were first identified, they can occur spontaneously anywhere. This is a misunderstanding that it only occurs once in whatever country and that travel bans will stop it from occurring in your country. Best way to prevent re-occurrences of variants and development of new variants is to reduce viral replication. Only model for that is immunization and social distancing. Anytime there is a new variant of concern though lockdowns and travel restrictions are important but by the time it is identified, the cat is usually out of the bag. So unimmunized are a reserve for the development and spread of variants, not just the spread. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted September 23, 2021 Share Posted September 23, 2021 8 hours ago, Smashian Kassian said: is there really not anywhere else he could theoretically be transferred too for this surgery? (Somewhere the hospital isn't as filled). I'm guessing you missed the post stating that they have closed down the surgery rooms in Alberta's Children's Hospital so they can turn them into covid/icu wards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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