Coronavirus outbreak

[Alflives]

8 minutes ago, 4petesake said:

I went online to try to find this list of the 11000 doctors that signed this declaration. There isn’t one.  This is an online petition that anyone can sign. “Physician” is the default title in the “signing as” box. I could haven signed it as is and my name would have been added as a doctor.  I couldn’t find a single reputable news source that reported anything other than the Medical summit itself. Every site that reported on numbers for this petition had links to other sites like “Steve Bannon’s War Room.” That could be why Trump’s name would be brought up.

 

 

Do you find it as strange as I do the lengths the antivax Covidiot Maskchinians go to avoid getting a life saving vaccine?  They even eat horse dewormer, huff bleach, and gobble down fish tank cleaner.  Seriously, these people are nuts.  

Edited October 10, 2021 by Alflives

[JM_]

6 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Do you find it as strange as I do the lengths the antivax Covidiot Maskchinians go to avoid getting a life saving vaccine?  They even eat horse dewormer, huff bleach, and gobble down fish tank cleaner.  Seriously, these people are nuts.  

never before in human history have so many people been able to demonstrate how stupid they are. Its the golden age of dumb.

[thedestroyerofworlds]

Got another one.  One of the owners posted to the Facebook group “BC Businesses against Health Pass”.  I think health officers should do a deep dive into that page and target every business owner who signed on or posted to the group.  I wouldn't be surprised if the owners of the Hope restaurant were part of the group as well.

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/8256326/kelowna-restaurant-shut-down/

Kelowna restaurant shut down for not verifying proof of vaccination: Interior Health

[bishopshodan]

5 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

Got another one.  One of the owners posted to the Facebook group “BC Businesses against Health Pass”.  I think health officers should do a deep dive into that page and target every business owner who signed on or posted to the group.  I wouldn't be surprised if the owners of the Hope restaurant were part of the group as well.

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/8256326/kelowna-restaurant-shut-down/

Kelowna restaurant shut down for not verifying proof of vaccination: Interior Health

I think I read that the Hope restaurant is getting fined $100 a day for defying their suspended license?

If I am correct, I dont think that is enough. 

These places need to be chained shut and face heavier financial punishment. 

[4petesake]

30 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

Got another one.  One of the owners posted to the Facebook group “BC Businesses against Health Pass”.  I think health officers should do a deep dive into that page and target every business owner who signed on or posted to the group.  I wouldn't be surprised if the owners of the Hope restaurant were part of the group as well.

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/8256326/kelowna-restaurant-shut-down/

Kelowna restaurant shut down for not verifying proof of vaccination: Interior Health

Apparently the owners may have misread the room by just a skootch…

 

That post said, “we’ve decided that we will remain open to all,” hoping that the restaurant’s stance may encourage other restaurant owners to defy B.C.’s proof-of-vaccination system.

 

 

[Alflives]

23 minutes ago, bishopshodan said:

I think I read that the Hope restaurant is getting fined $100 a day for defying their suspended license?

If I am correct, I dont think that is enough. 

These places need to be chained shut and face heavier financial punishment. 

It’s a Worksafe BC concern too.  Should be able to close them for unsafe workplace.  

Could we get these Covididiot antivaxxers to sign a waiver saying they give up their right to medical care?  

[gurn]

If these restaurants have decided not to follow the rules; can they get upset with me, if I decide not to follow the rules and smack them upside the head?

[Shayster007]

59 minutes ago, JM_ said:

never before in human history have so many people been able to demonstrate how stupid they are. Its the golden age of dumb.

I honestly think this is a weird form of natural selection. Due to advances in medicine, and how generally humans are much safer then ever before, nature needs a way to perform a necessary part of any species existence. I honestly believe a part of the population is born with a deficiency in logic, compassion, and common sense.

 

Those people will always find a way to be at risk of natural selection. Don't matter whether it's falling off a cliff, getting trampled my a stampede of antelope, not whereing their seatbelt, or now fighting the covid vaccine. Nature will always find a way to keep the population moving forward. 

[JM_]

2 minutes ago, Shayster007 said:

I honestly think this is a weird form of natural selection. Due to advances in medicine, and how generally humans are much safer then ever before, nature needs a way to perform a necessary part of any species existence. I honestly believe a part of the population is born with a deficiency in logic, compassion, and common sense.

 

Those people will always find a way to be at risk of natural selection. Don't matter whether it's falling off a cliff, getting trampled my a stampede of antelope, not whereing their seatbelt, or now fighting the covid vaccine. Nature will always find a way to keep the population moving forward. 

I guess we need to add going to a Stampede pancake breakfast to that list.

[Ghostsof1915]

I'm more concerned that Nurses (Not sure about Doctors) that are resigning because its a requirement to get vaccinated. 

I saw one who claims she was a nurse, but I notice:

- She didn't name the hospital.

- Didn't state which hospital suspended her. Nor did it say was she suspended for not getting vaccinated or something else?

- Didn't state where she graduated from.

- She looked more like a model. 

 

Maybe it's better if you don't believe your own profession, to leave it. 

[Lancaster]

4 hours ago, JM_ said:

Tokyo is such a great place, I'm happy for you. What are you doing there?

 

They had a lot of restrictions in place, so that seems to account for the drop from the scary numbers earlier this summer: https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/sep/28/japan-to-end-state-of-emergency-as-covid-cases-plummet

Unfortunately still in YVR.  Wanted to go over, but 10-14 days hotel quarantine with 2 toddlers?  No way, lol.  

 

Lots of restriction over there, but still comparatively less than in Canada.  Feels like Canada is trying to "push the envelope" to see how much the public will tolerate and once there are pushback, label that group with derogatory terms and get the "converted" to go after said group.  Any questions get blasted with the motto "Listen to the science" which is akin to "Shut up!".  Question the people who are in the position of authority (eg. following their funding, past professional connections, etc.) and it's a "conspiracy theory".  

Headlines are filled with biased interpretation of numbers and stats to follow a narrative.  Alternative treatment that requires more funding and research are immediately dismissed as "horse medicine" or "junk science".... even though there are plenty of articles prior to 2019 of stuff like ivermectin, NAC, etc... being used to treat pneumonia, SARS, influenza, etc.... stuff that are closely associated with COVID.  But it's against dogma to mention it.  

 

There's like zealous mob mentality going on in Canada.  Not gonna say it's 1984 or whatever... but talking to my parents who went through the Cultural Revolution in China... they say it's not too far off.  One definition of insanity is repeating the same thing over and over again.... Canada is starting to feel like that.  "Quick!  Everyone get vaxxed!  Cases are rising?!  More Vax!  Still rising?  Must be those who aren't vaxxed are to be blamed!  More vax!"  Whereas Japan is "let kinda wait and see.... everyone... try to be good" and they're doing better than here.  Why aren't Canadians pissed at the government for their current ineptitude?  Why aren't people questioning the decisions made by the government more?  Why are people accepting that current implementations are far inferior to those like in Japan?  Why is the government and those who support them are so keen on doubling down instead of just admitting that maybe they have no idea what they are doing and maybe they're making mistakes? 

[JM_]

5 minutes ago, Lancaster said:

Unfortunately still in YVR.  Wanted to go over, but 10-14 days hotel quarantine with 2 toddlers?  No way, lol.  

 

Lots of restriction over there, but still comparatively less than in Canada.  Feels like Canada is trying to "push the envelope" to see how much the public will tolerate and once there are pushback, label that group with derogatory terms and get the "converted" to go after said group.  Any questions get blasted with the motto "Listen to the science" which is akin to "Shut up!".  Question the people who are in the position of authority (eg. following their funding, past professional connections, etc.) and it's a "conspiracy theory".  

Headlines are filled with biased interpretation of numbers and stats to follow a narrative.  Alternative treatment that requires more funding and research are immediately dismissed as "horse medicine" or "junk science".... even though there are plenty of articles prior to 2019 of stuff like ivermectin, NAC, etc... being used to treat pneumonia, SARS, influenza, etc.... stuff that are closely associated with COVID.  But it's against dogma to mention it.  

 

There's like zealous mob mentality going on in Canada.  Not gonna say it's 1984 or whatever... but talking to my parents who went through the Cultural Revolution in China... they say it's not too far off.  One definition of insanity is repeating the same thing over and over again.... Canada is starting to feel like that.  "Quick!  Everyone get vaxxed!  Cases are rising?!  More Vax!  Still rising?  Must be those who aren't vaxxed are to be blamed!  More vax!"  Whereas Japan is "let kinda wait and see.... everyone... try to be good" and they're doing better than here.  Why aren't Canadians pissed at the government for their current ineptitude?  Why aren't people questioning the decisions made by the government more?  Why are people accepting that current implementations are far inferior to those like in Japan?  Why is the government and those who support them are so keen on doubling down instead of just admitting that maybe they have no idea what they are doing and maybe they're making mistakes? 

I don't see the same mistakes or mob that you do. I see $40 worth of vaccine keeping you, your loved ones or even someone you never met out of the ICU 9 times out of 10. That's pretty amazing, and people being mad at those that want to turn it into a political statement and not get the shot, are quite justified  in their anger imo.

 

There just isn't a good reason not to get it if you're able to.

 

 

 

Edited October 10, 2021 by JM_

[Lancaster]

3 minutes ago, JM_ said:

I don't see the same mistakes or mob that you do. I see $40 worth of vaccine keeping you, your loved ones or even someone you never met out of the ICU 9 times out of 10. That's pretty amazing, and people being mad at those that want to turn it into a political statement are quite justified imo.

 

 

Whether the vaccine is worthwhile or not, the question remains on how Japan has done squat and ended up better than Canada.  Shouldn't we be more like Japan instead?

People are too hung up on what errors the US is making.  Instead of just focusing on what does not work, why not focus on what is working?

 

One of the reason it's political is because many are mixing in politics in it.  If I said I am American and didn't get vaccinated.... what assumptions would be made?  That I am a Trump supporter, bible thumping, white dude who only graduated from high school?  Whether or not that is even accurate, the same playbook would be used against me regardless.  

Many people are pro-vaccine and are against the passport, but they're still labelled as anti-vaxxers.  It's just simply divisive politics.  In a secular society, some people treat politics as their religion.  Go against their political opinions (especially if it related to covid), then you're fair game for a 21st century inquisition (eg. cancelled, online harassment, doxxed, unfriended, etc).  I know some people who immigrated to Canada and are thinking of moving back to their home country as they feel Canada is become way too authoritative.... too different from the Canada they initially fell in love with.  

[Alflives]

57 minutes ago, Lancaster said:

Whether the vaccine is worthwhile or not, the question remains on how Japan has done squat and ended up better than Canada.  Shouldn't we be more like Japan instead?

People are too hung up on what errors the US is making.  Instead of just focusing on what does not work, why not focus on what is working?

 

One of the reason it's political is because many are mixing in politics in it.  If I said I am American and didn't get vaccinated.... what assumptions would be made?  That I am a Trump supporter, bible thumping, white dude who only graduated from high school?  Whether or not that is even accurate, the same playbook would be used against me regardless.  

Many people are pro-vaccine and are against the passport, but they're still labelled as anti-vaxxers.  It's just simply divisive politics.  In a secular society, some people treat politics as their religion.  Go against their political opinions (especially if it related to covid), then you're fair game for a 21st century inquisition (eg. cancelled, online harassment, doxxed, unfriended, etc).  I know some people who immigrated to Canada and are thinking of moving back to their home country as they feel Canada is become way too authoritative.... too different from the Canada they initially fell in love with.  

Holy crap!  Just get vaccinated.  

1 out of every 500 Americans has died from Covid.

We are not stupid like them, or shouldn’t be.  

[stawns]

2 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Unfortunately still in YVR.  Wanted to go over, but 10-14 days hotel quarantine with 2 toddlers?  No way, lol.  

 

Lots of restriction over there, but still comparatively less than in Canada.  Feels like Canada is trying to "push the envelope" to see how much the public will tolerate and once there are pushback, label that group with derogatory terms and get the "converted" to go after said group.  Any questions get blasted with the motto "Listen to the science" which is akin to "Shut up!".  Question the people who are in the position of authority (eg. following their funding, past professional connections, etc.) and it's a "conspiracy theory".  

Headlines are filled with biased interpretation of numbers and stats to follow a narrative.  Alternative treatment that requires more funding and research are immediately dismissed as "horse medicine" or "junk science".... even though there are plenty of articles prior to 2019 of stuff like ivermectin, NAC, etc... being used to treat pneumonia, SARS, influenza, etc.... stuff that are closely associated with COVID.  But it's against dogma to mention it.  

 

There's like zealous mob mentality going on in Canada.  Not gonna say it's 1984 or whatever... but talking to my parents who went through the Cultural Revolution in China... they say it's not too far off.  One definition of insanity is repeating the same thing over and over again.... Canada is starting to feel like that.  "Quick!  Everyone get vaxxed!  Cases are rising?!  More Vax!  Still rising?  Must be those who aren't vaxxed are to be blamed!  More vax!"  Whereas Japan is "let kinda wait and see.... everyone... try to be good" and they're doing better than here.  Why aren't Canadians pissed at the government for their current ineptitude?  Why aren't people questioning the decisions made by the government more?  Why are people accepting that current implementations are far inferior to those like in Japan?  Why is the government and those who support them are so keen on doubling down instead of just admitting that maybe they have no idea what they are doing and maybe they're making mistakes? 

or Canada has a lot of people who really care about the people in their communities.

[Kurgom]

5 hours ago, Shayster007 said:

Due to advances in medicine, and how generally humans are much safer then ever before, nature needs a way to perform a necessary part of any species existence.

Nature doesn't "perform" evolution, this is a bad line of thinking that is used to push eugenics. Environments change and random genetic mutations will adapt to the changes with varying degrees of success. Getting a vaccine is a choice, not a gene.

 

2 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Whether the vaccine is worthwhile or not, the question remains on how Japan has done squat and ended up better than Canada.  Shouldn't we be more like Japan instead?

People are too hung up on what errors the US is making.  Instead of just focusing on what does not work, why not focus on what is working?

 

One of the reason it's political is because many are mixing in politics in it.  If I said I am American and didn't get vaccinated.... what assumptions would be made?  That I am a Trump supporter, bible thumping, white dude who only graduated from high school?  Whether or not that is even accurate, the same playbook would be used against me regardless.  

Many people are pro-vaccine and are against the passport, but they're still labelled as anti-vaxxers.  It's just simply divisive politics.  In a secular society, some people treat politics as their religion.  Go against their political opinions (especially if it related to covid), then you're fair game for a 21st century inquisition (eg. cancelled, online harassment, doxxed, unfriended, etc).  I know some people who immigrated to Canada and are thinking of moving back to their home country as they feel Canada is become way too authoritative.... too different from the Canada they initially fell in love with.  

Japan not only is an Island but has the most socially responsible population in the world and it's not even close. The reason we aren't Japan is we will have people that go to work with covid when they're told not to go to work when sick, while in Japan a person will let their lights go out and not eat if they have to, to not spread the disease. Every single person wears a mask outside their house in cities, even outdoors. People starved to death during the state of emergency in Japan, and they've been more intense in their "lock downs" than ours. I honestly doubt there are many countries you could immigrate to and feel less authority from the government than Canada, especially with how the world has been shifting towards authoritarianism globally. I bet they'll regret it if they do.

 

There is merit to what you are saying about divisive politics but bud, it's not any better anywhere else on the planet right now. At least in Canada, we're at a "you get chased off the internet" level of mob rule while other parts of the world will kill you for thinking the wrong things or praying to the wrong gods.

Edited October 11, 2021 by Kurgom

[Shayster007]

18 minutes ago, Kurgom said:

Nature doesn't "perform" evolution, this is a bad line of thinking that is used to push eugenics. Environments change and random genetic mutations will adapt to the changes with varying degrees of success. Getting a vaccine is a choice, not a gene.

 

Japan not only is an Island but has the most socially responsible population in the world and it's not even close. The reason we aren't Japan is we will have people that go to work with covid when they're told not to go to work when sick, while in Japan a person will let their lights go out and not eat if they have to, to not spread the disease. Every single person wears a mask outside their house in cities, even outdoors. People starved to death during the state of emergency in Japan, and they've been more intense in their "lock downs" than ours. I honestly doubt there are many countries you could immigrate to and feel less authority from the government than Canada, especially with how the world has been shifting towards authoritarianism globally. I bet they'll regret it if they do.

 

There is merit to what you are saying about divisive politics but bud, it's not any better anywhere else on the planet right now. At least in Canada, we're at a "you get chased off the internet" level of mob rule while other parts of the world will kill you for thinking the wrong things or praying to the wrong gods.

Never said getting a vaccine is a gene. I said being selfish, lacking common sense, and being born without compassion for those around you is though. I equate those qualities to a large portion of the population who are anti-vaccine. Not all of them, but a large portion.

 

Getting the vaccine gives you the best chance of surving this pandemic. That is indisputable. Let's forget about helping the people around you stay healthy. If we just look at it from a personal level, not getting the vaccine increases your chance of having serious defects for the rest of your life, or even death. The part of the population that choose to get the vaccine increases their chance of survival. Seems close enough to me.

[4petesake]

3 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Whether the vaccine is worthwhile or not, the question remains on how Japan has done squat and ended up better than Canada.  Shouldn't we be more like Japan instead?

People are too hung up on what errors the US is making.  Instead of just focusing on what does not work, why not focus on what is working?

 

One of the reason it's political is because many are mixing in politics in it.  If I said I am American and didn't get vaccinated.... what assumptions would be made?  That I am a Trump supporter, bible thumping, white dude who only graduated from high school?  Whether or not that is even accurate, the same playbook would be used against me regardless.  

Many people are pro-vaccine and are against the passport, but they're still labelled as anti-vaxxers.  It's just simply divisive politics.  In a secular society, some people treat politics as their religion.  Go against their political opinions (especially if it related to covid), then you're fair game for a 21st century inquisition (eg. cancelled, online harassment, doxxed, unfriended, etc).  I know some people who immigrated to Canada and are thinking of moving back to their home country as they feel Canada is become way too authoritative.... too different from the Canada they initially fell in love with.  

Sorry but there are several points here that I can’t agree with. Where do you see that Japan has done squat? I do agree that Canada should be more like Japan with our measures though. Check out the list of citizens from countries that Japan denied entry.

 

Canada does have a higher partially vaccinated rate (78%)  but Japan is not significantly lower (72%). Our fully vaccinated rate is much higher.

 

There are posters here who are vaccinated but don’t agree with vaccine passports. I hope that I’m not misstating your position @VancouverHabitantthat while I may disagree with, I still fully respect their view. I don’t think that anyone here would label this poster as an anti-vaxxer. For some the passport is a step too far, for the rest of us it’s a necessary step to help move forward to get to the point where hospitals & ICUs can adequately handle Covid caseloads and still give timely healthcare to the rest of society. 
 

 

[JM_]

3 hours ago, Lancaster said:

Whether the vaccine is worthwhile or not, the question remains on how Japan has done squat and ended up better than Canada.  Shouldn't we be more like Japan instead?

People are too hung up on what errors the US is making.  Instead of just focusing on what does not work, why not focus on what is working?

 

One of the reason it's political is because many are mixing in politics in it.  If I said I am American and didn't get vaccinated.... what assumptions would be made?  That I am a Trump supporter, bible thumping, white dude who only graduated from high school?  Whether or not that is even accurate, the same playbook would be used against me regardless.  

Many people are pro-vaccine and are against the passport, but they're still labelled as anti-vaxxers.  It's just simply divisive politics.  In a secular society, some people treat politics as their religion.  Go against their political opinions (especially if it related to covid), then you're fair game for a 21st century inquisition (eg. cancelled, online harassment, doxxed, unfriended, etc).  I know some people who immigrated to Canada and are thinking of moving back to their home country as they feel Canada is become way too authoritative.... too different from the Canada they initially fell in love with.  

But Japan did have a major lockdown phase, and they are vaccinating.

 

I probably would assume those things about you because the statistics would back up my assumption. Of course you could be in the minority of people not a Trumper and anti-vaxxer.

 

I think people who are anti-passport still get grief because it allows the anti-vaxxers some leeway, which to me is unacceptable. Its such a small thing, and the slippery slope / 1984 stuff just isn't reality.

 

A lot of people have really suffered and lost people they love, its not just about being on a high horse.

 

[VancouverHabitant]

Don't drag me back into this @4petesake !!!  lol 

 

I only read the comment that you quoted by @Lancaster and I'll just ignore the Japan vs Canada conversation... 

 

 

I agree with @Lancaster that there is an active witch hunt out there for anyone that doesn't want to get the vaccine.  I think it's absolutely mental where our society has gotten to in the last 18 months.  Media (and especially "social" media) has really demonized this shrinking percentage of the population by equating them to people that don't care about others, are uneducated, right-wing Trump supporters.  What's the first thing we hear now?  "Anti-vaxxer!"  No sign of looking at an individual, they're all painted with the same broad brush.  

 

Keeping unvaccinated people from doing any social activities, working out, etc is very harsh.  Maybe I shouldn't be surprised as it's in human nature to pick a small percentage of population and gang up on them.  

At this point we may as well stop the BS about the vaccine being optional because it's really not for all intents and purposes.  People are losing their jobs and livelihoods over it and everybody wants them to suffer more and more until they give in. 

I've stopped caring about it all, the only impact that it has on me now is if I want to go out for a drink I'm not able to invite some of my friends that aren't vaccinated.