Coronavirus outbreak

[JM_]

Just now, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

There you go moving the goalposts again.  

Nobody said that masks will protect all the time.

meh, no one moved anything. I don't have any agenda here. If you can't talk about this without getting moody maybe don't respond to me. 

[Jimmy James]

1 hour ago, JM_ said:

for a while. Its not a good idea to give the impression that a mask will protect you all the time, because there are conditions where they don't. 

Condoms are 98% effective. I’m pretty sure people are capable of accepting reality, and making it work.
 

Nobody ever said masks were a fail-safe, they were only ever a protective layer for crowded areas. Outrageously effective at reducing infection. 
 

All of BC’s doctors saw and were exposed to Covid patients throughout the last few years. Vaccines, masks and PPE’s worked really well for them. That strong evidence in my book.

Edited October 21, 2022 by Jimmy James

[I.Am.Ironman]

4 hours ago, 4petesake said:

“Gravity ain’t real…”

 

 

 

I've crawled through that exact tunnel... ass puckering for sure. Hands are sweating just thinking about it. It's in Switzerland.

[KristoffWixenschon]

1 hour ago, Jimmy James said:

Condoms are 98% effective. I’m pretty sure people are capable of accepting reality, and making it work.
 

Nobody ever said masks were a fail-safe, they were only ever a protective layer for crowded areas. Outrageously effective at reducing infection. 
 

All of BC’s doctors saw and were exposed to Covid patients throughout the last few years. Vaccines, masks and PPE’s worked really well for them. That strong evidence in my book.

That's a properly fitted N95 mask vs an improperly worn decorative cloth mask. 

 

I still feel like the cloth masks do help somewhat. But you're probably both right. Masks were probably helpful to reduce some transmission. But also, people can get way too complacent wearing a cloth mask that doesnt work as well as they think it does.

[4petesake]

57 minutes ago, I.Am.Ironman said:

I've crawled through that exact tunnel... ass puckering for sure. Hands are sweating just thinking about it. It's in Switzerland.

Can.NOT.even…

Feel a little nauseous just watching someone else do it.

[Jimmy James]

1 hour ago, KristoffWixenschon said:

That's a properly fitted N95 mask vs an improperly worn decorative cloth mask. 

 

I still feel like the cloth masks do help somewhat. But you're probably both right. Masks were probably helpful to reduce some transmission. But also, people can get way too complacent wearing a cloth mask that doesnt work as well as they think it does.

You’re not wrong there

 

cloth masks are to the N95, what the sponge or the rhythm-method is to birth control. 

Edited October 21, 2022 by Jimmy James

[WeneedLumme]

14 hours ago, 6of1_halfdozenofother said:

Sure, but you missed the key point.  Ron's contention was that people exercising caution by masking was (in his mind) a display of fear and an affront to science and logic.  My point is that the science and logic don't support his contention.

 

Not to mention that choosing to exercise caution is not a display of fear; in fact, it's a prudent approach to an unknown situation.  Knowing him personally though, prudent doesn't seem to be in his vocabulary - and if it is, he certainly doesn't seem to exercise it all that much.

Yeah, hard to take someone seriously who is proud of the fact that he evaded the mask mandates by the clever ruse of carrying around a plastic cup for hours. Personally I consider the people who did that to be disgusting, much like the people who evaded the vax requirements for travelling by using forged vax passports.

Edited October 21, 2022 by WeneedLumme

[JM_]

10 hours ago, Jimmy James said:

Condoms are 98% effective. I’m pretty sure people are capable of accepting reality, and making it work.
 

Nobody ever said masks were a fail-safe, they were only ever a protective layer for crowded areas. Outrageously effective at reducing infection. 
 

All of BC’s doctors saw and were exposed to Covid patients throughout the last few years. Vaccines, masks and PPE’s worked really well for them. That strong evidence in my book.

they did, but PPE is actually further down the list of protections than other options. There's also a big difference between respirators and masks. 

 

The point I was making, without trying to win the internet, is that I can understand why Ron would raise it as an issue. 

 

[RUPERTKBD]

On 10/19/2022 at 2:58 PM, KristoffWixenschon said:

Probably because they dont feel that they will receive much benefit from an additional dose.

Indications seem to be that young, healthy, double or triple vaccinated people, who have already had covid, do not receive any benefit from additional doses. 

Older people and the immune compromised seem to be a different story and should probably continue boosting.

That's possible in some cases, but the poster I was responding to was suggesting that people who were not getting boosted, hadn't want to get vaccinated at all and only did so because they were "forced" to....

[KristoffWixenschon]

3 minutes ago, RUPERTKBD said:

That's possible in some cases, but the poster I was responding to was suggesting that people who were not getting boosted, hadn't want to get vaccinated at all and only did so because they were "forced" to....

I'm sure that's true in some cases too. 

 

I dont remember exactly but weren't we at 80% vaccination rates prior to the vaccine mandates, then 90% after the mandates?

 

So that's probably true for a lot of those people who were vaccinated in that time frame. 

There must be several different reasons people arent getting boosted in large numbers.

[JM_]

13 minutes ago, KristoffWixenschon said:

I'm sure that's true in some cases too. 

 

I dont remember exactly but weren't we at 80% vaccination rates prior to the vaccine mandates, then 90% after the mandates?

 

So that's probably true for a lot of those people who were vaccinated in that time frame. 

There must be several different reasons people arent getting boosted in large numbers.

I suspect it has to do with most people either having had or being exposed to covid, so maybe they figure why bother? its misguided but I can see why someone who's had covid might think another booster wouldn't help them. 

 

It could also just be messaging fatigue, people just aren't getting the message anymore. 

 

It shows how fickle we are as a group. Not so long ago we were upset over not having faster access to a shot, now most people are meh. We're lemmings. 

 

[J.I.A.H.N]

Just got my 4th shot yesterday. I was able to just walk in to the clinic. I actually got both the covid and the flu shot. No big deal. 

 

Having had covid recently, I can tell you that the shot is a very small price to pay for the inconvenience of actually having it, having to stay home for a week and coughing for 3 weeks was not fun! And that is with being vaccinated. I could not imagine what it would have been like without it!

 

I can also say that having given Covid to my wife, my tenant, 2 of my hockey buddies, I don't like the guilt of having affected someone else's life.

 

Most of my buddies.......60 + years of age are all up on their shots

 

Just for the record, I know 2 people who have died of Covid................neither was vaxxed, and of the 50 + people who have been vaxxed, none have seen a hospital

 

So, for me, its Pay me now or pay me later!

 

Incidentally, my buddies mom, who is 87 years old, got Covid, and before she tested, she was having low blood pressure, arrythmia, and diarrhea, she went and got a shot of the  Anti Viral drug Paxlovid and was on the mend withing the second day....................

[KristoffWixenschon]

1 hour ago, JM_ said:

I suspect it has to do with most people either having had or being exposed to covid, so maybe they figure why bother? its misguided but I can see why someone who's had covid might think another booster wouldn't help them. 

 

It could also just be messaging fatigue, people just aren't getting the message anymore. 

 

It shows how fickle we are as a group. Not so long ago we were upset over not having faster access to a shot, now most people are meh. We're lemmings. 

 

Yeah I agree, already having had covid and messaging fatigue. Those are two more reasons why people are reluctant or ambivalent about getting another booster.

 

Societal perception of the disease has changed. But also the disease has changed. 

 

I dont necessarily agree that we are lemmings (in this specific case. I agree we are lemmings in general, especially politically haha). My perception is that people are fatigued, they already feel like they are adequately protected with their current vaccination/infection status and they are less worried about the current strain of the virus.

[JM_]

40 minutes ago, KristoffWixenschon said:

Yeah I agree, already having had covid and messaging fatigue. Those are two more reasons why people are reluctant or ambivalent about getting another booster.

 

Societal perception of the disease has changed. But also the disease has changed. 

 

I dont necessarily agree that we are lemmings (in this specific case. I agree we are lemmings in general, especially politically haha). My perception is that people are fatigued, they already feel like they are adequately protected with their current vaccination/infection status and they are less worried about the current strain of the virus.

oh, we're lemmings. 

 

Instead of following expert advice people are going with the public perception idea that its OK to skip the booster protection. 

 

[thedestroyerofworlds]

2 hours ago, KristoffWixenschon said:

I'm sure that's true in some cases too. 

 

I dont remember exactly but weren't we at 80% vaccination rates prior to the vaccine mandates, then 90% after the mandates?

 

So that's probably true for a lot of those people who were vaccinated in that time frame. 

There must be several different reasons people arent getting boosted in large numbers.

I know a couple people who wouldn't have got vaccinated if it wasn't for the mandates.  They haven't got boosted, in large part because they don't see the need or they have some anti-vaxx influence in their life.

[KristoffWixenschon]

7 minutes ago, JM_ said:

oh, we're lemmings. 

 

Instead of following expert advice people are going with the public perception idea that its OK to skip the booster protection. 

 

Expert advice is a funny thing because it's all based on the interpretation of data.

 

The current data suggests that for most people, skipping a 4th dose is fine.

The data is pretty clear that 4th doses for healthcare workers, people over 60 and the immunocompromised, show significant reduction in symptoms, severe disease and death.

But for most healthy young people, especially those who have prior infection, there hasn't been a statistical benefit to receiving a 4th dose.

 

Even the WHO doesn't recommend 4th doses for young healthy populations. Now to be clear, the WHO doesnt tell young people to NOT to get a 4th dose. The vaccines are safe and they recognize that. They just dont recommend young people as a priority group.

 

https://www.who.int/news/item/17-05-2022-interim-statement-on-the-use-of-additional-booster-doses-of-emergency-use-listed-mrna-vaccines-against-covid-19

 

It will be interesting as we move forward. This is all subject to change as more studies are done and we gather more long term data.

[KristoffWixenschon]

9 minutes ago, thedestroyerofworlds said:

I know a couple people who wouldn't have got vaccinated if it wasn't for the mandates.  They haven't got boosted, in large part because they don't see the need or they have some anti-vaxx influence in their life.

Haha sounds like you know my parents.

[JM_]

33 minutes ago, KristoffWixenschon said:

Expert advice is a funny thing because it's all based on the interpretation of data.

 

The current data suggests that for most people, skipping a 4th dose is fine.

The data is pretty clear that 4th doses for healthcare workers, people over 60 and the immunocompromised, show significant reduction in symptoms, severe disease and death.

But for most healthy young people, especially those who have prior infection, there hasn't been a statistical benefit to receiving a 4th dose.

 

Even the WHO doesn't recommend 4th doses for young healthy populations. Now to be clear, the WHO doesnt tell young people to NOT to get a 4th dose. The vaccines are safe and they recognize that. They just dont recommend young people as a priority group.

 

https://www.who.int/news/item/17-05-2022-interim-statement-on-the-use-of-additional-booster-doses-of-emergency-use-listed-mrna-vaccines-against-covid-19

 

It will be interesting as we move forward. This is all subject to change as more studies are done and we gather more long term data.

isn't this ^ a whole lot better than people winging it? 

[4petesake]

Uptake of third doses are not quite as slow as speculated here in BC, specially when you look at different regions. Overall BC has a fully vaccinated with one booster rate of just under 58%. 
 

Edit to note that almost 9000 British Columbians received their third dose yesterday.

 

 

Edited October 21, 2022 by 4petesake

[D.B Cooper]

4 hours ago, KristoffWixenschon said:

I'm sure that's true in some cases too. 

 

I dont remember exactly but weren't we at 80% vaccination rates prior to the vaccine mandates, then 90% after the mandates?

 

So that's probably true for a lot of those people who were vaccinated in that time frame. 

There must be several different reasons people arent getting boosted in large numbers.

 

I’ve got a couple reasons why I haven’t gotten boosted.  I’ve got my first two, but not doing any more.  

We will start with the distrust in our health officials. 
I’ve watched them fumble move after move. 
They started by saying get the vax because it stops transmission. That was the only reason why I got it.  I’m healthy. I would be fine. 
I was worried for my parents. I didn’t want to give it to them. 
BUT.  We soon found out, it doesn’t stop transmission at all. 
My whole shop is vaxed.   Everyone in here has had it at least once.  
But they still tried blabbing the same shit. 
Also, as a rule, I don’t take advice from people who sound like they don’t know what they are talking about.  Coughbonnyhenrycough.  
Too much wishy washy bullshit for me. 
 

Second, and the most important one to me, I’ve had it 3 times now.  
It’s fine. It’s not even bad. 
Almost everyone I know who has gotten the booster, has gotten more sick from the shot than I have gotten from covid.  

 

Also, when does it end?   6 shots?  10?