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15 hours ago, stawns said:

this is where I am right now.  Though I was never tested, I am now 99.999999% sure I had covid 19 in Late Jan-early Feb and I am still suffering with the consequences of that virus.  I don't go a single day without heavy phlegm in my lungs, I fear my heart has been damaged, I have a continual fog in my brain and though I can exert myself physically in the moment ( to some degree), I pay for it for the next two days, struggling to breath and function normally. 

 

It's been four months for me now

Just go work yourself until you die. Kidding. But really your body is incredible. Run it to the bone.

 

Edit: I know you're a rugby player.  Just offering support. 

Edited by Gawdzukes
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7 hours ago, Wilbur said:

Wife has done most of the grocery shopping, but I had to go today.  Typical busy Saturday, and I'd estimate 5-10% were wearing masks.  I see a higher % on my walks/jogs outside which is just strange.

Masks are meh. Not breathing huge clouds of vapor as you're passing by people is much more effective. 

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I knew the simpletons wouldn't get it. Still more effective and still more beneficial but you have people like this that can't be made to behave properly.   

 

The best thing you can do is shop quick and not cough or breathe heavily while out in public. Wearing a mask means little compared to that. 

Edited by Gawdzukes
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13 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

It's funny how BC people only compare themselves to bigger provinces and declare themselves and Dr. Bonnie brilliant. News flash. You're not. And you don't make up all of Canada. :gocan:

Really?  whats the point of comparing ourselves to Newfoundland?  Other than Quebec, Alberta, and Ontario, the population of BC is about as much as the other provinces and territories combined.

 

Not sure where you are going with this.

 

BC has done a great job as has Alberta.  I would say Ontario hasn't been too bad either considering that they were behind the eight ball from the beginning with all those issues during spring break.  Quebec though, not so good.

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New info on asymptomatic carriers:

https://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/canada/asymptomatic-covid-19-findings-dim-hopes-for-herd-immunity-and-immunity-passports/ar-BB163A1x?ocid=spartan-dhp-feeds

 

A closer look at people who tested positive for COVID-19 but never developed symptoms has found that such asymptomatic carriers have few to no detectable antibodies just weeks after infection, suggesting they may not develop lasting immunity.

There's growing evidence that a significant proportion of people who test positive for COVID-19 never show symptoms, although it's not clear what percentage of people that is and what role they play in spreading the disease.

A Chinese study published this week in Nature followed 37 people in Wanzhou District in China who did not show any outward signs of the disease, despite testing positive when their respiratory tracts were swabbed and being kept in hospital for observation.

Some key findings include:

  • Levels of antibodies against COVID-19 were significantly lower in asymptomatic carriers than those with symptoms during active infection.

  • Antibody levels also dropped off far more quickly in people who never showed symptoms, and 40 per cent of them had no detectable antibodies eight weeks after recovery, compared with 13 per cent of symptomatic patients.

  • Those with asymptomatic infections tested positive for an average of five days longer than people with symptomatic infections — 19 days compared with 14 days — suggesting that they were shedding the virus longer.

The study also found that despite having no outward symptoms, 70 per cent had lung abnormalities detectable in X-rays at some point during infection — mostly spots called "ground-glass opacities," which can indicate inflammation or other signs of disease.

No antibodies could mean no immunity, but not necessarily

Dr. Samir Gupta, a clinician-scientist at St. Michael's Hospital in Toronto and assistant professor of medicine at the University of Toronto, noted in an interview with CBC News Network earlier this week that the study was very small.

Gupta, who wasn't involved in the study, added that it wasn't surprising that antibody levels fell a few months after infection. He said that's normal, since it's energy intensive for the body to maintain antibodies it doesn't need.

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What was "a little bit surprising," he said, was the fact that 40 per cent of people with asymptomatic infections had no detectable antibodies at all.

However, Gupta said, people have immunity to coronaviruses that cause common colds for only a few months, and that may also be the case for the coronavirus that causes COVID-19.

On the other hand, he said, "antibodies aren't the whole story."

There are other components of the immune system that play a role, such as memory cells. They remember a pathogen and begin releasing antibodies when they encounter it again, but they are hard to detect, Gupta said.

What this means for herd immunity and vaccines

Still, Tania Watts, a professor of immunology at the University of Toronto who was not involved in the study, expressed concern about the implications.

"This suggests that natural infection may not give long-lasting immunity, which is what people have been worried about," she said.

Some countries such as Sweden and at least one Canadian province have previously suggested that one way to control the spread of COVID-19 is to allow most of the population to get infected in a controlled fashion to generate "herd immunity." Once the population reaches a certain threshold of previous infection, there won't be enough susceptible people to spread the virus, and it can't spread exponentially as an epidemic.

But Watts said the low and short-lived levels of antibodies in asymptomatic infections in this study suggest we can't rely on herd immunity being induced for long enough a period of time to have an impact.

That means we may need to wait for a vaccine that induces a stronger, longer-lived response than many natural infections, she said. "I think this puts even more pressure on vaccine development."

What this means for antibody tests, 'immunity passports'

Watts said another implication of the study is that serological (blood) or antibody tests — which have been touted as a way to get an idea of who has been previously infected, how much of the population that represents and how close that is to herd immunity — may not work as hoped.

And it throws cold water on the idea of controversial "immunity passports," the idea of allowing more social interactions, such as work, travel and mass gatherings, for people who have previously been infected and therefore are immune and can't spread the virus — which would be based on serological testing. 

"Until we know what part of the immune system is protective," Watts said, "it's difficult to be able to do a test and tell someone you're safe or not."

What this means for disease transmission

While it's known that presymptomatic people can transmit COVID-19, it's not really known whether people who remain asymptomatic through the course of the disease can.

Watts said she thinks the finding in this study that people without symptoms shed the virus longer than people with symptoms is "shocking" and suggests we need to worry about transmission from asymptomatic people.

"Until we have a vaccine, I think we should have very clear recommendations that everybody wears masks."

She said the longer period of viral shedding is probably because a lack of symptoms indicate a weaker immune response, resulting in a longer time to clear the infection.

On the other hand, too intense an immune response is what puts patients in the ICU struggling to breathe.

The ideal is somewhere in between and what we'd like in a vaccine, Watts said.

"We really need that Goldilocks immune response."

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8 hours ago, Gawdzukes said:

Masks are meh. Not breathing huge clouds of vapor as you're passing by people is much more effective. 

 

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

I knew the simpletons wouldn't get it. Still more effective and still more beneficial but you have people like this that can't be made to behave properly.   

 

The best thing you can do is shop quick and not cough or breathe heavily while out in public. Wearing a mask means little compared to that. 

 

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

It's funny how BC people only compare themselves to bigger provinces and declare themselves and Dr. Bonnie brilliant. News flash. You're not. And you don't make up all of Canada. :gocan:

I guess we in BC just breathe too much compared to other provinces?

 

I guess Dr Bonnie got it wrong, it should have been Larger places/Lower faces/Don't breathe in places

Edited by Wilbur
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2 hours ago, bishopshodan said:

Florida is seeing big spikes in cases in people the under the age of 35.

 

What a surprise. 

 

 

Day's not even close to closing, and Florida is already over 10.6k new cases. likely over 17-18k by the time 3pm hits.

 

Edit: looks like they took 2k new cases off, shows just over 8.5k now

Edited by Chickenspear
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15 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

 

Maybe if she stopped yelling, she wouldn't have a breathing problem.

Honestly I think she has a thinking problem.

This is why USA has spikes.  Selfish people like her who refuse to wear masks indoors.

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1 hour ago, Wilbur said:

 

 

I guess we in BC just breathe too much compared to other provinces?

 

I guess Dr Bonnie got it wrong, it should have been Larger places/Lower faces/Don't breathe in places

I'm drunk. Don't mind me but you're 4/13 in covid as far as provinces go.

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3 hours ago, Gawdzukes said:

I knew the simpletons wouldn't get it. Still more effective and still more beneficial but you have people like this that can't be made to behave properly.   

 

The best thing you can do is shop quick and not cough or breathe heavily while out in public. Wearing a mask means little compared to that. 

Wrong 

 

Gifs-show-effectiveness-of-masks-in-preventing-Covid-19-4.gif

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3 hours ago, Gawdzukes said:

I knew the simpletons wouldn't get it. Still more effective and still more beneficial but you have people like this that can't be made to behave properly.   

 

The best thing you can do is shop quick and not cough or breathe heavily while out in public. Wearing a mask means little compared to that. 

There's a reason we get everyone to wear a mask when walking around the hospital now.

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2 hours ago, coho8888 said:

Really?  whats the point of comparing ourselves to Newfoundland?  Other than Quebec, Alberta, and Ontario, the population of BC is about as much as the other provinces and territories combined.

 

Not sure where you are going with this.

 

BC has done a great job as has Alberta.  I would say Ontario hasn't been too bad either considering that they were behind the eight ball from the beginning with all those issues during spring break.  Quebec though, not so good.

Calgary had over 40 people in a condo building  with the covid !

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8 minutes ago, BoKnows said:

There's a reason we get everyone to wear a mask when walking around the hospital now.

lol, where I'm from only 20% percent of the medical staff or people in general wear masks. You will learn in time ... eventually.

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Met a young man the other day (about 30), who insisted that wearing a mask is bad because it means you breath in your own breath and it doesn't get out. So if you had symptoms, I guess, that would make it worse for you, the mask wearer. So it is better to breathe mask free and let others breath in what you breathed out. Hmmm, funny logic.

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