[GDT/PGT] Vancouver Canucks @ Toronto Maple Laffs | February 8, 2021 | 4 p.m. PT | TVAS, SNP

[aGENT]

52 minutes ago, GritGrinder said:

The biggest difference is pretty easy to see in terms of deployment at least in Schmidt's case.

 

Here are his zone starts for his entire career.

13-14   55.8 oZ 44.2 dZ

14-15   58.7 oZ 41.3 dZ

15-16   55.5 oZ 44.5 dZ

16-17   59.4 oZ 40.6 dZ

17-18   46.7 oZ 53.3 dZ

18-19   46.4 oZ 53.6 dZ

19-20   49.7 oZ 50.3 dZ

20-21   37.5 oZ 62.5 dZ

 

Always in the 40-50% range for DZone starts until this season where Green has him at 62.5% DZone starts. 10-20% more Dzone starts than at anytime in his career is not letting us see the Schmidt that was in Washington and Vegas. So either Schmidt gets better defensively, Green evens out his zone starts or he just continues to be un-impressive in his current role.

Need Hamonic to get healthy, get in playing shape after being off almost a year and now injured, learn systems, build chemistry etc, etc for that to happen.

 

There's no quick fix unfortunately.

Edited February 9, 2021 by aGENT

[bree2]

10 hours ago, ruilin96 said:

20+ other players with covid should be enough to delay the games. Those boys (especially Markstrom and Tanev) had done everything for us, they deserve to have good health. The rest of the Flames can &^@# themselves though.

ya and the Canuck  org. helped Markstrom build his career, when he came here he was nothing but an AHL goalie and even that was stretching it. i remember how bad he was in Florida, the Canucks trained him the right way. so he should be grateful, as for Tanev, i love the guy but how many years in his career was he out due to injuries, almost every year., well they are not Canucks anymore, time to move on!

[ShawnAntoski]

56 minutes ago, GritGrinder said:

The biggest difference is pretty easy to see in terms of deployment at least in Schmidt's case.

 

Here are his zone starts for his entire career.

13-14   55.8 oZ 44.2 dZ

14-15   58.7 oZ 41.3 dZ

15-16   55.5 oZ 44.5 dZ

16-17   59.4 oZ 40.6 dZ

17-18   46.7 oZ 53.3 dZ

18-19   46.4 oZ 53.6 dZ

19-20   49.7 oZ 50.3 dZ

20-21   37.5 oZ 62.5 dZ

 

Always in the 40-50% range for DZone starts until this season where Green has him at 62.5% DZone starts. 10-20% more Dzone starts than at anytime in his career is not letting us see the Schmidt that was in Washington and Vegas. So either Schmidt gets better defensively, Green evens out his zone starts or he just continues to be un-impressive in his current role.

Ditto - deployment and usage of one player does have an affect on how effective that player can be.

 

Imo, it is JBs job to tinker with the roster, the players execute the game plan and it is the coaches who draws up the plan & puts it all together.  Of course, it can be argued a more talented/smarter player can execute & adapt quicker but in a cap world a team cannot have those type of players in every position; hence the more sustainable option would be for a coach to be able to maximize a roster despite the talent level. The way the team is losing is very concerning.   

[Wayne Glensky]

What an absolute joke. Listened to them my entire life and this is how they get treated??? &^@# off Bell. 

[86Viking]

7 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

What an absolute joke. Listened to them my entire life and this is how they get treated??? &^@# off Bell. 

No matter how big or small of a company you work for and no matter for how long just remember...we are all just a #! Punch in and punch out but there is no loyalty in any business.

 

Shut down a station but keep how many higher ups behind the scenes employed back in Toronto...life can be unfair, radio much like newspapers has changed alot, the S M R T fired TSN 1040 employees will start their own podcasts up and use back east connections of insiders to still hold a show.

 

My only hope is Matt Sekeres moves back to TO, never liked that guy on air and have ZERO idea how Blake Price dealt with him for all these years

[BPA]

1 hour ago, yes we can nucks said:

Quinn is currently the highest scoring dman and top 10 overall in the league. Is that sustainable? Maybe not. But he will be up there among the best come contract time. And who knows, maybe he puts on some weight and improve on his deficiencies. If we don't pay him 10mil, then some other team will. And that will be another talking point in Canucks history.

 

Maybe in just 5 years?

Quinn Hughes is our Kris Letang.  Great on offense and just OK on defense. 

[DeNiro]

1 minute ago, BPA said:

Quinn Hughes is our Kris Letang.  Great on offense and just OK on defense. 

Letang has 3 cups.

 

Let’s hope Hughes is our Letang.

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, yes we can nucks said:

Quinn is currently the highest scoring dman and top 10 overall in the league. Is that sustainable? Maybe not. But he will be up there among the best come contract time. And who knows, maybe he puts on some weight and improve on his deficiencies. If we don't pay him 10mil, then some other team will. And that will be another talking point in Canucks history.

 

Maybe in just 5 years?

LOL he won't get paid if he's a minus 30 by the end of the year (his pace)... THAT's not sustainable, and JB or whomever would be an idiot not to trade him to a team that's willing to pay 10 million a year for him (the haul would be incredible).    He's no prime Erik Karlsson, like Scott Niedermayer a player who could control the pace of the game and make amazing plays on both sides of the puck.    QHs at this point so far, hasn't moved the needle one bit on 5 x 5 scoring,  Markstrom and Tanev are exposing his faults.   So did  Vegas and the league took notice. 

 

I'm sure he will get bigger and less of a liability, over time - but at this point he's not earning more then BB did on his bridge deal, not if things continue no matter how many points he gets. 

 

Wonder what the haul would be on QHs right now anyways?   He's no Heiskanen, that kid is the next prime EK, or Lidstrom or something for sure - great on BOTH sides of the puck.   Ceiling for QHs is Housley (at least he doesn't have to worry too about the physical play as much as Housley did - and wow is he taking it even in today's toned down game, which isn't his fault - team needs a warrior a-hole to tone that stuff down big time).  

 

Bottom for QHs  is a third pairing PP specialist.   JB should be planning for both scenarios as it's anyone's guess at this point.   I've seen lots of players come into the league hot and fizzle out - and don't think QHs will be one of them, but he's definitely suspect at this point as far as two-way play goes.  For him to succeed he needs to be surrounded  by two way top four D - and play with a Murzyn, Mitchell, Tanev type.   When i say suspect - i mean the defensive side of the game - for sure he's got top level point gathering skills - but if your constantly getting scored on, it doesn't  win you games.  

Edited February 9, 2021 by IBatch

[IBatch]

16 minutes ago, DeNiro said:

Letang has 3 cups.

 

Let’s hope Hughes is our Letang.

Yep.   QHs doesn't have a proper comp, Barrie maybe - but he's 200lbs of muscle like Reinhart was so not really.  If Horvat is 5'3" like Bieksa said (who's another guy who I doubt even cracks 6'), how tall is QHs?   4'8"?  lol.  

 

That said it's his sophomore year and he gets a long leash and deserves a lot of slack.   But he's not getting a 10 million dollar deal.    Guys have to earn that sort of deal - which despite the points, he has for sure not.   We don't have Dubas for a GM. 

Edited February 9, 2021 by IBatch

[IBatch]

3 minutes ago, LAorVancouver said:

Correct, I agree that someone out there with a major gap in defence offense may choose to pay Quinn 10 mill+ if thats the case he would be a perfect offer sheet target. Canucks won't pay that and to get a treasure trove of picks would be amazing + the money we save on his contract can instantly erase our cap issues. We need more real tough defensemen not necessary offensive d.

Milbury is gone - but i suppose there is always hope.    That said none of this is going to happen.   QHs and EP will get bridges at around 6 each and that's it. 

[GritGrinder]

17 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Milbury is gone - but i suppose there is always hope.    That said none of this is going to happen.   QHs and EP will get bridges at around 6 each and that's it. 

Can't see them getting less than the $7m that Barzal got. He's very comparable to both. The most JB thing of all would be to sign EP and QH to 2 year bridge deals and then give Brock a 1 year QO for 22-23 and have all 3 plus Bo and JT as FA's of varying degree in the 22-23 offseason. Also its my understanding that only EP is eligible for an offer sheet because QH burned a year of his ELC by signing out of college and playing the 5 games at the end of 2019.

Edited February 9, 2021 by GritGrinder

[Dazzle]

1 hour ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Ditto - deployment and usage of one player does have an affect on how effective that player can be.

 

Imo, it is JBs job to tinker with the roster, the players execute the game plan and it is the coaches who draws up the plan & puts it all together.  Of course, it can be argued a more talented/smarter player can execute & adapt quicker but in a cap world a team cannot have those type of players in every position; hence the more sustainable option would be for a coach to be able to maximize a roster despite the talent level. The way the team is losing is very concerning.   

You mean it's the job of the coach to tinker with the roster...

 

JB isn't the guy reducing Schmidt's offensive zone times and giving him more defensive time instead. It's also not his fault that there's so many giveaways. I think this clearly indicates a fault with Green/Baumgartner.

[NewbieCanuckFan]

10 minutes ago, Dazzle said:

You mean it's the job of the coach to tinker with the roster...

 

JB isn't the guy reducing Schmidt's offensive zone times and giving him more defensive time instead. It's also not his fault that there's so many giveaways. I think this clearly indicates a fault with Green/Baumgartner.

In defense of Green, beyond Schmidt & Edler, there aren’t a lot of other options on the bench to handle those tougher D zone assignments on the blueline.  Sheltered minutes, sure.  Plenty of options.  But we’re not talking about those type of minutes.

Edited February 9, 2021 by NewbieCanuckFan

[Ballisticsports.]

2 hours ago, GritGrinder said:

The biggest difference is pretty easy to see in terms of deployment at least in Schmidt's case.

 

Here are his zone starts for his entire career.

13-14   55.8 oZ 44.2 dZ

14-15   58.7 oZ 41.3 dZ

15-16   55.5 oZ 44.5 dZ

16-17   59.4 oZ 40.6 dZ

17-18   46.7 oZ 53.3 dZ

18-19   46.4 oZ 53.6 dZ

19-20   49.7 oZ 50.3 dZ

20-21   37.5 oZ 62.5 dZ

 

Always in the 40-50% range for DZone starts until this season where Green has him at 62.5% DZone starts. 10-20% more Dzone starts than at anytime in his career is not letting us see the Schmidt that was in Washington and Vegas. So either Schmidt gets better defensively, Green evens out his zone starts or he just continues to be un-impressive in his current role.

Maybe a roster issue, trying to turn race horses into Work horses (or Orr)

They are offensive Defensemen on the offense and ""offensive" defensemen on defense

[bree2]

36 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Yep.   QHs doesn't have a proper comp, Barrie maybe - but he's 200lbs of muscle like Reinhart was so not really.  If Horvat is 5'3" like Bieksa said (who's another guy who I doubt even cracks 6'), how tall is QHs?   4'8"?  lol.  

 

That said it's his sophomore year and he gets a long leash and deserves a lot of slack.   But he's not getting a 10 million dollar deal.    Guys have to earn that sort of deal - which despite the points, he has for sure not.   We don't have Dubas for a GM. 

You don't know what the rest of the season might  bring for Hughes!

[Angry Goose]

16 hours ago, CanadianRugby said:

It's actually amazing how many points he has considering how he's been floating sometimes.  Like a modern day Kovalchuk.

Definitely wasn't floating last game.  Saw a number of hard back checks that broke up plays

[Pickly]

40 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Milbury is gone - but i suppose there is always hope.    That said none of this is going to happen.   QHs and EP will get bridges at around 6 each and that's it. 

It's simply amazing that you have the ability to read Jim's mind and predict the future. Unbelievable. 

[Devron]

Isn’t Quinn Hughes like 21years old. When does a defencemen of any caliber really find his stride in his own end?

[oldnews]

14 hours ago, kilgore said:

Yes.  "Simplify your puck movement, support the puck - things they did for the most part tonight and put themselves in a very good position to win."  I agree.  And I am confident that as professionals they already have moved on. They've moved on from being pissed at JB, to being pissed at themselves, I'm sure.  It had nothing to do with "mushy minded stories".   It was anger that JB reduced their chances of lifting the Cup in their careers, by a couple more years at least, in a very short career sport. 

mushy minded stories are what are filling this media market.

 

the idea that the expansion draft (which precluded re-signing Markstrom, or alternatively would have resulted in the end of Demko here), or covid cap stall (precluding re-signing Toffoli) is all Benning's fault - and laughably - has reduced their chances of "winning a cup in their careers" - is exactly the kind of drama I'm talking about. 

For me - the real loss was Tanev (and Leivo) - but the fact remains that the core are primarily 20 and 21 year olds - with some potential core still on the way - so their 'real' window is when these guys are closer to the 25 range....If the team sustains it's ability to produce young talent - this past offseason sure as hell did not represent any kind of closing window on this team - that strikes me as borderline absurd.

[appleboy]

You can't go by any of the teams stats right now. You certainly can't judge young players that may be put in circumstances that does not suit their skills. This defense needs work. A lot of work. The whole team is in flux this year. They lost a big chunk of their leadership group. It is less about talent and more about leadership. On top of that this is a really unusual year and hard to judge.  There is more than one team that are struggling. Odd high scores. Look at the goal tending numbers. 

 

Burke to Penguins. Interesting