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Tories Motion to Declare China's Action Against Uighurs as Genocide Passes 266-0, 72 Abstained (Cowards)


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1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

Its interesting, you throw that term out pretty easily. It would have been easy to go along with a cheap stunt with no teeth. Instead they are taking their lumps, ever wonder why? 

 

How is this purely political stunt going to help us get Kovrig and Spavor out of jail? 

Since it's politics, of course it's politicking.  But in this case, there's nothing wrong with calling a genocide a genocide.  

As for the two Michaels, it really sucks, but Canada has to stand by its principles.  

 

The MP's not voting just show how much of a hypocrite they are.  All the virtue signaling, all the soapbox theatrics about humans rights, equality or whatever... when it comes to a symbolic gesture, they balk at it.  Sure, it's just the Conservatives trying to get the headlines to win brownie points... but why didn't the Liberals go out and put this to a vote first?

 

It's as clear as day that China doesn't play well internationally.  They're a bully, plain and simple.  While we've all been taught that bullies are just misunderstood.... in this case China is the bully that knows exactly what it's doing and is working their angle to get what they want.  For those types of bullies, you don't appease them, you stand up to them.  

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14 minutes ago, Lancaster said:

Since it's politics, of course it's politicking.  But in this case, there's nothing wrong with calling a genocide a genocide.  

As for the two Michaels, it really sucks, but Canada has to stand by its principles.  

 

The MP's not voting just show how much of a hypocrite they are.  All the virtue signaling, all the soapbox theatrics about humans rights, equality or whatever... when it comes to a symbolic gesture, they balk at it.  Sure, it's just the Conservatives trying to get the headlines to win brownie points... but why didn't the Liberals go out and put this to a vote first?

 

It's as clear as day that China doesn't play well internationally.  They're a bully, plain and simple.  While we've all been taught that bullies are just misunderstood.... in this case China is the bully that knows exactly what it's doing and is working their angle to get what they want.  For those types of bullies, you don't appease them, you stand up to them.  

this vote is the literal the definition virtue signalling, it has no binding elements to it whatsoever. 

 

Principles... thats interesting. Singh e.g. lets his MPs rally to release Meng, while propping up the Conservatives in this charade.Thats politicking at its worst imo. He lets his MPs cave in and try to get Meng released, otoh plays these games to make it harder on our guys in jail :picard:

 

Trudeau and his cabinet let the Conservatives bash them on the head with this because they are the ones who are dealing with the reality of China and trying to get our two citizens home, which btw goes well beyond these two guys. The way that story plays out will effect the lives of every Canadian living and working in China. Its much bigger than some meaningless grandstanding.

 

All O'Toole did at best was a useless gesture for cheap points, at worst just doomed Kovrig and Spavor to years, maybe their lives, in jail. 

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38 minutes ago, Lancaster said:

Since it's politics, of course it's politicking.  But in this case, there's nothing wrong with calling a genocide a genocide.  

As for the two Michaels, it really sucks, but Canada has to stand by its principles.  

 

The MP's not voting just show how much of a hypocrite they are.  All the virtue signaling, all the soapbox theatrics about humans rights, equality or whatever... when it comes to a symbolic gesture, they balk at it.  Sure, it's just the Conservatives trying to get the headlines to win brownie points... but why didn't the Liberals go out and put this to a vote first?

 

It's as clear as day that China doesn't play well internationally.  They're a bully, plain and simple.  While we've all been taught that bullies are just misunderstood.... in this case China is the bully that knows exactly what it's doing and is working their angle to get what they want.  For those types of bullies, you don't appease them, you stand up to them.  

As it has no real ramifications it is actually mostly pointless and certainly toothless. China does need to be brought in line I agree but the only real ways are the rest of the globe isolating them in trade and/or potentially a massive reduction in the population. This just sets up for them to retaliate in some manner. 

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14 minutes ago, Gnarcore said:

As it has no real ramifications it is actually mostly pointless and certainly toothless. China does need to be brought in line I agree but the only real ways are the rest of the globe isolating them in trade and/or potentially a massive reduction in the population. This just sets up for them to retaliate in some manner. 

^ this. Canada has helped create a 57 country group to stand against countries like China on detentions (https://globalnews.ca/news/7641177/canada-arbitrary-detention-coalition-2-michaels/). Thats something real, not this fake vote BS.

 

If our guys aren't out of jail soon the next step is likely boycotting the 2022 Beijing olympics, which I would fully support. Not having Canada at a winter games makes a statement every time a sport is aired on tv and people wonder why Canada isn't there. Its a black eye and embarrassment China can avoid if they choose to, but if not, lets hit them where they seem to care most in not being able to save face. 

 

 

Edited by Jimmy McGill
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18 hours ago, Dazzle said:

I don't think using the word 'genocide' is helpful or entirely accurate. What China is doing to Uighurs is not exactly genocide by the very definitions of the word, but definitely violations of human rights. They're not the same thing.

China absolutely needs to be held accountable though. There are lots of reports of mass rapes and other unspeakable things going on in their concentration camps.

By definition what China is doing to the Uighurs is genocide. Moving them into concentration camps and raping women and children 100 classifies as genocide. And for all we know they are murdering these poor people but we will never hear about it as China is about as transparent as stained glass. China needs to be held accountable for their crimes against humanity. Not only with the treatment of certain ethnicities but forced labor camps, mass censorship, child labor, and absolute zero tolerance on free speech. What the CCP does their people is disgusting.  Only a certain amount of people are willing to speak out against China but we all know Beijing Biden and Trudeau wouldn’t dare speak out against their biggest trade ally. It’s time the world rises up against China. 

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Just now, Wayne Glensky said:

By definition what China is doing to the Uighurs is genocide. Moving them into concentration camps and raping women and children 100 classifies as genocide. And for all we know they are murdering these poor people but we will never hear about it as China is about as transparent as stained glass. China needs to be held accountable for their crimes against humanity. Not only with the treatment of certain ethnicities but forced labor camps, mass censorship, child labor, and absolute zero tolerance on free speech. What the CCP does their people is disgusting.  Only a certain amount of people are willing to speak out against China but we all know Beijing Biden and Trudeau wouldn’t dare speak out against their biggest trade ally. It’s time the world rises up against China. 

Trudeau has spoken out many times against China since our guys were arrested, what are you talking about? 

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/7641177/canada-arbitrary-detention-coalition-2-michaels/

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Hey, China release the Michaels or we aren't coming to your Olympics.

Still won't release the Michaels- we are going to rip up that trade deal with you, and take our business elsewhere. Yes that will hurt us as well, but doing the right thing is not always painless.

Edited by gurn
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3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

Trudeau has spoken out many times against China since our guys were arrested, what are you talking about? 

 

https://globalnews.ca/news/7641177/canada-arbitrary-detention-coalition-2-michaels/

Maybe so, but there was a time, in Trudeaus own words, in a live interview... 

 

 

The future prime minister’s odd answer: “You know, there’s a level of admiration I actually have for China ….”

China? Why China?

“Because their basic dictatorship is allowing them to actually turn their economy around on a dime and say ‘we need to go green  fastest…we need to start investing in solar.'”

 

To me right there that is enough evidence to prove Trudeau isn’t about Canada first. 

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7 minutes ago, gurn said:

Hey, China release the Michaels or we aren't coming to your Olympics.

Still won't release the Michaels- we are going to rip up that trade deal with you, and take our business elsewhere. Yes that will hurt us as well, but doing the right thing is not always painless.

we need a unified Canadian approach if we're going to make hard choices like this (which I would support), not political games. 

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Just now, Wayne Glensky said:

Maybe so, but there was a time, in Trudeaus own words, in a live interview... 

 

 

The future prime minister’s odd answer: “You know, there’s a level of admiration I actually have for China ….”

China? Why China?

“Because their basic dictatorship is allowing them to actually turn their economy around on a dime and say ‘we need to go green  fastest…we need to start investing in solar.'”

 

To me right there that is enough evidence to prove Trudeau isn’t about Canada first. 

If that line is proof to you of Trudeau putting China first, I'd suggest you have a pretty big bias against Trudeau to begin with. 

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2 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

If that line is proof to you of Trudeau putting China first, I'd suggest you have a pretty big bias against Trudeau to begin with. 

That’s not something you say and then 10 years later he like oh I was just kidding. Those are coming from a Prone Ministers mouth. And so what if I already have a bias against Trudeau? I was never a fan of Harper either but the level of incompetence in that administration is mind boggling and frightening at the same time. I don’t trust anyone that admired the CCP and unfortunately our Prime Minister is one of them. Remember, people are allowed to be bias and we are allowed to have opinions. 

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22 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

^ this. Canada has helped create a 57 country group to stand against countries like China on detentions (https://globalnews.ca/news/7641177/canada-arbitrary-detention-coalition-2-michaels/). Thats something real, not this fake vote BS.

 

If our guys aren't out of jail soon the next step is likely boycotting the 2022 Beijing olympics, which I would fully support. Not having Canada at a winter games makes a statement every time a sport is aired on tv and people wonder why Canada isn't there. Its a black eye and embarrassment China can avoid if they choose to, but if not, lets hit them where they seem to care most in not being able to save face. 

 

 

And bring back the Canada Cup to have the pros at and counter the men's hockey tourney ;) 

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9 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

Maybe so, but there was a time, in Trudeaus own words, in a live interview... 

 

 

The future prime minister’s odd answer: “You know, there’s a level of admiration I actually have for China ….”

China? Why China?

“Because their basic dictatorship is allowing them to actually turn their economy around on a dime and say ‘we need to go green  fastest…we need to start investing in solar.'”

 

To me right there that is enough evidence to prove Trudeau isn’t about Canada first. 

So you post the answer, but not the question that was asked.?

Context matters.

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8 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

That’s not something you say and then 10 years later he like oh I was just kidding. Those are coming from a Prone Ministers mouth. And so what if I already have a bias against Trudeau? I was never a fan of Harper either but the level of incompetence in that administration is mind boggling and frightening at the same time. I don’t trust anyone that admired the CCP and unfortunately our Prime Minister is one of them. Remember, people are allowed to be bias and we are allowed to have opinions. 

Yes you're allowed to be bias but then your opinions don't really hold any water because you've already made up your mind about something by having an inherent bias. Why would anyone listen to your opinion if they know you have a bias against something already?

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2 minutes ago, gurn said:

So you post the answer, but not the question that was asked.?

Context matters.

Justin Trudeau,  then running for the leadership of his party in 2013, was given a lob-ball question from a supporter at a “Ladies Night” meet-and-greet in Toronto: “Which nation, besides Canada, which nation’s administration do you most admire, and why?
 

there you are sir 

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1 minute ago, GritGrinder said:

Yes you're allowed to be bias but then your opinions don't really hold any water because you've already made up your mind about something by having an inherent bias. Why would anyone listen to your opinion if they know you have a bias against it already?

Because CDC is very liberal and it’s hard to get any point across. 

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28 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

^ this. Canada has helped create a 57 country group to stand against countries like China on detentions (https://globalnews.ca/news/7641177/canada-arbitrary-detention-coalition-2-michaels/). Thats something real, not this fake vote BS.

 

If our guys aren't out of jail soon the next step is likely boycotting the 2022 Beijing olympics, which I would fully support. Not having Canada at a winter games makes a statement every time a sport is aired on tv and people wonder why Canada isn't there. Its a black eye and embarrassment China can avoid if they choose to, but if not, lets hit them where they seem to care most in not being able to save face.

Yep. It sucks for the athletes, but there's no way we can support a corrupt regime that has imprisoned two of our citizens for years, just to make a political statement.

 

I guess the question would be: Do the Americans follow suit, like we did in 1980?

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1 minute ago, GritGrinder said:

Um what does that have to do with what I posted? Not having a good day are ya?

I don’t normally post about politics and I’ve made my point on this topic and that’s all I will  say. I am also at work. 

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15 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

That’s not something you say and then 10 years later he like oh I was just kidding. Those are coming from a Prone Ministers mouth. And so what if I already have a bias against Trudeau? I was never a fan of Harper either but the level of incompetence in that administration is mind boggling and frightening at the same time. I don’t trust anyone that admired the CCP and unfortunately our Prime Minister is one of them. Remember, people are allowed to be bias and we are allowed to have opinions. 

your bias matters because you're reading stuff into that statement that isn't true.

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