[GDT/PGT] Vancouver Canucks vs Montreal Canadiens | March 10, 2021 | 8 p.m. PT | SNP, RDS

[higgyfan]

2 hours ago, D-Money said:

Gillis had a contending team. His focus was on adding whatever he could to help the team win when their window was open, and he largely did well. Hamhuis and Ehrhoff were fantastic additions that cost the team virtually nothing. Tanev was also a home run of a signing. His drafting ended up poor (injuries and accidents didn’t help), but more than enough time has passed to address that.

 

Benning has been in charge since 2014, so has had sufficient time to figure out the defence. He certainly tried to - he used valuable trade assets to acquire young defensemen, but they turned out to be Sbisa and Gudbranson. Then he turned to free agency, and acquired Del Zotto and Myers. All 4 have been poor acquisitions, and that has set the team back (Myers is the best of them, but is significantly overpaid). I like Schmidt and Hamonic, and feel their struggles so far are coaching related...but ensuring the right coaches are there is also Jim’s responsibility.
 

It’s been nearly 7 years. Any problems with this team are now Benning’s fault, 100%.

Benning was hired in late May 2014, so his first showing in playoffs was the loss in the 1st round of 2015  We don't know whether the rebuild plan was even a thought at that point.  Imo, the rebuild should have started the following year (15/16), but they still had the Sedins and tried to fix the team by'retooling'.  It didn't work and once again the Canucks failed to make the playoffs.

 

So, starting at season 2015/16, the team did not qualify for 4 consecutive years, in the 5th year (19/20), they got to the 3rd round lost in game 7 following year.  Most likely, the team does not qualify this year.

 

At best, we can only say that the rebuild has been 6yrs; starting in season 15/16.  Who knows when the owner and/or management decided to actually commit to a rebuild.

 

I fully expect this team to make the playoffs next year, as they certainly have the talent and with a bit of tweaking, they will be very solid.

I can't think of a team (in recent years) that has had a successful rebuild in less than 6 seasons; including the 'lucky lotto' teams that manage to claim 1-3 overall picks during their term.

[Pickly]

18 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Nah.   We had a nice run last season - guess you forgot already - getting the kids feet wet and all.   Also added EP, QHs, AG, Hogs, Miller, Myers, OJ etc and said goodbye to Markstrom, Tanev and TT who I ever recall such a love affair by some fans over barely a dozen games (and still couldn't win with him lol)....  

 

The roster went from the Sedins to the kids in that time too.   But i suppose in some folks minds - a rebuild is supposed to take 3-4 years still.   Over the same time period the only roster i'd consider instead is CAR.   No thx to TO. Top heavy is a curse under the cap.   
 

It's only one year.   Next season if we can't make the playoffs that's a major failure - LA, ANA, SJ etc should prop up any team - too bad we didn't have ARI as well to beat up on but them's the breaks.   

I think what he meant was the Canucks have been heavily reliant on extremely solid goaltending which is covering up the glaring deficiencies on the defensive side of puck. Last years run was possible because of Markstrom and to a lesser extent Demko. 

[IBatch]

19 minutes ago, kanucks25 said:

If he showed that much fire but kept the bad turnovers, bad body language and lazy backchecks to a minimum I would agree with you.

 

I appreciate that he cares and is frustrated that things aren't going well, just don't know if he's expressing it the right way.

Won't argue that - i've noticed he was the last person in the lineup to get the "memo" not to pass the puck infront of our own net when under pressure - but still is doing that which is frustrating.   Also don't mind that he obviously hates losing either.   Horvat talks about it but you don't see the same fire on the ice - same old same old there - since Linden was Captain (and i like Horvat).    Miller's antics are at the minimum, a little entertaining too.   Holtby glaring at him was actually kind of funny.    Bottom line is i see the dialogue that when we are winning he's C material - when we are losing he can seem like a whiny little spoiled brat.    I'm sure the truth is also toned down both ways.   We only get a tiny glimpse into their world - and it's edited as far as what we do get to see.   I don't take any stock in pre and post game shows, i'm not even that sure why they bother with it.   Not like a main event fight going on right? 

[IBatch]

14 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

Benning was hired in late May 2014, so his first showing in playoffs was the loss in the 1st round of 2015  We don't know whether the rebuild plan was even a thought at that point.  Imo, the rebuild should have started the following year (15/16), but they still had the Sedins and tried to fix the team by'retooling'.  It didn't work and once again the Canucks failed to make the playoffs.

 

So, starting at season 2015/16, the team did not qualify for 4 consecutive years, in the 5th year (19/20), they got to the 3rd round lost in game 7 following year.  Most likely, the team does not qualify this year.

 

At best, we can only say that the rebuild has been 6yrs; starting in season 15/16.  Who knows when the owner and/or management decided to actually commit to a rebuild.

 

I fully expect this team to make the playoffs next year, as they certainly have the talent and with a bit of tweaking, they will be very solid.

I can't think of a team (in recent years) that has had a successful rebuild in less than 6 seasons; including the 'lucky lotto' teams that manage to claim 1-3 overall picks during their term.

Logical .... remember when the "R" word was dirty?   Fans forget they held on to hope for one last magical thing with the Sedins...we finished 7th overall the year we lost to CAL in the first round.   That's a contender level finish.    IMO JB had little choice to do anything but re-tool given he wasn't getting much from the old core to boost the next one.   Fair to say 2 playoffs in six years - then a miss - then an expectation for a run of 6 over the next 8 years.    3/8 are rebuilding and 1/8 will be an expansion team ... we have large playoff window opening, it cracked last season, doubt we make it this year - next year it won't be that easy either but a lot easier then this year .... and then it's out turn again.   Nobody rebuilds in under 5 years anymore without extreme luck - most take 7-10 years, especially the excellent teams paying the piper for contention when their core grows stale.   Plus we have a small window during that period too.  PIT won two cups that way. 

Edited March 11, 2021 by IBatch

[oldnews]

As has been the case often this season, the 4th line was the Canucks' best last night.

 

Beagle 

0 ozone starts, 8 dzone

43.5% corsi (10 on ice shot attempts for, 13 against).

67% in the faceoff circle

 

Hawryluk - who impressed some others in the GDT...(a bright spot last night).

0 ozone starts, 4 dzone

67% corsi (10/5)

 

Only the 2nd line had higher corsi (on ice shot attempt differential) - but they had 65-67% ozone starts (Horvat with 11 ozone starts, Pearson 10)...

 

Kudos as well to Edler (13 dzone starts, 3 ozones (18.8%) - who had 8 blocked shots, and 4 hits to lead the team by large margins.  Those were some bloody hard minutes.

Edited March 11, 2021 by oldnews

[SergioMomesso]

One of the few times I was happy to receive a concussion and didn't have to watch this debacle.

[Samgagner'sface]

Tough game for the boys. On to the next

[Silky mitts]

9 hours ago, Cromeslab said:

That’s even a worse proposal

how so? Eichel is a much better player than Horvat lol

[Pickly]

5 minutes ago, oldnews said:

As has been the case often this season, the 4th line was the Canucks' best last night.

 

Beagle 

0 ozone starts, 8 dzone

43.5% corsi (10 on ice shot attempts for, 13 against).

67% in the faceoff circle

 

Hawryluk - who impressed some others in the GDT...(a bright spot last night).

0 ozone starts, 4 dzone

67% corsi (10/5)

 

Only the 2nd line had higher corsi (on ice shot attempt differential) - but they had 65-67% ozone starts (Horvat with 11 ozone starts, Pearson 10)...

 

Kudos as well to Edler (13 dzone starts, 3 ozones (18.8%) - who had 8 blocked shots, and 4 hits to lead the team by large margins.  Those were some bloody hard minutes.

I appreciate your posts when you when you factor in the underlying stats, ala o zone/d zone and Corsi (it gives different perspective) but does it ever concern you how little out bottom 6 contributes on the offensive side of the puck? I mean, the little things do matter (no pun intended, Louie) but I think if this team is to ever be a true contender they are going to need regular offensive  contribution from all 4 lines. For example, last night's bottom six has contributed for a whopping 11 goals all season (6 from Sutter, 3 of which came in one game.) Just spitballing here.

[D-Money]

27 minutes ago, higgyfan said:

Benning was hired in late May 2014, so his first showing in playoffs was the loss in the 1st round of 2015  We don't know whether the rebuild plan was even a thought at that point.  Imo, the rebuild should have started the following year (15/16), but they still had the Sedins and tried to fix the team by'retooling'.  It didn't work and once again the Canucks failed to make the playoffs.

 

So, starting at season 2015/16, the team did not qualify for 4 consecutive years, in the 5th year (19/20), they got to the 3rd round lost in game 7 following year.  Most likely, the team does not qualify this year.

 

At best, we can only say that the rebuild has been 6yrs; starting in season 15/16.  Who knows when the owner and/or management decided to actually commit to a rebuild.

 

I fully expect this team to make the playoffs next year, as they certainly have the talent and with a bit of tweaking, they will be very solid.

I can't think of a team (in recent years) that has had a successful rebuild in less than 6 seasons; including the 'lucky lotto' teams that manage to claim 1-3 overall picks during their term.

You can dress it up however you like. But regardless, Benning has tried to fix the defence for nearly 7 years, and many of his attempts were failures.

 

Lots of teams have turned it around faster. The post-Thornton Bruins turned it around very fast. As did the post-Lecavalier Lightning. Both won cups, and are still rolling. Chicago started their current rebuild later than us, and look like they’re going to pass us.

[lmm]

1 hour ago, yes we can nucks said:

Winning 4 of every 5 games is a tall order and I know it's unrealistic. I think 2 out of every 3 is already a challenge but doable as long as we play well. But obviously we will need help from the teams we are chasing. That is the unknown factor. We had a brutal schedule early in the season that hurt us badly. From March on, we have a decent schedule. We just need one of Edmonton, Winnipeg, or Montreal to collapse from their exhausting schedule in the last half of the season for us to overtake them. I think it's quite feasible that one of them will collapse. As I said I still see hope for the playoffs.

so, did you say that  you think we can win 2 of 3 but not 4 of 6?

how do you feel about us going 6 of 9?

I think at this point we need to go 22-4 to sneak in

[canuck2288]

2 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

@canuck2288 we get It, Green isn't your guy.

 

How about coming up with a solution, one that could actually be implemented this season because I don't see one. King and Higgins aren't taking over. 

 

You make some good points about things like a lack of coaching adjustments but it gets lost in the Green hate. 

We had plenty of time when we were in the midst of our slump

 

we need to grab Gallant as montreal or seattle will want him

 

smyl could step in until gallant finishes quarantine. This allows to get started before next season.

 

plan enough for you?

 

btw i have stated this plan multiple times. Clearly you are not following me closely like my many followers are 

[NewbieCanuckFan]

32 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Plus we have a small window during that period too.  PIT won two cups that way. 

They don't overpay for their non-core players.  Once a "supporting" player gets too expensive, he gets dealt. Not because he sucks or is bad but because he doesn't fit their structure.  Laffs tried to follow that model except some of the core players suck.

 

Case in point, Brandon Sutter.  A capable 3C but got too expensive under the Pens salary structure model so they dealt him for a cheaper alternative (cap-wise).  Then when Bonino got too expensive, they dealt him too.  McCann will get dealt when/if that happens to him.

[JM_]

7 minutes ago, canuck2288 said:

 

we need to grab Gallant as montreal or seattle will want him

why do you think Gallant is the right guy?

[lmm]

12 minutes ago, Pickly said:

I appreciate your posts when you when you factor in the underlying stats, ala o zone/d zone and Corsi (it gives different perspective) but does it ever concern you how little out bottom 6 contributes on the offensive side of the puck? I mean, the little things do matter (no pun intended, Louie) but I think if this team is to ever be a true contender they are going to need regular offensive  contribution from all 4 lines. For example, last night's bottom six has contributed for a whopping 11 goals all season (6 from Sutter, 3 of which came in one game.) Just spitballing here.

does it concern anyone that of all our bottom 6s only Beagle 1-4 and Roussell 1-2 have more apples than oranges?

our top 2 scorers (bottom 6) have 6-1and 5-1 respectively

it seems our bottom six do not know how to set up goals without sending the puck to the point

most bottom 6 goals are point-point-rebound or a one man play (Sutter/Motte alone from the blue line)

nothing like puck from boards to net front or even a rush goal

[lmm]

9 minutes ago, canuck2288 said:

We had plenty of time when we were in the midst of our slump

 

we need to grab Gallant as montreal or seattle will want him

 

smyl could step in until gallant finishes quarantine. This allows to get started before next season.

 

plan enough for you?

 

btw i have stated this plan multiple times. Clearly you are not following me closely like my many followers are 

but but Gallant has been fired... Green has never been fired

[NewbieCanuckFan]

1 minute ago, lmm said:

does it concern anyone that of all our bottom 6s only Beagle 1-4 and Roussell 1-2 have more apples than oranges?

lmm doesn't like Matt Damon....

 

 

 

[lmm]

1 minute ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

lmm doesn't like Matt Damon....

 

 

 

you got me all wrong

need more apples

and oranges

and if we had some bananas we might attract some more apes

need more apes

all this faierie dust attracts too many Smurfs

[runtzguy]

No matter what, JB needs to be fired before free agency this year. JB does not have the mental capability to do fair contract talks (ie, LE, Beagle, Roussel, Myers, etc). 

 

There is no going around this. We have to wait 2 years for these awful contracts to go away before we can compete. In the meantime, we cannot have a moron in JB signing ridiculous contracts as this will push the 2 years we have to wait to compete to a bigger number.

Edited March 11, 2021 by runtzguy
n

[lmm]

15 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

why do you think Gallant is the right guy?

I'll take that winning record in Florida

https://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=1824