DSVII Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 (edited) 18 minutes ago, Petey_BOI said: ah cool, how does it feel to be so in tune with successful video game general managers. your strategy would isolate most of the draft picks, and anger them into demanding a trade. this is how you get hall for larrson deals. since they want out they may hold out and sign offer sheets. the team would certainly be added to the NTC of most players free agents would less likely want to sign and those that did would demand more NTC NMC in thier contracts. no one wants to play on the last place teams Probably the same feeling as being so in tune with how every NHL player will think and react it seems. This is a top tier league with only 700ish roster positions in the world, and each year hundreds of kids pushing hard to come over. There will always be someone willing to take a spot on a team. Taylor Hall's trade was because Chiarelli valued meat and potatoes over skill (sounds very familiar MO). Hall wanted to stay in Edmonton, even tweeted McDavid after he was drafted he was looking forward to stay. How many last place teams have failed to field a 23 team roster? Edited May 1, 2021 by DSVII Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 22 minutes ago, Bertuzzipunch said: Meh i doubt it. The contract is bad just like erikksons, you can get players who have those kinda contracts for cheap just to clear the cap space. Like nashville did with weber. Id assume how much arizona was asked to retain was the biggest issue. Nashville traded Weber and his terrible contract for PK Subban and his terrible contract though. At the time both were still very productive players. Anyone who thinks Arizona would have traded OEL for Eriksson AND retained 2 mil in doing so (aGENT) is on crack. Anyone who thinks Benning did not see OEL as the answer to our defense and would have overpaid to get him just isnt paying attention to how god awful his pro scouting ability really is. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad_BOI_pete Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 minute ago, DSVII said: Probably the same feeling as being so in tune with how every NHL player will think and react it seems. This is a top tier league with only 700ish roster positions in the world, and each year hundreds of kids pushing hard to come over. There will always be someone willing to take a spot on a team. Taylor Hall's trade was because Chiarelli valued meat and potatoes over skill. Hall wanted to stay in Edmonton, even tweeted McDavid after he was drafted he was looking forward to stay. Not related. How many last place teams have failed to field a 23 team roster? listen nice try, i really appreciate it, but the fact is most bottom feeders are forced into dressing rookies. some might say that its not a well thought out development plan for young players. heck it might even affect your drafting process, actually it ertainly would. players with immediate playing value would be valued higher than long term projects. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 5 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: Nashville traded Weber and his terrible contract for PK Subban and his terrible contract though. At the time both were still very productive players. Anyone who thinks Arizona would have traded OEL for Eriksson AND retained 2 mil in doing so (aGENT) is on crack. Anyone who thinks Benning did not see OEL as the answer to our defense and would have overpaid to get him just isnt paying attention to how god awful his pro scouting ability really is. His trades havent been that awful. His free agency signing record is definitely his biggest problem. I mean motte and miller were some good ones. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 Just now, Bertuzzipunch said: His trades havent been that awful. His free agency signing record is definitely his biggest problem. I mean motte and miller were some good ones. His free agent signings have absolutely been his biggest problem. Trades aremt that far off though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 4 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: His free agent signings have absolutely been his biggest problem. Trades aremt that far off though. Which trades do u think are so bad? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bad_BOI_pete Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 4 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: Nashville traded Weber and his terrible contract for PK Subban and his terrible contract though. At the time both were still very productive players. Anyone who thinks Arizona would have traded OEL for Eriksson AND retained 2 mil in doing so (aGENT) is on crack. Anyone who thinks Benning did not see OEL as the answer to our defense and would have overpaid to get him just isnt paying attention to how god awful his pro scouting ability really is. back to your old tricks again i see. there is one major problem in your argument(there's always at least one btw) the trade didn't happen. in your "reality" benning would have jumped at the first atrocious offer that was presented to him. and you like benning, huh i wonder how wild your theories would be if you didn't. enjoy living in your shoe 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckNORRIS4Cup Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 hour ago, appleboy said: I think most on here won't be surprised when I say that I agree with your statement. LOL However, living in the past is not going to win us a cup. What I want now is for them to refocus and get this club back on track. Jim has managed to draft some very talented players and now the core of the team is very young. This season may be a gift from the hockey gods. One more season and the dead cap becomes available to who ever is making decisions to utilize. ( We have had a few gifts from the gods as quite a few seasons have not gone the way this management had hoped for:) We might get another high pick and I do trust Jim to find us another valuable piece. Jim has already prepared you for another mediocre season. It would be nice to see some added org depth. I'm not living in the past just stating the obvious, and I'm not calling for him to be fired either, just acknowledging they screwed up He can have his last year on his contract, I strongly believe his future relies on what he does for coaching, if he cares about his job and his future here he should look at a new coach, if he resigns Green imo he's risking his future staying here. Will see what they do next year with who ever, and see what the outcome is then I will say if Benning should be gone or resigned. I like his drafting, but everything else is bad lol, so he better hope his players pay off next year or he gets someone else behind the bench to get them going, to save his job. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 minute ago, Petey_BOI said: back to your old tricks again i see. there is one major problem in your argument(there's always at least one btw) the trade didn't happen. in your "reality" benning would have jumped at the first atrocious offer that was presented to him. and you like benning, huh i wonder how wild your theories would be if you didn't. enjoy living in your shoe I thought you had me on ignore? I never said he would take the first offer. I said he would very likely be willing to overpay to get OEL. There is a difference there that I know you will struggle to see because you are so obsessed with replying to me that you refuse to see it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 5 minutes ago, Bertuzzipunch said: Which trades do u think are so bad? Off the top of my head the Miller trade was ok. The Schmidt one was good. Both were teams trying to shed cap though to be fair. Motte for Vanek took a long time but ended up good. Pearson for Gudbranson was decent. Pretty much everything else has been inconsequential to terrible. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChuckNORRIS4Cup Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 42 minutes ago, Petey_BOI said: ah cool, how does it feel to be so in tune with successful video game general managers. your strategy would isolate most of the draft picks, and anger them into demanding a trade. this is how you get hall for larrson deals. since they want out they may hold out and sign offer sheets. the team would certainly be added to the NTC of most players free agents would less likely want to sign and those that did would demand more NTC NMC in thier contracts. no one wants to play on the last place teams I don't know never have tried one maybe you can inform me. Do you really not understand how a rebuild is supposed to go? Yeah no one does that's why you move them and aquire prospects or picks and enjoy sucking for a few years, something that should of been done 6 years ago, it's to late now. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bertuzzipunch Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 10 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: Off the top of my head the Miller trade was ok. The Schmidt one was good. Both were teams trying to shed cap though to be fair. Motte for Vanek took a long time but ended up good. Pearson for Gudbranson was decent. Pretty much everything else has been inconsequential to terrible. Not really bringing any facts to the table brah 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
IBatch Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 hour ago, wallstreetamigo said: Its not bias, its just reality. Take a look at his trade history. Miller and Schmidt were cap relief trades for their previous teams. Gudbranson for Pearson was ok but his original trade for Gudbranson wipes out any possible positive to it. Sutter trade was garbage. Pretty much everything else is either bleeding picks and/or taking back tweeners or projects that 9 to 1 havent worked out. The framing does seems biased, using "cap dumps" Miller and Schmidt are good examples. Quality roster players the pair. Miller had a career year last season. Poor pro scouting lol. Does that mean they were bad trades for JB? Seems to me a lot of teams would have loved to be on the inside track for either of these guys no? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 1 hour ago, Bertuzzipunch said: Not really bringing any facts to the table brah You asked me whoch trades i thought were $&!#ty. The list of ones i didnt is way shorter. Do you want me to list every trade i think is $&!#ty? Cause all you need to do is go look at any main ones i didnt mentioon. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 (edited) 1 hour ago, IBatch said: The framing does seems biased, using "cap dumps" Miller and Schmidt are good examples. Quality roster players the pair. Miller had a career year last season. Poor pro scouting lol. Does that mean they were bad trades for JB? Seems to me a lot of teams would have loved to be on the inside track for either of these guys no? I never said they were $&!#ty players. I said Tampa Bay needed the cap to sign a better player, Point, and Vegas needed the cap for Pietrangelo, again a bettef player. So both teams traded those players to free up cap. I also said both were good trades. But the prices would have been a lot higher if they werent cap dumps. I can provide lots of examples of his pro scouting being $&!#ty. Give me a few i will find the list. Edited May 1, 2021 by wallstreetamigo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 Some of his worse signings: Eriksson, Gagner, Del Zotto, Schaller. Thats not including guys on the trade list he signed to bad contracts after trading too much for them like Sutter and Gudbranson. It also doesnt include decent players being overpaid by him (combo of term, dollars, and trade protection) like Beagle, Roussel, Virtanen, Myers, Pearson, Holtby, etc.) Some guys he traded for - many he paid too much and others were long shots to ever stick in the nhl and usually were being traded because they had become waiver eligible: Vey, Clendening, Baertschi, Prust, Sutter, Etem, Granlund, Larsen, Gudbranson, Goldobin, Pouliot, Leivo, Schenn, Spooner, Highmore You would think with that many swings some of them would become something good or stick in the nhl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 Effective pro scouting is about properly evaluating the player. But that analysis being accurate to the best extent it can is also the basis for valuing player contracts. Bennings contract signings clearly show he struggles properly evaluating players. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spur1 Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 33 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: Effective pro scouting is about properly evaluating the player. But that analysis being accurate to the best extent it can is also the basis for valuing player contracts. Bennings contract signings clearly show he struggles properly evaluating players. Says who? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Josepho Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 (edited) We don't even necessarily have to look at Benning's trade acquisitions to evaluate his ability to evaluate talent. He watched guys like Gudbranson/Sbisa/Granlund/Pouliot suck ass here, and decided to give them all extensions. Aside from one year with Sbisa in Vegas, all of those players immediately found themselves out of favour with literally every other team in the league. This either suggests that he is a poor talent evaluator or he's too arrogant to admit his own mistakes. Doesn't bode well either way. Edited May 1, 2021 by Josepho 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
combover Posted May 1, 2021 Share Posted May 1, 2021 They’ve had a plan. to be a competitive team that rebuilds on the fly and has a winning environment. they’ve failed at every one of those things as well as many other like cap management and asset management. JB and his management is in the top three of worst gms in this franchise he’ll be remember as such. His team stats prove it. he’s has excelled in excuses and bad contracts. he’s currently the worst GM employed in the nhl. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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