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Bridge Deals for Peterson/Hughes?

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53 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

I think the flat cap might make JM push for bridges to keep things under control for now, but I'm not sure their agent will go for that. I suppose it will come down to how hard Hughes and Petey will let their agent push for money. Are they willing to potentially hold out of games? How much do they want to win? They must be aware that taking a massive cap hit lowers our chances of winning in the future.

does signing a lower cap hit on a bridge deal increase our odds of winning a stanley cup? yes for those specific years! does signing a lower cap hit on a bridge deal increase our odds of winning a stanley cup after those 3 years? not so clear.

 

for jim benning to convince QH and EP40 that we are on the brink of becoming a cup contender is a tough sell.

 

compared the makeup of TBL,  how in 2 years  we become a cup contender

 

in 2 years our team will have to be like this.

ep40=point

hughes=hedman????

boeser=kucherov????

horvat=stamkos????

demko=valeslevski????

myers=mcdonagh/???

lind=cirelli???

schmidt=sergachev???

miller=palat?

podkolzin=killorn?

cernak=joulevi??

foote=rathbone?

hoglander=johnson?

gourde/coleman/maroon=????

 

the only players that have the potential to become better than  the one's i compared them to are bolded. jims gogt some work to do.

 

 

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36 minutes ago, drummerboy said:

Some people can take more than one thing in at a time and can process their own ideas.......

OK......

 

36 minutes ago, drummerboy said:


 

Benning has taken an old garbage team and brought us a full cupboard and a great up and coming team. 
In a couple years when the crippling dog Pooh contracts Benning has signed are done, we are set up to be one hell of a team. 
 

Make sense?

Yes. A great up and coming team that is crippled. Make a ton of sense. Have you stopped to think, if some of those "crippling" contracts are maybe what allowed JB to build this great up and coming team? Who is taking hard PK minutes? Sutter and Beagle. 

 

36 minutes ago, drummerboy said:

 

He has done an amazing job drafting and rebuilding this team.  

At the same time, he signed garbage contracts that are holding the team back this year and next.  
 

Seeing the changes he has made, as well as the Loui’s, I choose to side with being a Benning fan as opposed to a hater.   
 

You’re an oxymoron.     Hahaha

Sure. You clearly don't know what oxymoron means :) 

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2 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

Bargain star MacKinnon says he’d take less money again to help Avalanche win

 

https://nhl.nbcsports.com/2019/12/05/bargain-star-mackinnon-says-hed-take-less-money-again-to-help-avalanche-win/

of course, he would say he took less there. i mean being a .7ppg player makes him 6 million. than now it probably earns him 12 million as a "discount"

 

makes him look real good to say those things and then take a 500k discount off the top.

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3 hours ago, -AJ- said:

I think the flat cap might make JM push for bridges to keep things under control for now, but I'm not sure their agent will go for that. I suppose it will come down to how hard Hughes and Petey will let their agent push for money. Are they willing to potentially hold out of games? How much do they want to win? They must be aware that taking a massive cap hit lowers our chances of winning in the future.

I'm sorry to break this to you, but players always take as much as they can get.   BB agent pushed JB to the edge/max.   Sure EPs and QHs will do the same, just hope he holds his ground like he did with BB.   Nathan McKinnon said he'd sign another low deal just to help the AVs win the cup the last 12 months, but i think that's just postering.   And any idea of that i'm sure is out the window now....Look at what Rantanen got (was it 9.25?)... his teammates, including the one who benifited the most because of his play, didn't get the memo i guess.    

 

Sure Vegas, TB, Florida and Dallas get a no tax deal advantage.   So it creates a little show that those players are trying to "win a cup" but upon closer inspection they are not so cap "friendly" on other teams, and NMC makes sure it stays that way (we were lucky with JT Miller and Schmidt).   Cant wait to see what Points deal comes out as.  AP wouldn't stay in St. Louis over a couple hundred grand.   That's it.  Watching Toews comments this off season was comical.   It was his and Kanes contracts that created their cap issues, yet he's "shocked " they have to rebuild.   Doughy poughty did it too, and recently EK in SJ.    The superstars of the league are leeches on the cap and create a second class citizen environment  that forces GMs to let serviceable guys like Schenn and Hamonic to take whatever they can get, otherwise it's the next man up (prospects on ELC's).    The last guy i can recall taking one for our team was Burrows, but he was given his legacy country club deal soon after.    Tough deal under the cap, but it is what it is. 

 

In the end the agent gets as much as possible too for his own pocket book.   Sure the player is the boss and decent deals happen.    For me personally, i don't think either EP or QHs have done enough to deserve the type of money that would hurt the team (yet). 

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25 minutes ago, khay said:

OK......

 

Yes. A great up and coming team that is crippled. Make a ton of sense.

it makes plenty of sense.  
I two years those contract will be gone

Quote

 

Have you stopped to think, if some of those "crippling" contracts are maybe what allowed JB to build this great up and coming team? Who is taking hard PK minutes? Sutter and Beagle.

 

Sure. Eriksson has been a huge helper in developing the kids.    Sutter only plays half a season.  Beagle hasn’t been a disaster. 

 

Quote


 

Sure. You clearly don't know what oxymoron means :) 

That was the joke......

 

 

Maybe you’ll get this...

you dog gets sick and accidentally poops in front of the door at night.  
Do you hate that dog now?   
No, the dog has brought more good than a poop on the floor

Edited by drummerboy
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46 minutes ago, IBatch said:

I'm aware of their positions.   Also aware that EP has so much skill he made the switch which for sure is unusual, it's usually the other way around (C's can't cut it and go to the wing).   Based on the eye test, EP has more value then BB over the same time frame.   But one falls down whenever he's bumped, the other doesn't.    And JT Miller insulates EP to a certain degree.   I'm sorry, as of what i've seen so far,  EP despite all the promise hasn't done enough IMO to warrant a deal like AHO,  probably not Barzal either.     If you read my posts that's where i'm going, those two contracts set the market. 

 

Didn't AHO score 49, 63, 83 points? 

Didn't Barzal score  85, 62, 60?

And Trotz came in his second year and change all their d systems. 

 

Compared to 66, 66, ??

 

The only "always been" is this market. Their are other players out their too.   Brayden Point as well. 

 

Edit:  Have to add.   Based on this his contract year, have you noticed any significant improvements?  BB for sure carried our forward group this year, our best all around forward.   Yes he's older, that matters for sure.   I've watched several players enter the league and have their best seasons hear one.   I don't think that's what we have in EP, but i also haven't seen him carry the play and make a difference like i did with Bure or Mogilny.   As for QHs,  well Jovo had a couple years with us where he was very close to Norris finalists too, and I remember him taking over games by himself and doing it.   EP had three five point games his rookie year.   I think maybe it was two, and yes he looked poised for something great.   Not that he won't do that, but you have to pay your second contract guys on what they have done, not on potential.   At least that's how i see it.   Let them earn their third contracts.   Tavares and Mackinnon might be the last two guys i've seen do that so get that it's nit the same as it was before Dubas and Chakya (the analytic GMs) pretty much did their best to break the system.   

you really going to expect me take your arguments seriously? when you spout point totals, without considering any other factors? using your method Mario lemeuix would be over rated hack. 

 

 

 

all your second paragraph is crap based on your own eye's, from a time when half the nhl teams were made up of prized fighters. were talking 30 years ago!!!!!!!!!!! you remember????? i cant remember what i had for breakfast last week.

 

so it seems to me we are at a disagreement. while i value metrics based on past contracts, you value your eye.

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20 minutes ago, Petey_BOI said:

of course, he would say he took less there. i mean being a .7ppg player makes him 6 million. than now it probably earns him 12 million as a "discount"

 

makes him look real good to say those things and then take a 500k discount off the top.

I just referenced this without even noticing it was posted.   It's BS, at least we surely will find out at some point.   The player who got the most playing with him certainly didn't get the memo did he? 

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Colorada and Nathan McKinnon announce an extension to his deal.

4 years added on, begining in 2023/24 Nathan will recieve $2 mill a season.

 

 

Come on Nathan, put up or shut up.

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1 minute ago, Petey_BOI said:

you really going to expect me take your arguments seriously? when you spout point totals, without considering any other factors? using your method Mario lemeuix would be over rated hack. 

 

 

 

all your second paragraph is crap based on your own eye's, from a time when half the nhl teams were made up of prized fighters. were talking 30 years ago!!!!!!!!!!! you remember????? i cant remember what i had for breakfast last week.

 

so it seems to me we are at a disagreement. while i value metrics based on past contracts, you value your eye.

Wow pissed in your cornflakes today?  Why can't we just agree to disagree.   I don't think EP or QHs have done enough to warrant massive deals.   6.5-7x 6 with covid considered that's about it.   Move on. 

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14 minutes ago, IBatch said:

I'm sorry to break this to you, but players always take as much as they can get.   BB agent pushed JB to the edge/max.   Sure EPs and QHs will do the same, just hope he holds his ground like he did with BB.   Nathan McKinnon said he'd sign another low deal just to help the AVs win the cup the last 12 months, but i think that's just postering.   And any idea of that i'm sure is out the window now....Look at what Rantanen got (was it 9.25?)... his teammates, including the one who benifited the most because of his play, didn't get the memo i guess.    

 

Sure Vegas, TB, Florida and Dallas get a no tax deal advantage.   So it creates a little show that those players are trying to "win a cup" but upon closer inspection they are not so cap "friendly" on other teams, and NMC makes sure it stays that way (we were lucky with JT Miller and Schmidt).   Cant wait to see what Points deal comes out as.  AP wouldn't stay in St. Louis over a couple hundred grand.   That's it.  Watching Toews comments this off season was comical.   It was his and Kanes contracts that created their cap issues, yet he's "shocked " they have to rebuild.   Doughy poughty did it too, and recently EK in SJ.    The superstars of the league are leeches on the cap and create a second class citizen environment  that forces GMs to let serviceable guys like Schenn and Hamonic to take whatever they can get, otherwise it's the next man up (prospects on ELC's).    The last guy i can recall taking one for our team was Burrows, but he was given his legacy country club deal soon after.    Tough deal under the cap, but it is what it is. 

 

In the end the agent gets as much as possible too for his own pocket book.   Sure the player is the boss and decent deals happen.    For me personally, i don't think either EP or QHs have done enough to deserve the type of money that would hurt the team (yet). 

Yeah I get that, but it still annoys me. There are exceptions, like Horvat, Burrows (2x4years) and the like, but most just get as much money as they can. Personally, for my own experience, I've found that it's worth taking less money for a better work experience. If I loved playing in Vancouver (as I suspect I would if I was an NHL player), I would take a less favourable deal to stay in Vancouver.

 

I guess maybe I'm too hopeful. I didn't expect much for Hughes, but I had hope that Petey would be the sort to strong-arm his agent into taking a cheaper deal, but with his new premium agent, that's probably not happening.

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1 minute ago, -AJ- said:

Yeah I get that, but it still annoys me. There are exceptions, like Horvat, Burrows (2x4years) and the like, but most just get as much money as they can. Personally, for my own experience, I've found that it's worth taking less money for a better work experience. If I loved playing in Vancouver (as I suspect I would if I was an NHL player, I would take a less favourable deal to stay in Vancouver.

 

I guess maybe I'm too hopeful. I didn't expect much for Hughes, but I had hope that Petey would be the sort to strong-arm his agent into taking a cheaper deal, but with his new premium agent, that's probably not happening.

Horvat at the time was a fair deal.   It's exactly what Demko got, and JV for that matter too.   I'm hoping JB does the same for both QHs and EP.   Players need to earn their third contracts.   

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7 minutes ago, Petey_BOI said:

if jim benning signs EP40 to a 6.5X6 or 7x6 i will get a tatoo on my chest that reads  GM Jim is my lord and savior.

I think that is as good as done. You should go ahead and get that tattoo.   

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6 minutes ago, appleboy said:

I think that is as good as done. You should go ahead and get that tattoo.   

I will do it as long as you sign a contract saying you will pay for the removal if he doesn't

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1 hour ago, drummerboy said:

it makes plenty of sense.  
I two years those contract will be gone

Sure. Eriksson has been a huge helper in developing the kids.    Sutter only plays half a season.  Beagle hasn’t been a disaster. 

Eriksson was a mistake but he was never brought in to develop the kids. He was brought in to extend Sedins' career, which he failed to do.

Sutter and Beagle eats up tough minutes so that Bo doesn't have to eat up all of it or thrust EP on to that job. Too bad Sutter was injured, not JB's fault. 

 

Eriksson is the only real big blunder but I wouldn't pin that on JB. Ownership wanted to compete for the playoffs with the Sedins.

 

1 hour ago, drummerboy said:

 

That was the joke......

 

 

Maybe you’ll get this...

you dog gets sick and accidentally poops in front of the door at night.  
Do you hate that dog now?   
No, the dog has brought more good than a poop on the floor

My dog pooping in front of the door is hardly crippling my home. If it's sick, the last thing I do is think about how my home is crippled by the dog.

 

But anyways. Nice try.

 

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2 hours ago, Petey_BOI said:

of course, he would say he took less there. i mean being a .7ppg player makes him 6 million. than now it probably earns him 12 million as a "discount"

 

makes him look real good to say those things and then take a 500k discount off the top.

seriously? you're ragging on MacKinnnon? 

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3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

seriously? you're ragging on MacKinnnon? 

yes, kind of reminds me of kesler's comments, who didn't really take a home town discount.

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bridge So we can be capped f’d again in two/three years

 

7-8 year deals they’ll still be young guys when the deals expire.

these guys are the true foundation of this team 

Lock them  up and don’t don’t worry about them.

 

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Long term deals. Keep that cap hit as low and long as possible. 
 

Why bridge deals? So the can hit the jackpot after the league recovers from covid?

 

Long term, not a doubt in my mind 

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1 hour ago, Petey_BOI said:

yes, kind of reminds me of kesler's comments, who didn't really take a home town discount.

well, I think you and I have reached one of those agree to disagree moments :lol:

 

I'd trade him for anyone on the Canucks but thats why we have a discussion board. 

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