[Trade] Canucks trade Adam Gaudette to Blackhawks for Matthew Highmore

[aGENT]

1 minute ago, Alain Vigneault said:

Ok but I never said Gaudette was a horrible pick.  I've been critical of the fans who acted like he was a steal and have now changed their tone on him.

What exactly is 'wrong' with recognizing that he was an excellent 5th round pick and promising young player who unfortunately stalled in his progression, had an abysmal defensive game and wasn't a long term fit here?

[Dazzle]

45 minutes ago, Alain Vigneault said:

Lol.. a contradiction?  Well, when you deliberately decontextualize what it is your're reading, of course you'll arrive at that conclusion.  It's quite clear that I'm speaking from a point of comparison between his season last year and his season this year, and not his career value as a whole.  The fact still stands that his value dipped this year from where it was last year and a decision was made on that.

 

Who said anything about Benning being an incompetent drafter?  My whole thing in this thread has been about his bootlicking fans who act like he's a genius.  I've been commentating on those who say he's a genius for drafting Gaudette and now say he's a genius for trading him (for virtually nothing), pointing out the inconsistencies in their logic.  I haven't said anything about Benning's drafting ability.  Seems you're projecting again..lmfao.

Actually, there is nothing inconsistent about criticizing a prospect/player. The only thing consistent is you going after a certain GM, even if you're on weak ground. Gaudette is a good pick, no matter how you slice it, and if you were to look at that draft year in that round or later, you'd be hard pressed to find someone else better in that spot.

 

That being said, he no longer fit the team. Do you really have that much of a difficulty separating the two dimensions?

 

[AV.]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

What exactly is 'wrong' with recognizing that he was an excellent 5th round pick and promising young player who unfortunately stalled in his progression, had an abysmal defensive game and wasn't a long term fit here?

Because the backtracking and change of mind that has come about has not been genuine.  Fans here lauded Gaudette as this steal for his whole time here.  Fans (typically the Benning supporters) consistently used this pick as a benchmark for drafting success.  It is a "success" to get games out of a pick, but the tone here was that Benning was genius for this pick rather than a professional who simply listened to his scouts and did their homework.

 

It's all hypothetical but ask fans a week before the TDL if they would have moved Gaudette for a player with a low ceiling/"safer" chance of making the NHL in some capacity and the answer would have been a resounding "no".  The people claiming to like Highmore/applauding management for moving Gaudette are simply changing their narrative because it fits the support for the GM.  None of it has anything to do with the players at hand.

 

That's what I've been criticizing this whole time.

[Bad_BOI_pete]

2 hours ago, Alain Vigneault said:

What a bunch of mindless drivel.

 

Like, the last sentence alone is just pure comedy.  He played so bad...that his value reached a peak?

 

You and I both know that's just blasphemy lmfao.

 

 I may have worded it bad but his play did improve from the beginning of the season, 2G,2A in -4 in his last 19 games. his low point was probably at game 14 when he was scratched.

 

 benning decided on seeing if gaudette could improve on his playoff season, I would have done the same thing. there was likely little interest in him preseason when you could just sign soderberg for a mill, or literally have the choice between 102 RFA'S not qualified

 

these are just the decent 24 year olds

carter verhaeghe 1 million

duclair signed for 1.65 mill

dominik Kahun signed for 750k

lucas wallmark signed for 950K

jayce Hawryluk signed for 875k

mark Jankowski signed for 700K

 

no one would have gave crap for gaudette preseason

 

there was literally only one time to trade him where we would have gotten better value. that was last year at the TDL

 

and I'm guessing that there will be better RFA'S not qualified again next year. Gaudette if he gets a contract will be signed as depth, i'm thinking this is his last year in the NHL.

Edited May 12, 2021 by Petey_BOI

[oldnews]

Gaudette reminds me of Ben Hutton in a lot of ways.

 

I think Ben's was brighter - his weakness wasn't necessarily the inability to think the defensive game (Hutton had more problems with composure / making puck moving decisions - not really a vacancy/liability without the puck = moreso when he had it on his stick in his own end of the ice) - but regardless, otherwise some similarities there imo.  Late bloomer/pick that rose - showed a lot of potential early - could not sustain - did not improve - stagnated.  Darling of the fanbase / likeable - no shortage of opportunity here before eventually needing to move on....  Seemed to have a somewhat inflated sense of his performance.   Team avoided arbitration with him....market value proved to be dramatically less than fans in this market perceived.   In Ben's case he recovered somewhat - at least maintained a depth role at the NHL level - not sure how Gaudette will fare. 

[CanucksJay]

23 hours ago, Petey_BOI said:

 

 I may have worded it bad but his play did improve from the beginning of the season, 2G,2A in -4 in his last 19 games. his low point was probably at game 14 when he was scratched.

 

 benning decided on seeing if gaudette could improve on his playoff season, I would have done the same thing. there was likely little interest in him preseason when you could just sign soderberg for a mill, or literally have the choice between 102 RFA'S not qualified

 

these are just the decent 24 year olds

carter verhaeghe 1 million

duclair signed for 1.65 mill

dominik Kahun signed for 750k

lucas wallmark signed for 950K

jayce Hawryluk signed for 875k

mark Jankowski signed for 700K

 

no one would have gave crap for gaudette preseason

 

there was literally only one time to trade him where we would have gotten better value. that was last year at the TDL

 

and I'm guessing that there will be better RFA'S not qualified again next year. Gaudette if he gets a contract will be signed as depth, i'm thinking this is his last year in the NHL.

You had me (not fully agreeing but open to what you are saying) until saying that you think this is his least year in the NHL...

[Bad_BOI_pete]

On 5/13/2021 at 2:45 PM, CanucksJay said:

You had me (not fully agreeing but open to what you are saying) until saying that you think this is his least year in the NHL...

 it's one of my greatest flaws, thinking logistics influenced by emotions.

 

he will likely get a contract to display his talents at preseason.

 

But, the nhl bottom 6 is a wasteland filled with hungry youngsters looking to feed on struggling players.

[DeNiro]

Exactly why you should never judge a trade too soon.

[aGENT]

2 hours ago, DeNiro said:

Exactly why you should never judge a trade too soon.

Inb4 small sample size retorts 

[wallstreetamigo]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

Inb4 small sample size retorts 

The thing about the limitations of a small sample size is it applies to both players, not just one. Its an argument not to judge either based on a handful of games. 

[aGENT]

7 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

The thing about the limitations of a small sample size is it applies to both players, not just one. Its an argument not to judge either based on a handful of games. 

Oh I'm well aware.

[wallstreetamigo]

5 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Oh I'm well aware.

It sounded like you dont believe that small sample size bias exists. 

 

If Highmore can score when the games matter, I will be happy. If he can do it consistently I will be happy. He has been given huge opportunity so its nice to see him get a few goals.

 

I am hoping he turns out better than expected. I just dont think a few goals in a clump is enough evidence of that. He did that in the playoffs last year and until the last few games provided pretty much zero offense. I will be happy with 33 points in 59 games as an example

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

Which small sample size are we talking about, anyway?

 

Highmore with 5 points in 15 GP, 0.33 points per game, and 1.56 5v5 points/60?

 

Or Gaudette with 4 points in 7 GP, 0.57 points per game, and 2.27 5v5 points/60?

 

[Bad_BOI_pete]

3 hours ago, SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME said:

Which small sample size are we talking about, anyway?

 

Highmore with 5 points in 15 GP, 0.33 points per game, and 1.56 5v5 points/60?

 

Or Gaudette with 4 points in 7 GP, 0.57 points per game, and 2.27 5v5 points/60?

 

or these other stats, makes sense why gaudette was a healthy scratch last game of the season.

Player	GP	SH iSAT/60	SH S/60	PP GA/60	SH TOI	SH TOI/GP	SH TOI%
Matthew Highmore	15	2.3	2.3	4.53	26:30	1:46	38.3

 

Player	GP	PPA2	PPP	PPP/60	PP S/60	PP TOI	PP TOI/GP	PP TOI%
Adam Gaudette	7	1	1	12.68	0	4:44	0:41	14.4

 

Player	GP	TOI/GP	Hits/60	BkS/60	GvA/60	TkA/60
Adam Gaudette	7	12:12	4	2.81	2	1.4
Matthew Highmore	15	15:00	5.33	2.93	1.33	1.59

 

Player	GP	EV TOI/GP	On-Ice EV GF	On-Ice EV GA	On-Ice EV GD	On-Ice EV GF%
Matthew Highmore	15	13:11	9	9	0	50
Adam Gaudette	7	11:30	4	6	-2	40

Edited May 16, 2021 by Petey_BOI

[smithers joe]

i don't know why gaud was traded. i have a feeling he requested one but looking at the 2 players, canucks didn't feel confident in his defensive play or his play as a center. he wasn't a 2nd line player, at least not yet or good enough defensively to play 4th line. highmore's speed and drive make him more adaptable in the line up. think motte 2. i liked gaud but this might work out better for both teams.  lets give it a try.

[86Viking]

burrows 2.0 light...one can hope anyway!

[aGENT]

12 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

It sounded like you dont believe that small sample size bias exists. 

 

If Highmore can score when the games matter, I will be happy. If he can do it consistently I will be happy. He has been given huge opportunity so its nice to see him get a few goals.

 

I am hoping he turns out better than expected. I just dont think a few goals in a clump is enough evidence of that. He did that in the playoffs last year and until the last few games provided pretty much zero offense. I will be happy with 33 points in 59 games as an example

I guess 'sounds' can be deceiving.

 

For example. It sounds like you don't believe you have a massive anti management bias in pretty much every post... But that can't possibly be true...

 

[wallstreetamigo]

3 hours ago, aGENT said:

I guess 'sounds' can be deceiving.

 

For example. It sounds like you don't believe you have a massive anti management bias in pretty much every post... But that can't possibly be true...

 

Just because someone looks at the work management has done for 7 years and doesnt like it doesnt mean they are "biased".

 

I give Benning credit when I think he does good things. I criticize him when I think he makes bad decisions. It just happens that, imo, he does far more bad than good. If I was biased I would hate everything he does just for the sake of it.

 

You think the only mistake he has made of any significance is Eriksson. So I could call that you thinking he is a good manager overall based on your perception or I could be a dismissive douche and say you have pro Benning bias. I have never said that though because you have the right to your perspective just like I do. 

 

I am not big on getting into personal insults or telling other people not to post their opinions because I dont happen to agree. This forum is here so fans can talk about their team, its not here to only support pro management narratives and opinions.

 

If people dont like my opinions its cool. They should develop the adult ability of ignoring them or discussing why they disagree rather than marginalizing my opinion down to a bias. 

 

Thinking he is a sub par to terrible manager is based on a lot of things, not some irrational hate towards the guy. No one wishes he could stop $&!#ting the bed more than me.

 

Edited May 16, 2021 by wallstreetamigo

[Alflives]

7 hours ago, smithers joe said:

i don't know why gaud was traded. i have a feeling he requested one but looking at the 2 players, canucks didn't feel confident in his defensive play or his play as a center. he wasn't a 2nd line player, at least not yet or good enough defensively to play 4th line. highmore's speed and drive make him more adaptable in the line up. think motte 2. i liked gaud but this might work out better for both teams.  lets give it a try.

Agreed.  There just wasn’t a good fit for Gaud here.  And the new guy, Highmore, has a role as a bottom six checker, who can play up the lineup in a pinch.  Gaud wanted a role here we could fit him in to.  Highmore accepts his role, and it suits him.  It’s a good hockey trade.  

[wallstreetamigo]

Just now, Alflives said:

Agreed.  There just wasn’t a good fit for Gaud here.  And the new guy, Highmore, has a role as a bottom six checker, who can play up the lineup in a pinch.  Gaud wanted a role here we could fit him in to.  Highmore accepts his role, and it suits him.  It’s a good hockey trade.  

Highmore is not a top 6 winger though which is how he is being used, probably more to justify the trade than anything. Of course he accepts being in the top 6 after being a healthy scratch in Chi.

 

As a bottom 6 guy I like his game a lot, probably better than anyone not named Motte or MacEwan. In the top 6 though? Cmon. Thats just another sub par, one line scoring team waiting to happen. Its a waste of Bo to have him be both a top 6 scorer and a shutdown guy. With Pearson and Highmore on his wings, that should be a 3rd shutdown line, not a 2nd line tasked with providing offense. And if they want to use it that way its cool but get a better 2nd line that can score consistently.

 

The Canucks are brutal about not knowing how to properly utilize players. Been that way for more than a decade now actually.

 

If there is a spot in the top 6 for Highmore, there theoretically was a top 6 spot for Gaudette, although he was never really tried there to even see if he could perform. He is a far better offensive player. At the very least it might have raised his trade value.