Coconuts Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 32 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said: This Forum with some of the posters here are no better Don't narrow the lens too much, you can say that about any significant sports fanbase, you're always going to get a mixed bag The difference is most fans aren't going to badger players in person, or fabricate stories to drive social media or website traffic, or talk the sort of $&!# in person that they'd talk online while posting into the void Fans are always going to be fans, but almost none of them will be the kind of weasels a lot of media guys seem to be Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quantum Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Honestly, a lot of the media guys -- especially the Thomas Drance types -- are all now trying to emulate the Jason Botchford model where they're being loud and passionate but they're doing it to disastrous results. I wasn't a big TSN 1040 fan but I was a Botchford fan because he seemed to care about the team like most fans do and as Botch used to say he was a "fan of the fans". I did listen to the VanCast today with Thomas Drance and Jeff Paterson because I was curious about there take on the media thing. They basically tried to spin it off as the Canucks being super unprofessional, violating the CBA (which is true), and basically they talked about how they are worried that coming off Covid the Canucks will restrict reporters access to the Canucks as the team tries to clamp down on the narratives that come out of it. They also talked a lot about the comments Bo Horvat made when Drance asked how management supported the players during the Covid battle and how Bo only thanked the fans and the players families and didn't say anything about management. I think they're hoping this is the storyline that finally sees Benning and Weisbrod get ousted as it's clear the narrative that's about to come out is how management has lost the room and must go. (In fairness, I'm not the biggest Benning fan and wouldn't be sad if he got fired at the end of the season and replaced by someone competent). I do understand that those practices must have been hard and that keeping them private only really helped the players. I don't think any big storylines were going to come out about what went on and who was missing -- that information was revealed literally the day of yesterday's game. It's a fine balancing act, though, so I see it from both sides but Bieksa was right and as someone who obviously dabbles in the media (though he's definitely a commentator) he also has a decade of experience as a Canuck and there were definitely times where the media here wanted to run him out of town during the Sedins era heyday for not being the best defenseman in the league. So I get it. Canucks media is too harsh and you can't deny that. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWMc1 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 22 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said: It is their job and negativity sells Heck elections are won because of it, and if not then anti someone wins elections. I do not fault the Media for doing there jobs. I fault the fans for not understanding it is their job. And for the most part these people probably have great respect for the players but it is their job to sell what they are saying or writing The old tucker carlson defense. Fans should know better than to expect integrity or credibility from our media clowns. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 3 minutes ago, Quantum said: They also talked a lot about the comments Bo Horvat made when Drance asked how management supported the players during the Covid battle and how Bo only thanked the fans and the players families and didn't say anything about management. I think they're hoping this is the storyline that finally sees Benning and Weisbrod get ousted as it's clear the narrative that's about to come out is how management has lost the room and must go. (In fairness, I'm not the biggest Benning fan and wouldn't be sad if he got fired at the end of the season and replaced by someone competent). That's a perfect example of a new narrative that's being thrown out there by a couple of members of the media to see if it sticks. Based on nothing but conjecture. Imagine being Bo and reading this or hearing about it. I think that we as fans greatly underestimate how many of these stories players hear/read. Their friends and family read them too and ask them about it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Pettersson Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 2 hours ago, aGENT said: Only way I find out about 99% of their idiocy is on CDC. People re post their nonsense here and I'm dumbfounded people actually consume and agree with it There were people here who posted the media's fake story that Quinn Hughes was taking IV's. I wonder how those people feel now? 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 8 minutes ago, RWMc1 said: The old tucker carlson defense. Fans should know better than to expect integrity or credibility from our media clowns. Their not real media there entertainers just like Tucker Carlson, No one intelligent would ever call Carlson a journalist and no one should consider sports media journalists Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 18 minutes ago, Coconuts said: Don't narrow the lens too much, you can say that about any significant sports fanbase, you're always going to get a mixed bag The difference is most fans aren't going to badger players in person, or fabricate stories to drive social media or website traffic, or talk the sort of $&!# in person that they'd talk online while posting into the void Fans are always going to be fans, but almost none of them will be the kind of weasels a lot of media guys seem to be I agree It is hockey in Canada NFL and MLB in the States Soccer or Football in Europe Fans get stupid it is a mob mentality thing 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 (edited) 17 minutes ago, RWMc1 said: The old tucker carlson defense. Fans should know better than to expect integrity or credibility from our media clowns. Fox news is not news most stations that call themselves news is not news including CNN CBC is not news actually if being totally truthful there is not a single real news station. They all have some or a lot of Bias Edited April 20, 2021 by Arrow 1983 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 I am mixed on all this.............. I do think the media needs to report facts, but I also think they should have the right to question. It is much like these forums, if we are not allowed to have opinion, than these forums should not be interactive It is not wrong to have a different view or question a decision, no more than it is not wrong to be a constant supporter of the teams decisions IMO, What I get steamed about is the " Hughes was on IV" type of media exploitations There is absolutely nothing wrong with asking a question about why Tanev was not renewed or why Schmidt was traded for. Alot of times on here, you get the information you had earlier missed. I expect a civil discussion should happen And I do not believe anyone has moral high ground here, whether they blindly trust Benning, or Blindly hate Benning Personally, there are alot of things to like about him...........with his drafting being insanely good, IMO This all comes around to the point that, most people on here can reason, what is good and bad from the media. If they were not listened to, their ratings would be down, and they would be removed................it is the law of their jungle So, good on Kevin Bieska, who clears up some crap, but just remember that he is now part of the media, and he will want you to believe his words It might not always be correct, or forthright either. I love the guy don't get me wrong, but............... Ask Kevin what he thinks of the Eriksson signing and who he blames or questions on that subject, and I am sure he would be very careful not to spill too much info.............I feel he would give a very political answer on that one.....................or he would just deflect it............ I do not think it is wrong to have an opinion on a subject, and unless you are close to the subject matter, there is a certain extrapolation done Why would we be holding the media to a higher standard? I think it is important to have the conversation on it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWMc1 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 8 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said: Their not real media there entertainers just like Tucker Carlson, No one intelligent would ever call Carlson a journalist and no one should consider sports media journalists That was the point. You're defending their ineptitude by saying that they are inept and everyone should know it. Not all NHL teams have a media that is so constantly negative. You're pushing the "they're all the same" narrative when it's not true. Our media are some of the most despicable in all of the NHL. They've proven it time and again. 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Just now, RWMc1 said: That was the point. You're defending their ineptitude by saying that they are inept and everyone should know it. Not all NHL teams have a media that is so constantly negative. You're pushing the "they're all the same" narrative when it's not true. Our media are some of the most despicable in all of the NHL. They've proven it time and again. yes people should know it. The Media is not at fault for someone's lack of intelligent The Canadian Markets are fairly equal. You are just spouting the narrative that some one else has feed you that Vancouver is some how worse. The Canadian Hockey Market is no worse then that in the US for NFL or MLB. The Vancouver market is no worse than that of the rest of the Canadian market. My guess is you have not seen what they write like in Europe about Soccer or Football, they take their soccer serious. If you think they are bad in the UK with the royals their Soccer teams get that daily and more. The difference is that I have travelled this planet and experience these things first hand. Most fans are not worldly and therefor are feed and for most part believe the narrative they are told. Because it fits into their comfortable but usually miserable lives there is a saying some one once told me when I was young misery loves company. This is true for the General society, just consider Trump supporters. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kloubek Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 He's not wrong. Local media have always been hard on the team. Likely driven by our fickle fan base that can't stop complaining and very much run on a what-have-you-done-for-me-lately basis. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 5 minutes ago, kloubek said: He's not wrong. Local media have always been hard on the team. Likely driven by our fickle fan base that can't stop complaining and very much run on a what-have-you-done-for-me-lately basis. What came first the Chicken or the egg Is it the Media following the Fans opinion or the fan following the Media opinion. I would say the Fan following the Media Opinion. Media sells negativity cause that is what the fans respond to Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 13 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said: yes people should know it. The Media is not at fault for someone's lack of intelligent The Canadian Markets are fairly equal. You are just spouting the narrative that some one else has feed you that Vancouver is some how worse. The Canadian Hockey Market is no worse then that in the US for NFL or MLB. The Vancouver market is no worse than that of the rest of the Canadian market. My guess is you have not seen what they write like in Europe about Soccer or Football, they take their soccer serious. If you think they are bad in the UK with the royals their Soccer teams get that daily and more. The difference is that I have travelled this planet and experience these things first hand. Most fans are not worldly and therefor are feed and for most part believe the narrative they are told. Because it fits into their comfortable but usually miserable lives there is a saying some one once told me when I was young misery loves company. This is true for the General society, just consider Trump supporters. I think it was telling during the Stanley Cup finals in 2011 that the Vancouver media was happy to jump on our own team after Luongo spoke following our game 5 win. Boston media had a field day just covering what our own guys were doing. Luongo was having to answer ridiculous questions in between games 5 and 6, mostly thanks to our media guys. I think that Vancouver media takes the cake, other then maybe Toronto and Montreal. I know what you mean about soccer coverage overseas though where they take even more of a paparazzi approach. I just think that we are on an extreme end here in Vancouver when it comes to wanting to create controversies out of thin air and finding problems even when the club is winning. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 32 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said: I am mixed on all this.............. I do think the media needs to report facts, but I also think they should have the right to question. It is much like these forums, if we are not allowed to have opinion, than these forums should not be interactive It is not wrong to have a different view or question a decision, no more than it is not wrong to be a constant supporter of the teams decisions IMO, What I get steamed about is the " Hughes was on IV" type of media exploitations There is absolutely nothing wrong with asking a question about why Tanev was not renewed or why Schmidt was traded for. Alot of times on here, you get the information you had earlier missed. I expect a civil discussion should happen And I do not believe anyone has moral high ground here, whether they blindly trust Benning, or Blindly hate Benning Personally, there are alot of things to like about him...........with his drafting being insanely good, IMO This all comes around to the point that, most people on here can reason, what is good and bad from the media. If they were not listened to, their ratings would be down, and they would be removed................it is the law of their jungle So, good on Kevin Bieska, who clears up some crap, but just remember that he is now part of the media, and he will want you to believe his words It might not always be correct, or forthright either. I love the guy don't get me wrong, but............... Ask Kevin what he thinks of the Eriksson signing and who he blames or questions on that subject, and I am sure he would be very careful not to spill too much info.............I feel he would give a very political answer on that one.....................or he would just deflect it............ I do not think it is wrong to have an opinion on a subject, and unless you are close to the subject matter, there is a certain extrapolation done Why would we be holding the media to a higher standard? I think it is important to have the conversation on it. Just a couple things I picked up on You are right real journalism should ask why. But it should stop there. When a the media gives their opinion instead of facts it is no longer news but entertainment. About the Moral High Ground it is interesting the words you used Blindly trust or Hate Benning. Those are both Moral objectives. We would use blindly trust relating to God. Or The word Hate has truly a moral meaning. Why not instead say dislike Benning's moves or Like Benning's moves. You Say there is things to like about him truth is you do not know him. My guess is no one on this forum is close to him. You Know things he has done and only in term of for the Canucks organization Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 (edited) 17 minutes ago, VancouverHabitant said: I think it was telling during the Stanley Cup finals in 2011 that the Vancouver media was happy to jump on our own team after Luongo spoke following our game 5 win. Boston media had a field day just covering what our own guys were doing. Luongo was having to answer ridiculous questions in between games 5 and 6, mostly thanks to our media guys. I think that Vancouver media takes the cake, other then maybe Toronto and Montreal. I know what you mean about soccer coverage overseas though where they take even more of a paparazzi approach. I just think that we are on an extreme end here in Vancouver when it comes to wanting to create controversies out of thin air and finding problems even when the club is winning. I have to disagree with you, we really are not that much more extreme in Vancouver. It is a narrative or perception that is given to Vancouver. There is nothing in our Gene pool or water that makes us more extreme then from other human beings. It is a lie people choose to believe Lounge did it to himself he made the comment about pumping tires and Boston and Vancouver Media jumped on it as soon as Thomas made his comments. Lounge gave fuel to the fire. Of course a media that is there to entertain would jump all over it that is what they are paid to do. "Are you not entertained" I remember now from Russel Crowe Gladiator Edited April 20, 2021 by Arrow 1983 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWMc1 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 33 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said: yes people should know it. The Media is not at fault for someone's lack of intelligent The Canadian Markets are fairly equal. You are just spouting the narrative that some one else has feed you that Vancouver is some how worse. The Canadian Hockey Market is no worse then that in the US for NFL or MLB. The Vancouver market is no worse than that of the rest of the Canadian market. My guess is you have not seen what they write like in Europe about Soccer or Football, they take their soccer serious. If you think they are bad in the UK with the royals their Soccer teams get that daily and more. The difference is that I have travelled this planet and experience these things first hand. Most fans are not worldly and therefor are feed and for most part believe the narrative they are told. Because it fits into their comfortable but usually miserable lives there is a saying some one once told me when I was young misery loves company. This is true for the General society, just consider Trump supporters. Bullcrap!!! Elevating yourself to try to sound more convincing does the opposite. You are resorting to insulting the intelligence of anyone who has a differing opinion. The funny thing is if you were as intelligent as you make yourself out to be, you would notice that people here are questioning the local sports media and are not just buying into their crap. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 Just now, RWMc1 said: Bullcrap!!! Elevating yourself to try to sound more convincing does the opposite. You are resorting to insulting the intelligence of anyone who has a differing opinion. The funny thing is if you were as intelligent as you make yourself out to be, you would notice that people here are questioning the local sports media and are not just buying into their crap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4petesake Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 As someone who reposts a fair amount of what other media and fans are saying and posting, this conversation got me thinking about my own role. Should we just ignore silly/stupid/wrong things that are said? After all if a tweet gets posted in a forest and there is no one there to read it or repost it, then it has no life. But practically that will never happen as people will still follow those that share their opinions. I think it’s important to know what the media, both good and bad, is saying so that we have an idea of how fans are forming their opinions. It gives us an opportunity to discuss both sides of an issue rather than just falling in line with like-minded people which is far easier but dumbs both sides down. It’s not our job to change someone’s mind, only to provide an alternate way of looking at something. I have mad respect for someone who totally disagrees with me but can have a reasonable and open discussion. You can’t bully someone into changing their view but you can find areas & ideas that you can agree on. That can be enough. Lastly, I have always firmly and steadfastly believed that the most boring world to live in is one one where everyone looks and thinks just like me. So I guess I’ll just keep reposting the good and the crap. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arrow 1983 Posted April 20, 2021 Share Posted April 20, 2021 (edited) 9 minutes ago, RWMc1 said: Bullcrap!!! Elevating yourself to try to sound more convincing does the opposite. You are resorting to insulting the intelligence of anyone who has a differing opinion. The funny thing is if you were as intelligent as you make yourself out to be, you would notice that people here are questioning the local sports media and are not just buying into their crap. It is not me putting myself above you or anyone else. It is my experience some one who has had the great fortune to be enlightened to correct where you are wrong. Sorry I had to. But seriously we are not that special that we get to be so different. If you really believe we are you have been living in a Covid Bubble to long. Sorry again I had to. At no point did I ever say everyone was buying the narrative. It would not work if every one was negative who would they argue with. The fact that you did not figure out that point makes me happy that I with my great intellect was here to correct you Sorry again i had to do it Edited April 20, 2021 by Arrow 1983 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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