Is it time to bump Benning sideways?

[DSVII]

9 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

by what measure is Stevie Y the best GM in the league? 

I would think putting together one of the consistently best teams (by any slew of metrics you want to use) in the league in the Tampa Bay Lightning, and winning the first GM of the Year Award for their franchise, plays a generous part in that evaluation. Who would you put above Stevie Y?

 

And does it discount the point? You don't need a scouting background to be a GM. It isn't the primary skillset needed. 

Edited May 5, 2021 by DSVII

[JM_]

27 minutes ago, DSVII said:

I would think putting together one of the consistently best teams (by any slew of metrics you want to use) in the league in the Tampa Bay Lightning, and winning the first GM of the Year Award for their franchise, plays a generous part in that evaluation. Who would you put above Stevie Y?

 

And does it discount the point? You don't need a scouting background to be a GM. It isn't the primary skillset needed. 

so why did Tampa let him walk? 

 

I don't think we can boil it down to one thing. By all accounts, Kruger is a heck of a communicator, but I don't think he'll ever be trusted to run a team.

 

You need someone with a range of skills, but if I had to pick just one I'd go with the best scout because there's no replacement for talent. 

[Josepho]

8 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

so why did Tampa let him walk? 

 

I don't think we can boil it down to one thing. By all accounts, Kruger is a heck of a communicator, but I don't think he'll ever be trusted to run a team.

 

You need someone with a range of skills, but if I had to pick just one I'd go with the best scout because there's no replacement for talent. 

He resigned. 

[JM_]

2 minutes ago, Josepho said:

He resigned. 

its not that simple, we don't know what was going on behind the scenes. That was the end result of something. 

[DSVII]

1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

its not that simple, we don't know what was going on behind the scenes. That was the end result of something. 

I don't see it as a stretch that he wanted to rebuild the team that treated him so well during his career. His heart was with the wings. 

[DSVII]

1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

so why did Tampa let him walk? 

 

I don't think we can boil it down to one thing. By all accounts, Kruger is a heck of a communicator, but I don't think he'll ever be trusted to run a team.

 

You need someone with a range of skills, but if I had to pick just one I'd go with the best scout because there's no replacement for talent. 

Communication as a primary skill was another poster's argument. I'm just saying Drafting isn't the end all be all you go for in a GM.

 

Managing and acquiring talent imo is.

 

I'm in general very skeptical of leaders and managers who always want to be the smartest one in the room and have micromanaging any aspect of the business. It's not a winning strategy. 

[knucklehead91]

On 5/2/2021 at 5:51 PM, ken kaniff said:

Not sure where this notion that Benning is a super drafter when his drafting has been average at best. He picked Virtanen and Juolevi who both were off the board picks at the time (Nylander and Tkachuk were consensus picks) both of which are worse than who he passed on. Hughes fell to us so that was a no brainer. Boeser was consensus at the time (between him and Konecny). 
 

The only picks I would actually give him props for at Pettersson, Demko and Gaudette. And he traded Gaudette away for an AHL tweener. In addition he keeps trading away draft picks, so even if he was a good drafter it means nothing since we have less picks.

 

We would arguably be in a better position if we would have just went off of the TSN draft list rather than have Benning make picks. I wonder if Benning is still working for Boston, sabotaging the Canucks at every point over the last 7 years. Usually with this level of incompetence people get fired but Aqua is keeping Dim Jim around for whatever reason

Hoglander? “Why is nobody taking Kole Lind? DiPietro? Podkolzin? Rathbone? Boeser? 

[DSVII]

Looks like Jeff Gorton is available. He's a prime candidate to take over JB's role once he's promoted out of the GM position

[JM_]

53 minutes ago, DSVII said:

Communication as a primary skill was another poster's argument. I'm just saying Drafting isn't the end all be all you go for in a GM.

 

Managing and acquiring talent imo is.

 

I'm in general very skeptical of leaders and managers who always want to be the smartest one in the room and have micromanaging any aspect of the business. It's not a winning strategy. 

for sure, thats a terrible way to run an organization and leads to a lot of angry employees 

[SID.IS.SID.ME.IS.ME]

37 minutes ago, DSVII said:

Looks like Jeff Gorton is available. He's a prime candidate to take over JB's role once he's promoted out of the GM position

Definitely adds a very intriguing name to the list of answers to the inevitable “but who would replace him?” question, whenever the topic of #FireBenning comes up around here.

 

Would also be a nice trivia piece to have Gorton replace Benning, in Vancouver, after JB did the same to Gorton, in Boston (when Benning got promoted to the AGM position that Gorton was fired from in 2007). 
 

Always fun watching the 100 hockey men play musical chairs.  

[wallstreetamigo]

1 hour ago, DSVII said:

Looks like Jeff Gorton is available. He's a prime candidate to take over JB's role once he's promoted out of the GM position

Promoted? Please god no.

[24K PureCool]

18 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Promoted? Please god no.

We have precedence of fake promotions. Just ask Tallon in Florida. 

[xereau]

4 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

so why did Tampa let him walk? 

 

I don't think we can boil it down to one thing. By all accounts, Kruger is a heck of a communicator, but I don't think he'll ever be trusted to run a team.

 

You need someone with a range of skills, but if I had to pick just one I'd go with the best scout because there's no replacement for talent. 

They didn't let him walk, he 100% had his eyes set on the original 6 team for which he played his entire career...

[Timråfan]

5 hours ago, DSVII said:

 

 

 

Arguably the best GM in the league, Yzerman, did not have a scouting background. And he's known for screwing up his 1st round draft picks for Tampa (DeAngelo, Druoin, Koekkoek.) 

 

 

As with Benning it’s all about the scouts... Not the GM. 

[ken kaniff]

4 hours ago, knucklehead91 said:

Hoglander? “Why is nobody taking Kole Lind? DiPietro? Podkolzin? Rathbone? Boeser? 

Hoglander has been ok. Ill give him that one also. Lind has played just a couple games and hasnt done anything special. DiPietro has only played a couple games and got lit up (not Mikeys fault). Podkolzin hasnt played in the NHL yet and wasnt prominent in the KHL (Also not Podz fault). Rathbone has played one game. and Boeser was a consensus pick at that position. He even fell a bit from what i remember. Overall too early to tell for a few of these guys but drafting is not impressive for 7 years on the job

[knucklehead91]

2 hours ago, ken kaniff said:

Hoglander has been ok. Ill give him that one also. Lind has played just a couple games and hasnt done anything special. DiPietro has only played a couple games and got lit up (not Mikeys fault). Podkolzin hasnt played in the NHL yet and wasnt prominent in the KHL (Also not Podz fault). Rathbone has played one game. and Boeser was a consensus pick at that position. He even fell a bit from what i remember. Overall too early to tell for a few of these guys but drafting is not impressive for 7 years on the job

They show promise. Thats the difference between good drafting and bad drafting. So far in their respective leagues they have performed very well and at each level they graduate to, they have continued to show promise.

Go look at Gillis’s drafting and compare it to JBs tenure with the Canucks, we were hyped up over guys like Schroeder, Shinkaruk, Prab Rai, Patrick White, Rodin, Connauton, Jensen, Gaunce, Subban, Grenier, Hodgson, Corrado.....

Our drafting has sucked since 2005.

Under Gillis’ drafting 37 players have combined for a total of 1,965 games averaging 53gp. Of those 37 players 22 of them never played a game thats 59%. From the 15 players played games in the NHL 4/15 players played less than 10 games. 4 more guys played less than 80 games, 2 played under 200 games and 4 more players have played over 300, most notably are Bo Horvat, Kevin Connauton, Ben Hutton and Cody Hodgson.

 

Gillis’ drafting has produced 693 points...... 310 of that is Bo Horvats... (45%) The only guy who has a career going in a good direction

 

Benning’s drafting has produced 831, with big futures ahead for guys like Boeser, Pettersson and Hughes. 

Hughes+Pettersson+Boeser+Demko > Horvat. Thats the difference of good drafting.

Horvat is my absolute favourite player, but if I had to choose a GM to draft, Benning is high up.

We also have Rathbone, Hoglander, Podkolzin, Linus Karlsson, Lind, Gadjovich, Lockwood and a handful more of promising prospects to develop and make this team strong and deep. We have lots to work with and play with in order to build this team in to a cup contender. We could package promising prospects for big name players at deadlines to make pushes for the cup in the future.

 

 

Edited May 6, 2021 by knucklehead91

[Josepho]

3 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

They show promise. Thats the difference between good drafting and bad drafting. So far in their respective leagues they have performed very well and at each level they graduate to, they have continued to show promise.

Go look at Gillis’s drafting and compare it to JBs tenure with the Canucks, we were hyped up over guys like Schroeder, Shinkaruk, Prab Rai, Patrick White, Rodin, Connauton, Jensen, Gaunce, Subban, Grenier, Hodgson, Corrado.....

Our drafting has sucked since 2005.

Under Gillis’ drafting 37 players have combined for a total of 1,965 games averaging 53gp. Of those 37 players 22 of them never played a game thats 59%. From the 15 players played games in the NHL 4/15 players played less than 10 games. 4 more guys played less than 80 games, 2 played under 200 games and 4 more players have played over 300, most notably are Bo Horvat, Kevin Connauton, Ben Hutton and Cody Hodgson.

 

Gillis’ drafting has produced 693 points...... 310 of that is Bo Horvats... (45%) The only guy who has a career going in a good direction

 

Benning’s drafting has produced 831, with big futures ahead for guys like Boeser, Pettersson and Hughes. 

Hughes+Pettersson+Boeser+Demko > Horvat. Thats the difference of good drafting.

Horvat is my absolute favourite player, but if I had to choose a GM to draft, Benning high up.

We also have Rathbone, Hoglander, Podkolzin, Linus Karlsson, Lind, Gadjovich, Lockwood and a handful more of promising prospects to develop and make this team strong and deep. We have lots to work with and play with in order to build this team in to a cup contender. We could package promising prospects for big name players at deadlines to make pushes for the cup in the future.

 

 

The Gillis prospects you mentioned also showed promise, they just didn't work out. It's not like those guys were doomed picks from the beginning. Guys like Hodgson, Corrado, Jensen and Schroeder all were probably more valuable as prospects than (or at the very least comparable to) guys like Lind, Woo, DiPietro and Rathbone. 

 

People always get excited over late(r) round guys like Lind, but they usually don't turn out.

Edited May 6, 2021 by Josepho

[knucklehead91]

42 minutes ago, Josepho said:

The Gillis prospects you mentioned also showed promise, they just didn't work out. It's not like those guys were doomed picks from the beginning. Guys like Hodgson, Corrado, Jensen and Schroeder all were probably more valuable as prospects than (or at the very least comparable to) guys like Lind, Woo, DiPietro and Rathbone. 

 

People always get excited over late(r) round guys like Lind, but they usually don't turn out.

Gillis prospects were all we had to be hyped up about because those were the players we ended up drafting. They had decent junior years but they all struggled at the next level and never really showed a lot of promise. It was more hopeful than promising. Benning has draftpicks that are tearing up each and every league around the world. College/University KHL, AHL etc... not just WHL OHL or QThey have taken the next steps and continued to show potential

Edited May 6, 2021 by knucklehead91