Where are the Canucks with a good 3rd line Center and another Top 4 quality defenseman?

[Arrow 1983]

13 minutes ago, Patel Bure said:

Because playoff hockey is a completely different animal and often accounts for the greatest gains and learning experiences that are a player often makes?    

 

In 2015 for instance, even though the Canucks lost to Calgary, Bo Horvat clearly took his game to another level from that experience.  

 

Playoff experience is very important for a young developing core.   Losing or not.   
 

Look at what the Canucks and Demko learned about one another in the bubble.   Think playoff exposure didn’t help Demko out at all?  C’mon son.

 

 

Plus young teams can also surprise in the playoffs they might actually win a round

[Coconuts]

5 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

If Beagle doesn't go next season that will free up money to bring in a guy like Granlund a guy the Canucks could so use as third line center 

Ehhh.. if they went a more offensively geared third line perhaps. But when I consider someone to replace Sutter I think about bringing in someone who can play tough, primarily defensive zone minutes, and Granlund ain't that guy. 

 

That's also assuming Granlund would have any interest in joining Vancouver, whereas we have an established relationship with Sutter. 

[Arrow 1983]

6 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Remember when we were one Loui Eriksdon, Jay Beagle, Antoine Roussel, Tim Schaller, Erik Gudbranson, Brandon Sutter, Tanner Pearsom,Tyler Toffoli, etc away from being a contender?

 

I do.

 

And there is probably a 2% chance at best we land one of those players, let alone two or three.

 

A more likely scenario is Benning focuses on another OEL trade, loses out on any of them, and signs a bunch of next tier guys to bad contracts to try to cover for it. Its kind of his m.o.

 

Danault, Hamilton, Wennberg, Savard, and Larsen are going to want to sign for lots of money and term and to places where they want to get top 6 and top pairing opportunity.

 

Expecting them to sign in Van to be 3rd line pk guys or sit behind Hughes for pp time on the 2nd unit at best so we can run Pearson as the 4th forward is completely unrealistic imo. We already have a young guy who would probably help the top unit in Rathbone sitting behind Pearson and even Myers on the 2nd unit.

We need Granlund

You have to ask what would the team have looked like if Benning didn't go after vets.

The core vets where in decline and the Comets they weren't  even good. We barely had a AHL team

MG made good trades to fill the bottom 6 but never landed a giant for Kesler to play with. Didn't draft most of the core Burke did (Sedins).

Burke proves Benning is doing it right

Burke drafted well MG traded draft picks and Benning is rebuilding the core from nothing literally nothing. The question now is will Benning get to stay to see what he built unlike Burke 

Edited May 10, 2021 by Arrow 1983

[Arrow 1983]

2 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

Ehhh.. if they went a more offensively geared third line perhaps. But when I consider someone to replace Sutter I think about bringing in someone who can play tough, primarily defensive zone minutes, and Granlund ain't that guy. 

 

That's also assuming Granlund would have any interest in joining Vancouver, whereas we have an established relationship with Sutter. 

You are thinking old Granlund check him out now top PKer. Tons of defensive zone starts can still get a decent amount of points.

For your point about toughness let the 8th and 9th winger bring that. This team needs secondary scoring badly and scoring starts at center or defense

He is UFA so who knows. I'm sure he will listen to offers no UFA is a guarantee 

[Coconuts]

14 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

You are thinking old Granlund check him out now top PKer. Tons of defensive zone starts can still get a decent amount of points.

For your point about toughness let the 8th and 9th winger bring that. This team needs secondary scoring badly and scoring starts at center or defense

He is UFA so who knows. I'm sure he will listen to offers no UFA is a guarantee 

At 5'10 and 185 I remain skeptical, but if he's as valuable as you imply I don't see why Nashville would let him hit UFA. Particularly when one considers their need for offensively talented centers. Nashville always seems to be needing help up front. 

 

There's also the question of why he'd leave an organization that's made the playoffs for seven straight years for a team that's made the playoffs twice in eight years. Granlund ain't exactly young anymore, and this Nucks team has plenty of questions surrounding it. I just don't see it. 

Edited May 10, 2021 by Coconuts

[Arrow 1983]

This is what I hope next season looks like 

 

Miller Pettersson Boeser 

 

Pearson Horvat Podkolzin

 

Hoglander  (Granlund) (*****)Hoping not Virtanen 

 

Motte  Beagle???  Gadjovich (he brings toughness and showed in the OHL he could play)

 

on forward Try and trade Roussel or buy him out. Virtanen well I already wrote above what I think of Virtanen. Depending on cap space we fill that bottom 9 winger spot within or can find someone out side the organization 

 

Hoglander would be considered the #7 forward if injuries occur to top 6 he is first one in. Unless Podz can't cut it right away in the top 6 then switch Hogs for Podz. Pearson should watch his back as Hogs will be right behind him if he doesn't find the Chemistry he had with Horvat in past years.

 

Motte should be considered their #10 forward and will fill in on the third line as injuries occur.

 

Hogs, Granlund, Motte and Beagle are the PKers. 

 

#2 unit powerplay looks like

 

Hogs Granlund Pods

 

Pearson (Dman Hope this becomes Rathbone)

 

Defense look like 

 

Hughes Hamonic (yes re-sign him can probably get him on the cheap on a 2 year deal 2@ 1.75mill seems fair he brings toughness to the defense)

 

Rathbone  and Schmidt (I feel like this would be balanced as both are not Offensive superstars or defensive superstars just keep it simple and back each other up)

 

Juolevi and Myers ( Kind of like Rathbone and Schmidt but Juolevi seems like he is more defensive and Myers is a little more offensive)

 

goalies

Demko 

Holtby (really hope it isn't never liked the pick up I understood it but didn't like it they can get cheaper till Dipietro is ready). Plus would free up more cap space to fill that top 9 forward spot or maybe bring in someone better than Hamonic 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Arrow 1983]

37 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

At 5'10 and 185 I remain skeptical, but if he's as valuable as you imply I don't see why Nashville would let him hit UFA. Particularly when one considers their need for offensively talented centers. Nashville always seems to be needing help up front. 

 

There's also the question of why he'd leave an organization that's made the playoffs for seven straight years for a team that's made the playoffs twice in eight years. Granlund ain't exactly young anymore, and this Nucks team has plenty of questions surrounding it. I just don't see it. 

More money. and he is worth it. Nash only gave him 3.75mill for 1 year. If I recall and you or anyone else can correct me on it he signed his contract like last minute prior to season start. I think it came to money I would say he is worth 4.5mill range on a 3-4 year deal 

Edited May 10, 2021 by Arrow 1983

[Toyotasfan]

I don’t think buying shiny new expensive defenceman can fix this team when we play such a flawed defensive system.

Get rid of Baumgartner and find someone who can do the job.

[Arrow 1983]

11 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

This is what I hope next season looks like 

 

Miller Pettersson Boeser 

 

Pearson Horvat Podkolzin

 

Hoglander  (Granlund) (*****)Hoping not Virtanen 

 

Motte  Beagle???  Gadjovich (he brings toughness and showed in the OHL he could play)

 

on forward Try and trade Roussel or buy him out. Virtanen well I already wrote above what I think of Virtanen. Depending on cap space we fill that bottom 9 winger spot within or can find someone out side the organization 

 

Hoglander would be considered the #7 forward if injuries occur to top 6 he is first one in. Unless Podz can't cut it right away in the top 6 then switch Hogs for Podz. Pearson should watch his back as Hogs will be right behind him if he doesn't find the Chemistry he had with Horvat in past years.

 

Motte should be considered their #10 forward and will fill in on the third line as injuries occur.

 

Hogs, Granlund, Motte and Beagle are the PKers. 

 

#2 unit powerplay looks like

 

Hogs Granlund Pods

 

Pearson (Dman Hope this becomes Rathbone)

 

Defense look like 

 

Hughes Hamonic (yes re-sign him can probably get him on the cheap on a 2 year deal 2@ 1.75mill seems fair he brings toughness to the defense)

 

Rathbone  and Schmidt (I feel like this would be balanced as both are not Offensive superstars or defensive superstars just keep it simple and back each other up)

 

Juolevi and Myers ( Kind of like Rathbone and Schmidt but Juolevi seems like he is more defensive and Myers is a little more offensive)

 

goalies

Demko 

Holtby (really hope it isn't never liked the pick up I understood it but didn't like it they can get cheaper till Dipietro is ready). Plus would free up more cap space to fill that top 9 forward spot or maybe bring in someone better than Hamonic 

 

 

 

 

 

 

All coached by a new Guy that has more NHL experience my pick Gerard Gallant second pick Claude Julien (or both LOL) Offensive coach Defensive coach, PP coach PK coach 

 

Pay them 3-4 mill each and no assistants 

Edited May 10, 2021 by Arrow 1983

[wallstreetamigo]

1 hour ago, Patel Bure said:

Because playoff hockey is a completely different animal and often accounts for the greatest gains and learning experiences that a player often makes?    

 

In 2015 for instance, even though the Canucks lost to Calgary, Bo Horvat clearly took his game to another level from that experience.  

 

Playoff experience is very important for a young developing core.   Losing or not.   
 

Look at what the Canucks and Demko learned about one another in the bubble.   Think playoff exposure didn’t help Demko out at all?  C’mon son.

 

 

I am not discounting gaining some playoff experience. I am saying that squeaking in and being happy losing should not be the perennial goal for 7 years for any team like it has been for the Canucks.

 

Benning's worst moves as GM have all centered around one theme: sacrificing a true longer term competitive window for band aid fixes designed to squeak into the playoffs.

 

This team is essentially no more competitive now than it was the day Benning took over. 

[wallstreetamigo]

1 hour ago, Arrow 1983 said:

We need Granlund

You have to ask what would the team have looked like if Benning didn't go after vets.

The core vets where in decline and the Comets they weren't  even good. We barely had a AHL team

MG made good trades to fill the bottom 6 but never landed a giant for Kesler to play with. Didn't draft most of the core Burke did (Sedins).

Burke proves Benning is doing it right

Burke drafted well MG traded draft picks and Benning is rebuilding the core from nothing literally nothing. The question now is will Benning get to stay to see what he built unlike Burke 

Granlund on a cheap 1 year deal maybe. But honestly having enough wingers who can kill penalties or provide middle 6 level offense isnt really a huge need on this team.

 

It needs upgrades at 3 and 4 center, a top 6 lw, a top pairing all around rhd. 

 

Not sure how Burke proves Benning is doing it right. You do know Benning has traded a lot of picks for tweeners, right? Gillis at least had a top team, not a bottom feeder he was trading picks from to try to put a band aid on a broken leg.

[Junkyard Dog]

Pod-Petey-Boeser

Pearson-Horvat-Lind

Gadjovich-Miller-Hoglander

Motte-Beagle(if healthy)-Mac

 

Keep the PP#1 normal.

[Coconuts]

45 minutes ago, Arrow 1983 said:

More money. and he is worth it. Nash only gave him 3.75mill for 1 year. If I recall and you or anyone else can correct me on it he signed his contract like last minute prior to season start. I think it came to money I would say he is worth 4.5mill range on a 3-4 year deal 

Eh, if we want a more offensive third line we've already got Miller we could transition. I think it's important to have a center capable of eating heavy defensive minutes, I don't think Granlund is that guy, I think you want him in a more offensive role. Sutter eats PK and defensive zone minutes, whether it's him or not we need someone who can fill that role. 

 

Nashville's PK is actually worse than ours, if Granlund's a part of that unit that's not exactly encouraging. If he came cheap that'd be one thing, but I still question the fit. We've got enough bottom/middle six tweeners that our depth scoring should be better next season, and we've got our youth who will be pushing for jobs. This season has been pretty disastrous for us, we should be better next season, hopefully in part thanks to new coaching staff. 

 

I'm also loathe to hand out medium term and larger dollars now that we should finally have cap being freed up over the next couple seasons. Particularly with Horvat, Miller, and Boeser extensions looming on the horizon. 

[Junkyard Dog]

9 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

Eh, if we want a more offensive third line we've already got Miller we could transition. I think it's important to have a center capable of eating heavy defensive minutes, I don't think Granlund is that guy, I think you want him in a more offensive role. Sutter eats PK and defensive zone minutes, whether it's him or not we need someone who can fill that role. 

 

Nashville's PK is actually worse than ours, if Granlund's a part of that unit that's not exactly encouraging. If he came cheap that'd be one thing, but I still question the fit. We've got enough bottom/middle six tweeners that our depth scoring should be better next season, and we've got our youth who will be pushing for jobs. This season has been pretty disastrous for us, we should be better next season, hopefully in part thanks to new coaching staff. 

 

I'm also loathe to hand out medium term and larger dollars now that we should finally have cap being freed up over the next couple seasons. Particularly with Horvat, Miller, and Boeser extensions looming on the horizon. 

I'd just put Miller there next year for the sake of having the youngsters have someone solid to play with. Posted my lineup above you.

[KingRaj91]

35 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said:

Pod-Petey-Boeser

Pearson-Horvat-Lind

Gadjovich-Miller-Hoglander

Motte-Beagle(if healthy)-Mac

 

Keep the PP#1 normal.

That second line ain't it

[Junkyard Dog]

Just now, KingRaj91 said:

That second line ain't it

It's more of a defensive line that gets Lind experience in a shutdown role, facing all the top lines.

 

1st and 3rd lines are gonna be doing most of the scoring. 3rd line is gonna see a huge improvement in scoring. Hog/Miller won't have to face top D at even-strength and Gadjo fits in well as a finisher on that line.

 

We're gonna suck either way with the amount of youth we're gonna have next year. Might as well play the youth with good talent so they develop properly.

[Josepho]

Lind has been terrible at the NHL level so far and penciling him in your lineup at all, let alone on the 2nd line, is questionable.

[Pears]

13 minutes ago, Josepho said:

Lind has been terrible at the NHL level so far and penciling him in your lineup at all, let alone on the 2nd line, is questionable.

He’s gotten better each year at every level he’s played at. Relax. 

[Arrow 1983]

49 minutes ago, Junkyard Dog said:

I'd just put Miller there next year for the sake of having the youngsters have someone solid to play with. Posted my lineup above you.

With out Miller our left wing depth sucks.

 

Gadjovich often takes a season or two to adjust to the next league up. I do wonder what his ultimate ceiling is he could be a prototypical Power forward or a staple tough guy on the bottom 6. I really want to see what he can do in the NHL. One thing is for sure he is physical and should be given every opportunity to make the Canucks lineup

[Arrow 1983]

4 minutes ago, Pears said:

He’s gotten better each year at every level he’s played at. Relax. 

Lind will amount to nothing. Doesn't have a top end shot doesn't skate that well, Doesn't read the ice like a play maker well. He does everything OK. He doesn't have the toughness this team so dearly needs in the Bottom 6. Gadjovick would be better time spent in the line up. Lind is another Reid Bouchard people will call for him to be in the line up till he fizzles out and becomes what he will be a career AHLer.