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7 minutes ago, stawns said:

that's your side B?

 

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Bro come on, Fur Real?  Come on Fam?

 

Look at their  NHL stats and tell me you would still pick OJ.  ;)

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16 minutes ago, JohnTavares said:

Tell Jim I said hi.


No reasonable person can argue that you would have Olli Juolevi over Matthew Tkachuk.

 

Not even the GOAT Benning shills.

you're claiming not picking Tkachuk "set the team back years" but you can't support that statement. 

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Just now, Petey_BOI said:

Bro come on, Fur Real?  Come on Fam?

 

Look at their  NHL stats and tell me you would still pick OJ.  ;)

never said I would, I said I had no issues not picking MT.  

 

I'm also willing to wait and see what OJ becomes before I write it off.  I think he's going to be a top 3 dman on the team in a couple years and will likely be the high minute muncher in 5 years.........if he can stay healthy.

 

MT has good individual numbers, but has he helped Cagary improve?  Are they any further ahead with that pick than Van is with OJ?  Truthfully, Sergachev is who they should have picked there, but even then, who knows how he develops on a team not loaded like TB

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1 minute ago, Jimmy McGill said:

you're claiming not picking Tkachuk "set the team back years" but you can't support that statement. 

I said whiffing on the Virtanen and Juolevi picks set this team back years.

 

If this team had Nylander and Tkachuk in their top six, they would be a legitimate contender and be in the playoffs right now.

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Posted (edited)
1 minute ago, JohnTavares said:

I said whiffing on the Virtanen and Juolevi picks set this team back years.

 

If this team had Nylander and Tkachuk in their top six, they would be a legitimate contender and be in the playoffs right now.

you can't say that either. We may have missed on other picks because of where we'd be in the draft. We probably wouldn't have Hughes or Petey. 

 

Edited by Jimmy McGill
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1 minute ago, stawns said:

never said I would, I said I had no issues not picking MT.  

 

I'm also willing to wait and see what OJ becomes before I write it off.  I think he's going to be a top 3 dman on the team in a couple years and will likely be the high minute muncher in 5 years.........if he can stay healthy.

 

MT has good individual numbers, but has he helped Cagary improve?  Are they any further ahead with that pick than Van is with OJ?  Truthfully, Sergachev is who they should have picked there, but even then, who knows how he develops on a team not loaded like TB

Exactly. Juolevi was the safer pick out of Sergachev. There isn't a guarantee that Sergachev would have flourished as much as he did with TB also.

 

MT and Juolevi is basically a toss-up depending on what you want. I'd argue that if Juolevi wasn't so injured, we'd see him making a huge impact sooner.

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1 hour ago, Dazzle said:

Funny you go with this narrative yet..

 

No mention of Demko, Rathbone, Brisebois, Hoglander, Lind, Jasek, Gadjovich, Woo.

 

Demko and Hoglander are two players that you completely ignored. Big miss in your analysis. Compare that to the previous GMs, namely Gillis. Both of which are not 'high draft picks' that detractors accuse Benning of being gifted.

 

The other players are close or very close to being NHLers. At no such point did we have any kind of depth like this in previous regimes.

 

Let's just say your analysis that Benning's drafting being overrated is so flawed that we can safely disregard your perspective.

 

Podkolzin is gonna be like Horvat also. A winger version. That's what his playing style is comparable to. Funny how you left out Podkolzin and went with the hindsight Cole Caufield who was quite small at the time of his draft.

 

I only compared first round picks because the mydraft website analyzed only the top 30 prospects each year. I didn’t ignore Demko and Hoglander because I have no idea where Button or the others had them ranked. Similarly I didn’t include players in later rounds that history shows we should have picked but didn’t.

 

As for Caulfield being a hindsight pick that is untrue. Button’s picks I showed were made pre-draft every year. I have no idea yet whether Caulfield or Podkolzin will end up being the better NHL player and neither do you.

 

 

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3 minutes ago, stawns said:

never said I would, I said I had no issues not picking MT.  

 

I'm also willing to wait and see what OJ becomes before I write it off.  I think he's going to be a top 3 dman on the team in a couple years and will likely be the high minute muncher in 5 years.........if he can stay healthy.

 

MT has good individual numbers, but has he helped Cagary improve?  Are they any further ahead with that pick than Van is with OJ?  Truthfully, Sergachev is who they should have picked there, but even then, who knows how he develops on a team not loaded like TB

MT would be our third best player on the team right now. You have no issues on Benning passing on MT?

 

Wow... the Benning shills are really in full force.

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1 minute ago, JohnTavares said:

I said whiffing on the Virtanen and Juolevi picks set this team back years.

 

If this team had Nylander and Tkachuk in their top six, they would be a legitimate contender and be in the playoffs right now.

I think these ideas have been beaten to death. This thread is no more of an honest discussion as it is about you coming up with this rehashed ideas that this forum has already mentioned at length.

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2 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

you're claiming not picking Tkachuk "set the team back years" but you can't support that statement. 

Like pointed out before to this rather “dishonest” OP, rebuilding teams cover for those first rounders that aren’t home runs by finding gems later in the draft.  Benning found Rathbone, and Hollander outside of round one.  That’s how winn8ng teams are built.  

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Posted (edited)
2 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

you can't say that either. We may have missed on other picks because of where we'd be in the draft. We probably wouldn't have Huges or Petey. 

You can't say that either. We may or may not have had Hughes or Petey. No point in examining the butterfly effect.


Fact is, if we had Nylander and Tkachuk, we are likely in the playoffs right now.

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Just now, Alflives said:

Like pointed out before to this rather “dishonest” OP, rebuilding teams cover for those first rounders that aren’t home runs by finding gems later in the draft.  Benning found Rathbone, and Hollander outside of round one.  That’s how winn8ng teams are built.  

exactly. You need luck somewhere, its not always in the 1st round.

 

 

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Just now, JohnTavares said:

You can't say that either. We may or may not have had Hughes or Petey. No point in examining the butterfly effect.


Fact is, if we had Nylander and Tkachuk, we are likely in the playoffs right now.

If my grandma had wheels she could have been a bus. 

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Just now, Schmautzie said:

I only compared first round picks because the mydraft website analyzed only the top 30 prospects each year. I didn’t ignore Demko and Hoglander because I have no idea where Button or the others had them ranked. Similarly I didn’t include players in later rounds that history shows we should have picked but didn’t.

 

As for Caulfield being a hindsight pick that is untrue. Button’s picks I showed were made pre-draft every year. I have no idea yet whether Caulfield or Podkolzin will end up being the better NHL player and neither do you.

 

 

I don't remember what Button said, but Podkolzin was rated pretty highly by other scouts. Selective blindness is affecting you I guess.

 

By only comparing first round picks, you are missing a huge set of information. You did ignore Demko and Hoglander. Who cares what other scouts had ranked them? Look at the freaking draft and use hindsight to see the results. You can SEE Demko and Hoglander flourishing in their draft classes, NOT JUST their respective rounds.

 

You ARE ignoring (selectively omitting) information and that's why I think your discussion is not genuine.

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3 minutes ago, JohnTavares said:

I said whiffing on the Virtanen and Juolevi picks set this team back years.

 

If this team had Nylander and Tkachuk in their top six, they would be a legitimate contender and be in the playoffs right now.

If we had a Double Flamingo and a Jackass we are not any better.  

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1 minute ago, Dazzle said:

I think these ideas have been beaten to death. This thread is no more of an honest discussion as it is about you coming up with this rehashed ideas that this forum has already mentioned at length.

I'm trying to have an honest discussion. 


There are too many people here that are attached to JB's hip for no reason.


Arguing about Virtanen and Juolevi being huge misses is just disingenuous.

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24 minutes ago, JohnTavares said:

Tell Jim I said hi.


No reasonable person can argue that you would have Olli Juolevi over Matthew Tkachuk.

 

Not even the GOAT Benning shills.

I'd have picked Ollie before Tkachuk.

Nobody knew he was going to get injured.

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1 minute ago, JohnTavares said:

MT would be our third best player on the team right now. You have no issues on Benning passing on MT?

 

Wow... the Benning shills are really in full force.

I have no issues not picking  selfish ahole who will likely bolt the first chance he gets, no.  They clearly saw character issues with MT and chose to steer clear of him.  I'd have passed based soley on having to deal with his father

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