[Report] Canucks sign Travis Green to contract extension

[24K PureCool]

3 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

So because on paper we are a better team, it means we are a good team ? The stats don’t lie my friend. 

When did I even mention if the team is good on paper or not? Stop putting words in my mouth.

 

And as an academic and a professional data analyst, I can tell you data lie all the time. 

[Dumb Nuck]

1 minute ago, Wayne Glensky said:

So because on paper we are a better team, it means we are a good team ? The stats don’t lie my friend. 

I agree with him on that, on paper I do think we’re a better team, that is why we need a new coach, to bring out the best of our players, Green is not capable of that and we are just throwing away another year and in fact recovering from Greens coaching push back any hope of a Cup for years, I think with this core, if Green comes back, they will never win the Cup.

[Devron]

1 minute ago, Wayne Glensky said:

Holy &^@#. The Canucks played good hockey, but did we carry that into the following season? No. Same old dog $&!# dump and chase hockey and here we are again. Like I said, the Canucks performance in the bubble was an anomaly. 

Wouldn’t that make this year an anomaly as well? Genuinely curious why do you keep fighting the fight that this is a bad team. I don’t understand.

[PhillipBlunt]

1 minute ago, Wayne Glensky said:

Holy &^@#. The Canucks played good hockey, but did we carry that into the following season? No. Same old dog $&!# dump and chase hockey and here we are again. Like I said, the Canucks performance in the bubble was an anomaly. 

I agree that the dump and chase method is for the birds and doesn't come near to utilizing the plethora of talent some of the players possess. There needs to be more creativity and strategy to Green's playbook. Maybe this next season will be when he broadens his approach. 

[TheRussianRocket1994]

FFS...the media and a large portion of this fan base are incapable of being happy about anything!! Your reg lives must be miserable!! 

[johngould21]

11 minutes ago, VegasCanuck said:

Have been watching for 50 years. This is a much better team than their record shows.

 

Canucks had the worst schedule in the NHL from the very first game. Really didn't expect much this season, the Northern division is also a lot better than many fans want to admit. Ottawa is a solid team, who also had a rough start, but was really starting to come together in the last 20 - 25 games. If Ottawa gelled early, they would have likely been the 4th playoff team, ahead of Montreal.

 

Fans are freaking out about nothing. Was a hard season for all teams, was a harder season for the Canucks. They will be a much better team next year, not worried at all.

Very, very true. That was brutal, and to think it couldn't get any worse. 11 games in 17 days to end it all.

[Wayne Glensky]

Just now, PhillipBlunt said:

Define bad. A team with Bo Horvat, Elias Pettersson, Thatcher Demko, Quinn Hughes, Nils Hoglander, and Brock Boeser can't be a bad team, in my humble opinon. They can underperform, but aren't bad.

Our defensive structure is a mess. I can’t count how many times the 1st line got hemmed in their own zone for minutes at a time. Goaltending was hit and miss (no disrespect to Demmer as our defence was garbage). Our power play couldn’t score, and people still believe Brown is the man with the plan. Canucks could never consistently maintain pressure in the opposing zone and how many turnovers were there this year, how many odd man rushes did we give up?. The Canucks were a bad team this year. On top of that we had little to no depth on the bottom 6 and had no real supporting guys that could play up and down the lines. You really think Matthew Highmore and Travis Boyd were upgrades on Gaudette ? 

[4petesake]

1 hour ago, PhillipBlunt said:

 

[24K PureCool]

7 hours ago, Provost said:

Ummm that is distinctly NOT how data analysis works.

 

If their results are consistently bad, with one outlier... the outlier is what you throw out if you choose to, It would be special cause variation.

 

We have been bad for years, very much right in the same range just like this year.  We were also not good last year for most of the season, we just had a short hot streak with the play in and a playoff round.  We were absolutely trending towards missing the playoffs if the shortened season hadn’t rescued us.  The bubble is distinctly different than what came before and what came after.

 

Data analysis is heavily subjective. You can always come up with reasons to throw unwanted data points out. 

 

That is why you have research papers coming out with contradictory conclusions based on the same data set. 

 

I will argue that both the bubble season and this season are drastically different from the seasons prior and should be looked at as a whole and take the average of the two extremes which will make it in line with the trend from prior season. That is, small step improvement.

 

Anyone arguing that their data analysis is gospel are delusional. 

Edited May 21, 2021 by 24K PureCool

[Pickly]

2 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said:

I agree that the dump and chase method is for the birds and doesn't come near to utilizing the plethora of talent some of the players possess. There needs to be more creativity and strategy to Green's playbook. Maybe this next season will be when he broadens his approach. 

Maybe if he has more than 6 players to work with that can actually play a creative game rather than the deadweight that can only play that dump and chase style.

[BPA]

3 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

Holy &^@#. The Canucks played good hockey, but did we carry that into the following season? No. Same old dog $&!# dump and chase hockey and here we are again. Like I said, the Canucks performance in the bubble was an anomaly. 

It was Roussel who said in the interview that the Canucks were in the thick of the last playoff spot prior to their week break.  Then Covid happened and having to play 19 games in 31 days.  Said it was unsustainable.  Maybe 2 weeks at most but definitely not a month.  The players were gassed and still getting back into game shape.  So rather it is this season that is the anomaly. 

[VegasCanuck]

1 minute ago, Wayne Glensky said:

We will carry on this conversation March of 2022. 

Awesome, I'm here!

 

Yes, this team needs some changes, there are players who need to go, but Benning has done what he was hired to do, after 2 or 3 seasons of being asked to try and stretch more mileage out of the aging core, they committed to a rebuild and a commitment to build through the draft. We now have a solid, young core to build around.

 

Next season:

Pettersson will be back

Podkolzin will make his debut

 

Sutter will either be gone or back on a cap friendly 1.5 - 1.75 million hit without trade protection

Roussel will either be back playing like he did his first year here, before his knee injury, or he'll be sitting in Abbotsford

Virtanen will either be bought out or terminated under the Code of Conduct clause in his contract

Vesey, Hawryluk, Michaelis, Boyd, Baertschi, will all walk in free agency.

 

Edler will likely be back for around 2 - 3 million per season on a bonus heavy contract

Hamonic, I hope will be back around 2 million

Holtby will be gone to Seattle

DiPietro will assume backup duties behind Demko

 

Beagle will hopefully be able to continue his career, we have a much better penalty kill when he's here.

 

Rathbone will be with the main team

 

Eriksson will either retire or be bought out saving 2 million next season on cap space and only costing 1 million the following season.

 

Add in some nice cap friendly contracts from what should be a fairly deep talent pool this summer, due to the fact that the flat cap will continue for at least 2 more years.

 

These changes should allow our young core the opportunity to flourish and perform next season and have a strong year.

 

[Wayne Glensky]

1 minute ago, 24K PureCool said:

Data analyst is heavily subjective. You can always come up with reason to throw unwanted data point out. 

 

That us why you have research papers coming out with contradictory conclusions based on the same data set. 

 

I will argue that b8th the bubble season and this season is drastically different from the seasons prior and should be looked at as a whole and take the average of the two extremes which will make it in line with the trend from prior season. That is small step improvement.

 

Anyone arguing that their data analysis is gospel is delusional. 

Rather than analyzing data, how about we judge on ice performance. I don’t give a $&!# about your BA and your fancy little data reading. I care about results of the team on ice. 

[Wayne Glensky]

1 minute ago, VegasCanuck said:

Awesome, I'm here!

 

Yes, this team needs some changes, there are players who need to go, but Benning has done what he was hired to do, after 2 or 3 seasons of being asked to try and stretch more mileage out of the aging core, they committed to a rebuild and a commitment to build through the draft. We now have a solid, young core to build around.

 

Next season:

Pettersson will be back

Podkolzin will make his debut

 

Sutter will either be gone or back on a cap friendly 1.5 - 1.75 million hit without trade protection

Roussel will either be back playing like he did his first year here, before his knee injury, or he'll be sitting in Abbotsford

Virtanen will either be bought out or terminated under the Code of Conduct clause in his contract

Vesey, Hawryluk, Michaelis, Boyd, Baertschi, will all walk in free agency.

 

Edler will likely be back for around 2 - 3 million per season on a bonus heavy contract

Hamonic, I hope will be back around 2 million

Holtby will be gone to Seattle

DiPietro will assume backup duties behind Demko

 

Beagle will hopefully be able to continue his career, we have a much better penalty kill when he's here.

 

Rathbone will be with the main team

 

Eriksson will either retire or be bought out saving 2 million next season on cap space and only costing 1 million the following season.

 

Add in some nice cap friendly contracts from what should be a fairly deep talent pool this summer, due to the fact that the flat cap will continue for at least 2 more years.

 

These changes should allow our young core the opportunity to flourish and perform next season and have a strong year.

 

Well said Vegas. 

[Junkyard Dog]

4 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

Holy &^@#. The Canucks played good hockey, but did we carry that into the following season? No. Same old dog $&!# dump and chase hockey and here we are again. Like I said, the Canucks performance in the bubble was an anomaly. 

We played good hockey till we ran into a better team in Vegas who spot a spotlight on the issues this team has. 
 

We didn’t see any real change on those issues, instead they were made more apparent due to the rough start and new bodies we had. 
 

Hopefully next year we make life easier for our goalies and play better team D so we don’t have to rely on them so much to win games. 

[48MPHSlapShot]

The Canucks are a middling team. Not one of the worst in the league, but certainly not one of the best. We have a solid young core that's missing a couple of key pieces, and our role players are subpar for the most part, and we generally have decent goaltending. The team has incrementally improved over the last several years (I attribute this to improved personel, not coaching). 

 

Was the bubble an anomaly? Yes.

Was this season an anomaly? Also yes.

 

I don't see why this is so difficult for some people.

[24K PureCool]

6 minutes ago, Wayne Glensky said:

Rather than analyzing data, how about we judge on ice performance. I don’t give a $&!# about your BA and your fancy little data reading. I care about results of the team on ice. 

Oh the on ice team suck. Don't get me wrong but that was not the initial premise of the debate.

 

How can we be good when Petey was not playing like his usual self and Hughes and Miller becoming turnover machines. 

Edited May 20, 2021 by 24K PureCool

[NHL'er]

1 hour ago, PhillipBlunt said:

But.....different results somehow? 

[Smashian Kassian]

1 hour ago, Junkyard Dog said:

I am worried about the PK personnel. Motte is becoming injury prone(forward Tanev) and Beagle might be forced to retire with his injury. Both these guys make up a good #1 PK unit. If they can't stay healthy the PK probably will struggle with consistency, especially with Edler regressing. 

 

Looks like theres some hope for Highmore. And Pearson is not bad. But I agree they are going to have to find someone if Beagle is done, and on the cheap.

[aGENT]

So Benning and reportedly Green both back... I hope they have first responders watching all the local bridges