Will Podkolzin (The Lion) be the greatest playoff performer in canucks history

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Fred65 said:

What impressed me was the fact that Benning under pressure to perform selected a prospect that was certainly 2 years from joining the club

The report you posted on McTavish makes him sound like he’s got a lot of similar traits to Pods.  Can a team have too many guys like these two:  heavy, skilled, highly competitive, and a bit mean? 

[Fred65]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

The report you posted on McTavish makes him sound like he’s got a lot of similar traits to Pods.  Can a team have too many guys like these two:  heavy, skilled, highly competitive, and a bit mean? 

Funny you mention that. I had thought the same and wondered if two players of that style  could play on the same line

[Bertuzzipunch]

Just now, Fred65 said:

Funny you mention that. I had thought the same and wondered if two players of that style  could play on the same line

Hellya they can. This is what vegas does.

[Nuxfanabroad]

6 hours ago, Bertuzzipunch said:

Hellya they can. This is what vegas does.

Just watch what flavour of officiating we happen to receive.

 

(& no, I'm not objecting to the orig approach either)

Edited June 13, 2021 by Nuxfanabroad

[Fakename70]

On 6/12/2021 at 1:58 PM, IBatch said:

Kane and TT eh.    Nah i'd rather have two players coming up behind Horvat that can carry the mail with him (Hogs plays the L side too, natural left shot) then aging vets in their prime still.    Yes it's going to take time.   I don't mind waiting, that's a lot of payroll the team can use on their D where they don't have young depth coming up other then maybe Rathbone, maybe OJ... long shot Woo etc.    It's not time to "go for it" yet. Not hard to find wingers .... 

More waiting. Aren't you tired of that? And, yes, Kane and Toffoli. It was possible. I think you're a bit off if you're calling two top line wingers still on the right side of 30 "aging vets". Don't you expect more from this franchise though, than the annual hype of younger players who don't pan out, even when the bar and expectations are set low? I'd love to see some of the younger players we've seen get their first NHL action the last 2 seasons develop, but, just not in the top 6 like too many CDC'rs are projecting. Sorry, but, 2020 was a fluke. This is not a playoff team next year without a couple of top-6 calibre under-30 wingers flanking Horvat. And, to your point, sure, it's "not hard to find wingers". Particularly, for the top-6. If you're just looking to fill roster spots and aren't necessarily aiming for the playoffs, that is. 

 

But, yeah, you be sure to let me know exactly when you think it's time for the Vancouver Canucks to finally "go for it". I don't want to miss that. 

[IBatch]

30 minutes ago, Fakename70 said:

More waiting. Aren't you tired of that? And, yes, Kane and Toffoli. It was possible. I think you're a bit off if you're calling two top line wingers still on the right side of 30 "aging vets". Don't you expect more from this franchise though, than the annual hype of younger players who don't pan out, even when the bar and expectations are set low? I'd love to see some of the younger players we've seen get their first NHL action the last 2 seasons develop, but, just not in the top 6 like too many CDC'rs are projecting. Sorry, but, 2020 was a fluke. This is not a playoff team next year without a couple of top-6 calibre under-30 wingers flanking Horvat. And, to your point, sure, it's "not hard to find wingers". Particularly, for the top-6. If you're just looking to fill roster spots and aren't necessarily aiming for the playoffs, that is. 

 

But, yeah, you be sure to let me know exactly when you think it's time for the Vancouver Canucks to finally "go for it". I don't want to miss that. 

Nope i don't mind waiting.   Going for it after the bubble with the cap situation or without the timing was off.   TT seemed like a luxury.    Kane he's good enough and has grit, and TT is playing the best hockey of his career.   I get it, but with Hogs and Podz coming in, and at the time JV getting a fair deal for the year he just had, it made little sense for me to go "all-in" to clear cap (and lose the remainder of our pool, most of it anyways and some future draft picks) yet.    

 

The team isn't ready yet.   The forward group is close, the D is where the attention and the cap needs to go.  Yes i'd always love to get better players, and there was a time when miracles could happen (Mogilny - almost WG), but with cap it's never that simple.    By the time EP and QHs are in their mid 20's, TT and Kane would need new deals and be well into their 30's... and Hogs plus Podz would likely be playing somewhere else to tag Sutter and LE and Bear or whomever plus some picks to make that work.   

 

JB gave the team a chance to be much better then it was in the bubble when these guys are in their primes last off season by not committing 80 million to the guys he didn't re-sign..Horvat and Miller will be around Kane and TT age when EP and QHs are 24 and entering their prime (24-32), would much prefer to see what the rest of pool can still do, and find out what those extra saved picks can do and find out where the cash savings of Kane and TT can go to our D - that's the point.   In a couple of years we can always add a top six winger via free agency, easiest then to acquire via a trade too.  

 

Edit: Will it work?   Hard to say.   But the other way was easy to say, we did admirably the first 10 games.   The following 7 we had zero business in, Vegas is exactly what a contender looks like (age wise included).   All vets in their primes for the most part.   Just like St. Louis was, same with WSH, same with PIT last two cups, and just like TB is right now and last year.    We need MORE young players coming up not less and not the fast and easy fix either.   I don't want a team with a Tavares, or a Panarin and Trouba on it - just enough to be pretty good, or just enough to waste a cores chances in the mushy window.    I want one that comes out of their rebuild ready to do some damage and acknowledge we aren't done yet / but again at least we have a better chance now. 

Edited June 14, 2021 by IBatch

[wallstreetamigo]

On 6/12/2021 at 6:42 PM, Fred65 said:

What impressed me was the fact that Benning under pressure to perform selected a prospect that was certainly 2 years from joining the club

Judd Brackett's last draft as head of amateur scouting. A lot of good work done under his tenure imo.

[IBatch]

On 6/12/2021 at 8:59 PM, Alflives said:

 We are hopeful for a better team.  We know we need guys like Pods (and the 9OA this draft) to be impactful to our team being better.  We do have Pods recent KHL playoff performance to guide our thinking though.  So for him it’s less hope, and more expectation.  I’m so glad other teams were stupid and let Pods fall into our hands.  

Me too.   Top three pick in most prospect evaluations.    Impatience and maybe a little fear over a KHL player not wanting to come to the NHL but figure it's more the former then the latter.   Love that he's still holding strong as a premier prospect.    Not sure we will see him in the top six right away, will have to bump Hogs and possibly Pearson.   Hogs plays the L side too, and shoots left.    Hogs Horvat Podz would be a fun line to watch i'm sure....

[IBatch]

6 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Judd Brackett's last draft as head of amateur scouting. A lot of good work done under his tenure imo.

First and second rounders GMs are always involved in selecting.   Past that for most GMs it's largely scouting departments.   JB is still a scout at heart in a way, feels every pick should be done with the idea of one day playing in the NHL, said as much recently.    For sure Brackett has done some good work... but i'm not worried about it either.   One thing Brackett and JB haven't managed, and yes i know the odds aren't good,  is finding an Edler or Hansen yet.   That is a later round pick that plays 700-1000 games. 

[yes we can nucks]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

Me too.   Top three pick in most prospect evaluations.    Impatience and maybe a little fear over a KHL player not wanting to come to the NHL but figure it's more the former then the latter.   Love that he's still holding strong as a premier prospect.    Not sure we will see him in the top six right away, will have to bump Hogs and possibly Pearson.   Hogs plays the L side too, and shoots left.    Hogs Horvat Podz would be a fun line to watch i'm sure....

It would be fun just to call this line HOHOPO! 

[IBatch]

27 minutes ago, yes we can nucks said:

It would be fun just to call this line HOHOPO! 

Or HOP for short. 

[wallstreetamigo]

4 hours ago, IBatch said:

First and second rounders GMs are always involved in selecting.   Past that for most GMs it's largely scouting departments.   JB is still a scout at heart in a way, feels every pick should be done with the idea of one day playing in the NHL, said as much recently.    For sure Brackett has done some good work... but i'm not worried about it either.   One thing Brackett and JB haven't managed, and yes i know the odds aren't good,  is finding an Edler or Hansen yet.   That is a later round pick that plays 700-1000 games. 

Never said the GM wasnt involved. They are always involved to some degree.

 

Where Brackett's tenure really stands out to me is those round 3 to 7 picks though. Its too early to know just how those players will end up, and the Canucks have alreafy given up on some so it will depend on how they progress elsewhere, but those drafts produced a lot beyond the first 2 rounds, especially in comparison to many draft years before his tenure.

 

Benning/Weisbrod team is good but wildly overrated in terms of drafting though. Looking at their history in Van and previously there are a lot of pretty bad picks even in the early rounds. I dont think they are terrible by any stretch, they are pretty good actually, I just dont see the evidence they are drafting gods like many here claim. 

 

Having a guy like Brackett was clearly a pretty good combination for Canucks drafting. We will see if that prowess continues now that Benning and Weisbrod are running the show. Last draft they dudng have any top picks left so its hard to gauge what they did. If they dont trade picks in this draft we will get a clearer picture of the new drafting approach.

 

I will say I half expect their 1st and 2nd picks to be traded.

Edited June 14, 2021 by wallstreetamigo

[Fred65]

11 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Judd Brackett's last draft as head of amateur scouting. A lot of good work done under his tenure imo.

There's this constant debate who was doing the drafting Benning or Brackett. To my mind the scouting department was hitting on all cyclinder regardless. It was essential that either FA or Benning resolve this problem what ever it took. It's a great building block that's been lost for ever. You can't keep making these kind of managerial mistakes and expect any thing but mediocrity. Lots of work places have conflict within them. I thought loosing Gilman was another building block that they wasted. You see what the likes of Tampa and TO are doing streching the Cap rules and you have to think that cold have been us too

[Hairy Kneel]

On 6/12/2021 at 6:45 PM, Alflives said:

The report you posted on McTavish makes him sound like he’s got a lot of similar traits to Pods.  Can a team have too many guys like these two:  heavy, skilled, highly competitive, and a bit mean? 

In the playoffs it's not only about delivering the hit, it's also about absorbing a big hit and not getting rattled or bent out of shape. And stay in the play. Composure. Bigger guys can do that and take a number 

[IBatch]

On 6/14/2021 at 3:01 PM, wallstreetamigo said:

Never said the GM wasnt involved. They are always involved to some degree.

 

Where Brackett's tenure really stands out to me is those round 3 to 7 picks though. Its too early to know just how those players will end up, and the Canucks have alreafy given up on some so it will depend on how they progress elsewhere, but those drafts produced a lot beyond the first 2 rounds, especially in comparison to many draft years before his tenure.

 

Benning/Weisbrod team is good but wildly overrated in terms of drafting though. Looking at their history in Van and previously there are a lot of pretty bad picks even in the early rounds. I dont think they are terrible by any stretch, they are pretty good actually, I just dont see the evidence they are drafting gods like many here claim. 

 

Having a guy like Brackett was clearly a pretty good combination for Canucks drafting. We will see if that prowess continues now that Benning and Weisbrod are running the show. Last draft they dudng have any top picks left so its hard to gauge what they did. If they dont trade picks in this draft we will get a clearer picture of the new drafting approach.

 

I will say I half expect their 1st and 2nd picks to be traded.

I agree, they aren't drafting gods - but they are above average once you consider average draft position.   TB...man now there is a team that is an excellent godlike, drafting team.   Gems like Point and Kucherov, other guys like Cerilli and Cernak.   Since the Stamkos/Hedman days, it's not like they've drafted high is it?   A couple years ago they had the 9th best group of 21 and unders despite drafting mid 20's on average over a four year period.   We drafted 8-9th back then and had the 2-4 best pool for a period of years.   Can't go past one but we never really made it there either...debatable one year we actually did but it wasn't a slam dunk. 

 

Fortunately for us we weren't average either and this system is flawed to a degree because it assumes you have all your picks, at a time we needed good drafting, which is exactly what we got.  We basically did, with the pucks we used and acquired over that time it was a wash.   TB moved up 16 or so spots, more then any other team, we moved up 6-8.   Most teams stay around plus 2 to - 6.    A few, like EDM,  just totally blew because they couldn't find a player ever outside of the first round for the longest time.   

 

Burke blew some picks too, Quin blew even more but nobody could make a trade like he did.   Bringing in McLean and Adams, then trading Butcher...was a master stroke.   Then fixed his Stajnov pick with Naslund.   He drafted ok (Quin) too.  And of course hit the biggest home run ever with Bure.   Also drafted Ohlund. 

 

Then Milford drafted 10,000 NHL games over a four year period.   WOW.    JB ... very unlikely he's done that. 

 

We have more in common then you think.  I don't think JB is a drafting god, i think he's done a good job when we needed it the most, given he kept slipping but we kept drafting well anyways says it all.    Yes he had some misses.   He also drafted the best 5th overall pick the last decade, the best 22nd and the second best 7th.   Missed on OJ and JV.   OJ maybe not, if he plays 500 games then no it's not a miss, just what you hope to get at least.   Add to that Horvat was also the best 9th the past decade, Demko and Hogs look to be blue chippers... what we really have missed is a late round gem still.   Our quality is quite a bit above par, our quantity is on par but not enough to be called good drafting, just average. 

 

Edit:  Our quantity actually is above average too, we just haven't hit on a quality guy past the second round yet.   We have lots of guys who will play 100 NHL or more games, but no Hansen or Edler yet. 

 

Edited June 15, 2021 by IBatch

[IBatch]

On 6/14/2021 at 3:02 PM, Fred65 said:

There's this constant debate who was doing the drafting Benning or Brackett. To my mind the scouting department was hitting on all cyclinder regardless. It was essential that either FA or Benning resolve this problem what ever it took. It's a great building block that's been lost for ever. You can't keep making these kind of managerial mistakes and expect any thing but mediocrity. Lots of work places have conflict within them. I thought loosing Gilman was another building block that they wasted. You see what the likes of Tampa and TO are doing streching the Cap rules and you have to think that cold have been us too

Pretty obvious JB is at the table working hard to get the BPA during the second and third round.   I doubt he's making the final decisions past that.   If he is that's bad management.    Let his staff do the work.    "why hasn't Lind be taken yet" is a classic example, kid was ranked in the low 20's and slipped.   We picked him up.  Gads was anywhere between 28-50, also picked him up.   Hogs late first, also picked him up.   You can see and sometimes hear with video released, JB takes drafting very seriously . MG didn't.   Big failure having a 9 year gap in our pool.  

[IBatch]

19 hours ago, Hairy Kneel said:

In the playoffs it's not only about delivering the hit, it's also about absorbing a big hit and not getting rattled or bent out of shape. And stay in the play. Composure. Bigger guys can do that and take a number 

That's true.   I was impressed how BB took a massive hit and made a play in the bubble.   And how QHs kept getting no space and hit but kept on ticking.    Pearson and TT wasn't that impressed with either.   Myers was absolute gold, punished the crap out of everyone, same as Edler - leeping cross-check in the numbers to clear the net during one of the many Vegas scrambles around Demko (no call on the play - for sure a penalty).    Our teams isn't butter soft but can say there is work to get to the point of surviving more then 17 playoff type games.    If we made it past Vegas it would have been the most lopsided series win i've ever watched.   Any teams.   

 

Glad they got some exposure to this, and not sure everyone was healed from it when the season started either.   BB didn't score much but he was a gamer.   Horvat was a total boss against St.   Vegas ... only Demko, a beat up Myers, Motte and Edler seemed to have any game that could match up to Vegas though.  

 

We simply need to be capable of playing against them.  They are in our division.   Podz will help for sure.   Hamonic i think will too.   Edler ... won't be surprised to see him back either, at the very least as our new Benn.    McTavish is one fugly dude, hope he's this years pick but he might not be available.   We need more oomphf.  

Edited June 15, 2021 by IBatch

[wallstreetamigo]

4 hours ago, IBatch said:

I agree, they aren't drafting gods - but they are above average once you consider average draft position.   TB...man now there is a team that is an excellent godlike, drafting team.   Gems like Point and Kucherov, other guys like Cerilli and Cernak.   Since the Stamkos/Hedman days, it's not like they've drafted high is it?   A couple years ago they had the 9th best group of 21 and unders despite drafting mid 20's on average over a four year period.   We drafted 8-9th back then and had the 2-4 best pool for a period of years.   Can't go past one but we never really made it there either...debatable one year we actually did but it wasn't a slam dunk. 

 

Fortunately for us we weren't average either and this system is flawed to a degree because it assumes you have all your picks, at a time we needed good drafting, which is exactly what we got.  We basically did, with the pucks we used and acquired over that time it was a wash.   TB moved up 16 or so spots, more then any other team, we moved up 6-8.   Most teams stay around plus 2 to - 6.    A few, like EDM,  just totally blew because they couldn't find a player ever outside of the first round for the longest time.   

 

Burke blew some picks too, Quin blew even more but nobody could make a trade like he did.   Bringing in McLean and Adams, then trading Butcher...was a master stroke.   Then fixed his Stajnov pick with Naslund.   He drafted ok (Quin) too.  And of course hit the biggest home run ever with Bure.   Also drafted Ohlund. 

 

Then Milford drafted 10,000 NHL games over a four year period.   WOW.    JB ... very unlikely he's done that. 

 

We have more in common then you think.  I don't think JB is a drafting god, i think he's done a good job when we needed it the most, given he kept slipping but we kept drafting well anyways says it all.    Yes he had some misses.   He also drafted the best 5th overall pick the last decade, the best 22nd and the second best 7th.   Missed on OJ and JV.   OJ maybe not, if he plays 500 games then no it's not a miss, just what you hope to get at least.   Add to that Horvat was also the best 9th the past decade, Demko and Hogs look to be blue chippers... what we really have missed is a late round gem still.   Our quality is quite a bit above par, our quantity is on par but not enough to be called good drafting, just average. 

 

Edit:  Our quantity actually is above average too, we just haven't hit on a quality guy past the second round yet.   We have lots of guys who will play 100 NHL or more games, but no Hansen or Edler yet. 

 

No team hits on all its picks, even early ones. Drafting is not a concerm to me with Benning. I just feel like it was a much stronger group with Brackett there. We will see I guess.

 

I really dont see our prospect pool as teeming in top end quality talent. I mean, most of those guys have already graduated so thats not meant as a negative at all. I dont know if Benning has the time to draft much more to insert into the core. He will need to be much more strategic about signings and trades to surround this core group.

 

To me personally, I would prefer using this offseason for short 1 year placeholders, another draft piece at 9, and sell expiring contracts for picks/prospects at the deadline to then use along with cap space to effectively surround this core next offseason.

 

Going all in right now feels like it will backfire. Maybe a few pre expansion trades for undervalued guys but the ufa crop is pretty underwhelming to me.

[IBatch]

3 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

No team hits on all its picks, even early ones. Drafting is not a concerm to me with Benning. I just feel like it was a much stronger group with Brackett there. We will see I guess.

 

I really dont see our prospect pool as teeming in top end quality talent. I mean, most of those guys have already graduated so thats not meant as a negative at all. I dont know if Benning has the time to draft much more to insert into the core. He will need to be much more strategic about signings and trades to surround this core group.

 

To me personally, I would prefer using this offseason for short 1 year placeholders, another draft piece at 9, and sell expiring contracts for picks/prospects at the deadline to then use along with cap space to effectively surround this core next offseason.

 

Going all in right now feels like it will backfire. Maybe a few pre expansion trades for undervalued guys but the ufa crop is pretty underwhelming to me.

Yes this year is not the year to "go for it" at all.   IMO his best off season to date was last his last one.   Because we needed another experience D upgrade (thank you lord no more Del Zottos'), and he only committed two years of money at most elsewhere.   Schmidt > Tanev all considered.   Took time to gain traction but i think he will be fine.   We don't need to do anything other then sign the wonder twins, and look to improve where we can within the parameters of the cap and that's it.   Do think a trade might help too.    The team will get one rep with Miller and Horvat, if it doesn't work then the following year we should be re-assessing like Sakic did, to build around younger guys.    We have next season to do that.   As long as he keeps his picks and keeps drafting at the same rate we should be ok in the long run prospect wise.    Podz is highly touted still...after he's in our pool needs this years pick(s) badly.   

[Bertuzzipunch]

Our playoff podz “the lion!” is going to be in vancouver in about 2 weeks folks. HES COMING!!!