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[Proposal] Columbus -Vancouver (proposal)


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26 minutes ago, mll said:

I think he had to waive for Vancouver.   The limited NTC could make it also a bit harder to move him.  He turns 30 next month and might list only competitive teams rather than risk a rebuild.

 

I also don't see CBJ moving the pick.  Jones is on his way out.  Their goalies are both UFA in a year.  They don't have top-6 Cs - Domi just had shoulder surgery and will miss at least a month into the new season not that they were using him at C.  The odds are against them to be able to right their team with just a few moves.  I would think they'll want to draft and add to their prospect pool.

 

yeah Domi's surgery certainly doesn't help, I'm sure they would have liked to move him tbh. 

 

I think CBJ likely wants Miller in any kind of deal with us, which is a hard no for me.  

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7 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

yeah Domi's surgery certainly doesn't help, I'm sure they would have liked to move him tbh. 

 

I think CBJ likely wants Miller in any kind of deal with us, which is a hard no for me.  

Jones and Domi for Miller?  Imo Domi has less than no value, and is a cap dump.  

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20 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Jones and Domi for Miller?  Imo Domi has less than no value, and is a cap dump.  

I don't think our cap survives it. I'd be happy to give Domi a try on the cheap tho if they want to dump him for peanuts, I like his attitude. 

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1 hour ago, Bertuzzipunch said:

Because we want to target clarke at 5 if hes available and its a better chance than hoping hes there at 9. 
 

we need to bet that we will be a good team in 2024 so its a low 1st which is worth the risk imo

 

we had the highest scoring defense in the league this year, we dont need schmidts offense we need a big bruiser dman that we can get in a trade or UFA if we clear schmidts 6 mill deal. Quinn, myers, rathbone bring more than enough offense. Time to get dirty and find a big dude dman or a younger D guy to add to the backend.

yeah i guess that would be a draft deal regardless hinging if your player is there or not.

I guess i find it kind of hypocritical that you want to move out an "offensive" player in Schmidt to draft an offensive prospect in Clarke, granted prospects will project 2-3 years down the road but if our 2 main offensive dmen are super young in Hughes and Rathbone I'm not sure of the dire need to draft an offensive dmen so early especially to go up X amount of spots and giving up assets along the way to do so.

 

I also seem to think that Clarke being pretty well the only RHD dman in the top end of the draft he gets a lot of notice and praise. I do think it's valid to his toolset but he likely gets more time of day than most. I guess what I'm saying is I don't think his projectability is any higher or more interesting than the other players in the 3-10 range.

 

I think Schmidt has a lot more to give, he played with Theodore and was utilized in a shutdown-ish type role at some point. He's got a ton more two-way ability than what we've seen and it'd be a mistake to move from him.

 

I'll keep Schmidt, keep the 9th and try to expose Myers in the expansion draft to see if Seattle will take him and his 6m off our books for us... we can also try to snag an expansion viable player from Tampa or Carolina at a below market price due to expansion draft exposure..

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1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

I don't think our cap survives it. I'd be happy to give Domi a try on the cheap tho if they want to dump him for peanuts, I like his attitude. 

Domi is paid too much I think.  I do like his nastiness though.  Him and Bo on a line with Podkolzin would not be any fun to play against, that’s fir sure.  

Edited by Alflives
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35 minutes ago, goblix said:

yeah i guess that would be a draft deal regardless hinging if your player is there or not.

I guess i find it kind of hypocritical that you want to move out an "offensive" player in Schmidt to draft an offensive prospect in Clarke, granted prospects will project 2-3 years down the road but if our 2 main offensive dmen are super young in Hughes and Rathbone I'm not sure of the dire need to draft an offensive dmen so early especially to go up X amount of spots and giving up assets along the way to do so.

 

I also seem to think that Clarke being pretty well the only RHD dman in the top end of the draft he gets a lot of notice and praise. I do think it's valid to his toolset but he likely gets more time of day than most. I guess what I'm saying is I don't think his projectability is any higher or more interesting than the other players in the 3-10 range.

 

I think Schmidt has a lot more to give, he played with Theodore and was utilized in a shutdown-ish type role at some point. He's got a ton more two-way ability than what we've seen and it'd be a mistake to move from him.

 

I'll keep Schmidt, keep the 9th and try to expose Myers in the expansion draft to see if Seattle will take him and his 6m off our books for us... we can also try to snag an expansion viable player from Tampa or Carolina at a below market price due to expansion draft exposure..

Look at it like the avs with girard and makar. Schmidt didnt provide much offense and myers wont be here forever. Being 18 and hopefully ready by 20-21? Right when petey n quinn start entering their prime years.

 

plus the cap savings we could get a cheap dman and 3C or forward like galchenyuk and bogosian for a year or 2.

Edited by Bertuzzipunch
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4 minutes ago, Bertuzzipunch said:

Look at it like the avs with girard and makar. Schmidt didnt provide much offense and myers wont be here forever. Being 18 and hopefully ready by 20-21? Right when petey n quinn start entering their prime years.

 

plus the cap savings we could get a cheap dman and 3C or forward like galchenyuk and bogosian for a year or 2.

But by your logic if we have Rathbone and Hughes we wouldn't need more offensive defensemen at that point ? ^_^

 

People are overplaying this down year from Schmidt... he's a 30pt defender, a + player, and a 5 on 5 beast the previous 3 years and was pretty good in his 2 years in Washington as well... He didn't have a good year adjusting to a new team, new system, shortened schedule and a covid crisis... I feel like these aspects in consideration leads to an assumption that his play will be a considerable contribution to this team for the next 4 years in his contract.

 

I also do not want Bogo or Galchenyuk... especially doesn't make sense to go with a cheap option after clearing out 6m in cap space... a mediocre 3C like Galchenyuk does nothing for our depth and Bogo is just an alright defender but more-so seems redundant when you likely have Hamonic resigning here.

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3 minutes ago, goblix said:

But by your logic if we have Rathbone and Hughes we wouldn't need more offensive defensemen at that point ? ^_^

 

People are overplaying this down year from Schmidt... he's a 30pt defender, a + player, and a 5 on 5 beast the previous 3 years and was pretty good in his 2 years in Washington as well... He didn't have a good year adjusting to a new team, new system, shortened schedule and a covid crisis... I feel like these aspects in consideration leads to an assumption that his play will be a considerable contribution to this team for the next 4 years in his contract.

 

I also do not want Bogo or Galchenyuk... especially doesn't make sense to go with a cheap option after clearing out 6m in cap space... a mediocre 3C like Galchenyuk does nothing for our depth and Bogo is just an alright defender but more-so seems redundant when you likely have Hamonic resigning here.

We have no choice but to go cheap thats why i said 1 or 2 years. We gonna have problems finding players to sign with the cap situation were in. This is only till next offseason where money opens up even the money from Bogo and Chucky if we sign them just for a year. Rather just have a cheaper option than schmidt with what he brings. I dunno if age is catching up to him but he was very underwhelming and rather someone else pay him.

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1 hour ago, Alflives said:

Domi is paid too much I think.  I do like his nastiness though.  Him and Bo on a line with Podkolzin would not be any fun to play against, that’s fir sure.  

thats what I was thinking too. 

 

Get him in here as a cap dump, let him rehab and we can have him for the last 1/2 of the season and playoffs. Then a show-me deal. 

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1 minute ago, Bertuzzipunch said:

We have no choice but to go cheap thats why i said 1 or 2 years. We gonna have problems finding players to sign with the cap situation were in. This is only till next offseason where money opens up even the money from Bogo and Chucky if we sign them just for a year. Rather just have a cheaper option than schmidt with what he brings. I dunno if age is catching up to him but he was very underwhelming and rather someone else pay him.

This is what I'm saying. A guy goes to a new team is hard enough at times... Add on a very unique experience in the pandemic and you are writing him off for this single season...

He's 29 not 32, he's been a consistent 30pt, + player in his career not a 15pt, - player. But hey let's just chuck him out on the curb...

 

Our cap situation is not as dire as you or others make it out to be.. It's not perfect sure and there is some finagling to do but a virtanen buyout and a holtby buyout frees up around 6m on it's own. If you want to go cheap on a 3C and a bottom 6 defeneder then this Schmidt business is unrelated

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4 minutes ago, goblix said:

This is what I'm saying. A guy goes to a new team is hard enough at times... Add on a very unique experience in the pandemic and you are writing him off for this single season...

He's 29 not 32, he's been a consistent 30pt, + player in his career not a 15pt, - player. But hey let's just chuck him out on the curb...

 

Our cap situation is not as dire as you or others make it out to be.. It's not perfect sure and there is some finagling to do but a virtanen buyout and a holtby buyout frees up around 6m on it's own. If you want to go cheap on a 3C and a bottom 6 defeneder then this Schmidt business is unrelated

How can we buyout holtby? We still need a backup goalie. Buying him out and signing a new backup makes it no benefit to the cap, if anything it will make it worse.

 

We will see about schmidt but im not as confident as you in he will be the dman he was before. We all saw how bad this defense was all season. It needs a shakeup imo.

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Just now, Bertuzzipunch said:

How can we buyout holtby? We still need a backup goalie. Buying him out and signing a new backup makes it no benefit to the cap, if anything it will make it worse.

 

We will see about schmidt but im not as confident as you in he will be the dman he was before. We all saw how bad this defense was all season. It needs a shakeup imo.

buying out a 4.3m cap hit leaves us 500k in kickback this year.

signing a backup goalie with a ton of options is likely 2m tops... sooo overall that gives us 1.5m to 3m relief.. With Iain Clark (reported that the talks are going good) as the goalie coach i'll give it a go with pretty much any backup in the league that wants to sign cheap or there is DePietro if Canucks feel like they can play Demko like 50-55 games but I'd prefer to sign a backup myself

 

yeah I gave you reasons why Schmidt likely had issues... hell on this team all of our defensemen had issues defendind, you don't get a team -37 goal differential because of a single player...

Hughes had problems, Hamonic was bad at the start, Edler and Juolevi got turnstyled consistently, Myers gets too many penalties... etc etc etc

Clearly if all of these players are having issues then the onus is likely on the system they are playing.

 

Our defensive system is way too passive, the forwards and the defenders played out of sync with each other all season which caused inefficient transitions and deadly turnovers. The lack of practice time probably the main reason why they never did right the ship but I'd hope that the coaching staff takes some reflection in assessing their systems play.

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6 hours ago, Bertuzzipunch said:

Absolutely would do that 

I wouldn't. We are not rebuilding and need to be adding D that can help now not giving away who plays some of the hardest minutes and even in a down year was still are best D based on hard the minutes he absorbed. Next season I think as long as he plays only on the right side he will bounce back.

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Guys, those that do not understand why I suggest this.....let me explain.

 

#1.............Clarke fits our rebuild from a time factor....we are still in rebuild mode, or should be.

#2.............The age gap between Clarke and Schmidt is 12 years........so we get Clarke for 12 more years, instead of 2 more.

#3.............Schmidt's value has not been devalued, and I have no idea why anyone would say this

#4.............Clarke would be my number one pick at #5, McTavish would be my second choice

#5.............elite prospects has him at 6'2" 190 lbs at 18 years of age...........that's pretty close to 210 lbs as an adult (IMO)

#6.............this has already been mentioned, it clears 6 million off our cap, to be used somewhere else

#7............. With the additional 1st, we are sitting in a great position to take a faller, or take a later RHD if Clarke is gone

                 Aka: Ceulemans, Morrow, Heimosalmi, Schmidt, Mailloux, Bar

 

JB needs to look at the long term design of his team, which at this moment, has NO, RHD other than Woo, who will be here in 5 years. None! Think about that! IMO, that has huge implications for our future.

 

The other thing is that Columbus, needs to start their rebuild, and it will not be an over night process, so getting that 2024 1st, only means, they get an extra piece down the road, and with the top 10 of the draft being rather flat, they have the luxury of taking any number of players that might fit the rebuild. Schmidt is also someone that they can in turn also flip with another piece for something they need/want.

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24 minutes ago, janisahockeynut said:

Guys, those that do not understand why I suggest this.....let me explain.

 

#1.............Clarke fits our rebuild from a time factor....we are still in rebuild mode, or should be.

#2.............The age gap between Clarke and Schmidt is 12 years........so we get Clarke for 12 more years, instead of 2 more.

#3.............Schmidt's value has not been devalued, and I have no idea why anyone would say this

#4.............Clarke would be my number one pick at #5, McTavish would be my second choice

#5.............elite prospects has him at 6'2" 190 lbs at 18 years of age...........that's pretty close to 210 lbs as an adult (IMO)

#6.............this has already been mentioned, it clears 6 million off our cap, to be used somewhere else

#7............. With the additional 1st, we are sitting in a great position to take a faller, or take a later RHD if Clarke is gone

                 Aka: Ceulemans, Morrow, Heimosalmi, Schmidt, Mailloux, Bar

 

JB needs to look at the long term design of his team, which at this moment, has NO, RHD other than Woo, who will be here in 5 years. None! Think about that! IMO, that has huge implications for our future.

 

The other thing is that Columbus, needs to start their rebuild, and it will not be an over night process, so getting that 2024 1st, only means, they get an extra piece down the road, and with the top 10 of the draft being rather flat, they have the luxury of taking any number of players that might fit the rebuild. Schmidt is also someone that they can in turn also flip with another piece for something they need/want.

This is what i said but more in a mumbo jumbo dialogue 

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9 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Sorry but Columbus would punch JB in the sack for even proposing this.

Domi is obviously a cap dump, so that lowers Jones’ value.  

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Posted (edited)

I don't understand this trade.   Also don't get the Schmidt complainers, Schmidt Myers were our best D's this year (together), give the guy some slack, new teammates sometimes takes time, and all the players had issues the first 15 games or so except BB.  

 

As far as his cap hit goes he's 33thrd now, about to drop around 36-38 depending on the raises this year and one or two guys dropping down (Edler).  And there are also 10 D's within 500k of him, many who i wouldn't trade Schmidt for, and quite a few above him i wouldn't trade for either.   Third contract UFA's always get their due market wise.   

 

LHD/RHD like him don't come around often (available), fans, teammates, coach's and GM of Vegas hated losing him (or have folks forgetten that already). 

 

If we trade him he needs replacing.   I'm fine with that, but not for a 5th this year (Clarke could go as high as 3rd so we aren't necessarily going to get him, look at Seider, dropped 15 spots) ... 

 

Hate to say this but we need more guys like him (Schmidt), not less.   Or a good tweener.   Guys in his age range have their best seasons after 30 often, look at Edler for example, had one of his best 12 months of hockey at 33 (worlds, us etc.)   

 

When we went to the finals in 2011, we had 7 top four D's, Ballard maybe being the outlier but he was in Florida, our team was stacked with top four D's from top to bottom.   With QHs on board it changes things a little.    He's going to take time and still needs insulation.    Kill his career like Coho's if we aren't careful (playing him 25 minutes ... without PK time - too much at this point). 

 

If we had 4-5 top four D's plus QHs and a Manson type (defensive D) ... we should be fine.   Schmidt's deal works for our team right now.  Going to be tough for JB to flip him for a better cheaper D.   

 

Edit:  As far as his cap hit goes...curious study go look at the guys above him...how many of those guys would you trade for, that are also on their UFA deal?   Puts things quickly in perspective.    Some but not many. 

Edited by IBatch
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