If I only had a brain...(player?)

[LTC123]

Welcome from Winnipeg here....long time fan.

 

I remember following the Canucks in the 90's and mention of Trevor Linden.  I remember comment like, "If Linden only had a a player like  _________, he'd really explode offensively"     Or, If Bure only had a centreman like ______, he'd score more goals.  

 

Were (are) there players that you'd think that we were just one piece away that would have really propelled them into NHL stardom?  I believed we tried with Jimmy Carson and others but could never really find that one complementary player.  

 

Thoughts?

 

 

[JM_]

Welcome back.

 

The guy I wanted here was Lowry, I was really hoping he was going to make it to free agency. We need a smart, skilled and big player to stabilize our bottom 6. Boone Jenner is another guy I wish we could trade for, to take on that role. 

 

We also need, like most teams, a top pairing RHD for Hughes. But we'll have to draft that. 

[Fanuck]

I saw the thread title and thought this was going to be about:

 

'

 

and

 

[aGENT]

Boone Jenner or Nick Paul for 3C would be great.

 

A RD to play with Hughes in the Suter/Seabrook mold as well.

[Alflives]

I wish we would have had Big Buff playing with the Twins.  

[bigbadcanucks]

Sounds to me as if the "what if" questions about Linden and Bure are things you have conjured up in your own mind.  I don't recall the "what if" conversation about either Linden or Bure, and I was heavily vested in the Canucks as a season ticket holder and part of a corporate sponsor group during the Linden/Bure era (company I worked for had the scoreboard advertising rights).

 

Trevor Linden drove the play while he was on the ice, and brought with him immeasurable intangibles.  He was never going to be a 50-goal scorer or a superstar regardless of who he played with because he was an all-around player who was as defensively responsible as he was opportunistic offensively.

 

Pavel Bure was a play driver who scored 254 goals while in a Canucks jersey and the question being asked was how many could he have had if he were healthy 1995 to 1997 and didn't have deal with work stoppage in 1995-96, not what could have he done if he had a better centerman.  Bure played with Greg Adams, Russ Courtnall, Murray Craven and Mike Ridley as his centers most of the time.  Bure was a playmaker who finished most of his own plays, so he didn't rely on a centerman to feed him for one timers/tap ins. 

 

But I'll play along with our game and say that Lonny Bohonos, a Winnipegger, with the right playmaking centerman could have been a superstar for the Canucks. 

Edited June 7, 2021 by bigbadcanucks

[aGENT]

10 minutes ago, Alflives said:

I wish we would have had Big Buff playing with the Twins.  

Iginla on their W would have been magical.

[Patel Bure]

I wish we had a superstar goalie with us during the WCE era.    
 

Maybe even a JD Giguerre or Jose Theodore to back up that Naslund, Morrison, Bertuzzi, and Jovanovski nucleus.

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Iginla on their W would have been magical.

Oh ya.  Iggy would have been perfect!  

[Ghostsof1915]

33 minutes ago, bigbadcanucks said:

Sounds to me as if the "what if" questions about Linden and Bure are things you have conjured up in your own mind.  I don't recall the "what if" conversation about either Linden or Bure, and I was heavily vested in the Canucks as a season ticket holder and part of a corporate sponsor group during the Linden/Bure era (company I worked for had the scoreboard advertising rights).

 

Trevor Linden drove the play while he was on the ice, and brought with him immeasurable intangibles.  He was never going to be a 50-goal scorer or a superstar regardless of who he played with because he was an all-around player who was as defensively responsible as he was opportunistic offensively.

 

Pavel Bure was a play driver who scored 254 goals while in a Canucks jersey and the question being asked was how many could he have had if he were healthy 1995 to 1997 and didn't have deal with work stoppage in 1995-95, not what could have he done if he had a better centerman.  Bure played with Greg Adams, Russ Courtnall, Murray Craven and Mike Ridley as his centers most of the time.  Bure was a playmaker who finished most of his own plays, so he didn't rely on a centerman to feed him for one timers/tap ins. 

 

But I'll play along with our game and say that Lonny Bohonos, a Winnipegger, with the right playmaking centerman could have been a superstar for the Canucks. 

Oh no...Linden only had 30 or more goals in 6 of his first eight seasons in Vancouver. 

Also a converted center from a RW. As mentioned he was a fantastic player, and leader. 

I never had a what if with Linden. 

I had more of a what if with instead of returning to the NHL with San Jose, if Larionov came back to Vancouver. He had chemistry with Bure and 

would have added centre depth that the team was lacking. 

[Tom Sestito]

1 hour ago, aGENT said:

Boone Jenner or Nick Paul for 3C would be great.

 

A RD to play with Hughes in the Suter/Seabrook mold as well.

Not that I disagree with you, but how do you propose we get those players and the subsequent capspace needed without overpaying the available assets we have to dump salary? 

 

We need a 1st pairing defender, 2nd line winger, 3rd line center, and second pairing defender at the minimum (~20MM)

 

We need to move on from 75% of Myers, Eriksson, Beagle, Roussel, Holtby, Jake to get there. This is why I don't understand how we can be aggressive this summer? 

Edited June 7, 2021 by Tom Sestito

[aGENT]

15 minutes ago, Tom Sestito said:

Not that I disagree with you, but how do you propose we get those players and the subsequent capspace needed without overpaying the available assets we have to dump salary? 

 

We need a 1st pairing defender, 2nd line winger, 3rd line center, and second pairing defender at the minimum (~20MM)

 

We need to move on from 75% of Myers, Eriksson, Beagle, Roussel, Holtby, Jake to get there. This is why I don't understand how we can be aggressive this summer? 

Who said it has to all has to happen this summer?

 

Jenner is a UFA next year when we have cap opening up. (I also don't think he'd be prohibitively expensive to trade for as he is expiring).

 

I'm fine letting Podkolzin develop in to the winger over time. We may also get another winger this draft.

 

No need to move Myers and the rest all expire this year. Jake may be suspended, terminated or bought out.

[GB5]

Hughes with the modern equivalent of Willie Mitchell I think would be steller.

 

I am not sure who the current equivalent is but that is the mold of player I would like to see next to Hughes. Maybe a heart and soul UFA like David Savard would work?

Edited June 7, 2021 by GarthButcher5

[khay]

43 minutes ago, Tom Sestito said:

Not that I disagree with you, but how do you propose we get those players and the subsequent capspace needed without overpaying the available assets we have to dump salary? 

 

We need a 1st pairing defender, 2nd line winger, 3rd line center, and second pairing defender at the minimum (~20MM)

 

We need to move on from 75% of Myers, Eriksson, Beagle, Roussel, Holtby, Jake to get there. This is why I don't understand how we can be aggressive this summer? 

We don't need a 1st pairing defender like Hedman but more like Tanev, who will partner with Hughes to form a 1st pairing defence. I think those can be signed at around 5 mil.

 

Hughes-RD

Edler-Schmidt

Rathbone/OJ-Myers

 

We don't need that second pairing defender either. Just re-sign Edler at a discount, around 3mil.

 

We also don't need a 2nd line winger. We will have Podkolzin and Hoglander. 

 

Yes, we need a 3C and probably a 4C if Beagle is on LTIR. Hopefully we can find a 3C at around 4-4.5 mil and 4C around 2 mil?

 

It may be good to get a middle six winger.

 

Miller-EP-Boeser

Pearson-Horvat-Hoglander

Motte-3C-Podkolzin

Highmore-4C-4RW

 

I think we leave 4RW spot open for some healthy internal competition. 

 

TODO list

EP + Hughes for 12 mil

RD for 5 mil

3C for 4 mil

4C for 2 mil

Edler for 3 mil

 

In total we need about 26 mil.

 

We have 14 million in cap space as per Capfriendly.

 

- Buyout Holtby and Virtanen saves us 3.8 + 2.5 mil = 6.3 mil.

- LTIR for Beagle and Ferland gives us 6.5 mil.

 

That gives us about 26 mil to work with.

 

If we need more space, we will have to cap dump Roussel. With one year left and with a sweetener, we might be able to do it.

 

But maybe even Roussel might be placed on the LTIR. He hasn't been able to stay in the lineup consistently since his knee injury.

 

[bigbadcanucks]

1 hour ago, Patel Bure said:

I wish we had a superstar goalie with us during the WCE era.    
 

Maybe even a JD Giguerre or Jose Theodore to back up that Naslund, Morrison, Bertuzzi, and Jovanovski nucleus.

Thank the Hockey Gods that Jose Theodore was never a person of interest to the Canucks management.  I lived in Montreal from 1997 to 2004 and lived in the same condo building as Theodore on Ile de Soeurs and he was a piece of work.  He drove a suped-up black Hummer (first of its kind) with limo tint bullet proof glass because if he wasn't snorting coke up his nose, he was busy hanging out with Mom Boucher and the bikers.  Surprised he and his old man haven't met the Grim Reaper yet.

 

Linden and his wife also lived on Ile des Soeurs and I would run into them occasionally at the local Provigo. Being transplanted Anglophones in Montreal and transplanted westcoasters (Linden from Med Hat and me from the 'peg), we had some nice short conversations.  They were one of the nicest couples I've ever met.  Theodore on the other hand is what you scrape off from the bottom of your shoes.

[Patel Bure]

6 minutes ago, bigbadcanucks said:

Thank the Hockey Gods that Jose Theodore was never a person of interest to the Canucks management.  I lived in Montreal from 1997 to 2004 and lived in the same condo building as Theodore on Ile de Soeurs and he was a piece of work.  He drove a suped-up black Hummer (first of its kind) with limo tint bullet proof glass because if he wasn't snorting coke up his nose, he was busy hanging out with Mom Boucher and the bikers.  Surprised he and his old man haven't met the Grim Reaper yet.

 

Linden and his wife also lived on Ile des Soeurs and I would run into them occasionally at the local Provigo. Being transplanted Anglophones in Montreal and transplanted westcoasters (Linden from Med Hat and me from the 'peg), we had some nice short conversations.  They were one of the nicest couples I've ever met.  Theodore on the other hand is what you scrape off from the bottom of your shoes.

Oh wow, damn!  :-o.   
 

Never knew that about Theodore.   I always wondered why his game fell off a Cliff so drastically and now I know the answer I guess.   Given the drastic falls of Mike Richards, Dany Heatley, and Wade Redden, I wonder if they have similar stories (I’m NOT inferring anything by the way, just pure speculation).

[aGENT]

1 hour ago, Tom Sestito said:

Not that I disagree with you, but how do you propose we get those players and the subsequent capspace needed without overpaying the available assets we have to dump salary? 

 

We need a 1st pairing defender, 2nd line winger, 3rd line center, and second pairing defender at the minimum (~20MM)

 

We need to move on from 75% of Myers, Eriksson, Beagle, Roussel, Holtby, Jake to get there. This is why I don't understand how we can be aggressive this summer? 

Oh, and I like my idea of helping Tampa clear cap by swapping them Ferland for Killorn +.

 

They save $1m in cap and can utilize Ferland's LTIR status to perhaps re-sign say Savard.

 

Nice middle 6 W'er for you there

[Elias Pettersson]

2 hours ago, bigbadcanucks said:

Sounds to me as if the "what if" questions about Linden and Bure are things you have conjured up in your own mind.  I don't recall the "what if" conversation about either Linden or Bure, and I was heavily vested in the Canucks as a season ticket holder and part of a corporate sponsor group during the Linden/Bure era (company I worked for had the scoreboard advertising rights).

 

Trevor Linden drove the play while he was on the ice, and brought with him immeasurable intangibles.  He was never going to be a 50-goal scorer or a superstar regardless of who he played with because he was an all-around player who was as defensively responsible as he was opportunistic offensively.

 

Pavel Bure was a play driver who scored 254 goals while in a Canucks jersey and the question being asked was how many could he have had if he were healthy 1995 to 1997 and didn't have deal with work stoppage in 1995-96, not what could have he done if he had a better centerman.  Bure played with Greg Adams, Russ Courtnall, Murray Craven and Mike Ridley as his centers most of the time.  Bure was a playmaker who finished most of his own plays, so he didn't rely on a centerman to feed him for one timers/tap ins. 

 

But I'll play along with our game and say that Lonny Bohonos, a Winnipegger, with the right playmaking centerman could have been a superstar for the Canucks. 

There was a huge backlash when Quinn didn't re-sign Larionov because of the payment needed to be made to the Russian Sports Agency.  That was a huge "what if".  If Larionov had been re-signed Bure would have had his full time centre for the next several years and things would have been vastly different.  Murray Craven was no Larionov.  And Adams and Courtnall played wing not centre.  If Larionov had still been around after that first year I think the Canucks win the Stanley Cup in 1994.  He was the missing link up front on that team.  

 

Larionov went to San Jose and turned that team around with Sergei Makarov.  He then went to Detroit where he joined the other Russians on the team and helped them win 3 Stanley Cups.  Larionov was a massive loss to Vancouver, especially when we didn't have a true centre on the team to play with Bure.

[RUPERTKBD]

Not exactly what the OP means, I don't think, but I always revert to the time Canucks' brass got Wayne Gretzky out of bed and told him to "take it or leave it".

 

For those who might not know the story, Gretz wanted to play with Pavel and went to bed thinking he had a deal with Vancouver. He'd told Pat Quinn that he would sign the contract in the morning. However, when Stan MCCammon heard this, he instructed Quinn to get the contract signed "now". Quinn told McCammon not to worry, but (the story goes) McCammon was suspicious that Gretzky was going to take the offer to other teams, to see if he could get a better deal.

 

He ordered Quinn to wake Gretzky up and get the contract signed right away. Gretzky did not appreciate this and the entire deal blew up.

 

We can only wonder what kind of numbers Pasha could have put up with 99 feeding him the puck all season....

[ruilin96]

The 2011 roster with the addition of Jarome Iginla and Shea Weber. We would’ve definitely won the cup.

Edited June 7, 2021 by ruilin96