wallstreetamigo Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 31 minutes ago, aGENT said: Well we did need a goalie...and D. Probably a LOT more so than a winger BTW (where we're organizationally deepest). And Schmidt (despite his off year) was a no-brainer trade. Virtanen was an error given hindsight. The same people complaining about Toffoli would have been complaining about letting Virtanen walk for nothing. I wouldn't be surprised if Benning was likely attempting to use qualified Virtanen's rights to move some of that cap to add Toffoli actually. When Toffoli signed elsewhere... Sure. By most accounts, players are treated quite well and fairly by Vancouver/Benning. You have no idea what OEL's cap would have been or what cap we might have moved out. He didn't want to. He was looking for ways to improve, not maintain the status quo of a rebuilding team that wasn't good enough. I disagree. May not have showed this season (for a myriad of reasons) but I 100% swap Tanev and Stectcher for Schmidt and Hamonic any day. The point is we could have had a goalie, ad, AND a top 6 winger. We didnt need a 4.6 million backup. Get rid of Virtanen and sign a veteran backup for 1.5 mil and there is the money for Toffoli while still being able to get Schmidt. And who cares if people complained about getting rid of Virtanen? People complain about getting rid of Toffoli and it didnt impact anything. People complain about Benning and it didnt change anything. It was the right move for the team. And actually, by some accounts, like from Tanev and Toffoli, players are not treated well by Benning. If you think Arizona would be taking back a garbage contract or retaining a significant portion of OEL's contract you arent paying attention. The whole point for them was to get out from under it. They may have taken shorter term dead cap contracts back but how does that help the Canucks to take on an even longer, $&!#tier contract? We could have had Schmidt, Tanev, AND Hamonic if he played his cards right. I think that would have been even better. Hamonic was really only good because he was on a cheap contract. Not a guy you commit longer term money to. He was not as effective with Hughes as Tanev was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Googlie Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 (edited) 11 hours ago, lmm said: what did he do to warrant your support? He has a great relationship with Rathbone - was cited by Jake as one of the reasons he signed when he did. https://www.facebook.com/Canucks/videos/277600053510984/ Edited June 11, 2021 by Googlie 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 hour ago, aGENT said: Well we did need a goalie...and D. Probably a LOT more so than a winger BTW (where we're organizationally deepest). And Schmidt (despite his off year) was a no-brainer trade. Virtanen was an error given hindsight. The same people complaining about Toffoli would have been complaining about letting Virtanen walk for nothing. I wouldn't be surprised if Benning was likely attempting to use qualified Virtanen's rights to move some of that cap to add Toffoli actually. When Toffoli signed elsewhere... Sure. By most accounts, players are treated quite well and fairly by Vancouver/Benning. You have no idea what OEL's cap would have been or what cap we might have moved out. He didn't want to. He was looking for ways to improve, not maintain the status quo of a rebuilding team that wasn't good enough. I disagree. May not have showed this season (for a myriad of reasons) but I 100% swap Tanev and Stectcher for Schmidt and Hamonic any day. I honestly don't know where people get to such assumptions as I read on here. There's not really any cause for that kind of speculation, imo. Nothing serious anyway 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 9 minutes ago, stawns said: I honestly don't know how people get to such assumptions as I read on here. There's not really any cause for that kind of speculation, imo. Nothing serious anyway Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gurn Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 You can say that again. 4 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
KariyaSakicAnderson Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 (edited) 54 minutes ago, Canuckster86 said: We still have a very inexperienced coaching staff if King and Bum are in charge of the main F/D/PP/PK . I think it is way to early to say what Shaw's role is going to be, but I hope he is here to push Green and if we fall flat on our face next season, Shaw might get an interim HC opportunity with us if things are still a tire fire like years past. Brad Shaw it seems will be running the Forwards and PP while giving Baumgartner some input and possible direction on the D and PK side, that seems to be his bigger role an possibly the associate coach, Green's right hand man, next in command Here is an article in the province by Kuzma today and what Green and Shaw mention. https://www.google.ca/amp/s/theprovince.com/sports/hockey/nhl/vancouver-canucks/canucks-travis-green-picks-veteran-coach-brad-shaw-for-critical-role/wcm/16aeaf77-c0e9-4aa6-936c-4f18fb7cb22f/amp/ Canucks: Travis Green picks veteran coach Brad Shaw for critical role 'At times, I’ve been told I’m too detailed or too finite. I’ve gotten better and learned simplicity is a real important aspect ... ' — new Canucks assistant Brad Shaw Author of the article:Ben Kuzma Publishing date:Jun 10, 2021 • Last Updated 6 hours ago • 4 minute read Travis Green, pictured, will be aided by the hiring of Brad Shaw as a Canucks' assistant coach. The first conversation lasted an hour. The second one went on for two hours. When Brad Shaw wasn’t afforded an opportunity to interview as a replacement for departed Columbus head coach John Tortorella — the assistant was surprisingly not retained by the NHL club — Vancouver Canucks head coach Travis Green quickly sought permission to interview the free agent. What the Blue Jackets may have lost in their curious decision is what the Canucks hoped to have gained Wednesday in hiring the well-travelled and highly respected Shaw as a key assistant to Green. The former defensive defenceman, who logged 377 games with four NHL teams, hasn’t only guided top blueliners in a trio of coaching stops, his ability to deploy responsible mindsets will resonate with a club that has to stop the bleeding. The league’s 26th-ranked defence and 17th-rated penalty kill will get a boost from Shaw’s knowledge because the Jackets sported the best kill in the 2018-19 season. He was also instrumental in helping Seth Jones, Zach Werenski and Vladislav Gavrikov develop into top-tier defencemen and reliable rearguards. It’s why Shaw’s name popped up in the past to fill head-coaching vacancies in Arizona, New York (Rangers), Buffalo and New Jersey, and why the Canucks will deploy the 57-year-old Cambridge, Ont., native in an expanded role. Nolan Baumgartner will continue to work with defencemen and run the penalty kill but Shaw won’t be far away for some sage advice while helping direct forwards and the power play. “Brad brings a lot to the table,” said Green. “Everyone looks at him like he’s a defensive coach, but he’s a lot more than that. He’s a very sharp hockey mind and is going to be able to touch a lot of areas of our team and be a good influence on our staff. “We’ve (Baumgartner and Green) been together for four years and sometimes a different point of view and different set of eyes is helpful. That was a big part of it and I really enjoy talking to people who have a mind for the game. And as a coach, you want to be challenged and broaden your mind and ideas. He’s a new voice for me and somebody I can lean on and he’ll have some good words for Baumer.” Columbus Blue Jackets head coach John Tortorella stands in the bench in the game against the Detroit Red Wings in May 2021. An example of Shaw’s expanded capabilities came in the 2019 playoffs. He worked with Tortorella and assistant Brad Larsen, who will interview to replace Tortorella, and the trio devised a plan that completely choked the Tampa Bay Lightning, winners of the President’s Trophy. A shocking first-round sweep of the high-octane Lightning, who had four of the league’s top-six scorers and were held to eight series goals, was made possible by a staying-above-the-puck approach and mucking and grinding through the neutral zone. It worked for the first round, but the Jackets were eliminated in six games by the Boston Bruins in the second. Still, Shaw made a statement that he wasn’t a one-dimensional coach. The defensive side is something I’ve done for a long time and always had a huge interest in,” he said. “Your defence has a big role and how they see the game, react and finding solutions intrigues me and always will. It’s always a challenge to get that message across. “I know how I want players to play with habits and attention to detail. To have my hands in everything and have a little bit of a different job description is exciting. With Baumer, I hope to augment him in different ways by getting my point across and not being offensive. “We’re all in this together. It’s getting to a comfort level where you can say what’s on your mind and by being totally honest, we’ll get further ahead. For the defence and forwards, certain habits are important across the board. “At times, I’ve been told I’m too detailed or to finite. I’ve gotten better and learned simplicity is a real important aspect and coaching five years with Torts is as simple as it can get. He has his trigger points.” Those who really got to know Shaw, label him as “a super-nice guy”. If anything, he tends to be a perfectionist and a constant drilling of fundamentals might affect some, but the Canucks could use that right now. They need direction. “This is a steal for the Canucks,” said a Jackets’ insider. “You’ll see results pretty quick.” The Canucks also added Kyle Gustafson as an assistant and special assignment coach. He was assistant general manager and associate coach of the WHL Portland Winterhawks and his connection with Green dates to working the junior bench together. Edited June 11, 2021 by KariyaSakicAnderson 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 21 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: The point is we could have had a goalie, ad, AND a top 6 winger. We didnt need a 4.6 million backup. Get rid of Virtanen and sign a veteran backup for 1.5 mil and there is the money for Toffoli while still being able to get Schmidt. That's nice too say but if Demko had faltered/struggled this year...? 21 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: And who cares if people complained about getting rid of Virtanen? People complain about getting rid of Toffoli and it didnt impact anything. People complain about Benning and it didnt change anything. Will that we agree on 21 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: And actually, by some accounts, like from Tanev and Toffoli, players are not treated well by Benning. I'm going to go with the years of history of players who've talked about being treated well here, over a few guys during a one off, gong show pandemic year. 21 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: If you think Arizona would be taking back a garbage contract or retaining a significant portion of OEL's contract you arent paying attention. The whole point for them was to get out from under it. They may have taken shorter term dead cap contracts back but how does that help the Canucks to take on an even longer, $&!#tier contract? They wanted to get out from under the dollars more so than the cap. Benning may have insisted they retain and taken back Eriksson. Who the hell knows. Clearly the terms Benning was insisting on, that made sense for the Canucks, weren't palatable to Arizona. No loss. Get over it. You're vilifying him for something you don't know about, that didn't happen. 21 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: We could have had Schmidt, Tanev, AND Hamonic if he played his cards right. I think that would have been even better. Unlikely, somebody isn't signing with that depth impeding their play time. And not with Toffoli. 21 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: Hamonic was really only good because he was on a cheap contract. Not a guy you commit longer term money to. He was not as effective with Hughes as Tanev was. Who said he was worth signing to a big term deal? He was getting a heck of a lot closer towards the middle-end of the year. Better short term fit than Tanev, who also brings more physicality for less cap. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmautzie Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 12 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said: I think, at least based on what I took from Shaw's interview, is that BumG and King will be under him. He will be Green's only assistant or associate, and all other coaches outside of Clark will answer to both Shaw and Green. It sounded as though Shaw has very specific systems that he'd like the defense to utilize, and envisioned how it would impact the players. BumG will be mainly the PK, and implementing Shaw's more responsible defensive structures. Essentially Shaw was hired because of his track record with team defense, so going forward, it'll be his to mold, including how BroomGuarder coaches. I hope you’re right. I’m not sure if the Canucks rope-a-dope system in their own end is Green’s or Baumgartner’s but I’ll be happy to see the last of it. And it would be nice to apply some pressure to the puck carrier when on the PK instead of letting the opposing team set up and fire away at will. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 30 minutes ago, stawns said: I honestly don't know where people get to such assumptions as I read on here. There's not really any cause for that kind of speculation, imo. Nothing serious anyway Drance, Patterson... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmautzie Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 3 hours ago, Elias_Pettersson said: We have that point shot in Boeser. Still blows my mind that they can have Boeser and Pettersson on each side who can rip one timers better than 99% of the NHL, with an elite offensive/puck moving d man in Hughes and our pp struggles so much. I’d also have Hoglander on the first unit. Elite hands, can retrieve pucks and is more creative than anyone on our team besides Petey/Hughes. I’d like to see Hoglander on the first unit as well. It’s too bad that Green didn’t try him there at the end of last season but I guess without Pettersson it wouldn’t have really been the true first unit at that point. But who comes off if Hoglander goes on? My choice would be Horvat. That would at least give us a legitimate PP centre on the second unit. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 30 minutes ago, KariyaSakicAnderson said: Brad Shaw it seems will be running the Forwards Which is great because IMO a lot of our 'defensive problems' are actually poor forward support/not working as a 5 man unit. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post FaninMex Posted June 11, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 hour ago, wallstreetamigo said: The point is we could have had a goalie, ad, AND a top 6 winger. We didnt need a 4.6 million backup. Get rid of Virtanen and sign a veteran backup for 1.5 mil and there is the money for Toffoli while still being able to get Schmidt. And who cares if people complained about getting rid of Virtanen? People complain about getting rid of Toffoli and it didnt impact anything. People complain about Benning and it didnt change anything. It was the right move for the team. And actually, by some accounts, like from Tanev and Toffoli, players are not treated well by Benning. If you think Arizona would be taking back a garbage contract or retaining a significant portion of OEL's contract you arent paying attention. The whole point for them was to get out from under it. They may have taken shorter term dead cap contracts back but how does that help the Canucks to take on an even longer, $&!#tier contract? We could have had Schmidt, Tanev, AND Hamonic if he played his cards right. I think that would have been even better. Hamonic was really only good because he was on a cheap contract. Not a guy you commit longer term money to. He was not as effective with Hughes as Tanev was. How many times have you said the same thing over and over. You have argued this countless times with countless posters. Unless their name is Squamfan, we have all rebuffed what you have said and given various counter arguments but you still belch out the same same. Toffoli walked. He would not have changed our season so, who cares. Crying about spilled milk. Tanev. We moved on. His body will not survive many more years in this league. OEL. What is wrong with looking at options? How do you know what Arizona would or wouldn't do? You live in the land of If, Ands and Maybe's. Why not live in the present? But I think you just come on here to argue with someone like when you defended Drance of all people 5 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wallstreetamigo Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 21 minutes ago, aGENT said: That's nice too say but if Demko had faltered/struggled this year...? Will that we agree on I'm going to go with the years of history of players who've talked about being treated well here, over a few guys during a one off, gong show pandemic year. They wanted to get out from under the dollars more so than the cap. Benning may have insisted they retain and taken back Eriksson. Who the hell knows. Clearly the terms Benning was insisting on, that made sense for the Canucks, weren't palatable to Arizona. No loss. Get over it. You're vilifying him for something you don't know about, that didn't happen. Unlikely, somebody isn't signing with that depth impeding their play time. And not with Toffoli. Who said he was worth signing to a big term deal? He was getting a heck of a lot closer towards the middle-end of the year. Better short term fit than Tanev, who also brings more physicality for less cap. If Demko struggles, you do what many other middling to terrible teams relying on young goalies do. You let the young goalie work through it with the support of an inexpensive backup/1B, take the write off year if you need to (which ironically ended up happening anyway WITH big money Holtby), and you revisit the goaltending options next offseason if you dont think Demko is your guy. A team willing to let Markstrom walk should have simply given Demko the net and seen what he did with it. There is an endless trail of players over the years treated like crap by the Canucks. Sorry to break it to you. They werent retaining for 5 or 6 years or whatever was left on OEL's deal. Few if any teams would. So they retain for lets say the 2 years of Eriksson's contract and take him on. Short term that helps, long term it &^@#s the team though. Well, he traded for Schmidt, so Schmidt had no choice. He would have likely played on the left side anyway if all 3 of those guys were brought in. Hamonic is a good depth D at a good price. But he will supposedly only agree to play for max 4 teams out of 31, maybe 5 of 32 next year. He had already played for 1 of the 4. He had no leverage in contract negotiations and if he wanted a job in the league Van might have been his only option. That he signed a PTO and waited until the season started to sign tells me he had no other good offers. Chasing OEL may not have resulted in getting him (thank god) but it distracted Benning and had him allocating cap internally to the point he didnt even make offers to his own UFA players. So it ended up less $&!#ty than it could have but it was still a big reason Benning "ran out of time." 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PhillipBlunt Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 44 minutes ago, Schmautzie said: I hope you’re right. I’m not sure if the Canucks rope-a-dope system in their own end is Green’s or Baumgartner’s but I’ll be happy to see the last of it. And it would be nice to apply some pressure to the puck carrier when on the PK instead of letting the opposing team set up and fire away at will. Did you listen to Shaw on 650? The detail he goes into is unreal. I’m happy to have him here. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post aGENT Posted June 11, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 11, 2021 11 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said: If Demko struggles, you do what many other middling to terrible teams relying on young goalies do. You let the young goalie work through it with the support of an inexpensive backup/1B, take the write off year if you need to (which ironically ended up happening anyway WITH big money Holtby), and you revisit the goaltending options next offseason if you dont think Demko is your guy. A team willing to let Markstrom walk should have simply given Demko the net and seen what he did with it. There is an endless trail of players over the years treated like crap by the Canucks. Sorry to break it to you. They werent retaining for 5 or 6 years or whatever was left on OEL's deal. Few if any teams would. So they retain for lets say the 2 years of Eriksson's contract and take him on. Short term that helps, long term it &^@#s the team though. Well, he traded for Schmidt, so Schmidt had no choice. He would have likely played on the left side anyway if all 3 of those guys were brought in. Hamonic is a good depth D at a good price. But he will supposedly only agree to play for max 4 teams out of 31, maybe 5 of 32 next year. He had already played for 1 of the 4. He had no leverage in contract negotiations and if he wanted a job in the league Van might have been his only option. That he signed a PTO and waited until the season started to sign tells me he had no other good offers. Chasing OEL may not have resulted in getting him (thank god) but it distracted Benning and had him allocating cap internally to the point he didnt even make offers to his own UFA players. So it ended up less $&!#ty than it could have but it was still a big reason Benning "ran out of time." Sigh.... Unrealistic, conjecture, hyperbole, opinions as facts... Playing all your greatest hits I see. You can play chase your own tail for your encore. 1 2 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Monahan Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 @wallstreetamigo your rebuttal? You did the same thing with your claim of Toffoli trade= Sergachev trade. I’d love to hear your thoughts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post PhillipBlunt Posted June 11, 2021 Popular Post Share Posted June 11, 2021 1 6 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lmm Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 2 hours ago, Googlie said: He has a great relationship with Lockwood - was cited by Will as one of the reasons he signed when he did. https://www.facebook.com/Canucks/videos/277600053510984/ hey thanks for answering I assume you meant Rathbone 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Schmautzie Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 45 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Did you listen to Shaw on 650? The detail he goes into is unreal. I’m happy to have him here. No I didn’t hear the interview but I’m reading all sorts of good things about him. He sounds like just the guy we need. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sean Monahan Posted June 11, 2021 Share Posted June 11, 2021 15 minutes ago, PhillipBlunt said: Haha well the guy goes on about being objective then hides when his hypocrisy is pointed out. I’m all for criticism of JB but stand behind your opinions. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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