Point Scoring defensive D men

[theo5789]

Very underrated as I haven't seen his name mentioned yet is Jonas Brodin. Often partnered with Dumba and another offensive guy in Spurgeon, he's relied to be the steady defensive presence and the last couple of seasons, he's put up over 0.4 PPG. If he can push his offensive numbers a bit higher (although I think this is ridiculous for a defensemen category), he could be IMO a Norris candidate.

[Phil_314]

6 hours ago, IBatch said:

Two-way D's might be a better way to look at this

Agreed with this, the title of the thread is basically referring to two-way D-men (for categorizing I think there's a couple main ones: players like Quinn Hughes in this stage of his career are offensive D-men, best suited to carry the offensive load; Hedman and Cernak are realistically two-way D-men; and guys like Kris Russell in Edmonton would be defensive D-men, focusing on elements of the game like shot-blocking and minding his own zone first).  I can't think of any really defensive guys who also racked up points but who I'd label as a defensive D-man (Willie Mitchell fit the bill with his big shot though?)  

[4petesake]

14 minutes ago, theo5789 said:

Very underrated as I haven't seen his name mentioned yet is Jonas Brodin. Often partnered with Dumba and another offensive guy in Spurgeon, he's relied to be the steady defensive presence and the last couple of seasons, he's put up over 0.4 PPG. If he can push his offensive numbers a bit higher (although I think this is ridiculous for a defensemen category), he could be IMO a Norris candidate.

Brodin is a good choice here. I’ll add NYI Ryan Pulock to this list of relatively decent point producers who are excellent defensively as well. He’s like a higher scoring Tanev in that he seems to play like he has ice water in his veins. Watch him closely in the playoffs.

[JM_]

2 hours ago, janisahockeynut said:

Do you really feel Montreal is the 4th best team in the playoffs JIm?

 

Price is healthy and hot, and they have a couple of guys that are hot

 

But I would not be counting on them next year, in their regular division

 

I want us to be a long term contender, maybe I am a glass half full guy here

 

But I see so many holes....we are simply just not ready, IMO

when it comes to the playoffs, imo its as much about execution and staying healthy as it is about being "the best". Not sure what that really means. The best run and gun team? the best checking team? the healthiest team? luckiest team? 

 

I don't see why us becoming a long term contender is contingent on one more tank year. 

 

When you look at a team like Pittsburg .e.g, they have got so much out of their forwards not named Crosby and Malkin its ridiculous, and a lot of that is the coaching. Thats why I'm so happy to see Shaw here , and Clark retained. 

 

Even Vegas, if it wasn't for Fleury defying his age where are they? 

 

If we now have a coaching staff that can get that F group contributing more to team defence we're going to see some pretty fun nights next year. Good coaching can fill a lot of holes, imo. 

 

 

Edited June 11, 2021 by Jimmy McGill

[UKNuck96]

1 hour ago, 4petesake said:

Brodin is a good choice here. I’ll add NYI Ryan Pulock to this list of relatively decent point producers who are excellent defensively as well. He’s like a higher scoring Tanev in that he seems to play like he has ice water in his veins. Watch him closely in the playoffs.

Yeah Pulock does fit the mold I was thinking   how many are similar in that regard 

[mll]

1 hour ago, theo5789 said:

Very underrated as I haven't seen his name mentioned yet is Jonas Brodin. Often partnered with Dumba and another offensive guy in Spurgeon, he's relied to be the steady defensive presence and the last couple of seasons, he's put up over 0.4 PPG. If he can push his offensive numbers a bit higher (although I think this is ridiculous for a defensemen category), he could be IMO a Norris candidate.

Brodin is a good choice but Spurgeon too.  Spurgeon is counted on for defence first - wouldn't call him an offensive D.  He is just as reliable defensively as Brodin.  

 

[King Heffy]

2 hours ago, Phil_314 said:

Agreed with this, the title of the thread is basically referring to two-way D-men (for categorizing I think there's a couple main ones: players like Quinn Hughes in this stage of his career are offensive D-men, best suited to carry the offensive load; Hedman and Cernak are realistically two-way D-men; and guys like Kris Russell in Edmonton would be defensive D-men, focusing on elements of the game like shot-blocking and minding his own zone first).  I can't think of any really defensive guys who also racked up points but who I'd label as a defensive D-man (Willie Mitchell fit the bill with his big shot though?)  

Salo would be a good example.

[UKNuck96]

3 minutes ago, King Heffy said:

Salo would be a good example.

I did have Salo in mind but I would class him more as an all rounder 

[IBatch]

22 minutes ago, mll said:

Brodin is a good choice but Spurgeon too.  Spurgeon is counted on for defence first - wouldn't call him an offensive D.  He is just as reliable defensively as Brodin.  

 

Spurgeon is like Stecher plus...   A little guy that made it work and all heart.   Really did well actually, wouldn't think he did enough for that paycheque though.    Brodin is for sure a good example MIN was a top 3 defensive team last year and did pretty good again.   I have zero issue with spending that type of money in the D if we could get similar results.    Schmidt/ Myers/ Rathbone/OJ or Spurgeon/Brodin... 

[Elias Pettersson]

4 hours ago, smithers joe said:

so would i, but i'm sure if they were going to move him, they could find better deals. have you got your cards yet?

No haven’t gotten my cards yet.  I guess getting 9/20 was too hard to believe and I was disqualified. 

[mll]

1 hour ago, IBatch said:

Spurgeon is like Stecher plus...   A little guy that made it work and all heart.   Really did well actually, wouldn't think he did enough for that paycheque though.    Brodin is for sure a good example MIN was a top 3 defensive team last year and did pretty good again.   I have zero issue with spending that type of money in the D if we could get similar results.    Schmidt/ Myers/ Rathbone/OJ or Spurgeon/Brodin... 

Spurgeon is still criminally underrated - he's a legit D1 and one of the best defenders in the game.

 

He's a big part of why Minnesota were so good defensively.  Brodin is excellent but Spurgeon just as much.  Spurgeon can go up against anyone - just tremendous stick work, skating and smarts.  

 

Boudreau was so skeptical that such a small player could play defence but changed his mind quickly.  This was Boudreau just the summer before he was extended:  “He plays 25 minutes a game. He doesn’t do it with any fanfare, but, boy, he protects every defenseman he plays with.”

 

 

[IBatch]

7 minutes ago, mll said:

Spurgeon is still criminally underrated - he's a legit D1 and one of the best defenders in the game.

 

He's a big part of why Minnesota were so good defensively.  Brodin is excellent but Spurgeon just as much.  Spurgeon can go up against anyone - just tremendous stick work, skating and smarts.  

 

Boudreau was so skeptical that such a small player could play defence but changed his mind quickly.  This was Boudreau just the summer before he was extended:  “He plays 25 minutes a game. He doesn’t do it with any fanfare, but, boy, he protects every defenseman he plays with.”

 

 

I liked Soucy when we played them.   Felt he was criminally underrated.   Played the body hard which also takes a toll.   I'd rather have Weber,  pay an extra  million and get AP, pay even less and get Petry then pay 7.570 for that cap hit,  Hamilton same,  Eklbad same.   Yes he's a good defender but that contract is massive.   No thanks for me at least 

[Tom Sestito]

11 hours ago, IBatch said:

These guys are all on the small side for D's ... PMD really more then anything.   

 

Ekblad, Muzzin, AP, Suter, Pesce, Chychrun i believe is more what the OP is looking for, guys that defend well, put up points and can pound the puck.   Maybe i'm wrong.   Nothing wrong with any of those guys, McAvoy at least is putting on some weight (he was tiny his rookie year, didn't look much different then QHs really).   

 

Suppose a deep dive into the leagues best D PKers would also help find out some gems.   Above post i made suggested maybe two-way defenseman, identifying those guys i'm not sure exactly what we are talking about, but the terms i've seen used are PMD (QHs), Two-Way, Number One, Top Pairing, Defensive Defenseman and Rover (PMD basically).   
 

Cychrun is yet another good example why you don't give up on your guys, OJ best comp was Vlasic when we drafted him - he's a two-way  D who plays a safe game, definitely noticed that with his brief sample size.    Still a rookie next year too.  

A lot of those guys you mentioned literally don’t put up points.

 

I don’t care about size when it comes to ability to defend. Fox plays against other teams best players and doesn’t get scored on. Same with Toews, same with McAvoy. 

 

Being small doesn’t negate your ability to defend lol.

 

 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, Tom Sestito said:

A lot of those guys you mentioned literally don’t put up points.

 

I don’t care about size when it comes to ability to defend. Fox plays against other teams best players and doesn’t get scored on. Same with Toews, same with McAvoy. 

 

Being small doesn’t negate your ability to defend lol.

 

 

Smaller (I mean lighter) players all have more challenges defending.  But if they are smart, and well coached, they can defend as well or better than bigger (heavier) guys.  It's about smarts, and willingness to learn, and toughness to compete.  I think the guys mentioned above all have those traits.  I also see the same in Hughes, and Rathbone.  (I miss Troy Stecher.  I thought he was really good.)

[IBatch]

1 hour ago, Tom Sestito said:

A lot of those guys you mentioned literally don’t put up points.

 

I don’t care about size when it comes to ability to defend. Fox plays against other teams best players and doesn’t get scored on. Same with Toews, same with McAvoy. 

 

Being small doesn’t negate your ability to defend lol.

 

 

Lol.  Wasn't what the OP was asking.  Was asking for what players put up points and are great on the other side of the puck, and have a good hard shot.  Not about outscoring the opposition.  It wasn't a debate about McAvoy, Fox or Toews value.   And don't know why you'd think Weber (from earlier), Suter, Ekblad, Muzzin (career not much different the  Ohlunds really), Pesce, Suter and Chychrun don't put up points.   Like saying Edler never did.  Or Salo. 

Edited June 11, 2021 by IBatch

[CaNuCkSLoUiE23]

Ryan Suter is your answer. 

[IBatch]

8 minutes ago, CaNuCkSLoUiE23 said:

Ryan Suter is your answer. 

Yes he was one of the guys i named.   

[D.B Cooper]

Shea Weber has been that guy for a long time. 
Now that he is older, his grumpiness has grown even more, which is fantastic. 
He can’t really skate anymore, but he is still solid in his own end, and still has a cannon of a shot.  

[wallstreetamigo]

18 hours ago, smithers joe said:

what we need is bieksa in his prime. i believe we got lots of scoring from our D last year. we had trouble stopping GA. we don't need high priced d-men (can't afford them), we need a steady stay at home type to make us harder to play against.

Bieksa wasnt really a stay at home type though. He loved to jump up and really hit his stride when paired with a guy who would be far more like what the OP is looking for, namely Dan Hamhuis. Bieksa was more high risk than many people seem to remember. More like Jovanovski than anyone else I can think of from the D line.

 

Another former Canuck who would fit the OP mold would be Sami Salo. Always rock solid defensively with any partner and could hammer the puck and provide some points.