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What Lessons Have The Habs Taught Us?

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4 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

2014-2017 were the retooling years. 18-19 was the start of the rebuild. 19-20 we turned out to be a pretty good team. Benning has been very cautious about the contracts hes giving out since we made the post season. As much as toffoli would be nice now, i think his extension would be a little crippling if the cap remains flat for the next couple years and we begin to compete as he begins to slow down. JB has avoided extending the type of guys he used to hand contracts out to while we were retooling. Stand pat, develop the young core and find the missing links later, dont try to force something that isnt their yet. Just like he tried to force a cup for the Sedins up til they retired. There has certainly been a change in his habits. Toffoli, Tanev, Markstrom all fit the bill of Bennings previous tendency to sign those guys at those ages and the seasons they had.

Hope your right - fingers crossed cause the off season is just about to start.

 

What is your take on the addition of the Sedins ?

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58 minutes ago, Bure2Win said:

I don't believe in luck, good or bad, just incompetence.

Yyyyyaa……. COVID was an incompetent decision by JB..and it was incompetent to take the Canucks from the end of the Sedin era to the Petey, Hughes, Demko, Boeser, Hoglander, Podkolzin era so quickly…. When other teams like EDM BUF COL TBL took 7-11 years to rebuild… way to go JB 

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2 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Hope your right - fingers crossed cause the off season is just about to start 

Regardless of how aggressive the offseason is, I like the future of this team and the division we will be playing in next season. With a fresh slate for the Canucks after the horrendous scheduling and devastating COVID outbreak this season, I have high hopes for the boys. We should be a playoff team when we have teams like ANA, SJS, LAK and the uncertainty of the Kraken. Theres also some smoke in CGY… and when theres smoke theirs fire. Rumours (not sure how credible) thats Tkapuke wants out, something to do with Tkachuk and the team not having his back. There was an instance where Engelland (i think) flipped a puck at him and there was an altercation, no one came to Tkachuks aid. Monahan and Gaudreau may be on their way out the door as well. So all in all, we have VGK, EDM, CGY and the Kraken to compete with as possible playoff teams. The California teams are considerably weaker and are in the process of rebuilding. LAK might be the only team in that area that might be a bit feisty

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30 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Hope your right - fingers crossed cause the off season is just about to start.

 

What is your take on the addition of the Sedins ?

Good time for them to step in, with the farm team being in town. They can work with the young guys who are developing there, they can maybe help scout other teams prospects as potential targets to try and acquire. They might have the eye to see what prospects are ready versus the ones who arent. Less holes in their games instead of just pure point production. I think it could be a great opportunity for our young prospects coming up to learn the way the Sedins think the game. Like a “this is what we would do in this scenario” kinda thing. Maybe shed light on the young guys that they have more options than they think. Could create more open minded players.

 

hopefully they stepped in at the right time and can get their names on a cup in the next few years :P

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1 hour ago, knucklehead91 said:

Regardless of how aggressive the offseason is, I like the future of this team and the division we will be playing in next season. With a fresh slate for the Canucks after the horrendous scheduling and devastating COVID outbreak this season, I have high hopes for the boys. We should be a playoff team when we have teams like ANA, SJS, LAK and the uncertainty of the Kraken. Theres also some smoke in CGY… and when theres smoke theirs fire. Rumours (not sure how credible) thats Tkapuke wants out, something to do with Tkachuk and the team not having his back. There was an instance where Engelland (i think) flipped a puck at him and there was an altercation, no one came to Tkachuks aid. Monahan and Gaudreau may be on their way out the door as well. So all in all, we have VGK, EDM, CGY and the Kraken to compete with as possible playoff teams. The California teams are considerably weaker and are in the process of rebuilding. LAK might be the only team in that area that might be a bit feisty

California teams are probably a year/two of bottoming out away from icing a young competitive team - imo.   SJS is not as far ahead as LA & Anaheim which has been rebuilding for a few years now; although, LA unlike Anaheim kept there big contracts but in a year or two (inline with the Canucks) most/all of there big contracts will be off the books - cap space galore for both.

 

Vegas & Calgary after an aggressive offseason, seems to be retooling or rebuilding.  As for Deadmonton they just need a goalie to build around (for starters) cause the team has enough talent to make the playoffs.  Looking into Hollands' tenure with Deadmonton: he seems to have a had Bergevin version of trading an unknown lottery ticket (Sergachev), were he traded John Marino to the Pens for a 6th round pick (hoping JB will not make the same mistake with OJ).

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49 minutes ago, Toyotasfan said:

Going back to the title of this thread , defence wins championships. The Baumgartner soft collapse defensive system will never win , it’s the equivalent of turtelling in a fight. 

Yup agree completelty.  But we lack the dmen to play the system we need to suceed.

 

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1 hour ago, ShawnAntoski said:

California teams are probably a year/two of bottoming out away from icing a young competitive team - imo.   SJS is not as far ahead as LA & Anaheim which has been rebuilding for a few years now; although, LA unlike Anaheim kept there big contracts but in a year or two (inline with the Canucks) most/all of there big contracts will be off the books.

 

Vegas & Calgary after an aggressive offseason, seems to be retooling or rebuilding.  As for Deadmonton they just need a goalie to build around cause Holland has alot of work to do - how that trade of John Marino to the Pens for a 6th round pick (probably his version of the Sergachev trade, of trading an unknown lottery ticket).

Deadmonton is in big trouble for awhile…. They need to steal a young goalie on an ELC who plays lights out to give their backend a hope in hell. Their D is trash, their second line and beyond is pretty rough. Thanks to that McDavid deal, they are gunna be fisted for awhile in this flat cap. RNH is up for new ink and who knows if they can afford to keep him. Losing him will be a pretty devastating blow to a team who relies on 2 guys. You could see how bad Edmonton’s depth was in the playoffs. Shut down McDavid and Draisaitl and theres nothing left to worry about. Edmonton played the living crap out or McDavid in that triple OT Barrie isnt going to sign for cheap again.

The Cali teams surely will start icing some talent, but they will take a few years to get experience and grow as a team. We are a few years ahead of them. I dont see us having issues being a playoff team for the next 4-5 years. The teams in our division that will really need to worry are CGY, VGK and EDM. 
To me Calgary has gone stale, their original core has dried up and gone stale, sorta how Torts felt about the Canucks when he came here. They have this stink to them that needs to go. Monahan and Gaudreau need to be moved out. 
Edmonton is going to bleed while the cap remains flat and even if there is a slight increase, McDavid and Draisaitl are too much money. Like what happens when the best player on the planet needs a new deal and another pay raise… how much higher does it go from 12.5mil for him? Then there is Drai who needs a suitable raise from his 8.5m in salary, which he needs a new deal the year before McDavid.
 

Edmonton and Toronto may have cursed themselves by winning the McDavid and Matthews sweepstakes. 1) they are generational talent that gets paid top dollar. 2) the players around them benefit greatly from their ability to either set up the play or finish the play. Now you see a guy like Big money Marner not earning his keep in the playoffs. He has never even won anything in his NHL career, same with Tavares… yet they make big boy money… jeez talk about bad cap management, that JT contract is going to sink TO. Matthews will need a new deal in a few years, Marner and Tavares are signed one year longer… Matthews might take a look around and be like “peace the f*** out to this dumpster fire”

Matthews signed his way right to UFA, he wasted no time in hitting free agency. I get a feeling he is walking outta town if they dont trade him first. I doubt he wants to stay in Canada, hes a big city kinda guy with all the fashion and that boujee kinda crap. Sure TO is a big city, but I feel like he wants to be in a city like New York over Toronto and thats a place I could see him signing, if he isnt going back home to ARZ

 

Vegas struggled to score in the post-season, they had a hard time with MIN and MON. they have been drafting pretty low and the majority of their key forwards are 28-30. The rise and fall of Vegas has begun. 

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24 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

Deadmonton is in big trouble for awhile…. They need to steal a young goalie on an ELC who plays lights out to give their backend a hope in hell. Their D is trash, their second line and beyond is pretty rough. Thanks to that McDavid deal, they are gunna be fisted for awhile in this flat cap. RNH is up for new ink and who knows if they can afford to keep him. Losing him will be a pretty devastating blow to a team who relies on 2 guys. You could see how bad Edmonton’s depth was in the playoffs. Shut down McDavid and Draisaitl and theres nothing left to worry about. Edmonton played the living crap out or McDavid in that triple OT Barrie isnt going to sign for cheap again.

The Cali teams surely will start icing some talent, but they will take a few years to get experience and grow as a team. We are a few years ahead of them. I dont see us having issues being a playoff team for the next 4-5 years. The teams in our division that will really need to worry are CGY, VGK and EDM. 
To me Calgary has gone stale, their original core has dried up and gone stale, sorta how Torts felt about the Canucks when he came here. They have this stink to them that needs to go. Monahan and Gaudreau need to be moved out. 
Edmonton is going to bleed while the cap remains flat and even if there is a slight increase, McDavid and Draisaitl are too much money. Like what happens when the best player on the planet needs a new deal and another pay raise… how much higher does it go from 12.5mil for him? Then there is Drai who needs a suitable raise from his 8.5m in salary, which he needs a new deal the year before McDavid.
 

Edmonton and Toronto may have cursed themselves by winning the McDavid and Matthews sweepstakes. 1) they are generational talent that gets paid top dollar. 2) the players around them benefit greatly from their ability to either set up the play or finish the play. Now you see a guy like Big money Marner not earning his keep in the playoffs. He has never even won anything in his NHL career, same with Tavares… yet they make big boy money… jeez talk about bad cap management, that JT contract is going to sink TO. Matthews will need a new deal in a few years, Marner and Tavares are signed one year longer… Matthews might take a look around and be like “peace the f*** out to this dumpster fire”

Matthews signed his way right to UFA, he wasted no time in hitting free agency. I get a feeling he is walking outta town if they dont trade him first. I doubt he wants to stay in Canada, hes a big city kinda guy with all the fashion and that boujee kinda crap. Sure TO is a big city, but I feel like he wants to be in a city like New York over Toronto and thats a place I could see him signing, if he isnt going back home to ARZ

 

Vegas struggled to score in the post-season, they had a hard time with MIN and MON. they have been drafting pretty low and the majority of their key forwards are 28-30. The rise and fall of Vegas has begun. 

Good take and mostly agree, the x factor  with Anaheim & LA (imo) will be there cap space and it will be just in time (two years at most) for when there young talents are just getting there feet wet.  Also, both teams have good GM’s in charge with Mclleland in LA.  
 

I wonder how fickle the (spoiled) Vegas fans will be but McPhee is a long time GM; although, experience can only take you so far cause not all situations are exactly the same.

 

Laffs, Flakes and Deadmonton are starting to stale (despite the young talents in there rosters) - imo; and it would be interesting to see if any of there stars will stay as they head into there prime.  
 

I hope the Canucks don’t have the same experience as Calgary with there version of an aggressive offseason.  Preferably, the tweaking in the staff and the addition of the twins should be there biggest moves and the roster tweaking can wait after a year with Shaw.  Hope they keep there picks for this years draft cause in a cap world that is the best way win to build cheap talented depth rather than overpaying in FA & trades.  If the Canucks sticks with a patient approach, we can all watch the Abby team compete while the big club learns how to win with the young core.   No more of these overpaid signings for mentoring reasons; and if it is necessary, play the future then hire ex NHL players as coaches for that reason or/and pursue ex first line players that can actually mentor our young core from experience to cheap & short term deals.


 

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1 hour ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Good take and mostly agree, the x factor  with Anaheim & LA (imo) will be there cap space and it will be just in time (two years at most) for when there young talents are just getting there feet wet.  Also, both teams have good GM’s in charge with Mclleland in LA.  
 

I wonder how fickle the (spoiled) Vegas fans will be but McPhee is a long time GM; although, experience can only take you so far cause not all situations are exactly the same.

 

Laffs, Flakes and Deadmonton are starting to stale (despite the young talents in there rosters) - imo; and it would be interesting to see if any of there stars will stay as they head into there prime.  
 

I hope the Canucks don’t have the same experience as Calgary with there version of an aggressive offseason.  Preferably, the tweaking in the staff and the addition of the twins should be there biggest moves and the roster tweaking can wait after a year with Shaw.  Hope they keep there picks for this years draft cause in a cap world that is the best way win to build cheap talented depth rather than overpaying in FA & trades.  If the Canucks sticks with a patient approach, we can all watch the Abby team compete while the big club learns how to win with the young core.   No more of these overpaid signings for mentoring reasons; and if it is necessary, play the future then hire ex NHL players as coaches for that reason or/and pursue ex first line players that can actually mentor our young core from experience to cheap & short term deals.


 

Totally agree with the LA and Anaheim x-factors being their pending cap space. Its usually a preferred destination for UFA’s. Great weather all year round, nice beaches, that Cali lifestyle… They definitely have a leg up on a lot of franchises when it comes to attracting the big fishes. But if Vancouver can get ahead of them opening the win-now window, Vancouver is a beautiful city to live in and will help attract UFAs.

 

Toronto and Edmonton need some sort of change, they need a dynamic approach to the game. Right now they are very 1 dimensional teams, their biggest issues is they dont leave much cap space for any improvements. They rely on McDavid/Draisaitl Matthews/Marner waaay too much. Fortunately for TO Nylander was a stud and Spezza stepped the f**k up. Unfortunately for them, Marner and Matthews played it safe. Toronto is in an even worse situation for cap. You cant move Tavares’ contract at his age and the term left. You can move Marner or Matthews for a ransom, Marner wont have nearly the same return as Matthews. But still would fetch a decent return. So if they move Marner, Matthews loses his set-up man. Which Im sure he can do just fine. If they move Matthews or he walks… there goes the teams goal scoring, lol even though both him and Marner disappeared in the playoffs. Marner never showed up to the playoffs other than to take his post-season annual puck over the glass penalty. Matthews was there for a game or 2.. Spezza and Nylander were their best players by a long shot.

 

Toronto should have gone balls deep at the TDL and went for Hall and tried to run and gun their way to a cup appearance.

 

Idk what happened in Calgary this season, but they were a team I was expecting to be a much bigger threat. However if you look at their advanced stats, they look like a team who was just unlucky. Had a hard time scoring for whatever reason. Monahan dropped off a cliff, Tkachuk and Gaudreau were meh.

 

If I was Toronto…. This offseason I would try and package up Marner and try to fetch Eichel. 
 

Matthews/Eichel/Tavares as a 1, 2, 3 punch down the middle would be scary AF.

 

I like the direction our team is heading and who knows… maybe COVID screwing us, will reward us heavily down the road. Perhaps that 9th OA will be an impact player during a cup run and may be that x-factor for us. Or the 9th OA fetches us the guy we need to solidify our back end.

 

I’d like to see us run with the young guys this season and assess the team at the TDL, wether we are playoff bound or not and maybe save the aggressive off-season for 2022. We didnt really get to see the Canucks on full display, so its hard to say what we really need the most. Either make some moves at the deadline or revamp in the offseason. But for now, I wanna see what this team is like with the same scheduling/season as the rest of the league. Injuries are always a part of the season, I know we can battle through them, we were winning without Petey, it wasnt until COVID that we really suffered. However from the day Petey went down to the end of the season Vancouver went .500

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55 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

Totally agree with the LA and Anaheim x-factors being their pending cap space. Its usually a preferred destination for UFA’s. Great weather all year round, nice beaches, that Cali lifestyle… They definitely have a leg up on a lot of franchises when it comes to attracting the big fishes. But if Vancouver can get ahead of them opening the win-now window, Vancouver is a beautiful city to live in and will help attract UFAs.

 

Toronto and Edmonton need some sort of change, they need a dynamic approach to the game. Right now they are very 1 dimensional teams, their biggest issues is they dont leave much cap space for any improvements. They rely on McDavid/Draisaitl Matthews/Marner waaay too much. Fortunately for TO Nylander was a stud and Spezza stepped the f**k up. Unfortunately for them, Marner and Matthews played it safe. Toronto is in an even worse situation for cap. You cant move Tavares’ contract at his age and the term left. You can move Marner or Matthews for a ransom, Marner wont have nearly the same return as Matthews. But still would fetch a decent return. So if they move Marner, Matthews loses his set-up man. Which Im sure he can do just fine. If they move Matthews or he walks… there goes the teams goal scoring, lol even though both him and Marner disappeared in the playoffs. Marner never showed up to the playoffs other than to take his post-season annual puck over the glass penalty. Matthews was there for a game or 2.. Spezza and Nylander were their best players by a long shot.

 

Toronto should have gone balls deep at the TDL and went for Hall and tried to run and gun their way to a cup appearance.

 

Idk what happened in Calgary this season, but they were a team I was expecting to be a much bigger threat. However if you look at their advanced stats, they look like a team who was just unlucky. Had a hard time scoring for whatever reason. Monahan dropped off a cliff, Tkachuk and Gaudreau were meh.

 

If I was Toronto…. This offseason I would try and package up Marner and try to fetch Eichel. 
 

Matthews/Eichel/Tavares as a 1, 2, 3 punch down the middle would be scary AF.

 

I like the direction our team is heading and who knows… maybe COVID screwing us, will reward us heavily down the road. Perhaps that 9th OA will be an impact player during a cup run and may be that x-factor for us. Or the 9th OA fetches us the guy we need to solidify our back end.

 

I’d like to see us run with the young guys this season and assess the team at the TDL, wether we are playoff bound or not and maybe save the aggressive off-season for 2022. We didnt really get to see the Canucks on full display, so its hard to say what we really need the most. Either make some moves at the deadline or revamp in the offseason. But for now, I wanna see what this team is like with the same scheduling/season as the rest of the league. Injuries are always a part of the season, I know we can battle through them, we were winning without Petey, it wasnt until COVID that we really suffered. However from the day Petey went down to the end of the season Vancouver went .500

Good points !

 Imo, long term the Canucks are better built to compete cause of Demko - a (youngish) goalie they can build around.  In a few years, JM, Price and Hellybuck will be well into there thirties with a (still) high cap hit; although, some Laffs fans are starting to hype Wall as there franchise goalie of the future.   The cap mismanagements by Dubas is the very opposite of JB - atleast, with the Laffs, a majority of there cap is going to core players, whereas, with JB, a good portion is going to (often injured) complementary type players.  Hopefully, JB can continue to evolve and will have a long term approach during this offseason.  One thing, that I like with Dubas is the signings of ex first line players (Thornton & Spezza) to cheap & short term deals - very similar to the Habs with Staal (traded for) & Perry.  Due to the cap, the most difficult job for a GM's is how to keep a cup contender roster intact. 

 

The Cali advantage is perhaps starting to disappear due to the tax situation in Cali (one of the states with the highest exodus in the US); but these millionaires & so on, have access to the best so it might not be a factor at the end of day (?).   The league should really do something about the tax difference between countries & states; unfortunately, for Vancouver it will not happen cause Vancouver is considered to be a rich team/market.

 

From the start it was an uphill battle and with hindsight, it would had been prudent to trade assets then play & showcase the future; very similar to what teams like the Av's would tend to do in a losing season.   Preferably, all the FA's walk; and for the nostalgic crowd they can sign Edler to play in Abby.   As a Canuck fan perspective - all the Canadian teams are good hands.

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12 hours ago, knucklehead91 said:

2018-19 rebuild began, 2019-20 team began competing, thats not mismanagement, who the hell saw that coming? 2nd year without the Sedins and we are in a game 7 with VGK in the semis??

 

Mismanagement is when you mishandle contracts while being in a competitive window to win.

That is not the case for the Beagle Roussel and Sutter contracts we were in at the tail end of the Sedins careers and at the start of a rebuild. LE did earn a 6m deal due to his previous years of play. Not only that but when you look at what happened to LE when he came to VAN, perhaps VAN killed his career? 2 years with injuries,  hanging onto the hopes of the Sedin's magically carrying the deadweight for another year and then the Sedin's retired and the rebuild began.... once again.... that was 2018-19 and thats when Roussel and Beagle were acquired and overpaid... Because its a rebuild and who cares if we overpay for veterans in a losing season anyhow. Its about bringing in leadership and stability in the lineup, to allow prospects to develop outside the NHL or in sheltered roles....

 

NHL Standard

    Scoring     Goals Assists Shots Ice Time                
Season Age Tm Lg GP G A PTS +/- PIM EV PP SH GW EV PP SH S S% TSA TOI ATOI FOW FOL FO% BLK HIT TK GV Awards
7 yrs   DAL NHL 501 150 207 357 31 114 107 36 7 20 157 46 4 1060 14.2 1687 9203 18:22 25 64 28.1 217 138 335 184  
5 yrs   VAN NHL 252 38 52 90 -25 48 31 6 1 3 43 7 2 404 9.4 622 3840 15:14 11 13 45.8 100 32 114 43  
3 yrs   BOS NHL 224 62 85 147 28 32 42 18 2 11 61 21 3 468 13.2 711 4102 18:19 16 17 48.5 70 63 124 68  
Career   15 yrs NHL 977 250 344 594 34 194 180 60 10 34 261 74 9 1932 12.9 3020 17146 17:33 52 94 35.6 387 233 573 295  
2006-07 21 DAL NHL 59 6 13 19 -3 18 4 2 0 0 10 3 0 78 7.7   778 13:11                
2007-08 22 DAL NHL 69 14 17 31 5 28 10 4 0 0 15 2 0 120 11.7 200 968 14:02 2 11 15.4 14 24 58 22  
2008-09 23 DAL NHL 82 36 27 63 14 14 28 7 1 4 22 5 0 178 20.2 282 1626 19:50 2 9 18.2 51 31 80 31 Byng-13,Selke-50
2009-10 24 DAL NHL 82 29 42 71 -4 26 21 6 2 4 35 6 1 214 13.6 352 1620 19:46 4 7 36.4 48 31 46 33  
2010-11 25 DAL NHL 79 27 46 73 10 8 16 10 1 6 29 15 2 179 15.1 285 1625 20:34 1 3 25.0 46 26 72 34 AS-7,Byng-3,Selke-37
2011-12 26 DAL NHL 82 26 45 71 18 12 19 5 2 3 37 7 1 187 13.9 301 1620 19:46 7 9 43.8 40 20 50 43 AS-5,Byng-4,Selke-23
2012-13 27 DAL NHL 48 12 17 29 -9 8 9 2 1 3 9 8 0 104 11.5 189 966 20:07 9 25 26.5 18 6 29 21 Byng-9
2013-14 28 BOS NHL 61 10 27 37 14 6 8 2 0 2 17 9 1 115 8.7 178 1008 16:32 0 0   13 12 31 17  
2014-15 29 BOS NHL 81 22 25 47 1 14 16 6 0 4 19 5 1 169 13.0 265 1497 18:29 4 8 33.3 23 29 45 24 Byng-19
2015-16 30 BOS NHL 82 30 33 63 13 12 18 10 2 5 25 7 1 184 16.3 268 1598 19:29 12 9 57.1 34 22 48 27 AS-11,Byng-3,Selke-35
2016-17 31 VAN NHL 65 11 13 24 -9 8 6 5 0 1 10 2 1 132 8.3 212 1214 18:41 0 1 0.0 26 11 37 16 Byng-49
2017-18 32 VAN NHL 50 10 13 23 0 4 9 0 1 0 9 3 1 101 9.9 148 813 16:16 6 8 42.9 30 7 25 9  
2018-19 33 VAN NHL 81 11 18 29 -11 22 10 1 0 2 16 2 0 107 10.3 170 1139 14:04 2 4 33.3 28 3 29 10  
2019-20 34 VAN NHL 49 6 7 13 -2 12 6 0 0 0 7 0 0 59 10.2 85 606 12:22 2 0 100.0 15 10 17 8  
2020-21 35 VAN NHL 7 0 1 1 -3 2 0 0 0 0 1 0 0 5 0.0 7 67 9:35 1 0 100.0 1 1 6 0  

 

NHL Possession Metrics

 
      Corsi (All) Fenwick (All) PDO (All) Zone Starts (All)
Season Age Team Lg GP TOI CF CA CF% CF% rel FF FA FF% FF% rel oiGF oiSH% oiGA oiSV% PDO oZS% dZS%
3 yrs   BOS NHL 224 4098.9 4416 3307 57.2 8.0 3312 2501 57.0 8.1 227 9.5 153 91.7 101.1 58.6 41.4
6 yrs   DAL NHL 442 8404.5 8301 7165 53.7 4.7 6284 5480 53.4 4.3 476 10.8 376 90.5 101.3 57.8 42.2
5 yrs   VAN NHL 252 3839.7 3385 3614 48.4 0.0 2517 2793 47.4 -1.1 149 8.0 183 91.0 99.1 44.3 55.7
Career     NHL 918 16343.1 16102 14086 53.3 4.5 12113 10774 52.9 4.1 852 9.8 712 90.9 100.7 54.8 45.2
2007-08 22 DAL NHL 69 968.0 885 593 59.9 7.2 684 473 59.1 7.9 50 10.0 34 90.0 100.0 60.0 40.0
2008-09 23 DAL NHL 82 1624.7 1540 1272 54.8 3.5 1193 980 54.9 3.2 90 10.8 78 88.7 99.5 52.5 47.5
2009-10 24 DAL NHL 82 1600.7 1696 1584 51.7 1.8 1289 1220 51.4 0.6 102 11.4 95 89.2 100.6 61.5 38.5
2010-11 25 DAL NHL 79 1625.0 1637 1423 53.5 5.8 1243 1084 53.4 5.3 94 11.2 57 92.7 103.9 63.2 36.8
2011-12 26 DAL NHL 82 1620.5 1559 1452 51.8 4.4 1163 1073 52.0 4.2 96 11.3 70 91.3 102.6 53.8 46.2
2012-13 27 DAL NHL 48 965.8 984 841 53.9 10.1 712 650 52.3 9.4 44 8.9 42 90.9 99.8 56.1 43.9
2013-14 28 BOS NHL 61 1008.2 1045 724 59.1 5.3 785 566 58.1 4.5 57 9.8 34 92.4 102.2 60.8 39.2
2014-15 29 BOS NHL 81 1494.8 1620 1199 57.5 7.9 1207 905 57.1 8.6 75 8.9 61 90.7 99.6 57.8 42.2
2015-16 30 BOS NHL 82 1595.9 1751 1384 55.9 9.0 1320 1030 56.2 9.0 95 9.8 58 92.1 101.9 58.1 41.9
2016-17 31 VAN NHL 65 1213.8 1112 1053 51.4 4.6 801 818 49.5 3.7 46 8.0 52 91.1 99.1 52.0 48.0
2017-18 32 VAN NHL 50 813.5 727 779 48.3 0.7 552 598 48.0 0.4 36 8.7 41 90.9 99.5 43.8 56.2
2018-19 33 VAN NHL 81 1139.2 987 1069 48.0 -0.5 754 830 47.6 -1.3 39 7.1 50 91.7 98.7 41.2 58.8
2019-20 34 VAN NHL 49 606.2 521 636 45.0 -4.8 381 484 44.0 -7.1 27 9.4 36 90.1 99.5 34.2 65.8
2020-21 35 VAN NHL 7 67.1 38 77 33.0 -19.5 29 63 31.5 -20.5 1 4.0 4 89.5 93.5 27.3 72.7

 

His corsi sucked in VAN but his TK and GV were quite impressive not just in VAN but throughout his career

LE had great possession numbers, put up points, retrieved pucks like a mad man and rarely turned the puck over.

His zone deployment changed when he came to VAN, he went from getting the offensive zone faceoffs to D-zone. 

His PDO dropped when he got to VAN (S%+sv%)

Its also worth noting LE suffered 2 big injuries in his first 2 seasons with the Canucks and that his line mates retired 2 seasons after his arrival

lol? he definite mishandled the contract.. because of all the crippling contracts he gave up we were unable to take advantage of EP Hughes ELC all the contracts he gave up like candy could have been used to take advantage of the small window last year and this year to field a competitive team on the ice.. imagine having competent players for the 18mil worth of dead contracts that provides nothing saddling the team not including the luongo recapture? we would actually been able to re-sign toffoli sign some competent top 4 defenseman and who knows maybe we could have been the habs this year as it was a super easy path to get to the conference final in this division we were in. but nah we have 18mil worth of useless plugs that would be coming off the books in a year or 2 when we *MIGHT* be competitive but prolly more than half of those are going to hughes ep boeser... if the plan was to continue rebuild for another couple years then why the hell did we trade for miller?????? he'll be 30+ in 2 years usually when people starts to decline.. we traded for him so that he'll likely be declining when we are competitive?? baffles me ppl think this was all going according to plan and they were planning to continue rebuilding for couple more years..and signing holtby to that big 4+mil x2 contract is part of the plan to rebuild? guy haven't even had a good save percentage in 3 years so we signed him to a massive overpaid contract just to expose him to seattle who more than likely won't take him? lol admit it he mishandled his contract literally every year he's been here.

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16 hours ago, PhillipBlunt said:

What happened to the analytics only weasels? Where are their formulas and hypotheses on speed, and that larger more physical players are a thing of the past? 

season 2 time GIF by American Gods

You do realize that the Habs are looked at very favourably in terms of 5v5 play and zone entry prevention metrics, right? 

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7 hours ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Good points !

 Imo, long term the Canucks are better built to compete cause of Demko - a (youngish) goalie they can build around.  In a few years, JM, Price and Hellybuck will be well into there thirties with a (still) high cap hit; although, some Laffs fans are starting to hype Wall as there franchise goalie of the future.   The cap mismanagements by Dubas is the very opposite of JB - atleast, with the Laffs, a majority of there cap is going to core players, whereas, with JB, a good portion is going to (often injured) complementary type players.  Hopefully, JB can continue to evolve and will have a long term approach during this offseason.  One thing, that I like with Dubas is the signings of ex first line players (Thornton & Spezza) to cheap & short term deals - very similar to the Habs with Staal (traded for) & Perry.  Due to the cap, the most difficult job for a GM's is how to keep a cup contender roster intact. 

 

The Cali advantage is perhaps starting to disappear due to the tax situation in Cali (one of the states with the highest exodus in the US); but these millionaires & so on, have access to the best so it might not be a factor at the end of day (?).   The league should really do something about the tax difference between countries & states; unfortunately, for Vancouver it will not happen cause Vancouver is considered to be a rich team/market.

 

From the start it was an uphill battle and with hindsight, it would had been prudent to trade assets then play & showcase the future; very similar to what teams like the Av's would tend to do in a losing season.   Preferably, all the FA's walk; and for the nostalgic crowd they can sign Edler to play in Abby.   As a Canuck fan perspective - all the Canadian teams are good hands.

The big issue with the Laff’s core, is 4 of them take up nearly 50% of the cap. Thats a very small core, that doesnt even include a dman or a goalie. The problem with Jumbo Joe is he isnt a 200ft player and doesnt provide much grit at all. Simmonds has never been much of a 200ft player either. Spezza has played very well in their bottom 6. Montreal signed gritty 200ft players that also drive the net. Thornton is a perimeter set up guy, Spezza drives the net off the rush, but he’s also kinda one of those guys who would rather move around the wall, back of the net and circle the high slot than be right in the goalies kitchen. Theyve been skill guys who have either scored off the rush or set up plays their entire career.. Spezza has been able to adapt to a different style later in his career, but still tends to work around the perimeter, Simmonds goes to the net, but hes pretty bad defensively. 
Staal and Perry on the other hand are 200ft players and drive the net, Perry has made a career of being a pain in the arse for goalies and Staal has been good at providing screens. I’d say Toronto needs more Spezzas, Thornton is not a bottom 6 guy. 
 

 

 

 

YES YES AND YES TO THE TAX DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MARKETS NEEDING A F***ING CHANGE OMG F*** THAT. 
TBL can sign a 12m player for 8-9m same with FLA VGK DAL because of the the no tax states they are in. This pisses me off so f***ing much. A buddy and I were talking and he suggested a really good idea that the NHL salary cap should be calculated on their take home value, not the total salary, to make it fair for all teams. Or  what I suggest is that the non-tax or lower tax states should all have their own salary caps and it should be pro-rated to be the same % to the rest of the market. Like TBL should have a 62-65m  cap hit

Kucherov is one of the best players in the league, makes 9.5m and only accounts for 11.7% of the cap. 
McDavid takes up 15.3% with a 12.5m cap hit. 
9.5mil is 15.3% of 62mil.

 

therefore if these tax free states had their own separate cap hit that was pro-rated to be on par with the rest of the league it would make it fair for all NHL teams. I really hate how this has not been addressed and not enough teams have b*tched and complained for equality.

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6 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

The big issue with the Laff’s core, is 4 of them take up nearly 50% of the cap. Thats a very small core, that doesnt even include a dman or a goalie. The problem with Jumbo Joe is he isnt a 200ft player and doesnt provide much grit at all. Simmonds has never been much of a 200ft player either. Spezza has played very well in their bottom 6. Montreal signed gritty 200ft players that also drive the net. Thornton is a perimeter set up guy, Spezza drives the net off the rush, but he’s also kinda one of those guys who would rather move around the wall, back of the net and circle the high slot than be right in the goalies kitchen. Theyve been skill guys who have either scored off the rush or set up plays their entire career.. Spezza has been able to adapt to a different style later in his career, but still tends to work around the perimeter, Simmonds goes to the net, but hes pretty bad defensively. 
Staal and Perry on the other hand are 200ft players and drive the net, Perry has made a career of being a pain in the arse for goalies and Staal has been good at providing screens. I’d say Toronto needs more Spezzas, Thornton is not a bottom 6 guy. 
 

 

 

 

YES YES AND YES TO THE TAX DIFFERENCE BETWEEN MARKETS NEEDING A F***ING CHANGE OMG F*** THAT. 
TBL can sign a 12m player for 8-9m same with FLA VGK DAL because of the the no tax states they are in. This pisses me off so f***ing much. A buddy and I were talking and he suggested a really good idea that the NHL salary cap should be calculated on their take home value, not the total salary, to make it fair for all teams. Or  what I suggest is that the non-tax or lower tax states should all have their own salary caps and it should be pro-rated to be the same % to the rest of the market. Like TBL should have a 62-65m  cap hit

Kucherov is one of the best players in the league, makes 9.5m and only accounts for 11.7% of the cap. 
McDavid takes up 15.3% with a 12.5m cap hit. 
9.5mil is 15.3% of 62mil.

 

therefore if these tax free states had their own separate cap hit that was pro-rated to be on par with the rest of the league it would make it fair for all NHL teams. I really hate how this has not been addressed and not enough teams have b*tched and complained for equality.

Our dollar is 20% less than the US green back.  Players are paid in US funds.  If the player lives here, he has 20% more purchase power.  Simply don’t overpay guys on their RFA contracts.  And if a guy will not sign here for the same dollar as a low tax state, then we don’t want him, because he’s not committed to being here.  That’s what the Twins were talking about in their recent interview.  We want guys who are committed to be here.  

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13 hours ago, Toyotasfan said:

Going back to the title of this thread , defence wins championships. The Baumgartner soft collapse defensive system will never win , it’s the equivalent of turtelling in a fight. 

Well hopefully one of the reasons Shaw was brought in was to mentor Baumer and provide some structure to the defence...has to be a win right?

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