[Trade] Canucks trade Jay Beagle, Loui Eriksson, Antoine Roussel, 2021 1st-round pick, 2022 2nd-round pick, 2023 7th-round pick to Coyotes for Oliver Ekman-Larsson, Conor Garland

[RUPERTKBD]

1 hour ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

Only time he's been able to recoup a 2nd was unloading stuff leftover from the Gillis regime  (think we even got a 2nd round pick compensation for Torts - heh, not worth the aggravation he put the team thru that one year) unless I'm mistaken.

Oh, I don't know.....watching Torts try and get past McGrattan and into the Flames locker room was worth the price of admission for me....

 

The biggest disappointment for me is that we didn't get to see him and Hartley go toe to toe....

[stawns]

1 hour ago, NewbieCanuckFan said:

Only time he's been able to recoup a 2nd was unloading stuff leftover from the Gillis regime  (think we even got a 2nd round pick compensation for Torts - heh, not worth the aggravation he put the team thru that one year) unless I'm mistaken.

There's a huge difference between a  rebuilding phase and a competitive phase.  He's, more or less, got his team in place that he thinks can compete for a a Cup.  And while he will tweak that lineup, as GM his attention will now turn back to preparing to rebuild after this core has had their shot.

[204CanucksFan]

1 hour ago, Fanuck said:

One question nobody has been able to answer is whether or not JB voided OEL's clauses when the transaction took place as GM's can do that in certain cases.

OEL's NMC is still in effect because the Canucks never had the option to void it. The only reason they had the option to void JT Miller's modified NMC was because he was traded to Van before the clause came in to effect. Since OEL's was already in effect when traded it remains as part of his contract.

[N4ZZY]

8 hours ago, iinatcc said:

I think this is why we should only evaluate trades after some time has passed. And when we re evaluate the Schmidt one it might still look bad.

 

In reverse the JT Miller trade didn't look good when we first heard about it but, since then, the trade is considered a win and people who didn't like it then changed their minds (myself included) 

 

Speaking of Miller, I believe this is the first concrete trade win Benning had and it only too about 5 years 

 

Personally I don't have strong opinions on this trade yet. I do question the motivation of acquiring OEL and future cap implications. That said Garland could also sway how this trade is precieved. I am hearing some Marchand comparisons so there is promise

I’ll be honest. When I first heard the trade. I wasn’t happy that we included the 9OA. With that being said. After a couple of hours and saw how the draft went down and how neither Johnson or any of the players management were rumored to have liked were there. I feel a little better about the trade. I still don’t like how Benning included yet another second round pick for a deeper draft next season. I find it really odd that for a guy who’s strength is drafting has given away draft capital ever since he’s been a GM of the Canucks. We would have a much deeper and better team if he actually kept most of his picks over the last 7-8 years. 

[stanleysteamersmyl]

I can't wait to see them in the Whale jersey - OEL, Garland, Dickerson, Podkolzin and the new kid, Sidney, who wanted to join a cup contender.

[mll]

Just now, 204CanucksFan said:

OEL's NMC is still in effect because the Canucks never had the option to void it. The only reason they had the option to void JT Miller's modified NMC was because he was traded to Van before the clause came in to effect. Since OEL's was already in effect when traded it remains as part of his contract.

All trade clauses even future ones now automatically travel with the player.   Was changed in the CBA approved last summer.

 

 

 

[aqua59]

17 hours ago, bishopshodan said:

Yoda should not swear. 

Then don't I like it

[A.A.A]

Watched OELs media call video, he genuinely seems happy and excited for fresh start in Vancouver.

 

I admittedly didn't like the trade at first, but have come around to it over the past couple days. If OEL can recover his game he can be a huge boost to our blue line. His contract also appears to be buyout friendly (?)  if things come to that in a few years.

 

[RUPERTKBD]

24 minutes ago, combover said:

This is hilarious.

from what I’m reading it sounds like the most avid supporters are saying basically if we can get rid of all Jim ufa signing from the past three/four seasons and a few of his trades we’ll be in good shape but still think he’s doing a good job. Lol

thats classic. 
And it’s the same people that defended these pick ups    in the first place 

Soooo.....are you saying then that any contract where the player doesn't perform at the level he was at when signed for the duration of the contract length is a mistake?

 

Seems to me that a ton of deals are made in the NHL every year, where the team realizes that they'll be paying the going rate for a diminished asset by the contracts end....it's the proverbial cost of doing business.

[Pears]

We’re expected to win next year now…?

[N4ZZY]

4 minutes ago, stawns said:

There's a huge difference between a  rebuilding phase and a competitive phase.  He's, more or less, got his team in place that he thinks can compete for a a Cup.  And while he will tweak that lineup, as GM his attention will now turn back to preparing to rebuild after this core has had their shot.

see the thing is. When do you know when the rebuilding phase is over. Is it when the GM has his new core and you start to build around that core and start competing for the postseason play year after year? Because it kind of feels like we are entering into that period of contending. Is this team with its current roster makeup a contender? I guess that’s my question and struggle. We have some good pieces. But I’m not sure if anyone would consider us a Cup contender. We are more like a team contending for the playoffs. Is this team built to go far into the postseason? I’m not sure about that either. 

[Rush17]

Would you sign oel 6 years at 7m as a Ufa D? Keep in mind jones, Makar, and miro contracts as RFA comps.

 

You also get to erase three bad contracts.

 

[24K PureCool]

1 minute ago, N4ZZY said:

see the thing is. When do you know when the rebuilding phase is over. Is it when the GM has his new core and you start to build around that core and start competing for the postseason play year after year? Because it kind of feels like we are entering into that period of contending. Is this team with its current roster makeup a contender? I guess that’s my question and struggle. We have some good pieces. But I’m not sure if anyone would consider us a Cup contender. We are more like a team contending for the playoffs. Is this team built to go far into the postseason? I’m not sure about that either. 

Small steps. No team goes from rebuild to contender in a season or two.

We are in transition and this deal if OEL is even a shade of his former self will be a big step in that direction.

 

Guenther ain't gonna help us until 4 or 5 years later. We can't tread water waiting for these kids to develop. 

[goblix]

20 minutes ago, appleboy said:

Jim needs Schmidt's 6 mil. They need add at least one defensive D man. Plus sign Garland and Dickinson.

 

Holtby buyout hits us with $500k this year but over a mil next year. Loui's cap recapture comes off next year though. 

I've been messing around with the cap... It's tough because we don't really know what value Hughes, Petterson, Dicksinson and Garland are requesting...

 

 

I'm mainly going on what the general media is saying on it.. I think with Abbotsford in our backyard this probably gives us flexibility to yoyo Rathbone up and down this year based on need so he can get a lot of ice time in the AHL.. Plus i may just buy an Abbotsford Rathbone jersey lol !

 

Anyways its definitely close and doesn't leave much flexibility but I think I like the way this roster looks, gives us the chance to see what Schmidt can do on a decent roster in a normal year and probably in the end drives his value up for better return anyways.

[appleboy]

1 minute ago, stawns said:

There's a huge difference between a  rebuilding phase and a competitive phase.  He's, more or less, got his team in place that he thinks can compete for a a Cup.  And while he will tweak that lineup, as GM his attention will now turn back to preparing to rebuild after this core has had their shot.

I think there is one big difference between this team and say the club that Gillis was managing. I think we have two cores. What I mean is we have two age groups that are going to have their run and the youngest one looks like the better of the two. (Too Me)

Bo , Miller and Boeser will be part of the next few years and then unless they resign they may be moved out. ( add Garland to that age group)

The younger group has a bigger window. Petey, Hughes , Rathbone , Hoglander and Podkolzin.  Demko may be here for the long hall. Goal tenders seem to stick around.

 

I really was looking at the second group as the one's who could bring us the cup and so wanted to see them keep added to our youth. I see the team's cup chances as being stronger in say five years. Hopefully they do better job at asset management over the next few years.  Guys like Miller , Bo , Boeser and Garland can't be allowed to walk if this club is to make consecutive runs. Hopefully Jim keeps a better handle on our cap so we don't need to flip out draft picks. ( lets also hope we hit a few late round gems to make up for the lack of picks)

[-DLC-]

20 minutes ago, appleboy said:

I think it is important to understand that this puts the club in a win now scenario. They now have a very short window before being back into a rebuilding mode. You can't trade away two first and seconds and thirds without depleting your system. Plus Miller and Horvat are UFA's in two seasons. ( which might be part of the rush)

You know what the owners have done before if the playoffs are even a tinny bit possible.  ( they refuse to trade players for assets at the trade deadline allowing them to walk for squat)

Of coarse Miller and Horvat might resign. 

What you state as "refuse to trade players for assets" isn't necessarily true.  They try things but there are always the people on the other side who get to determine whether or not they want to make these deals.

 

Sounds easy enough but isn't always so.

 

I don't mind a "win now" scenario because you can also let THAT window slide.  We have some players in the line up who are showing great things and so why not take a shot?  You never know how far that can take you unless you try?  You can't wait to slot in the perfect roster and collect picks until it's "just right" because you have to have trial runs to adequately assess things.  You learn on the fly as to where you're at.

 

I do agree that there isn't much there and picks are important moving forward.....but we're a little ahead of the curve in that our picks are sliding in earlier than some others do.  Are more NHL ready than other picks may be.  That depletes the "prospect" cupboard but for all the right reasons.  Some suggest it's "due to a lack of" when, really, it's something positive.

[4petesake]

1 minute ago, N4ZZY said:

see the thing is. When do you know when the rebuilding phase is over. Is it when the GM has his new core and you start to build around that core and start competing for the postseason play year after year? Because it kind of feels like we are entering into that period of contending. Is this team with its current roster makeup a contender? I guess that’s my question and struggle. We have some good pieces. But I’m not sure if anyone would consider us a Cup contender. We are more like a team contending for the playoffs. Is this team built to go far into the postseason? I’m not sure about that either. 

I think the rebuild is over when your core is stocked and you have good prospects waiting in the pipeline. After that comes the tweaking to be a true cup contender. We are good with our core, maybe too much money allocated to the defence that we have now. We need to swap out one for another top 4 RD. I’d still like to see a bit more size and toughness so if that’s combined with the RD that’d be a win. Since we’ve graduated so many of our top prospects we’re a little thin in the pipeline so back to keeping our picks next year I trust. Next year comes the fine tuning.

[-DLC-]

8 minutes ago, appleboy said:

I think there is one big difference between this team and say the club that Gillis was managing. I think we have two cores. What I mean is we have two age groups that are going to have their run and the youngest one looks like the better of the two. (Too Me)

Bo , Miller and Boeser will be part of the next few years and then unless they resign they may be moved out. ( add Garland to that age group)

The younger group has a bigger window. Petey, Hughes , Rathbone , Hoglander and Podkolzin.  Demko may be here for the long hall. Goal tenders seem to stick around.

 

I really was looking at the second group as the one's who could bring us the cup and so wanted to see them keep added to our youth. I see the team's cup chances as being stronger in say five years. Hopefully they do better job at asset management over the next few years.  Guys like Miller , Bo , Boeser and Garland can't be allowed to walk if this club is to make consecutive runs. Hopefully Jim keeps a better handle on our cap so we don't need to flip out draft picks. ( lets also hope we hit a few late round gems to make up for the lack of picks)

I honestly feel that you're overthinking things and looking too far down the road.  

 

If you have a team that's full of young hopefuls you start focusing there, not down the road if/when they're gone.  If in 5 years things are bleak and players move on, we will have had 5 years to replenish because it'll likely signify that we were near the bottom rather than the top.  Guys won't want to leave if we're "close".

 

But that's how it works - if your team is given a shot "now" and doesn't make it, they either gain invaluable experience and a taste that makes them hungry to get back there or...they drop out the bottom and you get picks.

People panic about the half empty cup but there's one that's half full that we're eager to see play out.  Then we'll decide "where we're at" (in 5 years).

 

 

[86Viking]

13 minutes ago, Rush17 said:

Would you sign oel 6 years at 7m as a Ufa D? Keep in mind jones, Makar, and miro contracts as RFA comps.

 

You also get to erase three bad contracts.

 

erase 1 year of bad contracts to take on OEL for 6 more years and HAVE that NMC follow him, has to be a bit of a scare. Hoping this works out well for us, if we aren't a winning team by Christmas or early new year I could easily see the GM get canned tho. Owners had to have signed off on this deal tho and they seem to love JB so who knows...

[stawns]

18 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

see the thing is. When do you know when the rebuilding phase is over. Is it when the GM has his new core and you start to build around that core and start competing for the postseason play year after year? Because it kind of feels like we are entering into that period of contending. Is this team with its current roster makeup a contender? I guess that’s my question and struggle. We have some good pieces. But I’m not sure if anyone would consider us a Cup contender. We are more like a team contending for the playoffs. Is this team built to go far into the postseason? I’m not sure about that either. 

Friday night