{Discussion} Canucks Trades the last 3 years and next year

[IBatch]

5 hours ago, Iron Fist said:

If we're not waiting then let's not wait for it either. Sign a big fish free agency in landeskog and let's go for it the next 5 years. Trade Schmidt and holtbt for 2 defenders 

Landeskog is a massive fish with too much of a tag, if we are going Messier i'd much rather go with Hamilton.   Would solve our R side issue for the entirety of EPs offer sheet which is coming.    That's why JB did this.   Was a master stroke really.    Or maybe not, but now everyone knows he can match.

 

JV will get bought out.    Schmidt and or Holtby possibly moved.    Picks will come back.   Heck we could even flip Garland or Dickinson.  

 

Finally JB is dealing from a position of strength.   Fans are restless think 2 playoff in 7 years doesn't cut it anymore, and you can bet owners want money back after floating the team the past 18 months.   We can now compete in our own division.   All those one goal plus maybe an empty netter - should end up with a lot more points.   We can now run three proper scoring lines.   Or load up two and have a decent bottom six that costs 12 million for the 4th line.   Mitigating that wasted cap space over 6-7 years was genuis.    Man the cost to dump cap these days - and he managed it for peanuts on the dollar.   The most significant trade since Bertuzzi really. 

 

 

[IBatch]

5 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

The OEL trade is like relying on Moneymart just to make ends meet.  Yeah you got a paycheck but now you owe even more to interest(draft picks, cap space).  If he could've got a 2nd instead of adding one that could be used to move Holtby.  Again, don't like these moves but at the end of the day Ownership had to approve it so it's on them if this club continues to spin its wheels in the mud.  

Except we were the ones getting "three buck on a hun" ...

 

If ARI wasn't so desperate these moves 12 millions before flat cap cost two unprotected firsts.   OEL in this market would get close to what he's costing now with retention as a UFA.   And Garland is worth a first too.    He differed his 12 over seven years AND replaced Edler.     Also we don't know this detail yet, but because OEL waived did JB honour those clauses?   In other words did he keep them.... has the option to say no.   Which means we can trade OEL if we want.   With another 1.5 wonder what he'd get back.    Master stroke.   At half the market value. 

[grandmaster]

6 hours ago, Iron Fist said:

I like the The Schmidt/Toffoli/Miller/Highmore/Dickinson/OEL/Garland deals.  But the cost for all this was quite substantial. NO 1st or 2nd in 2020. NO 1st/3rd/4th in 2021. NO 2nd/3rd in 2022. Madden/Gaudette/Lind OUT

 

I wanna make it clear that consider us winners on all these transactions.

 

But like wtf was the point of doing all this. Why now?,  we're still a few years away from being legit contenders.  With Holtby being traded and Dipietro may be being back next year along with Pod making NHL. We only have Jett Woo, Danila Klimovich and next years 1st left in the pipeline for the foreseeable future, 1 or 2 of which might be gone at the deadline next year.

 

I just don't get it. Great trades tho

Madden/Gaudette/Lind were never gonna be NHL’ers. Also, don’t always bank on picks turning into something. 

You are also wrong that they are “a few years from being legit contenders”. This core has been together for a bit now. It was time to compliment them and see how far they can go. 
 

The new add on of a top 4 defenceman, top 6 forward, top 9 tenacious checker makes them contenders. It is all contingent on how they play as a team. We also have a lot of less dead weight anchoring them down now. 

 

[spook007]

6 hours ago, Devron44 said:

Our entire core has been drafted and developed with some of that on going of course. But at what point do we have to start winning here?
 

At the end of the season I wanted to be patient for one more year but then JB pulls this move off. I’m quite impressed. Don’t sleep on Garland either. Bo, Petey, Miller etc want to win. 
 

We do have to restock the cupboards to a certain degree but we already have the core, we should be able to reload on the fly now and there’s still youth coming. Podz, Rathbone. Some sleepers in Kunz, Lockwood etc. The type of guys we will need on ETC. 
 

It’s go time 

This...

Exactly how I feel about this as well... 

I was ready to wait another year, but didn't think Benning could pull something like this off... 

Its mostly not possible to keep your picks, while improving the team... Can be done via FA, but we also know it costs to do so, and in this cap world that matters...

 

Benning made his move, lets start winning games now... 

[Jester13]

4 hours ago, Dumb Nuck said:

Making the playoffs and being a playoff team are whole different animals, we are nowhere here being a playoff team.

I'll bet you ＄100 that the Nucks make the playoffs this year. 

[IBatch]

2 hours ago, grandmaster said:

Madden/Gaudette/Lind were never gonna be NHL’ers. Also, don’t always bank on picks turning into something. 

You are also wrong that they are “a few years from being legit contenders”. This core has been together for a bit now. It was time to compliment them and see how far they can go. 
 

The new add on of a top 4 defenceman, top 6 forward, top 9 tenacious checker makes them contenders. It is all contingent on how they play as a team. We also have a lot of less dead weight anchoring them down now. 

 

Yes.  Not to get overexcited and say stuff i might regret - but this trade is starting to feel a lot like the Luongo's.   Back then i knew right away in my bones we just made a massive out of the park, totally out of the stadium home run.   And we're going to be an amazing team for years.   How young was Luongo again!  Bad bad team in Florida and he was just killing it.   It's the only trade i've ever seen where i absolutely was certain this team was going places.   This one has some shades of that but it's anyone's guess what happens next.   But next is now possible too. 

 

Its a little serendipity for me right now.  Spend a lot of time discussing the Canucks future with my brother who's better at this then me.   He's part of the reason i love the Canucks so much.   And respect any insight he offers.   Said for awhile JB needs to make a big trade as teams simply can't rely on BPA.   I know this too having witnessed the Butcher trade all those years ago (and i loved me some Butcher!) trades that hurt a little usually are the best ones.   Linden tree is done of course that's a massive one.   Still hate it.   But it worked.  Bertuzzi lol man did we fleece them.    The best part about this trade  - is what comes next.   And even if what comes next is nothing for now it's ok. 

 

And whatever does of course will be connected.   I'm 100% fine if we just sign now.   Rome isn't made in a day.   We have next years first.   Luongo in the bank. and Flexibility again.    Yes as of right now, JB has the assets to start wrapping this all up.   Will we be mediocre, good or great or still a mess - it will be linked to this trade an i for one am glad it was made.    I think good is more then possible and great is finally opening up too.  

[Bertuzzipunch]

Not a playoff team? Tell me one other team in our div that has the forward depth that we do on the top 9 now, its even better than vegas. Were already way better defensively with dicky and podz who will help out the d better this year. I wouldnt be shocked one bit if we win the division 

[Tre Mac]

4 hours ago, IBatch said:

Except we were the ones getting "three buck on a hun" ...

 

If ARI wasn't so desperate these moves 12 millions before flat cap cost two unprotected firsts.   OEL in this market would get close to what he's costing now with retention as a UFA.   And Garland is worth a first too.    He differed his 12 over seven years AND replaced Edler.     Also we don't know this detail yet, but because OEL waived did JB honour those clauses?   In other words did he keep them.... has the option to say no.   Which means we can trade OEL if we want.   With another 1.5 wonder what he'd get back.    Master stroke.   At half the market value. 

You missed the point entirely.  The Nucks were the ones who were desperate and took on a ton of cap and risk just so JB can keep is job, he knows he's gone if they miss the playoffs again. That what payday loans are for, people that are desperate for money they get it sooner at a cost of increase interest.  JB acquires Schmidt and Holtby literally last offseason and he is desperate to move that cap, so desperate in fact he has to get their agents to find deals.  Like someone that is horrible with money and has to hit up money mart every week just to make ends meat - That's Benning with this cap.  It was a poor deal, like taking out a second mortgage just to pay off the interest of the first.  He didn't need to add a second, if anything Arizona should added one of their many seconds but they didn't, that's what makes this a bad trade.  Master stroke?  I just don't get this board sometimes.  Like what are you guys seeing here?  

 

I

[ShawnAntoski]

1 hour ago, Bertuzzipunch said:

Not a playoff team? Tell me one other team in our div that has the forward depth that we do on the top 9 now, its even better than vegas. Were already way better defensively with dicky and podz who will help out the d better this year. I wouldnt be shocked one bit if we win the division 

Good take.  Pessure is now on Green to put it together but it seems JB is still not done; imo, alot of things have to go right but on paper the team is better.

 

Looking forward: to puck drop and how all these new pieces will win together.

Edited July 25, 2021 by ShawnAntoski

[Bertuzzipunch]

14 minutes ago, ShawnAntoski said:

Good take.  Pessure is now on Green to put it together but it seems JB is still not done; imo, alot of things have to go right but on paper the team is better.

 

Looking forward to puck drop and how all these new pieces will win together.

Opening night cant come fast enough

[RU SERIOUS]

14 hours ago, Iron Fist said:

I like the The Schmidt/Toffoli/Miller/Highmore/Dickinson/OEL/Garland deals.  But the cost for all this was quite substantial. NO 1st or 2nd in 2020. NO 1st/3rd/4th in 2021. NO 2nd/3rd in 2022. Madden/Gaudette/Lind OUT

 

I wanna make it clear that consider us winners on all these transactions.

 

But like wtf was the point of doing all this. Why now?,  we're still a few years away from being legit contenders.  With Holtby being traded and Dipietro may be being back next year along with Pod making NHL. We only have Jett Woo, Danila Klimovich and next years 1st left in the pipeline for the foreseeable future, 1 or 2 of which might be gone at the deadline next year.

 

I just don't get it. Great trades tho

I get it.......It's called saving your ^$$ and what all GM's do when they have failed after seven years at the helm with the same results year after year after year and are on thin ice and about to be fired.   They empty the pantry of tomorrow to save their skin today.    

 

Pretty Obvious to anyone who's been watching this game for many years.!  This is Uncle Jim's last act of desperation.   If it fails and we have an encore of this years results - he's toast next year and the next GM will unfortunately have to restart the rebuild all over again for another several years because you are correct in your observation - that our prospect pool is severly depleated.

 

............and BTW, I am elated to see all the deadwood (Roussel, Beagle, Lucky Loui, Special Ed, Butter-Sutter and Jake the Ripper) turfed out of this city.    Could not have wished for anything better and hopeful that with the removal of all that negative energy, laziness and ineptness makes a difference to the young core and motivates them.

 

Fingers Crossed!

 

 

 

[IBatch]

6 hours ago, Tre Mac said:

You missed the point entirely.  The Nucks were the ones who were desperate and took on a ton of cap and risk just so JB can keep is job, he knows he's gone if they miss the playoffs again. That what payday loans are for, people that are desperate for money they get it sooner at a cost of increase interest.  JB acquires Schmidt and Holtby literally last offseason and he is desperate to move that cap, so desperate in fact he has to get their agents to find deals.  Like someone that is horrible with money and has to hit up money mart every week just to make ends meat - That's Benning with this cap.  It was a poor deal, like taking out a second mortgage just to pay off the interest of the first.  He didn't need to add a second, if anything Arizona should added one of their many seconds but they didn't, that's what makes this a bad trade.  Master stroke?  I just don't get this board sometimes.  Like what are you guys seeing here?  

 

I

That's a grouchy take but sure! 

[RWMc1]

4 hours ago, RU SERIOUS said:

I get it.......It's called saving your ^$$ and what all GM's do when they have failed after seven years at the helm with the same results year after year after year and are on thin ice and about to be fired.   They empty the pantry of tomorrow to save their skin today.    

 

Pretty Obvious to anyone who's been watching this game for many years.!  This is Uncle Jim's last act of desperation.   If it fails and we have an encore of this years results - he's toast next year and the next GM will unfortunately have to restart the rebuild all over again for another several years because you are correct in your observation - that our prospect pool is severly depleated.

 

............and BTW, I am elated to see all the deadwood (Roussel, Beagle, Lucky Loui, Special Ed, Butter-Sutter and Jake the Ripper) turfed out of this city.    Could not have wished for anything better and hopeful that with the removal of all that negative energy, laziness and ineptness makes a difference to the young core and motivates them.

 

Fingers Crossed!

 

 

 

The negative energy didn't come from the players, it came from the media and "fans" who constantly whined about them.

 

So which players will they watch with a microscope hoping to find mistakes to complain about now?

[RWMc1]

7 minutes ago, IBatch said:

That's a grouchy take but sure! 

He's a sukurass and lice butt kisser.

[Timråfan]

Gillismode isin place so let’s go for theCup instead of drafting… 

[KyGuy123]

Time to start going all in. We have cleared cap and going forward that was our biggest obstacle. Trade Schmidt and Holtby for picks even if you have to add one to get better ones. Aquire depth through one year cheap contracts and see what sticks, if nothing move on at the deadline for picks. 
I think from here on out we are starting to build tradable assets where we can actually acquire picks in trades and Benning will start doing so.
He owes it to his scouting staff and being a former scout probably feels guilty about the lack of quality picks. I’m betting Schmidt and Holtby are still here due to picks being asked in return without retention and are holding out due to supply and demand. 
 

[kanucks25]

Few draft picks and few prospects left, all before accomplishing anything.

 

So we have no choice but to compete now, that's what Benning has initiated with the latest trade.

 

It's make or break time. If this core doesn't have it, we're in for a lot more years of pain.

 

This isn't "the" year, as the core is still relatively young and could have a lot of good years together, but I think people are overestimating how much cap space we'll have going forward. The limit isn't supposed to increase for at least a few more seasons, and for every Luongo recapture or Holtby contract coming off the books, a Horvat or Boeser or Hoglander is in line for a raise.

 

What we desperately need is a mid or late draft pick or two to become impact players. Someone like Jett Woo coming out of nowhere and establishing himself as a top-4 RD while still on his ELC or cheap bridge contract. We simply don't have the roster, assets, cap space to be a legit contender without something like this happening.

 

We need some luck, I think we can all agree that we're due.

Edited July 26, 2021 by kanucks25

[DSVII]

On 7/24/2021 at 9:45 PM, Jester13 said:

We're a playoff team this upcoming year. Our window is now open. We can restock over the next four years. 

This makes the current crop of contracts much more important. Because if JB doesn't structure the team into something that is sustainable over a few years and not one and done playoff team that implodes cap wise like in 2020, we'll be back to trading draft picks for immediate help to address the holes left by players leaving (Toff/Tanev -> Garland/Dickinson/OEL).

 

I do credit JB with perhaps the most creative trade of his tenure, the more I look at it, very high risk and high reward. At least it won't be boring haha.

 

And from the inklings from Friedman, JB won't have four years to restock the cupboards if he fails to make playoffs next year. 

Edited July 27, 2021 by DSVII

[IBatch]

On 7/26/2021 at 5:53 PM, KyGuy123 said:

Time to start going all in. We have cleared cap and going forward that was our biggest obstacle. Trade Schmidt and Holtby for picks even if you have to add one to get better ones. Aquire depth through one year cheap contracts and see what sticks, if nothing move on at the deadline for picks. 
I think from here on out we are starting to build tradable assets where we can actually acquire picks in trades and Benning will start doing so.
He owes it to his scouting staff and being a former scout probably feels guilty about the lack of quality picks. I’m betting Schmidt and Holtby are still here due to picks being asked in return without retention and are holding out due to supply and demand. 
 

Plus one for predicting the first part (thanks for your service Schmidt and Holtby!)...going all in though makes me concerned we just start a cycle of mediocrity, but also get that EP and QHs  and Podz get two kicks at the can, one with this core and one with parts of the next one.   As long as the cap saved is used wisely, i don't mind whatever JB does next.   Need RHDs...that's a surety.   Hamilton....there is a way we could actually afford him now but i'm not sure what that would cost - likely 9-9.5 now given the Jones deal.    He's three years younger then AP.    And matches up well enough with our older core members.   

 

If not then save some cap for the trade deadline/next year, Hamonic and maybe Schenn.   And keep looking.   If we spend to the cap then do it on one year contracts with what's left over only.