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Does anyone worry about the Canucks forwards not having enough size and toughness?

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12 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Tucker Poolman

Vancouver Canucks / NHL - 21/22

Height

6'4" / 193 cm

Weight

216 lbs / 98 kg

 

Tucker Poolman - Elite Prospects

 

Vasili Podkolzin

a.k.a. "Vasily Podkolzin"

Vancouver Canucks / NHL - 21/22

Height

6'4" / 192 cm

Weight

203 lbs / 92 kg

 

Vasili Podkolzin - Elite Prospects

 

:frantic:

203 isn't scary or intimidating though....216 is getting there!

 

Poolman doesn't take penalties does he?

 

I want a snarly sob that keeps guys honest.

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Not really concern cause the team identity should with the new faces (in the roster & staff); and it should be about team tougheness: biting back hard at the moment of the incidence regardless, of the league/game managers.

 

Imo, when it come to toughness it is about sending the right message(s).

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On 7/31/2021 at 9:45 AM, NUCKER67 said:

I would've preferred they sign Khaira to C the 4th line, but they decided to re-sign old faithful. 

To be fair Sutter is far more skilled than Khaira

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6 hours ago, FlyLow_ said:

This is how I feel. I do think it's going to be an issue in the playoffs, but right now I'm more worried about the penalty kill. Sutter, Dickenson and Motte are our only good penalty killers. We still need another guy that is good on the penalty kill. We have guys like Bo, Miller and Pearson that can technically do it, but they aren't good at it and it's better for us if we can keep Bo and Miller off of the PK.

 

If we can find a guy that's big/tough and also good on the PK, we can kill two stones with one bird. I know he's already signed, but we need a Trevor Lewis type for our last open spot.

Calgary Flames:  Lewis, Coleman, Richie, Tkapuke, Zadorov and MacKay.  Sutter is  re-building the LA Kings.  Oh, I forgot Lucic.

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We are certainly nowhere near as heavy as some of the teams, especially the Cup winning teams, but I think this is a work in progress. Ideally you'd have your top-6 full of skilled but also big, physical guys. That just comes down to drafting at the end of the day. If you get a Kopitar or Ryan O'Reilly consider yourself lucky. 

 

In our top-6 we've got some skinny skilled guys, sure, but let's not forget Brock is getting pretty big, Miller isn't small at 6'1" 218lbs and Bo is a big body as well. Yes, Garland and Hoglander are small, but Podkolzin is on his way to our top-6 soon...

 

Our bottom-6 need to be heavier, that's for sure. Dickinson, Motte and Pearson are all average sized (although they play bigger than they really are). Sutter is lanky but not heavy, MacEwan (if he's in the lineup) will hopefully bring some size but the other guys like Highmore are obviously pretty small. Bailey has a nice frame and at 214lbs could even then pack some more weight on, but he and MacEwan play a heavier AHL game.

 

I really wanted JB to go out and sign Ritchie, he was had in the end for 2.5M for a 15-20 goal scorer last season (on pace for >20 goals albeit with Boston), and obviously plays a really solid physical game. We don't really have a "hitter" or enforcer anymore.

 

On defence as well we have pretty average-sized players, Myers and OEL are tall but don't use their size, Poolman and Hamonic are moderately physical and Juolevi uses his body well from what we've seen, but no big crushers or hitters. Again, Zadorov would have been a nice pickup but JB has clearly opted for a different direction, because these guys were out there to be had. I think JB has gone for more "defensive skill" rather than size and grit this off-season, let's see how it pays off, but it's no secret that to go deep in the playoffs you need a heavier team.

 

That or the players we have just need to play a heavier style of game...

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8 hours ago, Bo Dega said:

Your hatred of "Swedes" are getting tiresome, blame your stupid Canadian GMs for picking the skilled ones that actually can score over the knuckledragging northamerican plugs you seem to prefer. Why don`t they draft more Ulf Samuelsson`s you think?, there are plenty of thoose in Sweden too, It`s because there is no shortage of those closer by. You would probably hate on Forsberg too if he was a canuck...because he is Swedish.

Grow up.

 

Well it's certainly not a hatred of Swedes, it's just the reality that few swedes have any "push-back" in them. I'm not sure if it's genetic or a cultural "Euro" trait where they've been over domesticated but I've watched nearly every one of our prominent Swedes on our team get their dinner served to them on numerous embarrassing occassions. From Naslund getting his lights knocked out and letting Bertuzzi take care of things, to the Sedins getting tortured and punched during the entire Bruins Final series in 2011 and doing nothing to EP40 getting picked up and slammed to the ice to big Alex Eldler getting the snot punched out of him this year and cowing down....just to name few of very many examples.

 

They are/were all exceptional players and I'll never dispute that - BUT - the reality in the NHL is; that when push comes to shove, in a fight for the Stanley cup, a team needs size and grit to push thru to win the cup (not just skill) and the Canucks are seriously lacking that.  In fact of the four finalist teams this year they were ranked No.1, 2, 3 and 8 in terms of physical size and each team had some notable feisty players on their rosters - that we lack and so while there is place on the team for Finesse style Swedish players who are fun to watch in the regular season, we still need some players with some real fire in their belly too that will phsically sacrafice everything to win the Stanley Cup because it's more important than winning the Euro-cup or Olympics.

 

Until this is addressed, we stand zero chance of ever punching our ticket to a Stanley cup.

Sorry to be so honest & burst your baloon.................

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2 hours ago, ChuckNORRIS4Cup said:

Would people be interested in a trade for Wilson? 

The combo of him as a Canuck would mean a near life suspension the next chance the NHL would get.

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8 hours ago, RU SERIOUS said:

Well it's certainly not a hatred of Swedes, it's just the reality that few swedes have any "push-back" in them. I'm not sure if it's genetic or a cultural "Euro" trait where they've been over domesticated but I've watched nearly every one of our prominent Swedes on our team get their dinner served to them on numerous embarrassing occassions. From Naslund getting his lights knocked out and letting Bertuzzi take care of things, to the Sedins getting tortured and punched during the entire Bruins Final series in 2011 and doing nothing to EP40 getting picked up and slammed to the ice to big Alex Eldler getting the snot punched out of him this year and cowing down....just to name few of very many examples.

 

They are/were all exceptional players and I'll never dispute that - BUT - the reality in the NHL is; that when push comes to shove, in a fight for the Stanley cup, a team needs size and grit to push thru to win the cup (not just skill) and the Canucks are seriously lacking that.  In fact of the four finalist teams this year they were ranked No.1, 2, 3 and 8 in terms of physical size and each team had some notable feisty players on their rosters - that we lack and so while there is place on the team for Finesse style Swedish players who are fun to watch in the regular season, we still need some players with some real fire in their belly too that will phsically sacrafice everything to win the Stanley Cup because it's more important than winning the Euro-cup or Olympics.

 

Until this is addressed, we stand zero chance of ever punching our ticket to a Stanley cup.

Sorry to be so honest & burst your baloon.................

There’s some truth here. It takes all types to win the Cup. I must say Petey has certainly shown more pushback than the Sedins. I could even see him getting in a fight or two at some point.

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On 7/31/2021 at 9:39 AM, Jimmy McGill said:

Not that much. Pearson, MacEwan, Bo, Dickie, Brock, Podkolzin are all over 200 lbs. Hoglander and Garland are 'lil but they aren't afraid to play bigger than they are. Dickinson is also supposed to be a hard player to deal with. 

 

Our d group has some OK size to it now as well.

 

I would have liked to add Ritchie for something like 1.25-1.5 x 1 year but not what TO gave him. Having said that, it would be nice to add a bit more size to the 4th line somehow. 

 

Pearson: Not a grit guy.

MacE: Yes!

Bo: No.

Brock: Hes a lover not a fighter.

Pod: Lets see if he can take his KHL game into the NHL first.

Hoglander: No.

Garland: Maybe.

 

Were soft for sure. Only way we win a series against a bigger team with more clout is to hope 

that they are too slow. Other than that we have no one that scares anybody on our team. 

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5 hours ago, Slegr said:

There’s some truth here. It takes all types to win the Cup. I must say Petey has certainly shown more pushback than the Sedins. I could even see him getting in a fight or two at some point.

I can't wait to see that !    If petey ever drops his gloves, it will be to wipe his behind because other than a few shoves, I don't think he has a punch in his soul.   But I did enjoy your humour....LOL !!!

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1 hour ago, RU SERIOUS said:

I can't wait to see that !    If petey ever drops his gloves, it will be to wipe his behind because other than a few shoves, I don't think he has a punch in his soul.   But I did enjoy your humour....LOL !!!

Yes, let`s ridicule a guy for being small/lean and as a bonus for you he is Swedish. How about that Gretzky guy? Tough guy? Must have been, since he is not european.

 

I actually agree with you on most points, A team will go nowhere in the playoffs without tough and gritty players. Sedins not beating Marchand to a pulp was embarrassing, even if you suck at fighting you have to have some selfrespect and fight in you. Edlers thing looked bad but, he should have handled that better but the whole situation was ridiculous, why would he engage with the other teams best fighter for no reason? Petey being bodyslammed, anyone could bodyslam Petey on skates so that was just a lame thing to do but even lamer was the response from his teammates, (of all nationalities) who did nothing. 

 

Equally lame is blaming players from a certain country though and it is pretty annoying, As you know europeans are playing on full size ice growing up, so from age 5-18+ they are playing a very different style with much more time and space and less contact than in the very small ice in northamerica, It takes time to adjust to the faster and more physical game.

 

I will not try to "win" this argument because I agree with your main points, just tired of you calling out "Swedes" over and over again, maybe 

that is what 10+ years of watching the Sedins have done to you ?

 

Speaking of feisty and gritty (not very tough though), I look forward too see a Hogz-Horvat-Garland line.

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22 hours ago, Jimmy McGill said:

I think Berkie has it correct for the most part, you need some guys that can grind teams down over 7 games. Your entire team doesn't have to be that, but you do need some.

 

If the refs let Myers hit like they let others hit, that would help a lot. 

Absolutely.   Myers has the "it" factor come post season.   He gets meaner, and also has the ability to skate the puck in by himself and score or at least put the puck on net.    Watching the Canucks for decades now and there is a short list of guys i've seen who's games amp up in the post season.   Most of them were on the Linden teams but not all of them.   I was very impressed with our young cores first crack, Horvat, EP, QHs all did fine or great in Horvats case, Captain clutch with 10 in 17 playoff type games and our series star against St. louis going head to head against O'Reilly , who was also very good and one of the  best in the business.   Motte and Myers get added to that group, and of course Demko.   Also was particularly happy to see BB take heavy hits to make plays and contribute in other ways then just the scoreboard.  

 

Linden, Ronning, McLean, Adams, Courtnall, and Babcyh all amped up in the post season.   The rest were just as good in the regular season as the playoffs and didn't wilt.  

 

One of my biggest complaints about both the WCE era and Sedin teams were that the post season not a lot of guys were very more noticeable.   The Sedins in particular didn't amp up their games.   Lesser stats really.  Still very good, same as the WCE.   But not extra.   Kesler and Bieksa were the only two that amped up IMO.    Cooke maybe in the WCE era.   Cloutier was the inverse lol.   Linden was still awesome just before retirement and Luongo did it once too,  played his best series ever against Turco.   Too bad that didn't keep up.  

 

The bubble isn't a big enough sample size, but for sure there is a hint that our new core is at least equal to the task, and given their ages and how well they've done so far,  reason for optimism that this is the first core since the 1989-94 team that will have young players on it that can produce right away, and could be playoff warriors/hero's too.  

Edited by IBatch
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5 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

why do you need to scare them to win? we can still be hard on pucks which has nothing to do with fighting or being effective. 

You bet.   

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4 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Absolutely.   Myers has the "it" factor come post season.   He gets meaner, and also has the ability to skate the puck in by himself and score or at least put the puck on net.    Watching the Canucks for decades now and there is a short list of guys i've seen who's games amp up in the post season.   Most of them were on the Linden teams but not all of them.   I was very impressed with our young cores first crack, Horvat, EP, QHs all did fine or great in Horvats case, Captain clutch with 10 in 17 playoff type games and our series star against St. louis going head to head against O'Reilly , who was also very good and one of the  best in the business.   Motte and Myers get added to that group, and of course Demko.   Also was particularly happy to see BB take heavy hits to make plays and contribute in other ways then just the scoreboard.  

 

Linden, Ronning, McLean, Adams, Courtnall, and Babcyh all amped up in the post season.   The rest were just as good in the regular season as the playoffs and didn't wilt.  

 

One of my biggest complaints about both the WCE era and Sedin teams were that the post season not a lot of guys were very more noticeable.   The Sedins in particular didn't amp up their games.   Lesser stats really.  Still very good, same as the WCE.   But not extra.   Kesler and Bieksa were the only two that amped up IMO.    Cooke maybe in the WCE era.   Cloutier was the inverse lol.   Linden was still awesome just before retirement and did it once too,  played his best series ever against Turco.   Too bad that didn't keep up.  

 

The bubble isn't a big enough sample size, but for sure there is a hint that our new core is at least equal to the task, and given their ages and how well they've done so far,  reason for optimism that this is the first core since the 1989-94 team that will have young players on it that can produce right away, and could be playoff warriors/hero's too.  

Of the Berkie style, Myers certainly is that kind of guy. Maybe Miller? Hoping Podz is too. 

 

Bo does elevate in the playoffs for sure, he isn't out there like a heat seeking missile hitting guys he's just really effective and hard to play against. 

 

The question for me is, will this team get ground down or will they push the play and be in fewer situations to get run over? just have to wait and see. 

 

My theory on the Sedins not changing in the playoffs is they really just had one gear and they gave their all every night even in the regular season. 

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It's not about traditional 'toughness', it's about being hard on pucks & strong along the walls.

 

I do like having guys that aren't afraid to drop them if need be, but we don't need an enforcer type.

 

Hamonic isn't afraid to throw them, Luke Schenn brings some toughness, & Im hopeful MacEwen can provide some of that muscle/energy (even if it's not an everyday role). 

 

As far as size from a 'hard to play against' standpoint, I think Podkolzin could be a pleasant surprise. He competes for pucks like his life depends on it. 

 

 

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1 hour ago, Jimmy McGill said:

Of the Berkie style, Myers certainly is that kind of guy. Maybe Miller? Hoping Podz is too. 

 

Bo does elevate in the playoffs for sure, he isn't out there like a heat seeking missile hitting guys he's just really effective and hard to play against. 

 

The question for me is, will this team get ground down or will they push the play and be in fewer situations to get run over? just have to wait and see. 

 

My theory on the Sedins not changing in the playoffs is they really just had one gear and they gave their all every night even in the regular season. 

I agree with you on the Sedins - two of our most consistent players over an 7-8 year period.   Lines up with the only advice i have ever heard the Sedins saying about Sundin as a mentor "just play the playoffs like they were regular season games".... that they did.   Not many Linden/Williams types (Mr. Game 7) ... who's career points in the playoff jump off the page compared to their regular season performances (Ronning and Babych too while on our team).  

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