Draft edition: Benning vs the World

[knucklehead91]

21 minutes ago, Timråfan said:

Well, it’s easy to troll so keep on.

You could have chosen another title and talk a bit more about the Canucks instead of Benning.

Just the fact Benning had the oppurtunity to pick early is different if you compare with Gillis. 
So when there is a lot of factors that has to fit in perfect It’s not because of One GM or One scout.

As I said, without Inge in the organisation No Petey. And because people seem to misunderstand, yes, one scout or one GM can determine wich player it is that drafts but on the whole it’s not because of one scout or GM. 
So why bring forth Benning ahead of the organisation? 

I don’t agree that Benning is the one that should take all credit or blame for what happens. It’s like Green should be the one to blame for the defensive coach or all credit if the PP is best in the league.

 

 

Well you would know first hand its easy to troll

 

There seems to be waaay to much hate and negativity around Benning and his tenure here. Which is why I named it Benning vs the World because it seems like he is being blamed for everything for his “7 year rebuild”. “Fans” have not taken any prior issues from the last 15 years into consideration as to why under Benning the Canucks have “taken so long” when it was the failure of drafting that led us to a dead end in the twilight of the Sedins careers. It was drafting that let us down year after year. Since Benning has come onboard, this organization has done a complete 180 in that department and fans do not have the patience to put up with having to build through the draft because it takes years, especially when you have nothing in the cupboards to begin with. The point about Gillis picking later than Benning is that he failed completely to find a single NHL player in his time during our window to win. We lived off the Burke and early Nonis drafting to get by, but consistently failed to add anything else through the lens of our own organization. Benning drafted 23rd and got Boeser??? So why the hell couldnt Gillis get a guy later in the 1st round? Hoglander was 40th, Rathbone was 95th. Why is it Benning can find something outside the first round, but Gillis couldnt find ANYTHING in the first round from 2008-2012. He only got Horvat from a trade to move up. If it wasnt for moving Schneider we’d still be f***ed down the middle. We would only have Pettersson. You cant make excuses for Gillis when Benning found more NHL players later in the rounds than Gillis found period.

 

Benning ultimately has the final say as to who we are drafting. He came in and drafted on short notice higher in the draft in 2014, since that draft he has hit a homerun in almost every single draft. The OJ draft is a bit unfair to judge quite yet because OJ had sustained serious injuries after being drafted, but he is healthy now and Lockwood looks like he could be a guy who earns a spot. 
 

And a lot of fans only look at the negatives and dont see the positives or even try to understand each of Bennings moves and the timing of the moves during his timeline here, which, be prepared for it, im working on breaking down Bennings timeline, trades and signings.

[Timråfan]

4 minutes ago, vancan2233 said:

How is he a bad communicator? that is also a key to good drafting. Your first response to this post was out of dislike for Benning or you would not have come to assumption it was written to troll those who do not support Benning. 

Look at me as an objective person. 
That can give some hints. If you look at me as biased you miss the point of my post.

 

It’s indifferent if it’s hockey, medicine, science… I want credit to be given to the right person, at least an organisation that gives credit to the right people.

When Benning gave credit to Delorme it was a strategic choice of him wich in my view is very wrong.

Benning should be honest and not pad ”his” people as Inge was on his way to retirement.

Benning know Inge very well.

This is my objective view in any similar situation.

This is not because I dislike Benning.

There is a lot of men padding each others backs instead of being honest.

You can say I have high demands on every man who is GM.

 

Regarding communication it’s mostly his communication with media but there were also some bad communiction when Benning tried to get OEL last year and lost an all accounts. Didn’t all three of Stecher, Tanev and Toffoli say that they had to sign because Benning didn’t speak to them? Here it’s just memory so I can be mistaken. 

 

The troll bit from OP is that he choose to put Benning on a pidestal instead of recognice the whole organisation and value each part of it.

It’s not like Benning hasn’t been a heated discussion topic before.

That means the OP made a choice using title and direction of his post.

 

 

[Timråfan]

3 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

Well you would know first hand its easy to troll

 

There seems to be waaay to much hate and negativity around Benning and his tenure here. Which is why I named it Benning vs the World because it seems like he is being blamed for everything for his “7 year rebuild”. “Fans” have not taken any prior issues from the last 15 years into consideration as to why under Benning the Canucks have “taken so long” when it was the failure of drafting that led us to a dead end in the twilight of the Sedins careers. It was drafting that let us down year after year. Since Benning has come onboard, this organization has done a complete 180 in that department and fans do not have the patience to put up with having to build through the draft because it takes years, especially when you have nothing in the cupboards to begin with. The point about Gillis picking later than Benning is that he failed completely to find a single NHL player in his time during our window to win. We lived off the Burke and early Nonis drafting to get by, but consistently failed to add anything else through the lens of our own organization. Benning drafted 23rd and got Boeser??? So why the hell couldnt Gillis get a guy later in the 1st round? Hoglander was 40th, Rathbone was 95th. Why is it Benning can find something outside the first round, but Gillis couldnt find ANYTHING in the first round from 2008-2012. He only got Horvat from a trade to move up. If it wasnt for moving Schneider we’d still be f***ed down the middle. We would only have Pettersson. You cant make excuses for Gillis when Benning found more NHL players later in the rounds than Gillis found period.

 

Benning ultimately has the final say as to who we are drafting. He came in and drafted on short notice higher in the draft in 2014, since that draft he has hit a homerun in almost every single draft. The OJ draft is a bit unfair to judge quite yet because OJ had sustained serious injuries after being drafted, but he is healthy now and Lockwood looks like he could be a guy who earns a spot. 
 

And a lot of fans only look at the negatives and dont see the positives or even try to understand each of Bennings moves and the timing of the moves during his timeline here, which, be prepared for it, im working on breaking down Bennings timeline, trades and signings.

So why do you want to make things worse? 
There is no reason to put Benning on a piedestal because fans here sometimes come with negative criticism against him.

There a lot more here that is positive because they see that we are going in the right direction.

 

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Timråfan said:

The troll bit from OP is that he choose to put Benning on a pidestal instead of recognice the whole organisation and value each part of it.

It’s not like Benning hasn’t been a heated discussion topic before.

That means the OP made a choice using title and direction of his post.

 

 

It’s a Canuck’s home fan board.  How in the heck can it be considered trolling to post positive things about the team?  Wouldn’t it be trolling to do the opposite, considering the vast majority of the people hear are Canuck fans?  

[Timråfan]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

It’s a Canuck’s home fan board.  How in the heck can it be considered trolling to post positive things about the team?  Wouldn’t it be trolling to do the opposite, considering the vast majority of the people hear are Canuck fans?  

Well, he just admitted that he choose title because he thought people here was too negative towards Benning. 

Trolling might be too strong though. 
Biased is better. 
English isn’t so easy when trying to find similar words. 

[Alflives]

19 minutes ago, Timråfan said:

Well, he just admitted that he choose title because he thought people here was too negative towards Benning. 

Trolling might be too strong though. 
Biased is better. 
English isn’t so easy when trying to find similar words. 

Okay, but it’s a Canuck’s fan board.  Why would we not look at things from our team’s view?  

Edited August 4, 2021 by Alflives

[knucklehead91]

4 minutes ago, Timråfan said:

So why do you want to make things worse? 
There is no reason to put Benning on a piedestal because fans here sometimes come with negative criticism against him.

There a lot more here that is positive because they see that we are going in the right direction.

 

Dont include yourself in the “we” you clearly arent part of this team. I stand behind this team, I stand behind management, coaches and players. I can understand the struggles, how we got to this point and where we are headed. If you want to include yourself in the “we 2 movement” then you had better get off your a$$, stop watching Timra and bring some positivity to these forums.
The Canucks went through the toughest season to date no other team can say they had the same hurdles as us and how COVID decimated this team, physically, mentally and emotionally, not just the players, but the fans were crushed as well. Players hit an all time low in self confidence, Green looked hearbroken in his year end interview before the extension. You could see the pain and suffering this team went through all season, so for you to come here and start bashing and adding negativity, you do not belong on here and you are not a real fan. Support this bloody team, help build the fans confidence around you instead of trying to tear this fan base down and drag them with you into the negative outlook you have on everything. 
 

This is the we 2 movement, WE Stand behind the Canucks through the thick and the thin. Either get on board or get out of the way because this team and its supporters are going to run you and your negativity over.

[vancan2233]

1 minute ago, Timråfan said:

Look at me as an objective person. 
That can give some hints. If you look at me as biased you miss the point of my post.

 

It’s indifferent if it’s hockey, medicine, science… I want credit to be given to the right person, at least an organisation that gives credit to the right people.

When Benning gave credit to Delorme it was a strategic choice of him wich in my view is very wrong.

Benning should be honest and not pad ”his” people as Inge was on his way to retirement.

Benning know Inge very well.

This is my objective view in any similar situation.

This is not because I dislike Benning.

There is a lot of men padding each others backs instead of being honest.

You can say I have high demands on every man who is GM.

 

Regarding communication it’s mostly his communication with media but there were also some bad communiction when Benning tried to get OEL last year and lost an all accounts. Didn’t all three of Stecher, Tanev and Toffoli say that they had to sign because Benning didn’t speak to them? Here it’s just memory so I can be mistaken. 

 

The troll bit from OP is that he choose to put Benning on a pidestal instead of recognice the whole organisation and value each part of it.

It’s not like Benning hasn’t been a heated discussion topic before.

That means the OP made a choice using title and direction of his post.

 

 

Just because he gives Benning praise and made a post because there is a lot of negative pointing at Benning as destroying the team does not mean he does not give other credit for the team. The bold part does not make him a troll. If people are going to isolate Benning as the problem then he has all the right to give some light to what he has done to help. Why that gives you problems is beyond me.

Regarding OEL, you have no idea where the communication went wrong.

Have you gone and posted "trolling" in the posts that have nothing but negative topic towards Benning or defended him when someone post ridiculous comments about him. 

[JM_]

36 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Leafs suck old smelly socks!  Benning has drafted better than Dumbass and ShanaHAM.  

Shanapus is going to have to tear it down after next year. 

[Alflives]

Just now, Jimmy McGill said:

Shanapus is going to have to tear it down after next year. 

When Matthews hits free agency in two years, the Coyotes are positioning their cap perfectly to give him an offer he can’t refuse.  It’s brings such great joy to watch the Leafs lose.  

[JM_]

Just now, Alflives said:

When Matthews hits free agency in two years, the Coyotes are positioning their cap perfectly to give him an offer he can’t refuse.  It’s brings such great joy to watch the Leafs lose.  

Matthews is going to pull a Seth Jones and announce before his last season that he won't be re-signing with TO. He may even try to pull that next summer. 

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

Matthews is going to pull a Seth Jones and announce before his last season that he won't be re-signing with TO. He may even try to pull that next summer. 

Good point.  That will put the Leafs into another rebuild, but this time they’re won’t have Lou Lam to do all the heavy lifting.  

[JM_]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Good point.  That will put the Leafs into another rebuild, but this time they’re won’t have Lou Lam to do all the heavy lifting.  

yup. There's no way he plays out that last year in TO. Jones has set the precedent.

 

Edited August 4, 2021 by Jimmy McGill

[Alflives]

3 minutes ago, Jimmy McGill said:

yup. There's no way he plays out that last year in TO. Jones has set the precedent.

 

And notice how Benning has drafted lots of really good players in the last three years.  What exactly has Dumbass drafted?  Littlegren, and Robertscared. 

[Dumb Nuck]

34 minutes ago, knucklehead91 said:

Dont include yourself in the “we” you clearly arent part of this team. I stand behind this team, I stand behind management, coaches and players. I can understand the struggles, how we got to this point and where we are headed. If you want to include yourself in the “we 2 movement” then you had better get off your a$$, stop watching Timra and bring some positivity to these forums.
The Canucks went through the toughest season to date no other team can say they had the same hurdles as us and how COVID decimated this team, physically, mentally and emotionally, not just the players, but the fans were crushed as well. Players hit an all time low in self confidence, Green looked hearbroken in his year end interview before the extension. You could see the pain and suffering this team went through all season, so for you to come here and start bashing and adding negativity, you do not belong on here and you are not a real fan. Support this bloody team, help build the fans confidence around you instead of trying to tear this fan base down and drag them with you into the negative outlook you have on everything. 
 

This is the we 2 movement, WE Stand behind the Canucks through the thick and the thin. Either get on board or get out of the way because this team and its supporters are going to run you and your negativity over.

LOL, we 2 movement, I prefer to have mine in private.

[JM_]

4 minutes ago, Alflives said:

And notice how Benning has drafted lots of really good players in the last three years.  What exactly has Dumbass drafted?  Littlegren, and Robertscared. 

and ditched Marleau for a 1st, even though he could still play and got nothing back.

 

Sure we also lost a 1st, but we got Garland. We also ditched our dead cap for OEL, who is better than any Leaf LHD. 

[Alflives]

Just now, Dumb Nuck said:

LOL, we 2 movement, I prefer to have mine in private.

Wear Depends and you can 2 have them in public. 

[Dumb Nuck]

7 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Wear Depends and you can 2 have them in public. 

I think I got a couple decades before I reach that point.

[Patel Bure]

2 hours ago, Solinar said:

Okay, while I understand that drafting high as compared to drafting later in the round, is different, we should also keep in mind that you should still be able to find 2 nhl players per draft.  I'd expect a star to be found every 3-5 years, and a superstar every 5-7 years at that pace.  The Gillis regime, while successful on ice, were absolutely terrible drafting.  There was no excuse, and it severely hampered the success of the big club and was addressed by a multitude of trades.  Nonis was better, but really whiffed on some of the players he could have gotten.

  Benning's strength does seem to be the draft, and he has delivered what would be a strong pipeline of talent, but the argument is that it could have been better if he wasn't just so bad at pro scouting.  I mean, f#cking terrible.  Like, oh my god, do you even watch NHL games or comprehend how the NHL works.   The player he could have gotten with the picks he's traded away, which are high value return picks, we could have an even better team than we do now, and we wouldn't have to dip as badly into free agency as we do.  He also seems to have forwards and goaltenders down pat, but damn boy, you seriously do not understand defensemen.  Defense is voodoo to Benning.  I don't understand why, he used to be a freaking defensemen, but...hell, can't be good at all 3 positions.

  Benning would probably be better suited to the AGM position, and would be utilized heavily to handle drafting and development.  Then a GM who could get a handle on contracts, ufa signings, pro scouting, and...communication, would serve the club in the GM chair.   I mean really, rain man would probably have an easier time during a press conference.

 

  The GM is responsible for many things, and although you are allowed to have strengths and weaknesses, his strength *drafting* is severely hampered by his pro scouting acumen and his asset management, and ability to figure out the d-core which is basically still a shambles because it seems he doesn't understand the position he's trying to fix.  That being said, when he does make a mistake, and does figure out how to fix it, we rarely see the same mistake again.  That means there's at least a little hope as we go forward, and the team that he's built, right now on paper, is probably the best team he's iced, on paper, during his tenure.  I'll withhold from donating to the firebenning campaign till December of this year.  While hopeful, I am seriously tired of this team not being able to get beyond the fixation on size, 'intangibles', and thinking that we should be able to punch the puck into the net, as opposed to having enough skill to do it the ...I don't know, hockey way.  This season is going to be a make or break year for me, as a fan.  I'm tired...it has been nearly 40 years of cheering for this team.  Please, I hope this is the year we turn a corner.

Can you please show me a current NHL team that has drafted (consistently) “two NHL players per draft” that actually stuck with their teams beyond one season?  
 

Again, look at the Canucks:

 

Current:  Pettersson, Boeser, Hoglander, Horvat, Podkolzin, Hughes, Juolevi, Rathbone, Demko,

 

Incoming:  Dipietro

 

Former:  Virtanen, Gaudette, Tryamkin

 

Guys like Dickinson, Miller, Pearson, Garland, Highmore, and Motte were brought in from our picks (directly and indirectly).  
 

So again, I’m not sure if I’m understanding your argument.

Edited August 4, 2021 by Patel Bure

[Googlie]

5 hours ago, Dazzle said:

Garland's American, bruh.

You know, I had my doubts but remembered a recent signing from Ontario, and was just in too much of a hurry to look it up.  Dickinson, ofc, from Ontario, Garland from Scituate. Mass.