[Report] Josh Archibald out indefinitely due to heart condition

[ruututuutu]

38 minutes ago, bad alice french said:

Unfortunate. 

Sounds like the medical system needs work. Why were we so caught off guard by this?

Why are we caught off guard by an unprecedented global pandemic? Good question. I hope we have a plan for the next alien invasion as well.

Edited October 5, 2021 by ruututuutu

[bad alice french]

36 minutes ago, StanleyCupOneDay said:

If you choose not to get vaccinated then you are by choice anti-vax. I truly wish that this disease doesn’t come into your family or community, it can be a real eye opener.

https://globalnews.ca/news/8216343/bc-mom-covid-unvaccinated-regret-hospital/

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/04/fit-and-healthy-man-42-from-southport-who-rejected-vaccine-dies-of-covid

Nice cherry picking work.

Trust the internet.

[bad alice french]

21 minutes ago, ruututuutu said:

Why are we caught off guard by an unprecedented global pandemic? Good question. I hope we have a plan for the next alien invasion as well.

Well said.

Guilty as charged. That was a sloppy post on my part.

[bad alice french]

4 hours ago, JM_ said:

"what do you mean i have to wait 3 years for a knee operation"?  covid math baby.

Sensationalism at its best. You're a beauty.

[Jtutino]

1 hour ago, StanleyCupOneDay said:

You’re right and it also says most patients with myocarditis responded well to medicine and rest and felt better quickly. Next line says patients can usually return back to their normal daily activities after symptoms improve. So the majority of the minority who get this potential side effect after receiving a vaccine can get back to normal fairly quickly.

They might get back to normal fairly quick but what are there long terms affects off your heart swelling for that period of time? CDC says they basically have no clue.

[Jtutino]

1 hour ago, ruututuutu said:

Why are we caught off guard by an unprecedented global pandemic? Good question. I hope we have a plan for the next alien invasion as well.

It's been going on for over 18 months. China can build a hospital in 10 days but Alberta doesn't have a contingency plan for 300 people in ICU after a year and a half? We spent 250 billion since this began but don't have enough beds? What if a variant comes around that the vaxx doesn't protect against? And 1000 people need ICU beds? They should have plans in place.

[Jtutino]

1 hour ago, StanleyCupOneDay said:

If you choose not to get vaccinated then you are by choice anti-vax. I truly wish that this disease doesn’t come into your family or community, it can be a real eye opener.

https://globalnews.ca/news/8216343/bc-mom-covid-unvaccinated-regret-hospital/

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/aug/04/fit-and-healthy-man-42-from-southport-who-rejected-vaccine-dies-of-covid

So if you've had 10 vaccines but don't get 1 you're an anti vaxxer?

[bubba6]

1 hour ago, StanleyCupOneDay said:

First hand experience does not automatically mean that this is the case in all hospitals. Maybe it is for your local one and if so that’s great! It means those needing care can get it, but for the other hospitals where that’s not true it is a very serious issue.

 

I am not certain on the data behind my claim that the vaccinated face equal if not more cases of myocarditis, but I’m going to mention it anyways is not a very convincing argument.

 

You’re absolutely right on this one. We need to monitor the number of cases, the number of long haul cases and overall impacts from COVID.

 

It’s really not, the data shows not only does it prevent hospitalizations and death, but it also lessens the ability for one to infect another if they have COVID.

 

https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/vaccinated-people-are-less-likely-spread-covid-new-research-finds-n1280583

 

Of course Archibald very well could have developed the myocarditis condition (3.1m worldwide diagnosed in 2017 according to the myocarditis foundation https://www.myocarditisfoundation.org/about-myocarditis/ ) without having gotten COVID, but I think evidence points to the more likely answer that he got it as an effect after contracting the disease. We already know from mountains of research and clinical trials that vaccines protect the person from COVID infection at the 95%ish range. Therefore it is absolutely reasonable to say a vaccine could have prevented his current condition.

First hand experience does not correlate perfectly with other locations no.

 

When i mean not certain on the data i mean Global or large scale I was only speaking of local numbers.

 

I really do not want to get into a debate about effectiveness of the vaccine especially referencing studies i do not have on hand. but that is one study and multiple others show no diminished or a minimal decreased effect of transmission, only decrease of symptoms.

 

The only issue i have with the connection between his covid diagnosis and the timeline of the Myocarditis diagnosis is that generally it happens relatively soon after if not in conjunction with the viral or bacterial infection (shouldn't leave out a possible cause due to a drug reaction in case he was on any prescription medications as a possibility)

so unless it went undiagnosed for so long it is very likely to have no connection with his covid diagnosis. the only way we can be sure is if we were his doctor and know the timeline of symptoms. no point in speculating beyond that.

 

[bubba6]

2 hours ago, StanleyCupOneDay said:

I’m always open to more data, it’s a new disease so we may not know everything. However that said I’m more likely to see the “vaccine gave me a side effect after contracting COVID” as an “I got COVID before my vaccine was able to fully protect me” situation and that they’re just experiencing bad COVID symptoms one of which is myocarditis.

This is definitely one area we need more information and data. I feel this could be a major part of the adverse reactions especially if you have covid and get the Vaccine pre symptoms just as the virus is building up to a higher viral load or contract the virus a couple of days after the vaccine how does that affect our immune response to both the virus and the Vaccine. Someone may have been perfectly fine getting the virus with minimal symptoms, or getting the Vaccine with minimal reactions but combined it could be fatal (worst case) but more data is needed to really know. I am not actually aware of any studies looking at this I am sure there is at least one so I will try and find something maybe I am completely wrong and it has no effect.

If anyone else is aware of such studies please direct me to the link.

[JM_]

13 hours ago, Jtutino said:

Crazy 4% in teens thats wild

the important part is that vaccine risk is much lower than when you get covid as a teen:

 

They found that the risk of heart inflammation was 21 times higher among girls with COVID-19 and about six times higher among boys with COVID-19 compared with the vaccination group.

 

https://www.upi.com/Health_News/2021/08/03/CDC-After-nearly-9M-Pfizer-shots-for-US-teens-serious-side-effects-rare/3371627961965/

[Gurn]

2 minutes ago, JM_ said:

the important part is that vaccine risk is much lower than when you get covid as a teen:

 

They found that the risk of heart inflammation was 21 times higher among girls with COVID-19 and about six times higher among boys with COVID-19 compared with the vaccination group.

 

https://www.upi.com/Health_News/2021/08/03/CDC-After-nearly-9M-Pfizer-shots-for-US-teens-serious-side-effects-rare/3371627961965/

Math, once again, with the win.

[JM_]

10 hours ago, Jtutino said:

It's been going on for over 18 months. China can build a hospital in 10 days but Alberta doesn't have a contingency plan for 300 people in ICU after a year and a half? We spent 250 billion since this began but don't have enough beds? What if a variant comes around that the vaxx doesn't protect against? And 1000 people need ICU beds? They should have plans in place.

we do have plans, its called getting a shot.

 

Pandering to the anti-vaxxers is the problem, particularly in AB. This is what "freedom" looks like. There's nothing wrong with our healthcare system, thats not where the problem is.

[JM_]

12 hours ago, bad alice french said:

That's why I live where I live my friend.

That's also why i'm choosing to not be vaccinated at this time.

My family and I are active and healthy. I have faith in my own immune system to deal with the possibility of being infected. We have smaller and more like minded social circles and we don't travel. 

I'm grateful for all of this. To be clear I am totally pro choice and absolutely not a non vaxxer. What's right for some isn't always right for all.

Simple. 

why am I not surprised?

[DrJockitch]

10 hours ago, Jtutino said:

It's been going on for over 18 months. China can build a hospital in 10 days but Alberta doesn't have a contingency plan for 300 people in ICU after a year and a half? We spent 250 billion since this began but don't have enough beds? What if a variant comes around that the vaxx doesn't protect against? And 1000 people need ICU beds? They should have plans in place.

There have been a lot of contingency plans built, a lot of which were never used. I can’t speak specifically to Alberta other than knowing that they have actually had to expand ICU into other regions of the hospitals like the CCU which puts Cardiac care patients ina. Much more precarious position.

Creating more beds and getting more ventilators is a easy thing, the problem is the staffing.  Qualified nurses, RTs, doctors.  The healthcare system has been pushed by audit after audit to look where can cut expenses and it almost always has come down to pushing out expertise. Having RPNs take over RN jobs, PSWs taking over RPN jobs reducing RTs and physician coverage to a minimum.  These are issues that take a long time to fix.

It has been a general problem have seen for a long time. Politicians look at average hospital occupancy and make budgets and plans around that. This is foolish in a hospital/health care system, you need to plan for the flood not the average and ultimately this is the end result of this kind of planning. 

[JM_]

52 minutes ago, gurn said:

Math, once again, with the win.

its really fascinating to see the thought process at work. Its like saying you don't believe in cholesterol and think you can eat at McDonalds every day, because "I'm healthy" and you're just scared.

 

I don't think there's any rational conversation left with the people still refusing to get vaccinated. Its pointless now.

 

[Gurn]

People will be doing masters thesis's on this for years.

Trying to figure out the overlap between the anti vaxxers and the truly mentally ill, I'm positive there is some.

One thing that does lead me to this, is the way some people will say that covid was made in a lab, thus unnatural and designed to do damage.

Yet some of those will turn around and say their natural immunity will save them; from what they allege was a designed human killer.

They can believe that science created a killer, yet can't believe that science created a preventative measure.

The I'm special, my immunity  will protect me crowd seem borderline delusional. 

I'm special, not going to be part of the 2% of Canadians that die from covid, nor part of the covid long haulers; which is anywhere between 8-25 %.

So around a 1 in 4 chance, yet they are special.?

 

 

[Bure_Pavel]

17 hours ago, on the cycle said:

Well it is your human right to refuse medical treatment, this includes vaccines. Also there have been recent studies suggesting that natural immunity is upwards of 14x more effective than the immunity gained through vaccine.

 

I still think you should get the vaccine but to suggest someone who has already had covid is a threat to others seems to be incorrect, especially if you're vaccinated. I you're still afraid of the unvaccinated I would suggest seeking mental health treatment.

Yeah it is his right to roll the dice on his own safety, but based on the medical and scientific communities the risks of the vaccine are minimal compared to the risks of Covid-19. You might as well be Evander Kane walking into a Vegas casino. 

[The Lock]

14 hours ago, bad alice french said:

That's why I live where I live my friend.

That's also why i'm choosing to not be vaccinated at this time.

My family and I are active and healthy. I have faith in my own immune system to deal with the possibility of being infected. We have smaller and more like minded social circles and we don't travel. 

I'm grateful for all of this. To be clear I am totally pro choice and absolutely not a non vaxxer. What's right for some isn't always right for all.

Simple. 

For now they are active and healthy. Covid has literally made people with your mentality though have a change of mind after it's too late.

 

You may be "pro choice" but so are the people who got vaccinated. By your decision, you are neglecting the wishes of the majority to get rid of this pandemic. You are effectively the person shouting fire in a full movie theatre and, for that, I have the pro choice to choose not to respect you as you are not respecting the majority.

 

I want to be clear on a couple of things: I'm done with this pandemic and I'm done with the anti-vaxxers (and people who refuse to vaccinate in general) who would put themselves over others at the cost of countless lives. I want this pandemic gone. I've seen way too much death, and it's just going to continue because of people who refuse to vaccinate.

 

Rights only should ever go so far when it involves death. Free speech has its limits.

Edited October 5, 2021 by The Lock

[on the cycle]

44 minutes ago, The Lock said:

For now they are active and healthy. Covid has literally made people with your mentality though have a change of mind after it's too late.

 

You may be "pro choice" but so are the people who got vaccinated. By your decision, you are neglecting the wishes of the majority to get rid of this pandemic. You are effectively the person shouting fire in a full movie theatre and, for that, I have the pro choice to choose not to respect you as you are not respecting the majority.

 

I want to be clear on a couple of things: I'm done with this pandemic and I'm done with the anti-vaxxers (and people who refuse to vaccinate in general) who would put themselves over others at the cost of countless lives. I want this pandemic gone. I've seen way too much death, and it's just going to continue because of people who refuse to vaccinate.

 

Rights only should ever go so far when it involves death. Free speech has its limits.

Those who choose safety over freedom deserve neither.

 

I'm a free speech absolutist

I'm a Libertarian

I will not stand for authoritarianism

I will not subject others to my will

 

You do not embody these principles.

[The Lock]

33 minutes ago, on the cycle said:

Those who choose safety over freedom deserve neither.

 

I'm a free speech absolutist

I'm a Libertarian

I will not stand for authoritarianism

I will not subject others to my will

 

You do not embody these principles.

Good for you? I honeslty do not care if you don't like me opinion since I don't care for your opinion either. I don't believe in authoritarianism but I also don't believe in people hiding behind free speech while killing others indirectly as a result. The fact that you need to associate what I said with "authoritarianism" shows just how extreme you have to go in order to make me sound bad. Yet, I said nothing about authoritarianism.

 

We'll have to agree to disaagree since I believe, those who would hide behind a facade of freedom while destroying others' liberties to live need to learn what freedom actually is. I will not believe you to be a "free speech absolutionist" while people around me are dying from that very mentality.

Edited October 5, 2021 by The Lock