Warhippy Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 15 hours ago, D.B Cooper said: You could be right……… but I don’t think so. Lol. Maybe on HF, but not here. Hahah Comparable trades Duchene O'Reilly x2 St Louis To a much lesser extent, Eichel and Johansen These types of players get absolutely monstrous returns. 1st line centre/winger hybrid that produces ppg numbers in every situation on the ice from pk and pp to even strength. With a VERY nice contract for another full season. Think about what dangling Kesler immediately after the 2011 run before his ntc kicked in would have net this team in return. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, shiznak said: Are they willing to mortgage their future for an off chance of winning a Cup? What if, they don’t win in those two years? Then they essentially lose Strome and Miller to free agency; Chytil and Schneider in a trade, and a first. Their center depth will be completely gutted. Like I mention in another thread, it would be a lot cheaper for them to go get a rental player (ie Giroux, Pavelski) without selling the future. Rumours have the Avs in for Giroux based on his UFA status Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 24 minutes ago, shiznak said: Are they willing to mortgage their future for an off chance of winning a Cup? What if, they don’t win in those two years? Then they essentially lose Strome and Miller to free agency; Chytil and Schneider in a trade, and a first. Their center depth will be completely gutted. Like I mention in another thread, it would be a lot cheaper for them to go get a rental player (ie Giroux, Pavelski) without selling the future. Teams mortgage their future at a chance every year at the deadline, without fail. The future isn't the point of playing, winning the Cup is. Spending young players to buy impact players is not some new phenomenon They've also got plenty of good young players, losing two of them isn't the end of the world for them and they can move older assets for younger players as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiznak Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 6 minutes ago, stawns said: Teams mortgage their future at a chance every year at the deadline, without fail. The future isn't the point of playing, winning the Cup is. Spending young players to buy impact players is not some new phenomenon They've also got plenty of good young players, losing two of them isn't the end of the world for them and they can move older assets for younger players as well. I can’t remember the last time a big ticket player who got traded to a team and then precede to win the Stanley Cup with that same team. I guess you can say Coleman from last season, but the Lightning didn’t exactly mortgage their future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 8 minutes ago, shiznak said: I can’t remember the last time a big ticket player who got traded to a team and then precede to win the Stanley Cup with that same team. I guess you can say Coleman from last season, but the Lightning didn’t exactly mortgage their future. O'Reilly. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiznak Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 2 minutes ago, Warhippy said: O'Reilly. Sorry, I meant a trade deadline acquisition. Beside, St. Louis didn’t exactly sell their future for him, either. Decent prospect (Thompson), a late first round pick, and a middle 2nd. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 20 minutes ago, shiznak said: I can’t remember the last time a big ticket player who got traded to a team and then precede to win the Stanley Cup with that same team. I guess you can say Coleman from last season, but the Lightning didn’t exactly mortgage their future. I never said they'd win, just that multiple teams do it every year. I'm not sure what point you're arguing for here Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shiznak Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 5 minutes ago, stawns said: I never said they'd win, just that multiple teams do it every year. I'm not sure what point you're arguing for here And every team who do so (mortgage their future at the deadline), never really amount to anything in the playoffs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 1 minute ago, shiznak said: And every team who do so (mortgage their future at the deadline), never really amount to anything in the playoffs. Not much argument here, but every year multiple teams still do it and will continue to do it and this is, hopefully, the year that the Canucks seize that opportunity as sellers. There's 4-5 of the top teams that have plenty of cap space and the young assets to make a big deal and a good GM will leverage them against each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jester13 Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 18 minutes ago, stawns said: I never said they'd win, just that multiple teams do it every year. I'm not sure what point you're arguing for here IIRC, the Kings and St. Louis won after acquiring some big names - can't remember if it was the same year, but definitely shortly after. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCNate Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 Honestly, I think I'd give up Horvat before JT Miller. I know that won't happen, but trading Miller creates too big a hole in our lineup. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 3 hours ago, shiznak said: I keep reading, the Rangers have enough to retain Miller after his current deal is up. However, I just don’t see it. They have a ton of players coming off their entry level deals, and I think they are more of a priority then re-signing Miller to a huge contract. I mean, there’s a reason why they moved Buchnevich. They could possibly move Krieder’s contract, but if you have the option of a 32-yrs old with 4 more years at 6.5M or re-signing a 30-yrs old to a 8M+, 6+yrs deal. I think I would choose the former and hope Krieder can continue to play at a high level at that age. Trading Krieder would also mean giving up more assets to a team to take on his contract, which the Rangers probably will not have, if they trade for Miller. I read this every year. The Canucks have not been able to be cap compliant for like 5 years in a row according to CDC. Yet they are, every year. If they trade for Miller, they likely have a plan to re-up him, assuming he works out for them. Teams figure out out to keep good players. And yes, they might have to move someone else None of the kids should require prohibitive raises and IIRC, they have a couple contracts coming off the books as well. WORST case, they get two runs out of him, at a bargain hit, and then sell his rights at the draft. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 13 minutes ago, BCNate said: Honestly, I think I'd give up Horvat before JT Miller. I know that won't happen, but trading Miller creates too big a hole in our lineup. The only reason to keep a 29 year old player on the verge of a massive contract is if you're ready to win right now. Otherwise it's a complete waste of resources 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
D.B Cooper Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 2 hours ago, Warhippy said: Comparable trades Duchene O'Reilly x2 St Louis To a much lesser extent, Eichel and Johansen These types of players get absolutely monstrous returns. 1st line centre/winger hybrid that produces ppg numbers in every situation on the ice from pk and pp to even strength. With a VERY nice contract for another full season. Think about what dangling Kesler immediately after the 2011 run before his ntc kicked in would have net this team in return. No one is arguing about JT bringing in a haul and a half. Im saying, there is zero chance Avs consider trading Byram. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BCNate Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 43 minutes ago, stawns said: The only reason to keep a 29 year old player on the verge of a massive contract is if you're ready to win right now. Otherwise it's a complete waste of resources Miller is lightyears better than Horvat, and only two years older. If the contracts are similar, I'd pay Miller before Horvat. I'd expect that both would return solid packages, with Miller getting an extra piece. If you deal Miller, as soon as you get competitive, you are looking for another Miller. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86Viking Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 32 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: No one is arguing about JT bringing in a haul and a half. Im saying, there is zero chance Avs consider trading Byram. I agree! Also, time to change the title of this thread to an all purpose JT Miller thread no? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 Just now, BCNate said: Miller is lightyears better than Horvat, and only two years older. If the contracts are similar, I'd pay Miller before Horvat. I'd expect that both would return solid packages, with Miller getting an extra piece. If you deal Miller, as soon as you get competitive, you are looking for another Miller. Lots of millers out there, maybe even in their system already. Are you ready to pay a 30 year old $9m for 5-6 years, probably with a nmc? I'm curious what leads you to believe he's stay in van? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 1 minute ago, BCNate said: Miller is lightyears better than Horvat, and only two years older. If the contracts are similar, I'd pay Miller before Horvat. I'd expect that both would return solid packages, with Miller getting an extra piece. If you deal Miller, as soon as you get competitive, you are looking for another Miller. Didn't JR say he wanted to make trades to get younger? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 33 minutes ago, D.B Cooper said: No one is arguing about JT bringing in a haul and a half. Im saying, there is zero chance Avs consider trading Byram. And they said the same thing about a non lottery protected pick to the Avs. Eichel and his neck injury. Kessel and his contract. Hall for Larsson These trades happen ALL the time, and if you look at things, the Avs have less need of Byram with his concussion issues with Barron in the wings and Toews producing at a PPG clip Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mll Posted January 26, 2022 Share Posted January 26, 2022 4 minutes ago, Warhippy said: And they said the same thing about a non lottery protected pick to the Avs. Eichel and his neck injury. Kessel and his contract. Hall for Larsson These trades happen ALL the time, and if you look at things, the Avs have less need of Byram with his concussion issues with Barron in the wings and Toews producing at a PPG clip AVS have no cap space. Their target is also Giroux per Friedman if they can find a way to make it work cap wise - upcoming UFA and a right handed C. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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