RWJC Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 1 minute ago, aGENT said: Yeah, he has. Under Bruce, he's actually trending up. Small sample sizes and all that... Who suggested paying him his QO? A $1m raise is well under his QO FYI. (It's also the high end of what I think he'll get, as I noted earlier). He's also not one dimensional. Good scoring, character guy with a decent 2 way game and underrated play making. He’s not trending up under Bruce. He’s playing at what was his expected output…which was still trending downwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 8 minutes ago, Darius said: Heres a question for those of you that want to move on from Brock. Where will you get those 20-30 goals from each year? UFA will cost you at least 6 million you would think. Internally? Do you really see Hogz or Klimovich as long term solutions? I think if they move on from him they need to get a D man in return, thats the priority. But that leaves a big hole on RW. Garland, improving the dcorp, depth UFA to name a few. A balanced roster will improve the teams offense (and defense) overall, not just in one spot. I'm curious, and I don't mean this is a jab, did you think this core was going to going make it through a rebuild without changing anything? JB brought assets together and now that they have a decent amount, they can start to shape the roster better.........but they have to use the valuable chips they have to do it. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BertaNuck Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 I think they go for malkin and a pick or prospect malkin to help podz out Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 (edited) 1 minute ago, combover said: So you believe only fast players can be superstars. or top 6 players ? Highmores fast I guess he should be on the top line. boeser isn’t a liability. building is just that, you surround players with players that compliment each other hughes plays better with a more defensive partner. As far a the sedins they struggled until the right line mates were found that’s more the point and in carter burrows. it’s all about balance fast slow skilled grit big small offensive minded defensive minded. getting more speed at the expense of skill achieves nothing. Boeser is a top 3 on most teams a top 6 on every team but some believe he’s not good enough to play for Vancouver. If he’s so slow so ineffective why hasn’t it showed in his production? Year after year he is consistent. If He such a liability why isn’t he minus leader on the team. I get it people are looking for anything (foot speed) to justify trading a 50-60 point 24 year old player just entering his prime. but the only reason that holds water is he won’t sign an extension in the 6-7 mill range. I’m not looking for any reason, I’m providing legitimate reasons and concerns about a player who is about to potentially receive more money for less production. Edited February 20, 2022 by RWJC Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
204CanucksFan Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 35 minutes ago, Ferlands_Head said: There are 43 players that have outscored BB since he joined the league, I'm not sure how that makes him one of the best in the league. I'm not sure there's anybody other than you that considers him one of the best in the league. I don't feel he should be mentioned in the same sentence as guys like Pastrnak, Connor or even Debrincat (These guys are some of the best in the league) He's playing, but you can clearly see that his shot isn't what it was before. Like another poster stated earlier, he's not even in a shooting position on the PP anymore. His shot was lethal before but now even the coaching staff isn't utilizing his shot. It's a problem when your so called best goal scorer is putting up 4 goals in the playoffs. I was merely stating that Motte can match his goal production in the playoffs which is unacceptable. TT is still producing at close to a 60 pt pace this season which is about what BB puts up for way cheaper. BB is going to be 25 in a week and he hasn't even improved on his rookie season. And yet Boeser has more goals and points than TT this season. And no, there are 40 players with more goals than BB. As for being "not even in a shooting position on the PP anymore" it seems to be working since he scored the teams last 2 PP goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 3 minutes ago, combover said: So you believe only fast players can be superstars. or top 6 players ? Highmores fast I guess he should be on the top line. boeser isn’t a liability. building is just that, you surround players with players that compliment each other hughes plays better with a more defensive partner. As far a the sedins they struggled until the right line mates were found that’s more the point and in carter burrows. it’s all about balance fast slow skilled grit big small offensive minded defensive minded. getting more speed at the expense of skill achieves nothing. Boeser is a top 3 on most teams a top 6 on every team but some believe he’s not good enough to play for Vancouver. If he’s so slow so ineffective why hasn’t it showed in his production? Year after year he is consistent. If He such a liability why isn’t he minus leader on the team. I get it people are looking for anything (foot speed) to justify trading a 50-60 point 24 year old player just entering his prime. but the only reason that holds water is he won’t sign an extension in the 6-7 mill range. Please re-read. In no capacity did I ever say or believe that only fast players can be superstars. In fact i mentioned the Sedins in the same post… Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 3 minutes ago, aGENT said: Yeah, he has. Under Bruce, he's actually trending up. Small sample sizes and all that... Who suggested paying him his QO? A $1m raise is well under his QO FYI. (It's also the high end of what I think he'll get, as I noted earlier). He's also not one dimensional. Good scoring, character guy with a decent 2 way game and underrated play making. goals or assists doesn't matter, it's still offense only. Hs two way game is barely decent and he has a very tough time getting the puck out of the zone, isn't fast enough to skate it out and isn't quick enough to be much of a takeaway guy in the nzone. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 4 minutes ago, RWJC said: He’s not trending up under Bruce. He’s playing at what was his expected output…which was still trending downwards. He's almost at 1ppg since Bruce took over, so no. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stawns Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 to me, moving Boeser is a no brainer and moving Miller is a "only if you get the deal you want" move. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 2 minutes ago, stawns said: goals or assists doesn't matter, it's still offense only. Hs two way game is barely decent and he has a very tough time getting the puck out of the zone, isn't fast enough to skate it out and isn't quick enough to be much of a takeaway guy in the nzone. And again, I'm fine if they decide to move him for someone with 3/4 the offense, but added speed and/or grit, or a RHD etc. But this concept that he's not worth +/-$6.5m is ridiculous. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Darius Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 1 minute ago, stawns said: Garland, improving the dcorp, depth UFA to name a few. A balanced roster will improve the teams offense (and defense) overall, not just in one spot. I'm curious, and I don't mean this is a jab, did you think this core was going to going make it through a rebuild without changing anything? JB brought assets together and now that they have a decent amount, they can start to shape the roster better.........but they have to use the valuable chips they have to do it. I too think one or two "core" players need to be traded. Its the easiest long term solution to fix issues. If they want to draft their way to improving Im afraid we are going to be waiting for another 5 years. IMHO the first guy that needs to go is Miller. Hes our best overall player and the return could patch up the holes on this team for years. Trading him can alter the course of this franchise for years - Look at what trading Linden turned into...the ramifications are still felt today. Miller at his age and projected salary just doesnt fit. I like Garland. Im not sold on him yet. Garland gives me Cliffy Ronning vibes, the difference was Cliffy played on a team with some absolute monsters - lots of big forwards and D men which allowed the team to have a nsmaller guy like Cliff. This team has EP/Hogz/Hughes....can another sub 5 foot 10 guy form a core that go a long way? Im not sure. But I agree with you the D core needs improving. Demko is putting lipstick on a pig right now... 1 2 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferlands_Head Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 4 minutes ago, 204CanucksFan said: And yet Boeser has more goals and points than TT this season. And no, there are 40 players with more goals than BB. As for being "not even in a shooting position on the PP anymore" it seems to be working since he scored the teams last 2 PP goals. Yeah but he's also way cheaper and the production is very close. #40 or 43 the point is he's not one of the best in the league in goal scoring. You think he should be mentioned with guys like Connor or Debrincat? If you said he's top 40 in the league in goal scoring i'd agree with you. It seems your standards of being "one of the best in the league" are pretty low. Yes I've seen both. One of them Petey literally shot it right off his stick and in. All he had to do was have a stick on the ice, and the other one was a lucky bounce, that he tapped in. Literally any other Canuck could have scored those goals. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 17 minutes ago, aGENT said: And again, I'm fine if they decide to move him for someone with 3/4 the offense, but added speed and/or grit, or a RHD etc. But this concept that he's not worth +/-$6.5m is ridiculous. Just to clarify…I’m not arguing against him at his current contract. Value for sure. I’m arguing against him at 7.5 which is factually what he is entitled to next. Yeah he could sign for much less, but that’s hypothetical and somewhat redundant when looking at the current landscape and what facts we have as fans to utilize in our own perspectives. if we’re going to play armchair GM, and pontificate on what we each think should be done next, it helps to at least use real time facts to balance out speculation. Just my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 28 minutes ago, aGENT said: He's almost at 1ppg since Bruce took over, so no. Which is somewhat common to him when he’s on a hot streak. What about when he’s not? When he’s slumping? When his back check is listless? guess who is also at ppg? Miller. and where is Miller most visible? all 3 zones. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 1 minute ago, RWJC said: Just to clarify…I’m not arguing against him at his current contract. Value for sure. I’m arguing against him at 7.5 which is factually what he is entitled to next. Nope. It's not And $6.5 isn't his current contract either. It's an almost $1m raise on his current deal. The +/- $1m you started arguing with me about. 1 minute ago, RWJC said: Yeah he could sign for much less, but that’s hypothetical and somewhat redundant when looking at the current landscape and what facts we have as fans to utilize in our own perspectives. if we’re going to play armchair GM, and pontificate on what we each think should be done next, it helps to at least use real time facts to balance out speculation. Just my opinion. Yes, you should try that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aGENT Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 1 minute ago, RWJC said: Which is somewhat common to him when he’s on a hot streak. What about when he’s not? When he’s slumping? When his back check is listless? guess who is also at ppg? Miller. and where is Miller most visible? all 3 zones. Especially when he's tossing the puck through the middle in our end/the neutral zone, right to the opposition 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RWJC Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 18 minutes ago, aGENT said: Nope. It's not And $6.5 isn't his current contract either. It's an almost $1m raise on his current deal. The +/- $1m you started arguing with me about. Yes, you should try that. ok here ya go https://thehockeywriters.com/projecting-canucks-forward-boesers-next-contract/ “Boeser is in the final season of his three-year contract with an annual average value (AAV) of $5.875 million. He received the contract after posting 29 goals and 55 points in his rookie season and 26 goals and 56 points in his sophomore season. He will be a restricted free agent (RFA) this offseason. Since he signed his contract before the new CBA, his qualifying offer is based on his total salary, which is $7.5 million. It is hard to find contract comparables for Boeser. Other players with similar production last season include Kyle Connor, Evander Kane, Brayden Point and Mika Zibanejad. Connor received a seven-year contract with an AAV of $7.142 million. Kane earned a seven-year contract with an AAV of $7 million. Both Connor and Kane’s AAVs are tough to compare with Boeser since the starting point for his next contract will be at $7.5 million. Point is coming into the last season of his three-year deal with an AAV of $6.750 million and is entering an eight-year contract with an AAV of $9.5 million starting in 2022-23, which isn’t a cap-hit Boeser will receive. Zibanejad is in a similar situation as Boeser since he is coming off a five-year contract with an AAV of $5.350 million. If Zibanejad signs his next contract before Boeser, it will give both sides (the team and the player) an idea of how much the forward should receive. Unless Boeser scores 40+ goals next season, the Point comparison doesn’t work. The forward will have to have a career year to receive a contract with a cap-hit above $9 million. Meanwhile, the Connor and Kane deals are good comparisons for the term of Boeser’s next contract, while the Zibenajad deal could set the tone for the negotiations between the forward and the team. Projected Contract for Boeser The Canucks will likely have to offer Boeser a six to a seven-year contract with an AAV between $7.5-$8.5 million. If he signs a contract with a cap hit higher than $7.850 million, which is the AAV of Hughes’ six-year contract, he will carry the highest cap hit on the roster. “ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferlands_Head Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 50 minutes ago, aGENT said: He's almost at 1ppg since Bruce took over, so no. Since Bruce took over he's had 18PTS in 22GP which equals to 67 PT pace which is basically his career average. He's definitely improved from earlier in the season but it's more in line with his career average. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popular Post combover Posted February 20, 2022 Popular Post Share Posted February 20, 2022 41 minutes ago, RWJC said: I’m not looking for any reason, I’m providing legitimate reasons and concerns about a player who is about to potentially receive more money for less production. Total onboard with trading him if he won’t extend or wants the 7.5 mill Qualifying. but we’d be hard pressed to find a young goal scoring top 3 - 28 goals 58 point player for less than 6.5. kind of funny reading he’s slow a defensive liability trending the wrong way contract is to high but then post what teams should be willing pay for him. almost makes it sound like we should be paying for someone to take him. but reality is that qualifying offer hurts his value we’d be selling low. I think a lot of people will be disappointed with what he’d get as a return not because of the player boeser is but because of the contract situation. A playoff team might even consider him basically a rental with no intension of qualifying him. Moving miller would be guy that has the ability to change this franchise. Picks prospects cap selling high. 2 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ferlands_Head Posted February 20, 2022 Share Posted February 20, 2022 6 minutes ago, RWJC said: ok here ya go https://thehockeywriters.com/projecting-canucks-forward-boesers-next-contract/ “Boeser is in the final season of his three-year contract with an annual average value (AAV) of $5.875 million. He received the contract after posting 29 goals and 55 points in his rookie season and 26 goals and 56 points in his sophomore season. He will be a restricted free agent (RFA) this offseason. Since he signed his contract before the new CBA, his qualifying offer is based on his total salary, which is $7.5 million. It is hard to find contract comparables for Boeser. Other players with similar production last season include Kyle Connor, Evander Kane, Brayden Point and Mika Zibanejad. Connor received a seven-year contract with an AAV of $7.142 million. Kane earned a seven-year contract with an AAV of $7 million. Both Connor and Kane’s AAVs are tough to compare with Boeser since the starting point for his next contract will be at $7.5 million. Point is coming into the last season of his three-year deal with an AAV of $6.750 million and is entering an eight-year contract with an AAV of $9.5 million starting in 2022-23, which isn’t a cap-hit Boeser will receive. Zibanejad is in a similar situation as Boeser since he is coming off a five-year contract with an AAV of $5.350 million. If Zibanejad signs his next contract before Boeser, it will give both sides (the team and the player) an idea of how much the forward should receive. Unless Boeser scores 40+ goals next season, the Point comparison doesn’t work. The forward will have to have a career year to receive a contract with a cap-hit above $9 million. Meanwhile, the Connor and Kane deals are good comparisons for the term of Boeser’s next contract, while the Zibenajad deal could set the tone for the negotiations between the forward and the team. Projected Contract for Boeser The Canucks will likely have to offer Boeser a six to a seven-year contract with an AAV between $7.5-$8.5 million. If he signs a contract with a cap hit higher than $7.850 million, which is the AAV of Hughes’ six-year contract, he will carry the highest cap hit on the roster. “ I can agree with all your points except the little bit about Zibby. The problem with the Zibanejad angle is that he's a PPG Centre who has shown he can produce at a very high level that BB would probably never be capable of. I don't think BB is worth anything remotely close to Zibby IMO. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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