[Proposal] Contender to Reset

[86Viking]

it looked okay till I saw Baumgartner retained...please justify 1 reason why he should be kept??

[wallstreetamigo]

3 minutes ago, J-P said:

You could make case for Demko, especially earlier in the season. Hogs been good and even great at times but is still inconsistent (great player though and hopefully a bright future). OEL has been great every game though and makes the right play 9 times out of 10 both on O and D. If you don't see that we're just not watching the same games.

OEL has been good. I would not say great every game. He has taken some really dumb penalties that cost the team. He has provided next to no offense although that’s not entirely his fault with this dumb coach.

 

Hoglander gives his all every shift. He does more with less ice time than any player on this team.

[wallstreetamigo]

1 minute ago, Canuckster86 said:

it looked okay till I saw Baumgartner retained...please justify 1 reason why he should be kept??

He is a former Canuck.

[NMHockey]

1 minute ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Acclimated in 2 or 3 years? Ya that seems like a good plan after 8 years of hoping a coach will get acclimated.

 

Cooper actually learned how to coach though unlike Green.

 

Hansen has never coached anywhere. He is not qualified at this point on a team that needs experienced coaching. Malhotra has been mostly a development/skills coach. 
 

You have no actual evidence that the Sedins had any input on any moves that were made. 
 

Sorry, the next Canuck up approach to management will make the Canucks a bigger joke than they already are. Expand the search and hire the best people even if they never played for the Canucks.

Oh sorry? Did you think we’re going to contend at this rate in only 1 year? Cooper actually learned to coach yeah. Why can’t Malhotra? We’re not talking about Green.

Hansen would be an associate coach role stop stressing about him. For example Burrows had never coached anywhere either and now look at him. Helped get Montreal to the Final in his first stint as an assistant… Malhotra was working with the Canucks for a few years in development but has been a direct assistant coach for almost five years now so what are you talking about? I have no evidence the Sedins had any input on the moves made? How about the fact they’re very good friends with Ekman-Larsson and we’re specifically brought in to not only oversee Abbotsford but also watch over moves Benning makes.

[wallstreetamigo]

3 minutes ago, ZH96 said:

Maybe get your eyes looked at then.
Tanner Pearson has a career high in points since coming here and has not dropped off his two-way game. Tyler Myers has been given a tough time and has played no worse than anywhere else and also has used his size here more consistently than ever before. Justin Bailey is coming into his own and is a late bloomer who in an underrated way has improved the speed, size, effort, and puck retrieval ability of the bottom nine depth players. He’s played better here than he ever did in Buffalo and Philadelphia. Jaroslav Halak when called upon has been the best backup goaltender we’ve had since arguably

Cory Schneider. Thomas Vanek played like he was in his prime again while here, was a major influence on Horvat and Boeser, and then netted us Motte. Derek Dorsett led the league in PIMS here, was a top five enforcer, and had career highs in points here while also influencing in a very positive way towards the young players.

Tanner Pearson had a career high in points thanks to the 9 - count em 9 - empty net points he had that season. Outside of those he was a 3rd line level producer with top 6 and PP minutes. Every other year he has been garbage offensively and spotty defensively. 
 

Myers was far better early in his career, sorry to say.

 

Bailey skates fast but has shown he does next to nothing else. It’s why he is back in the minors.

 

Halak has been Halak. He isn’t any better than he has been. Arguably not as effective as he was for the Bruins. 
 

Vanek was way better earlier in his career too. 
 

Who cares about Motte and Dorsey. 4th liners getting better still means they are 4th liners. 
 

In 8 years, 1 guy significantly improving over his previous stops next to a whole bunch who got worse is not a good look for Benning.
 

 

[J-P]

15 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

OEL has been good. I would not say great every game. He has taken some really dumb penalties that cost the team. He has provided next to no offense although that’s not entirely his fault with this dumb coach.

 

Hoglander gives his all every shift. He does more with less ice time than any player on this team.

I think the penalities are a bit unfair as he generally suffer from other players mistakes.

 

Agree totally on Hogs making the most of what he's given. Been like that since day one of rookie training camp.

[NMHockey]

9 hours ago, DontMessMe said:

HELL FKING NO

Yeah maybe no to Baumgartner. All of this was just trying to be realistic and in the brains of these people. I assume Malhotra would want Baumer still as they coached together here for a few years and got along well.

[wallstreetamigo]

6 minutes ago, J-P said:

I think the penalities are a bit unfair as he generally suffer from other players mistakes.

 

Agree totally on Hogs making the most of what he's given. Been like that since day one of rookie training camp.

The ones caused by other players are different. It’s more the careless stick penalties I worry about. 

[NMHockey]

21 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Tanner Pearson had a career high in points thanks to the 9 - count em 9 - empty net points he had that season. Outside of those he was a 3rd line level producer with top 6 and PP minutes. Every other year he has been garbage offensively and spotty defensively. 
 

Myers was far better early in his career, sorry to say.

 

Bailey skates fast but has shown he does next to nothing else. It’s why he is back in the minors.

 

Halak has been Halak. He isn’t any better than he has been. Arguably not as effective as he was for the Bruins. 
 

Vanek was way better earlier in his career too. 
 

Who cares about Motte and Dorsey. 4th liners getting better still means they are 4th liners. 
 

In 8 years, 1 guy significantly improving over his previous stops next to a whole bunch who got worse is not a good look for Benning.
 

 

Pearson still matched his third highest point totals even without the empty netters, significantly improved coming here compared to his previous two seasons before, and that season he had the highest point totals yet was cut short due to Covid. So he still would have had a career year LOL. Every other year he has had an unappreciated impact on the locker room, young players, and 200 foot play and physicality. He brings cup winning experience, sneaky good cycling ability-trustworthy puck possession, and solid defensive work. Bailey has speed and aggression and was doing well disrupting McDavid and Draisaitl in preseason. He is a late bloomer and is only back in the minors because Green dislikes young players and now Motte is healthy. I don’t know what Halak you’ve watched but he was the reason we had a chance to win those very tight games we played with him in net. Vanek was just as good here as he was early in his career and I rest my case he got us Motte who isn’t just some 4th liner.

Edited November 23, 2021 by ZH96

[wallstreetamigo]

20 minutes ago, ZH96 said:

Oh sorry? Did you think we’re going to contend at this rate in only 1 year? Cooper actually learned to coach yeah. Why can’t Malhotra? We’re not talking about Green.

Hansen would be an associate coach role stop stressing about him. For example Burrows had never coached anywhere either and now look at him. Helped get Montreal to the Final in his first stint as an assistant… Malhotra was working with the Canucks for a few years in development but has been a direct assistant coach for almost five years now so what are you talking about? I have no evidence the Sedins had any input on the moves made? How about the fact they’re very good friends with Ekman-Larsson and we’re specifically brought in to not only oversee Abbotsford but also watch over moves Benning makes.

The point is this team needs coaches who already know how to coach, not on the job trainees. 

Malhotra is a nice guy and a good coach. He just isn’t ready to take over this team by any stretch. Hansen isn’t ready to jump right onto an nhl bench. 
 

The Sedins weren’t brought in to “oversee” Benning or Abbotsford and no one has ever said any such thing. They were brought in as entry level guys to learn. They aren’t experienced at all in management.
 

Being friends with a guy doesn’t mean they had input on anything. Benning was after OEL long before they got hired. It cost him Tanev and Toffoli the previous summer, remember?

[wallstreetamigo]

6 minutes ago, ZH96 said:

Pearson still matched his third highest point totals even without the empty netters, significantly improved coming here compared to his previous two seasons before, and that season he had the highest point totals yet was cut short due to Covid. So he still would have had a career year LOL. Every other year he has had an unappreciated impact on the locker room, young players, and 200 foot play and physicality. He brings cup winning experience, sneaky good cycling ability-trustworthy puck possession, and solid defensive work. Bailey has speed and aggression and was doing well disrupting McDavid and Draisaitl in preseason. He is a late bloomer and is only back in the minors because Green dislikes young players and now Motte is healthy. I don’t know what Halak you’ve watched but he was the reason we had a chance to win those very tight games we played with him in net. Vanek was just as good here as he was early in his career and I rest my case he got us Motte who isn’t just some 4th liner.

Lol Pearson getting spoon fed top 6 and pp minutes and producing like a 3rd liner offensively is a good thing now? He has had one marginally good season in the last 3 and now 4 including this one so far. He is pretty much the definition of meh.

 

Pearson is the definition of what is wrong with this team. Self entitled and gifted opportunities by the coach that at best he earns one or two shifts a game before completely disappearing for the rest. He is the first player who should be shipped out.

 

You are really stretching hard to find examples of players who have gotten better since coming to Van if you are relying on Motte (turned out to be a good 4th line energy guy but is super overrated on cdc). Bailey is an ahl quality player. 
 

I don’t know what Halak you watched before this year but he has been the same as previous years minus the actual results. 

Edited November 23, 2021 by wallstreetamigo

[NMHockey]

1 minute ago, wallstreetamigo said:

The point is this team needs coaches who already know how to coach, not on the job trainees. 

Malhotra is a nice guy and a good coach. He just isn’t ready to take over this team by any stretch. Hansen isn’t ready to jump right onto an nhl bench. 
 

The Sedins weren’t brought in to “oversee” Benning or Abbotsford and no one has ever said any such thing. They were brought in as entry level guys to learn. They aren’t experienced at all in management.
 

Being friends with a guy doesn’t mean they had input on anything. Benning was after OEL long before they got hired. It cost him Tanev and Toffoli the previous summer, remember?

Like I said you could say Jon Cooper wasn’t ready to take over either. Neither was Kyle Gustafson who we just hired. So why can’t Malhotra and Hansen? The Sedins were brought in to give input on what Benning does because fans were calling for Bennings head and Aquilini knew that Bennings scouting ability combined with the Sedins knowledge could balance things out and would calm the fan base seeing how they adore the Sedins. And yes they were also brought in to watch over Abbotsford with Ryan Johnson. Here’s the article below talking about how part of their responsibilities is such. The Sedins themselves also talked about it in an interview after being hired. And yes in this case the Sedins connection to Ekman-Larsson played into it. It’s why the deal got done this year and not the one previous as you said. Tanev and Toffoli were never going to be kept anyways. Tanev and Markstrom planned to sign in Calgary together for awhile and Markstrom only agreed to sign there if the Flames signed Tanev too. Plus the Flames overpaid for Tanev anyways so who cares. Toffoli was let go because at the time Virtanen was a young power forward coming off a breakout year in points who was also cheaper and Benning chose him. Like I said. Get those eyes checked.
 

[NMHockey]

3 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Lol Pearson getting spoon fed top 6 and pp minutes and producing like a 3rd liner offensively is a good thing now? He has had one marginally good season in the last 3 and now 4 including this one so far. He is pretty much the definition of meh.

 

Pearson is the definition of what is wrong with this team. Self entitled and gifted opportunities by the coach that at best he earns one or two shifts a game before completely disappearing for the rest. He is the first player who should be shipped out.

 

You are really stretching hard to find examples of players who have gotten better since coming to Van if you are relying on Motte (turned out to be a good 4th line energy guy but is super overrated on cdc). Bailey is an ahl quality player. 
 

I don’t know what Halak you watched before this year but he has been the same as previous years minus the actual results. 

Pearson isn’t flashy but he makes linemates better because he’s responsible and smart. He’d had multiple 20 goal and 35-40 point seasons on LA before coming here from

Pittsburgh. And was a major part of LAs Stanley Cup winning SECOND LINE with Pearson-Carter-Toffoli. Stretching hard? I gave examples of players who’ve come here and elevated their skillsets from every part of the last 12 years. From top pairing D and PP1 snipers to support D and two-way depth forwards. Read the list again. Halak has been solid and Ian Clark who is the best goaltending coach in the world and who our fanbase threatened Benning over; specifically told management to bring Halak in. You really think they’re going to bring in some schmuck that will negatively affect Demkos development? Motte is underrated because he’s not a 20 goal scorer. He’s not overrated. In terms of his two-way play, speed, aggression, effect on teammates and game flow as well as PK ability, he’s a top ten in the league in that aspect. There’s a reason teams started calling on him over a year ago. Get real man.

[GB5]

10 hours ago, ZH96 said:

Staff

1. Jim Benning relieved as GM.
    {

    Markus Naslund hired as
    President of Hockey Operations and GM.

 

2. John Weisbrod relieved as Assistant GM.

    {

    Henrik Sedin promoted to Assistant GM.

 

3. Chris Gear relieved as Assistant GM.

    {

    Daniel Sedin promoted to Assistant GM.

    {

    Chris Gear hired as Senior Advisor to GM      (while remaining Chief Legal Officer).

 

5. Stan Smyl promoted to Senior Advisor to  GM (while remaining Senior Advisor of  Canucks Hockey-Business Operations).

{

Derek Dorsett hired as Senior Advisor.

6. Travis Green relieved as Head Coach.

    {
    Manny Malhotra hired as Head Coach.

 

7. Brad Shaw retained as Assistant Coach.

 

8. Jason King relieved as Assistant Coach.

    {

    Guy Boucher hired as Assistant Coach.

 

9. Nolan Baumgartner retained as Assistant Coach.
    

10. Kyle Gustafson relieved as Associate Coach.

    {
    Jannik Hansen hired as Associate Coach.

 

Roster’s

1. Wild acquires: F J.T. Miller

                            W Alex Chiasson

    Canucks acquire: W Kevin Fiala

                                 F Nick Bjugstad     
                               2nd Round Draft Pick 2022

                               7th Round Draft Pick 2023

 

 

2. Devils acquire: D Quinn Hughes

 

    Canucks acquire: D Jonas Siegenthaler

                                 F Fabian Zetterlund

                                1st Round Draft Pick 2023

                               2nd Round Draft Pick 2023

 

3. Avalanche acquires: W Brock Boeser

 

    Canucks acquire: F Tyson Jost

           (Conditional) 1st Round Draft Pick 2024

     

 

4. Canucks acquire: D Marcus Pettersson

 

    Penguins acquire: D Guillaume Brisebois

                               2nd Round Draft Pick 2024

 

 

N.Hoglander -E.Pettersson- C.Garland

K.Fiala -B.Horvat- V.Podkolzin

T.Pearson -T.Jost- N.Bjugstad

J.Lammikko -Ja.Dickinson- Ju.Bailey

M.Highmore                         F.Zetterlund

                                          

 

O.Ekman-Larsson - T.Poolman

M.Pettersson - T.Myers

J.Siegenthaler - L.Schenn

J.Rathbone - K.Burroughs

 

T.Demko

J.Halak

 

EDIT: Adding another 1st in 2023 and 2024 and another 2nd in 2023 is to stock up for a massive run at the 1st overall pick in 2023 (if we don’t have it) to bring in the next generational star and hometown boy Connor Bedard. For example something like

 

Coyotes/Blackhawks/Kraken/Senators/

Blue Jackets acquire(‘s):

                  F Bo Horvat

D Tucker Poolman OR D Marcus Pettersson

                  G Arturs Silovs

                  D Joni Jurmo

                  W William Lockwood

                  1st Round Draft Pick 2023 (VAN)

                  1st Round Draft Pick 2023 (NJD)

                  1st Round Draft Pick 2024 (COL) 2nd Round Draft Pick 2023 (High of VAN/NJD)

                   

 

The only hiring that makes sense is Guy Boucher but he would have to be the Head Coach.

 

Other than that, ex players should not be prime candidates for front office jobs. This team needs to hire the best person for the job regardless of their background.

 

The team president and GM should not be yes men and be willing to defend their position against their bosses the owners if they want to succeed.

[wallstreetamigo]

25 minutes ago, ZH96 said:

Pearson isn’t flashy but he makes linemates better because he’s responsible and smart. He’d had multiple 20 goal and 35-40 point seasons on LA before coming here from

Pittsburgh. And was a major part of LAs Stanley Cup winning SECOND LINE with Pearson-Carter-Toffoli. Stretching hard? I gave examples of players who’ve come here and elevated their skillsets from every part of the last 12 years. From top pairing D and PP1 snipers to support D and two-way depth forwards. Read the list again. Halak has been solid and Ian Clark who is the best goaltending coach in the world and who our fanbase threatened Benning over; specifically told management to bring Halak in. You really think they’re going to bring in some schmuck that will negatively affect Demkos development? Motte is underrated because he’s not a 20 goal scorer. He’s not overrated. In terms of his two-way play, speed, aggression, effect on teammates and game flow as well as PK ability, he’s a top ten in the league in that aspect. There’s a reason teams started calling on him over a year ago. Get real man.

Lol you are clueless.

 

Multiple 20 goal seasons on LA? I see one.

 

Gretzky was pretty awesome back in the day too. Might want to sign him. 
 

You said players who have been better here since coming here. That’s not any of the guys you mentioned other than Miller and possibly Motte and guys who were brought in before Benning was even here. 
 

Motte is a good player and probably the only example on your list outside of Miller who got better coming here. But he is still a 4th liner and incredibly overrated on cdc. Top 10 in the league? Lol He is injured more than he is in the lineup. Would other teams want him? Sure. But you make it sound like teams are clamouring to pay a kings ransom for him.
 

Halak is just Halak. He isn’t magically better here than he was anywhere else. 

Edited November 23, 2021 by wallstreetamigo

[NMHockey]

28 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Lol you are clueless.

 

Gretzky was pretty awesome back in the day too. Might want to sign him. 
 

You said players who have been better here since coming here. That’s not any of the guys you mentioned other than Miller and possibly Motte and guys who were brought in before Benning was even here. 
 

Motte is a good player and probably the only example on your list outside of Miller who got better coming here. But he is still a 4th liner and incredibly overrated on cdc. Top 10 in the league? Lol He is injured more than he is in the lineup. Would other teams want him? Sure. But you make it sound like teams are clamouring to pay a kings ransom for him.
 

Halak is just Halak. He isn’t magically better here than he was anywhere else. 

Clueless? Lol maybe learn to read and read over everything. What does Gretzky have to do with Guy Boucher and Manny Malhotra?

Miller and Motte have been the only players that got better since coming here under Benning?

 

Say hello to..

Oliver Ekman-Larsson (Best D-man on the team, heady, always gets shots through, waits for big hits, runs PP, has re-surged his career)

 

Conor Garland (Enough said)

 

Luke Schenn (Leader, makes Hughes better and has done that on two occasions now, steady, beat up Zack MacEwen and drew a penalty at the same time LOL. When he’s back it will be huge)

Tucker Poolman (+5 and 3 points in 16 games {2 in his last four}, steady, plays an all-around style and will get better with time)

Tanner Pearson (Leader, career high points here, has settled Horvat and taken defensive pressure off him, cup ring, unmatched locker room presence)

 

Kyle Burroughs (Better every game. Biega 2.0)

Justin Bailey (Late bloomer and was disrupting McDavid and Draisaitl in preseason. Fast as anyone once he gets going. Physical)

Antoine Roussel (Career high points before knee injury, underrated how impactful he was to the bench and young players. Elite pest and drove other teams insane)

 

Thomas Vanek (Helped Horvat and Boeser come along and netted us Motte. Racked points here)

 

Jussi Jokinen (10 points in 14 games after coming here and was great for Horvat and Boeser)

 

Josh Leivo (Went to another level after coming here. Knee injury ruined him)

 

Derek Dorsett (Career high in points here. Led league in PIMS. Unmatched on young player and game momentum influence)

 

Oscar Fantenberg (Played his best NHL hockey here and was the best bottom pairing LHD we’ve had. He’s exactly what we need behind Ekman-Larsson and Hughes right now)

Markus Granlund (Everyone ripped Benning for trading Shinkaruk for him but he was a top three PKer, netted a 19 goal season, played all situations decently)

 

Sven Baertschi (Sure we could’ve had Rasmus Andersson with that pick but without Baertschis concussions he had multiple seasons of pushing 40-50 point pace and was great for Bo)

Emerson Etem (Was great for Bo. Broke out briefly here. A win in the Jensen-Etem swap)

 

I’ll throw in that Benning drafted 

Pettersson, Demko, Hughes, Podkolzin, Boeser, Hoglander, Klimovich, Rathbone, Lockwood, DiPietro, Silovs. That counts as players that improved since joining the team.

Edited November 23, 2021 by ZH96

[Coconuts]

We already did the bunch of rookies in coaching and management, why would we want to do the rookies thing again? 

 

Naslund's never been an NHL GM, the SHL is a different animal. Why would he leave Sweden for this? You're assuming he'd even want this.

 

The twins are still getting their feet wet, and Dorsett? Really? He's done nothing to qualify him for a management role.

 

Manny's got about four years experience as an assistant, has never been a head coach at any level, and you want to hand him the reigns? Seriously?

 

Why the hell would we retain a failed part of Green's staff in Baumgartner? For Manny? On the off chance Manny did happen we'd be better off surrounding him with more experienced assistants. Get Baumer the hell out of here. 

 

Hansen's done nothing besides be an NHL player to qualify him for a coaching role. Most players don't jump right into NHL coaching, even Burr started in the AHL.

 

Under no circumstances should we be stocking our management and coaching staff with a bunch of inexperience again. This former Canuck nepotism is tiresome. Bring in people who've already had experience in these roles. 

 

Edited November 23, 2021 by Coconuts

[NMHockey]

2 hours ago, Canuckster86 said:

it looked okay till I saw Baumgartner retained...please justify 1 reason why he should be kept??

All of this was just trying to be realistic and in the brains of these people. I assume Malhotra would want Baumer still as they coached together here for a few years and got along well.

[NMHockey]

36 minutes ago, Coconuts said:

We already did the bunch of rookies in coaching and management, why would we want to do the rookies thing again? 

 

Naslund's never been an NHL GM, the SHL is a different animal. Why would he leave Sweden for this? You're assuming he'd even want this.

 

The twins are still getting their feet wet, and Dorsett? Really? He's done nothing to qualify him for a management role.

 

Manny's got about four years experience as an assistant, has never been a head coach at any level, and you want to hand him the reigns? Seriously?

 

Why the hell would we retain a failed part of Green's staff in Baumgartner? For Manny? On the off chance Manny did happen we'd be better off surrounding him with more experienced assistants. Get Baumer the hell out of here. 

 

Hansen's done nothing besides be an NHL player to qualify him for a coaching role. Most players don't jump right into NHL coaching, even Burr started in the AHL.

 

Under no circumstances should we be stocking our management and coaching staff with a bunch of inexperience again. This former Canuck nepotism is tiresome. Bring in people who've already had experience in these roles. 

 

Jon Cooper, Doug Jarvis, Alex Burrows,

Bill Zito, Kyle Dubas.. just to name a few all had respectively little to no managerial/coaching experience before they were thrown into the fire. They’re doing quite well…

[Coconuts]

10 minutes ago, ZH96 said:

Jon Cooper, Doug Jarvis, Alex Burrows,

Bill Zito, Kyle Dubas.. just to name a few all had respectively little to no managerial/coaching experience before they were thrown into the fire. They’re doing quite well…

And were there all thrown into the fire together as inexperienced NHL employees? Because even with a few current pieces of management sticking around that's a helluva lot of experience at once. 

 

Benning was a rookie GM who's had eight years, we've had two rookie head coaches in a row. You really think ownership is going to be able to sell the fanbase on yet more inexperience being plugged into key positions? We're already staring down another potential retool.