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[Rumour] Bo Horvat Trade/Contract Talks


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17 minutes ago, combover said:

It’s Pretty simple they signed the wrong guy in the summer. 
 

i wonder who will take the 700+ faceoffs  horvats taken so far this season… 2nd in the league in wins. 
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I believe the team's intention was and is to re-sign Horvat.

 

The Canucks did the right thing in retaining Miller. He has been a beast in his own ways, he's getting crapped on because he is locked up which is both ironic and disappointing to see from the fans.

 

Don't think a garbage contract of a lesser player re: Myers is going to be why Horvat doesn't remain in Vancouver.

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Knowing he’s working on his shot with Oates changed my perspective on his outburst of goals this year. Looks less like he’s working harder in a contract year (which I’m sure is still part of it), and more like he’s legitimately improving his skills. 
 

If he can be a top 10 scorer over the next 3-4 years, I’d be okay with 7 or 8 years x $8.5M contract. Just need to move out one large contract for a lesser return.

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5 minutes ago, Nicklas Bo Hunter said:

I am honestly surprised a move has not been made yet. I thought raty getting a look in the nhl meant a deal was pretty close between nyi and van. 

I imagine there isn't a trade while we're still going through the Christmas break. Perhaps Jan. 3rd?

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13 minutes ago, Nicklas Bo Hunter said:

I am honestly surprised a move has not been made yet. I thought raty getting a look in the nhl meant a deal was pretty close between nyi and van. 

Hope you’re right. They have the space and motivation to make the first trade after the break. Imagine if it’s Miller for Bailey, Raty and a 1st.

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For the folks who want to see a deal where Van sells off some vet piece(s):

 

A big point in our favour is the current, competitive parity. Last season, especially out east, there was a Grand Canyon-esque divide between the haves & nots. The top-8 were bloody well etched in stone in Nov! There are several hopefuls not too far back of the Conf #5 - #9 ranking logjam. Perhaps 8 or 9 teams fighting, with aspirations for the last 4 eastern PO positions.

 

We really need to sell off(at least) three vets in the next coupla' months. They should start ASAP!

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3 hours ago, Provost said:

These moves need to happen now.  Looking at the next three weeks of our schedule, it is really tough and isn’t going to be a span where our players likely pile on production.

 

This is the high water mark for value.

Fair, but cap space will prorate to allow more moves in two months. 

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If Bo wants 8.5M I think we can haggle him down to say 8M or 8.25M easily. Surely Kuzmenko doesn't sign for more than 6M, and a bridge deal would be wise. So basically we need to find 8M in cap space to re-sign these guys (taking into consideration Bo at 5M and Kuz at 1M right now on our cap).

 

The easy options are moving some of the big contracts out like Boeser (6.6M), Garland (5M), Pearson (3.2M) or Myers (6M) but obviously we have to take some cap coming back, and ideally some sort of help on defence, but it certainly can be done. I worry management don't have the JB-esque balls to pull of multiple trades, which is what they'd have to do to be able to fix the defence AND clear cap space. If Miller comes into play things get more interesting.

 

A simple solution for this weak management is to just trade Boeser for Severson or Dumba, and then as their cap comes off the books in the off-season, they can decide to change things up if they want or stick with the defenceman at a lower cap hit.

 

I also worry management will go for a win-soon type trade with Bo and we may not get a 1st back. I think they'll be looking at hockey trades, like getting a young center and defenceman back. There's plenty of packages which could work out there - Carlo + Zacha, Peeke + Kuraly/Roslovic, Girard + Newhook. There's a lot of quality coming back though so it won't be a good pick, probably a 2nd or 3rd or maybe even nothing.

 

If there is any sort of similar trade for Miller, you have to hope management jump at it. He's scoring at a 70 point pace now and on a 8M contract which is rediculous. Heck, I'd even do Miller for Severson (plus maybe a pick if they're feeling generous?) 1-for-1 and then we've got a lot more wiggle room in the off-season.

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Really not sure why management decided to re-sign Miller early and high, after he just dropped a 99 point season when his contract expires this year. Absolute dumb move, they should have waited it out, there was no rush to trade or sign him last year. They really should have seen if he could back up that offence - which he clearly can't - and then made a decision. If he somehow dropped another 100pt year this year then fair enough, pay the man, trade him or let him walk, but the chance of him doing that was always going to be so slim. They knew they had Bo to re-sign this off-season and anything could happen, so rather than rushing the Miller signing they should have waited.

 

It would have been uncomfortable having to sign two top centers, sure, but it would have given them more information and more flexibility to re-sign the better center and trade the worse one. Now we're looking at retaining the worse one and trading or losing the better, younger center as a result of their rash decision to re-sign him a year early after he'd come off a career year. Smart move by Miller's agent, he walked all over the noobie Allvin. Such a rookie mistake by a GM.

 

You'd like to think any savvy GM, even the cap-silly JB, wouldn't have signed a guy right off a 99 point season when it's not even his contract year. 

 

If we hadn't re-signed Miller last year we'd have some real options this year. We could flip Miller for a top-4 defenceman quite easily (for Severson or Dumba really come to mind, 1-for-1 likeness in cap and ability) or a pick/prospect to a contender or heck, even let him walk would be a better option. All of these options mean we re-sign Horvat.

 

Now because of management's lack of patience and being pressured into a trade/signing last year, we're going to lose our captain...

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8 minutes ago, DownUndaCanuck said:

Really not sure why management decided to re-sign Miller early and high, after he just dropped a 99 point season when his contract expires this year. Absolute dumb move, they should have waited it out, there was no rush to trade or sign him last year. They really should have seen if he could back up that offence - which he clearly can't - and then made a decision. If he somehow dropped another 100pt year this year then fair enough, pay the man, trade him or let him walk, but the chance of him doing that was always going to be so slim. They knew they had Bo to re-sign this off-season and anything could happen, so rather than rushing the Miller signing they should have waited.

 

It would have been uncomfortable having to sign two top centers, sure, but it would have given them more information and more flexibility to re-sign the better center and trade the worse one. Now we're looking at retaining the worse one and trading or losing the better, younger center as a result of their rash decision to re-sign him a year early after he'd come off a career year. Smart move by Miller's agent, he walked all over the noobie Allvin. Such a rookie mistake by a GM.

 

You'd like to think any savvy GM, even the cap-silly JB, wouldn't have signed a guy right off a 99 point season when it's not even his contract year. 

 

If we hadn't re-signed Miller last year we'd have some real options this year. We could flip Miller for a top-4 defenceman quite easily (for Severson or Dumba really come to mind, 1-for-1 likeness in cap and ability) or a pick/prospect to a contender or heck, even let him walk would be a better option. All of these options mean we re-sign Horvat.

 

Now because of management's lack of patience and being pressured into a trade/signing last year, we're going to lose our captain...

The team was as patient as one can be waiting until September to sign Miller.

 

Miller locked up does not mean Horvat cannot be.

 

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2 hours ago, Mike Vanderhoek said:

The team was as patient as one can be waiting until September to sign Miller.

 

Miller locked up does not mean Horvat cannot be.

 

But Miller had 1 more year on his contract, expiring at the same time as Bo's, so why not wait until then?

 

I know there's a way they can keep both but it would realistically mean they have to move a lot of cap around. Bo deserves 8-8.5M, and Miller's extension kicks in next year too. That's just under 6M in cap space we don't currently have. The easy solution is to make one or two trades, but in any trade, we have to take cap back. There's unlikely to be a Boeser/Myers for 1st/2nd round pick trade out there, because no team can just eat 6M in cap space, especially contenders. 

 

I think it'll sadly be easier for management to just trade Bo and acquire a young center and defenceman, rather than trade Boeser/Garland/Myers/Pearson, acquire some decent defensive support back and then re-sign Bo to a team-friendly contract.

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2 hours ago, ilduce39 said:

Miller to Carolina for Kotkaniemi.  
 

Than Bo to the Rags for Lafreniere + whatever to make the cap work.

Carolina needs a 2C. That's Bo, not Miller. We also don't really need Kotkaniemi. Prefer something around Drury, Morrow etc

 

Miller would be a better fit in places like Calgary, Islanders etc.

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14 hours ago, Provost said:

These moves need to happen now.  Looking at the next three weeks of our schedule, it is really tough and isn’t going to be a span where our players likely pile on production.

 

This is the high water mark for value.

My thinking is, they need to get it done by the end of January.

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