Quinn Hughes is turning into a Star

[Rindiculous]

18 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Maybe some of those players are better because they play with Makar though?

 

The difference I see between Makar and Hughes (and both are incredible talents) is that Makar makes other players around him better. Hughes hasn’t quite hit that level yet but I fully expect he will be that guy eventually. 

It always goes both ways.  While I haven’t watched Makar this year, he had a terrible start to the year with all of Colorado’s top players out.  Then when they get back he gets better.  It also went the opposite way last year.  Analytically, the top line for the Avs last year were much worse when Makar wasn’t on the ice and Makar was much worse without the Avs top line on the ice

[J.I.A.H.N]

4 minutes ago, IBatch said:

Absolutely.    Miller is peaking now.   What will Brock's peak look like, and whom should or will get the better deal next time.   Agree a six year deal is where it should land unless he goes to market and then who the heck knows.   Brock plays an easier position to fill.   But the idea is to score goals and he's still got enough time to become the 35-45 goal scorer we all imagined him to be his rookie year.   It's not easy to score in this league ... his shot is elite.   All-star game MVP isn't easy to do ... he did it as a rookie.     Miller is easy to add to any team and make it better because he plays C and LW.    To me his best comp is Stastny.   And feel he's for 4/5 good years left in him right now for sure.   And for sure the better player.    To me it comes down to cap all the time.   Miller is great because he punches above his pay scale.   If he was getting 8.5-9 we'd be saying no thanks wouldn't we?   He's sure playing in that category.   And not many players sustain that level until they are 36-38.   The Sedins couldn't.   Naslund couldn't, Linden couldn't.   Bure didn't make it.  Neither did Mogilny for that matter.   Sundin did.   Messier did until 35/36 when we signed him lol - and he's no Messier.    Stastny pro-rated maybe his deal is now would be in the 7 range.   Food for thought so yes i agree Janis, it's rare a player is that good for that long.   Might as well enjoy it while we have it, and who knows maybe he loves it here and would do a deal 7 x 6 - and in that case we'd be ok. 

Well, hooooold on there,  Bobalouie!  (gotta be the wrong spelling)

 

So 3/4 years of Miller is more important than 7 years of Boeser and a returning asset? I am not sure about that. Now if it is just the next 4 years........I am all in, but it is not

 

We need JR to sign in and answer that? I guess if you trade Boeser now, you get his asset, so there is that. We always talk like GMing is so easy, but wow, there are alot of

 

variables!

[Rindiculous]

4 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Well, hooooold on there,  Bobalouie!  (gotta be the wrong spelling)

 

So 3/4 years of Miller is more important than 7 years of Boeser and a returning asset? I am not sure about that. Now if it is just the next 4 years........I am all in, but it is not

 

We need JR to sign in and answer that? I guess if you trade Boeser now, you get his asset, so there is that. We always talk like GMing is so easy, but wow, there are alot of

 

variables!

Or we just keep both.  There are other ways we could maneuver around the cap to keep our entire core together, although that would probably require basically pulling a Toronto and get league minimum guys on the fourth line and third pairing,

[J.I.A.H.N]

8 minutes ago, Rindiculous said:

Or we just keep both.  There are other ways we could maneuver around the cap to keep our entire core together, although that would probably require basically pulling a Toronto and get league minimum guys on the fourth line and third pairing,

Yes, but then comes the "where is the #1/2 RHD?" question and how we acquire him. Do we just draft and wait 2 more years of junior, then hope he is ready 2/3 years after that?

 

Beacuse that is 5 years off of Boesers and Millers shelf life. Can we be a top 10 with out that? maybe we are better off trading our 2022-1st during the draft and getting a RHD that is 2/3 years along the road? 

 

 

Edited December 23, 2021 by J.I.A.H.N

[Rindiculous]

6 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Yes, but then comes the "where is the #1/2 RHD?" question and how we acquire him. Do we just draft and wait 2 more years of junior, then hope he is ready 2/3 years after that?

 

Beacuse that is 5 years off of Boesers and Millers shelf life. Can we be a top 10 with out that? maybe we are better off trading our 2022-1st during the draft and getting a RHD that is 2/3 years along the road? 

 

 

Our right side isn’t that bad compared to other cup winners.  Do you think Tampa’s right side was significantly better than ours currently the last two years?  How I always see top teams in todays day and age is by having one really good offensive defense side (for us it’s Hughes and OEL on our left side just like Hedman and McDonough in Tampa) while having a more stay at home other side.  The difference is we have Myers which is better than Tampa could boast on their right side.  So a RD isn’t our be all end all and our defense has been stellar this year for the most part and even better under BB.

 

So I don’t think we really need to worry about a good RD.  Not many teams boast many good RD so it is not the be all end all.  It’ll probably be important to find a Myers replacement in 3 years but that’s 6 mill worth of cap space to do that with.

[JM_]

1 hour ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Yeah, I been trying to figure out how a GM would work through this............

 

This is what I have come up with............let's just say this for the example

 

Miller.............30 at next contract........................we sign him for 6 years.....................and he is done, and not worth re-signing at 36

 

Boeser..........25 at next contract........................we sign him for 7 years.....................is he done at 32, or do we sign or trade before?

 

Both guys are signed until 2029......................

 

So which one provides the better deal?

Which one provides the better contribution throughout the entire contract

and who can be moved to give us additional assets near  the end.

 

I really struggle with this. I like all our shinny toys! But a re-alignment of assets may make a difference down the road...........can I suffer through more down years, will I have to?

 

This is when JR will truly make his money

 

 

 

That's it Jan, its really not an easy call. 

 

The only way to keep them both is to trade all our dead or less effective cap hits to Buffalo for our 1st.

 

But even that doesn't fill our RHD or 3C holes.

[wallstreetamigo]

3 hours ago, Rindiculous said:

It always goes both ways.  While I haven’t watched Makar this year, he had a terrible start to the year with all of Colorado’s top players out.  Then when they get back he gets better.  It also went the opposite way last year.  Analytically, the top line for the Avs last year were much worse when Makar wasn’t on the ice and Makar was much worse without the Avs top line on the ice

Pretty sure that metric would hold true for pretty much every top player. Play better with better players seems like kind of a no brainer. Makar imo is better (at this point) than Hughes at making the players around him more effective. Hughes is very skilled individually and creates offensive chances out of thin air but it feels more individual than cohesive with all of his teammates. On the PP he only really uses 2 or 3 different plays almost all the time. There is room for his creativity to shine. 

[KyGuy123]

Crazy how he doesn’t have a Xfactor in NHL 22. How is he not there with skating, blows my mind.

Edited December 24, 2021 by KyGuy123

[Rindiculous]

6 hours ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Pretty sure that metric would hold true for pretty much every top player. Play better with better players seems like kind of a no brainer. Makar imo is better (at this point) than Hughes at making the players around him more effective. Hughes is very skilled individually and creates offensive chances out of thin air but it feels more individual than cohesive with all of his teammates. On the PP he only really uses 2 or 3 different plays almost all the time. There is room for his creativity to shine. 

I'd probably agree if I watched both players.  I'm gonna have to watch some Avs games after the break to see how good Makar really is.  I bet both are better in different ways.  For example, I don't know if there is a defenseman in the league who is better than Hughes at the first pass out of the defensive zone.  Every single time it's always right on the guy's tape.  Makar is really good at scoring goals so I bet he has one of the best shots as a defenseman.  I'll watch and see what Makar is best at.

Edited December 24, 2021 by Rindiculous

[iceman64]

On 12/8/2021 at 11:10 PM, *Buzzsaw* said:

I will admit I had my doubts last year with all the defensive gaffes that Hughes made and his struggles with turnovers.

 

But this year he has almost completely put that all behind him.  As lots have commented, his D-Zone play is hugely improved, he is learning to apply his skating superiority and use it in place of physical presence.  Instead of trying to muscle opponents off the puck, he is skating them off the puck... just getting position and then using his stick to separate the puck.

 

And even while his D-Game has improved by leaps and bounds, his offensive skill set has remained star level... the ease with which he controls the puck in the O-Zone and distributes passes, and keeps the opponent from clearing is continuing to improve.

 

I can't say how much I am impressed with this kids play... he is a Star in the making... number is gonna be up there in the rafters if he keeps it up. 

He still needs to improve his reads but he's gotten noticably better but that will come with time. The only other thing I can think of is his passing choices, sometimes does longer higher risk passes when shorter low risk passes move the puck out safer but the rest of the D has struggled there too with the same thing and missing stretch passes more often than not but overall it's getting there as well and thennnnn there's our boy Demko being there game in game out but we can't keep depending on him standing on his head all the time. D has to get better along with a 200 ft game by everyone. 

How long will it take to get there? now there's a good question.

 Meh.. anyway, Hughie is still young and will get better. Have no doubt he's nowhere close to his end potential.

 

[MaxVerstappen33]

On 12/21/2021 at 9:19 PM, wallstreetamigo said:

If I had to choose one I would choose Makar hands down. Hughes is awesome but Makar is still better imo. 

You just proved my point. This is a Hughs thread and Hughs plays on our team. Nobody cares that you'd rather have Makar. 

[wallstreetamigo]

3 minutes ago, MaxVerstappen33 said:

You just proved my point. This is a Hughs thread and Hughs plays on our team. Nobody cares that you'd rather have Makar. 

Like always, you generally have no point.

 

Dont you have some hair to tear out panicking about all the moves Rutherford hasn’t made yet that you are sure he would have 5 min after taking over for your hero Benning?

 

Anyone who has watched both of them play and has a functioning brain that understands hockey would want Makar over Hughes at this point. 

 

 

Edited December 24, 2021 by wallstreetamigo

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, MaxVerstappen33 said:

You just proved my point. This is a Hughs thread and Hughs plays on our team. Nobody cares that you'd rather have Makar. 

Absolutely!  Hughes is actually better.  He drives play by passing.  Makar is a “look at me Go mommy” puck carrying guy.  

[Alflives]

Just now, wallstreetamigo said:

Like always, you generally have no point.

 

Dont you have some hair to tear out panicking about all the moves Rutherford hasn’t made yet that you are sure he would have 5 min after taking over for your hero Benning?

 

 

No need to troll by pumping up other teams’ young players, while disparaging ours.  

Go to the Av’s home board and criticize our great young player.  

Be a true fan. 

[wallstreetamigo]

1 minute ago, Alflives said:

Absolutely!  Hughes is actually better.  He drives play by passing.  Makar is a “look at me Go mommy” puck carrying guy.  

See, my point above is proven right here. 
 

Hughes isn’t suddenly better because people can’t bring themselves to objectively assess other young guys like Makar, Chychrun, etc. 

 

Ask Sakic if he would trade Makar straight up for Hughes. The response you are likely to get should tell you which is actually better. 

[wallstreetamigo]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

No need to troll by pumping up other teams’ young players, while disparaging ours.  

Go to the Av’s home board and criticize our great young player.  

Be a true fan. 

Once again (for the millionth time) being a true fan has nothing to do with unrealistically putting down better players on other teams. It just makes you look insecure about our players actually. 

[Alflives]

1 minute ago, wallstreetamigo said:

See, my point above is proven right here. 
 

Hughes isn’t suddenly better because people can’t bring themselves to objectively assess other young guys like Makar, Chychrun, etc. 

 

Ask Sakic if he would trade Makar straight up for Hughes. The response you are likely to get should tell you which is actually better. 

Then I’d cheer for the guy on our team.  I’m a true fan, who puts our players (especially are young core guys who are our hope for a Cup one day) over other teams’ players.  I don’t troll our home board criticize our young stars while expressing love for other teams’ players.  

Be a true fan!  Embrace the hate!  

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, wallstreetamigo said:

Once again (for the millionth time) being a true fan has nothing to do with unrealistically putting down better players on other teams. It just makes you look insecure about our players actually. 

Being a true fan is putting your team’s young stars (who your team’s future depends on) ahead of other teams’ comparables.  

To disparage Hughes, while promoting another team’s comparable is not being a true fan.  

Be a true fan!  Embrace the hate.  

[wallstreetamigo]

4 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Being a true fan is putting your team’s young stars (who your team’s future depends on) ahead of other teams’ comparables.  

To disparage Hughes, while promoting another team’s comparable is not being a true fan.  

Be a true fan!  Embrace the hate.  

I am a fan of hockey. The Canucks are my team but I can recognize that other talented players and teams are better.

 

Under your logic, saying Petterssen is better than McDavid makes someone a “true fan”. In reality it just makes them an idiot.

[wallstreetamigo]

10 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Then I’d cheer for the guy on our team.  I’m a true fan, who puts our players (especially are young core guys who are our hope for a Cup one day) over other teams’ players.  I don’t troll our home board criticize our young stars while expressing love for other teams’ players.  

Be a true fan!  Embrace the hate!  

How was I criticizing Hughes. I said he is a tremendous talent that is only going to get better. The fact I think Makar is currently better than him isn’t slagging on Hughes at all. It’s called being realistic. You should try it.