What's wrong with EP.???

[StiffStick33]

4 minutes ago, EmilyM said:

"Tough guys to look after star players" works when guys are taking liberties on our star players, but that's not the case anymore. The league isn't filled with goons going after our stars. How will an enforcer help Petey win one-on-one battles? It's not like guys are taking runs at him every time he has the puck. He's bumped off the puck by just about any opposing player right now.

Seems he had some trouble with Juolevi last night even. 

Edited January 12, 2022 by StiffStick33

[RolexSub]

15 minutes ago, EmilyM said:

"Tough guys to look after star players" works when guys are taking liberties on our star players, but that's not the case anymore. The league isn't filled with goons going after our stars. How will an enforcer help Petey win one-on-one battles? It's not like guys are taking runs at him every time he has the puck. He's bumped off the puck by just about any opposing player right now.

Not saying we need a Gino Odjick out there but teammates that are willing to drop their gloves if someone is alway after your star players. Every team has a few tough guys that is willing to drop it and didn't you see what happened last night when Demko was hit and no one did anything? That is the problem with our team right now. No reaction at all. And look at other teams if you hit there goalie the entire team will be after you. And same if you keep going after their star players. You will have to answer the bell to their tough guy. 

[EmilyM]

3 minutes ago, RolexSub said:

Not saying we need a Gino Odjick out there but teammates that are willing to drop their gloves if someone is alway after your star players. Every team has a few tough guys that is willing to drop it and didn't you see what happened last night when Demko was hit and no one did anything? That is the problem with our team right now. No reaction at all. And look at other teams if you hit there goalie the entire team will be after you. And same if you keep going after their star players. You will have to answer the bell to their tough guy. 

But the thing is I don't see guys going after Petey in overtly aggressive ways, nor do they need to. He's simply losing hockey battles. If we had a guy drop the gloves every time Petey lost a hockey battle, our entire roster would be in the penalty box.

[JM_]

I think his wrist injury really messed up his off-season strength training. We may just have to watch him struggle this season until he can go work on that for 4 month and come back stronger. 

 

He is slowly getting better tho, maybe we'll see the real Petey in the back 1/2 of this season. 

[RolexSub]

6 minutes ago, EmilyM said:

But the thing is I don't see guys going after Petey in overtly aggressive ways, nor do they need to. He's simply losing hockey battles. If we had a guy drop the gloves every time Petey lost a hockey battle, our entire roster would be in the penalty box.

I would say the past 2 months not so much guys are heavily after him but if you watch the first month a lot of guys were trying to run him over and I think that started to get to his nerve and the mental aspect of it. His situation is quite similar to the Sedins on their sophmore season where they don't look like they can play in the NHL due to their lack of size and strength. I think Petey needs to bulk up 15-20lbs of muscles and that will help as well he needs to mentally get stronger. And we all know we have a soft team...even Bieska said it in Hockey Night in Canada!! 

Edited January 12, 2022 by RolexSub

[D.B Cooper]

Too much time tweeting. Not enough training. 
His work ethic has caught up to him.  
I think he will be fine next year because this year is a giant slap in his face.  
He will dedicate next offseason to training hard. 

[reyezone]

1 minute ago, RolexSub said:

I would say the past 2 months not so much guys are heavily after him but if you watch the first month a lot of guys were trying to run him over and I think that started to get to his nerve and the mental aspect of it. His situation is quite similar to the Sedins on their sophmore season where they don't look like they can play in the NHL due to their lack of size and strength. I think Petey needs to bulk up 15-20lbs of muscles and that will help as well he needs to mentally get stronger. 

I think the increase in body weight that he has already put on may be contributing to his drop in speed and shiftyness. 

[EmilyM]

1 minute ago, RolexSub said:

I would say the past 2 months not so much guys are heavily after him but if you watch the first month a lot of guys were trying to run him over and I think that started to get to his nerve and the mental aspect of it. His situation is quite similar to the Sedins on their sophmore season where they don't look like they can play in the NHL due to their lack of size and strength. I think Petey needs to bulk up 15-20lbs of muscles and that will help as well he needs to mentally get stronger. 

Agree. I initially took your original statement as a be-all-end-all fix that exonerated Petey of any personal responsibility, but I fully agree there are several overlying issues with regard to toughness.

[ktcy2]

Did he gain muscle or weight? That might affect his game. It’s a mystery what is happening with EP. It can’t get worse than this and this is some nightmare material for Canucks fans. We thought we have ourselves a first line elite center but now with each passing game it’s looking more likely that he will never regain his form. 
 

if you look at other great top talents. There is not one out there that has had such a subpar season. Not only are his numbers bad, but he is not doing anything out there. This is extremely concerning and it’s a mystery. It could be pressure. 

[RolexSub]

12 minutes ago, reyezone said:

I think the increase in body weight that he has already put on may be contributing to his drop in speed and shiftyness. 

I don't agree...add more muscle you will be able to skate even harder and faster and will be harder for the opponent to get you off the puck. Not unless he bulked up 15-20lbs of fat only. 

[khay]

I heard he put on some weight and now that he is over 180 pounds? Although NHL lists as 176 pounds.

 

It could be a combination of things.

 

Wrist injury affecting his release more than he lets on.

 

Getting used to new weight. Maybe he is realizing that he cannot react and move as fast and quick as he did before putting on whatever weight he gained if he did gain any.

 

He is a bit slower in processing the game as well. Before, he could see two or three moves ahead and that usually opened up some space to operate. Now, he makes one move and runs into trouble and gets trapped. 

 

Opposition limiting space for him to skate and gain speed to enter the zone. 

 

Young players often see a dip in production. What matters is that he finds a way to get back on track and we need him to figure it out soon.

 

[Bruce Boudreau]

4 hours ago, MikeyD said:

The biggest concern for me was his off-season work. He didn't even really build his frame at all. He's at an age where he should have an adult frame and he had all that time in the off-season to put on weight and he has come in looking the exact same as previous years. He's spent one off-season in the gym it seems. Seems like there's a motivational disconnect there. 

 

1 hour ago, N7Nucks said:

The fact he still has the body type of a 15 year old. I know  people, and himself, want to pretend it doesn't matter but now that teams gameplan for him he either needs to have the elite skating of a Gaudreau or Hughes or have the physical size of a MacKinnon. That guy struggled for a while too, now he's a tank. On top of elite skating. Petey can't finesse anyone with his skating alone and he's not strong enough to battle through checking. The Sedins were tanks. They knew they couldn't skate around anyone so they became elite passers and elite along the boards.

 

Also, I feel like mentally he's struggling. Fears to shoot are evident, he might be dejected from getting thrown around every game. Must be tough getting shoved around and bullied every game. He's not the same gamer he was either. He'd dog people for the puck after turnovers, now it's not really present. People have Boeser at the top of their trade list, unpopular opinion, but I might consider moving Petey before Boeser. Mostly cause I think Petey will get us a top RHD and I don't think Boeser has that value.

 

46 minutes ago, RolexSub said:

He is a big target every time he is on the ice and get's hit all the time and no one comes to his defence. So imagine trying to play your game when you worry you will get hit and possibly get injured again. Hence the reason for his hesitation out there. Like I said many times, we need a few tough guys out there to look after our star players so they can focus on their game and to help create more space for them. Also, I think he needs to put on another 15lbs of muscles out there. 

I feel his frame was never talked about much because as a rookie his wrist shot and slapper were surprising goalies.

 

Also he was an above average skater speed wise as a rookie once he got going despite having somewhat awkward skating mechanics and Bambi like movements.

 

You don't see those off the rush chances anymore where he gets his shot off on the wing.

 

 

His frame and weight is not discussed enough.

 

He obviously needs to add more strength to improve his skating and shot. It would also greatly aid his ability to win faceoffs and hold his own in puck battles while being smart with his stick.

 

Is it a mental issue or physical issue?

 

Does he have a digestive disorder like Gaudette that makes it difficult to gain weight and maintain strength over the course of a season?

 

Is he just a more picky eater?

 

It's definitely some combo of mental and physical but nobody really knows unless they know his personal and family situation to comment with any merit.

 

[EmilyM]

3 minutes ago, ktcy2 said:

Did he gain muscle or weight? That might affect his game. It’s a mystery what is happening with EP. It can’t get worse than this and this is some nightmare material for Canucks fans. We thought we have ourselves a first line elite center but now with each passing game it’s looking more likely that he will never regain his form. 
 

if you look at other great top talents. There is not one out there that has had such a subpar season. Not only are his numbers bad, but he is not doing anything out there. This is extremely concerning and it’s a mystery. It could be pressure. 

William Nylander may be the best recent example of what we hope Petey's trajectory would be. He had a very similarly garbage season in 2018-19 coming off contract negotiations (54 7-20-27) and his deal looks good now. Not saying "Willie did it so Petey will do it too", but that's one glimmer of hope that not all is lost yet.

[nergish]

- zero footspeed when entering the offensive zone

- playing the perimeter, and not driving the net

- not getting to the net even without the puck, rarely in a scoring position

- decent defensive awareness and positioning, but not physically strong enough to defend effectively

- not shooting enough

 

Despite being older and more experienced, he literally looks on par with Podkolzin right now in that you can see glimpses of high of upside and ability - but he's playing like a boy amongst men.

Petey needs strength, but it's his footspeed that has been most disappointing to me this season.

Edited January 12, 2022 by nergish

[fanfor42]

16 hours ago, Provost said:

I go for door #3.

 

Sometimes players, young ones especially” have bad stretches.

 

He was good last year, only slightly down on production but the entire team was horrific around him so that seems to make sense.

 

I think he will be just fine.  He apparently works hard after practices and according to Boudreau might be just too in his own head about it.  
 

A new summer of adjusting his training and resetting things, starting the season on time and not missing training camp, etc will bring him back into form.

 

Maybe it turns out he is just a great player and not an elite top 5 franchise centre in the league like he was tracking to be during his ELC.  I don’t think that means he is “off”.  Naslund was no Bure in terms of elite play driving, but he was an amazing player for us for years.

 

 

Naslund 869 pts in 1117 NHL games for a points per game avg of .777

Bure 779 points in 702 NHL games for a points per game avg of  1.11

Petey 170 points in 200 NHL games for a points per game avg of .850.

 

Trouble with Petey is his current season where he has just 17 points in 35 games for a pts per game avg of only .486. So which way is he going?

 

I don't think Petey is going to be a Bure but could be a Naslund.  He has to turn around the current trend though  - or he's gonna be a disappointment.

 

 

[Slegr]

I’m just glad that we didn’t end up signing him to a long term deal like Hughes. It’s just too bad that this wasn’t Petey’s contract year rather than last year (which he missed most of anyway). 
And if he does magically turn it around in time for this next contract, I hope he takes into consideration that he was overpaid this year by a large proportion based on his performance. I still think he can get back to his earlier form.

[Jester13]

Do the Canucks have a sports psychologist to work with players when they need it? I really feel like Petey could benefit from one. 

[tas]

typical case of a young, supremely-talented guy who's used to everything being easy having his confidence shattered by adversity.

 

time will tell if he has the grapes to pull himself out of it and learn to work hard. 

Edited January 12, 2022 by tas

[rekker]

EP has the skills. He does. It's going to be entirely up to him to work out of this. To me, he took the offseason lightly and he got caught offgaurd. It happens to kids. He's as determined an athlete I've seen. He hates losing. He's frustrated as hell. You can see it. He will work on things, strength this off season. Unfortunately, the NHL schedule doesn't allow for what he needs to do during the season. I still have faith in the kid and we need to be patient. 

[WeneedLumme]

2 hours ago, JM_ said:

I think his wrist injury really messed up his off-season strength training. We may just have to watch him struggle this season until he can go work on that for 4 month and come back stronger. 

 

He is slowly getting better tho, maybe we'll see the real Petey in the back 1/2 of this season. 

Exactly. If you combine the injury/strength training issue with no playing for over 7 months, just how long would a reasonable person expect a player to take to get back to mid-season form? I would expect a minimum of at least half a season.