Plans for Roster going forward (Discussion)

[JustABandwagoner]

36 minutes ago, aGENT said:

I don't think he's worth $7.5. I doubt he thinks he's earned $7.5. I doubt his agent is stupid.

He will take the QO 100%. 

[aGENT]

8 minutes ago, DontMessMe said:

He will take the QO 100%. 

Rather than 6 years of security... Ok.

 

Math.

Edited January 21, 2022 by aGENT

[JustABandwagoner]

8 minutes ago, aGENT said:

Rather than 6 years of security... Ok.

 

Math.

Its foolish for him not to take qualifying offer. After that, it walks him into free agency. If not, then after that year, he becomes UFA. Theres gonna be bidders and someone will overpay. 

[khay]

I prefer gradual incremental changes even if it may not cater to fans wanting a cup contender starting next season. I don't like disrupting chemistry; high roster turnover usually means 20-30 games of sucking before the team starts to gel and play to their potential.

 

For this season, the only players I would consider moving out are Miller and maybe Motte if he isn't interested in re-signing.

 

Miller could get us at least two young roster players to help us retool on-the-fly.

 

Depending on the performance of the new players and if the rest of the team picks up the slack, we could still challenge for a playoff spot in the volatile Pacific division. 

 

If we can't get two young roster players from Miller trade, I would not trade him as I don't think we should give up on the playoffs. So I like Miller for Chytil  + Schneider + 1st deal but I want to keep Schenn around for defensive depth.

 

Whether we trade Miller or not, I would try to bring in a veteran left shot defenceman to help PK as soon as possible. Maybe a guy like Nick Holden from Ottawa or Marc Staal from Detroit are realistic targets on expiring contracts and low cap hit. Maybe even Robert Hagg from Buffalo. I would like Ben Chiarot but he will cost a lot to acquire.

Pearson-Miller-Boeser

Podz-EP-Hogz

Dickinson-Horvat-Garland

Motte-Lammikko-Highmore

 

OEL-Myers

Hughes-Poolman

Holden/Staal/Hagg-Hamonic
Burroughs-Schenn

 

Pacific is a weak division as initially predicted.

 

Vegas is on pace for 100 points.

Calgary 98 points.

LA 90 points.

Anaheim: 88 points.

Sharks: 88 points.

 

I think 92+ points gets us into top 3. We have 43 games remaining to get 53 points. Record like 25-15-3 seems very much possible given our 5-on-5 defence and if Petey starts scoring.

 

If Petey is starting to get going, we have 3 lines that just doesn't lose match up games 5-on-5. Fix the PK and we will do better than 25-15-3.

 

[aGENT]

8 hours ago, DontMessMe said:

Its foolish for him not to take qualifying offer. After that, it walks him into free agency. If not, then after that year, he becomes UFA. Theres gonna be bidders and someone will overpay. 

So he's going to take an extra $500k-$1m for one year, with high escrow, and no security, to head out in to the unknown, to forego the guaranteed near $40m dollars that a guaranteed contract represents and not play for the team that drafted him, that's full of close friends.

 

ok.

 

You're acting like the two are millions apart. That's not the case.

 

 

Edited January 21, 2022 by aGENT

[KKnight]

2 hours ago, aGENT said:

So he's going to take an extra $500k-$1m for one year, with high escrow, and no security, to head out in to the unknown, to forego the guaranteed near $40m dollars that a guaranteed contract represents and not play for the team that drafted him, that's full of close friends.

 

ok.

 

You're acting like the two are millions apart. That's not the case.

 

 

I do agree with Agent on this. Although I think he may ask for more. If he comes in a 6.5, that's a pretty fair contract, but if we start getting in to 7.25 - 8 I start to question that. That's why I suggested Laine, because he is a much better scorer and has 40 goal potential. If you were to ask me Boeser @ 7.5 or Laine at 7.75 -8 I'm choosing Laine everytime. 

[aGENT]

31 minutes ago, KKnight said:

I do agree with Agent on this. Although I think he may ask for more. If he comes in a 6.5, that's a pretty fair contract, but if we start getting in to 7.25 - 8 I start to question that. That's why I suggested Laine, because he is a much better scorer and has 40 goal potential. If you were to ask me Boeser @ 7.5 or Laine at 7.75 -8 I'm choosing Laine everytime. 

Yeah, I think Boeser likely falls in the $6.5-$7 range, depending on term. And he takes that over his one year QO (that the team likely arbitrates anyway) for the security and bigger overall money. Like it's just silly to suggest otherwise. 

 

And Boeser on a +/-$6.75m x +/- 6 year deal is just fine, thanks.

 

Bunch of panicky Pollyannas...

[JustABandwagoner]

5 hours ago, aGENT said:

So he's going to take an extra $500k-$1m for one year, with high escrow, and no security, to head out in to the unknown, to forego the guaranteed near $40m dollars that a guaranteed contract represents and not play for the team that drafted him, that's full of close friends.

 

ok.

 

You're acting like the two are millions apart. That's not the case.

 

 

We shall wait and see what happens

[BigTramFan]

Been ruminating on this for a while and thinking that IF Miller is traded in a deal for Schneider (something like Miller + Schenn for Schneider + 1st) then I would like to see JR target the following UFAs centers in the off season:

 

V Trocheck $6m x 5

N Paul $2.5m x 4

 

Trocheck is a righty and a demon on the dot and is also legit playmaking 2C. He is a few months younger than Miller (will be 29 next season) but still well inside his prime and will be a key contributor when we are contending. He is a good replacement for the loss of Miller because he will be cheaper and not need to be signed for as long, so the risk of many years of a bad contract is much lower. Essentially instead of resigning Miller for $8m+ x 8, we get Schneider + Trocheck for combined <$7m for the next couple of years. Miller's grit and pushback is replaced by inserting Nick Paul into the 3C position. Trocheck can lead our PP2 and both guys lead a PK unit.

 

In addition we may need a cheap serviceable LD to replace Schenn if he is part of the Schneider deal, e.g. someone like a Brendan Smith at $0.8m x 1, who can step in and fill the bottom pairing LD role while Rathbone continues developing. Rathbone gets a few starts to warm him into the NHL with a view to earning the 3LD spot in 2023-24.

 

Hamonic is traded to WSH before the 2022 TDL in exchange for Kempny, who's contract ends this season and we don't resign.

 

I would like to resign Boeser $6.5 x 8, Motte $2m x 3, Halak $2m x 2, Lammikko $0.75m

 

Think the cap is compliant. Next season roster is something like this:

 

Hoglander Horvat Boeser

Pettersson Trocheck Podkolzin

Pearson Paul Garland

Dickinson Lammikko Motte

(Highmore)

 

OEL Myers

Hughes Schneider

Smith Poolman

(Rathbone Burroughs)

 

Demko (Halak)

[KKnight]

On 1/22/2022 at 7:29 PM, BigTramFan said:

Been ruminating on this for a while and thinking that IF Miller is traded in a deal for Schneider (something like Miller + Schenn for Schneider + 1st) then I would like to see JR target the following UFAs centers in the off season:

 

V Trocheck $6m x 5

N Paul $2.5m x 4

 

Trocheck is a righty and a demon on the dot and is also legit playmaking 2C. He is a few months younger than Miller (will be 29 next season) but still well inside his prime and will be a key contributor when we are contending. He is a good replacement for the loss of Miller because he will be cheaper and not need to be signed for as long, so the risk of many years of a bad contract is much lower. Essentially instead of resigning Miller for $8m+ x 8, we get Schneider + Trocheck for combined <$7m for the next couple of years. Miller's grit and pushback is replaced by inserting Nick Paul into the 3C position. Trocheck can lead our PP2 and both guys lead a PK unit.

 

In addition we may need a cheap serviceable LD to replace Schenn if he is part of the Schneider deal, e.g. someone like a Brendan Smith at $0.8m x 1, who can step in and fill the bottom pairing LD role while Rathbone continues developing. Rathbone gets a few starts to warm him into the NHL with a view to earning the 3LD spot in 2023-24.

 

Hamonic is traded to WSH before the 2022 TDL in exchange for Kempny, who's contract ends this season and we don't resign.

 

I would like to resign Boeser $6.5 x 8, Motte $2m x 3, Halak $2m x 2, Lammikko $0.75m

 

Think the cap is compliant. Next season roster is something like this:

 

Hoglander Horvat Boeser

Pettersson Trocheck Podkolzin

Pearson Paul Garland

Dickinson Lammikko Motte

(Highmore)

 

OEL Myers

Hughes Schneider

Smith Poolman

(Rathbone Burroughs)

 

Demko (Halak)

Nick Paul at 2.5 per over 4 years? Guy has 9 points this year. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Paul, but there might be better options for us depending on the Miller cap savings for younger players. 

 

By the sounds of it, Rangers are hot and heavy for Miller, but so are a lot of teams. 

 

There are 2 deals that would interest me.

 

1. Van: Lafreniere and a 1st. 

    Rangers: Miller 

 

Or the one I posted above. 

 

If we get Lafreniere, that changes the outlook of our offseason. 

 

As far as other moves, I still think our forward group needs to get some size.

 

I personally like Motte more than Dickinson and would prefer to move Dickinson, but are their suitors? Does Motte want to stay here? 

 

I could see us getting a low pick for Schenn & Chiasson.

 

pray that someone bites on Halak. 

 

Lafreniere - Pete - Garland 

Hoglander - Bo - Boeser 

Pearson - ? - Podz 

Motte or Dickinson - ? - Lockwood 

 

Love your idea about Trocheck, don't think there is any chance Carolina let's him hit Market. 

 

Nicholas Roy might be an option. 

 

[BigTramFan]

51 minutes ago, KKnight said:

Love your idea about Trocheck, don't think there is any chance Carolina let's him hit Market. 

 

Nicholas Roy might be an option. 

 

A lot of fans are expecting Trocheck not to be re-upped in CAR and/or not wanting to spend more than $5.5m on him if they do. I think their likely top 9 centers are Aho, KK and Staal, so I think if VAN makes a decent offer they have a chance at Trocheck

[BigTramFan]

1 hour ago, KKnight said:

Nick Paul at 2.5 per over 4 years? Guy has 9 points this year. Don't get me wrong, I don't mind Paul, but there might be better options for us depending on the Miller cap savings for younger players. 

 

There are 2 deals that would interest me.

 

1. Van: Lafreniere and a 1st. 

    Rangers: Miller 

 

Lafreniere has an AAV of $3.775m, so we would only save $1.5m compared over keeping Miller. Not much room to add anything else on the roster like an upgrade on RHD

[KKnight]

10 minutes ago, BigTramFan said:

Lafreniere has an AAV of $3.775m, so we would only save $1.5m compared over keeping Miller. Not much room to add anything else on the roster like an upgrade on RHD

That's only if he hits his performance bonuses. The guy had been demoted to the 4th line. He's a impact forward, not a checker. I personally think with an increased role he can be that impact winger everyone thought he was gonna be. 

[KKnight]

25 minutes ago, BigTramFan said:

A lot of fans are expecting Trocheck not to be re-upped in CAR and/or not wanting to spend more than $5.5m on him if they do. I think their likely top 9 centers are Aho, KK and Staal, so I think if VAN makes a decent offer they have a chance at Trocheck

I would love Trocheck, just unsure if he hits market. 

 

He really would be perfect for us. 

Edited January 24, 2022 by KKnight

[N4ZZY]

On 1/20/2022 at 11:05 PM, aGENT said:

Rather than 6 years of security... Ok.

 

Math.

I don’t take 6.5M per year, even if it is for 6 years. I think he’ll probably be okay with 7M for 6 years. 

 

 

[N4ZZY]

13 minutes ago, KKnight said:

I would love Trocheck, just unsure if he hits market. 

 

He really would be perfect for us. 

If he hits market, I’m sure there will be demand for his services. 

 

 

 

[N4ZZY]

15 minutes ago, KKnight said:

That's only if he hits his performance bonuses. The guy had been demoted to the 4th line. He's a impact forward, not a checker. I personally think with an increased role he can be that impact winger everyone thought he was gonna be. 

Why is Gallant playing Laff on the fourth line? 

 

 

[KKnight]

18 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

Why is Gallant playing Laff on the fourth line? 

 

 

I dunno if he still is, but I know he got demoted a couple times recently. It says on dailyfaceoff that he's back on the 1st line. 

[IBatch]

On 1/21/2022 at 12:13 AM, DontMessMe said:

I rather pay Miller than Boeser. Boeser needs to go. No money for him

Sure there is.   What there isn't money for is both these guys. 

 

Millers return could end up being a bunch of duds.   So could Brocks.   But odds are Miller's return is much better.   And the difference between Miller's and Brock Boeser's next deal is also a contribution one way or the other.  

 

To me i'd rather have more cap space, and the kings ransom Miller could get us. then keeping Milller, trading Brock unless there are things we just don't know.   Like does Horvat have any interest in staying?     Think every player gets once their salary goes up it costs the team somewhere else (with the exception of Toews and Kane, at least publicly - "what do you mean a rebuild" - lol).   Also agree with aGENT - Brocks next deal doesn't start at his qualifying offer.   Maybe his agent goes there but it would just be posturing.    They know he hasn't earned that - so does any sane arbitrator. 

[CanucksJay]

If canucks record under BB from when he took over in Dec until trade deadline is that of a top 5 team in the league or even top 2 in the West, would people still want “asset management” and trade Miller or would you want to run it back next year and see how our guys do with a full season under BB?
my thoughts are to see what this team is capable of before blowing it up and starting a “retool”

teams that are top 5 usually buy at the deadline not sell. I personally would love to see where we are at at the trade deadline and then decide wherher to sell or stay put.

who knows, if we miraculously have the Pacific 2 Spot and guys like Petey and Boeser have snapped out of their slump and are high scorers again, would we even entertain the possibility of buying at the deadline?
So far under BB, I thought we were flat out only outplayed once (against Carolina). Once our guys are back and if we are beating teams like Colorado and Vegas, would we consider giving this team a chance to see what they can do?
 

ofcourse, if they flounder down the stretch, the decision to sell becomes much easier