[PGT] Florida Panthers at Vancouver Canucks | Jan. 21, 2022

[N4ZZY]

1 hour ago, Gawdzukes said:

No not at all. I have no idea what you're going on and on about though. Why are you so mad? lol we're just trying to have a civil conversation. No one is mocking you at all. We're just saying some people are looking at the big picture, like I'm sure you would agree JR should be being he is the President and all. Of course we're all hoping we keep winning too. It's been fantastic. I'm cheering my ass off every game if you'll notice in the GDT's. We are all fans of the team.

 

I don't know where you're getting this people want to lose thing from. Absolutely nobody in this conversation said that. I think you're caught up in old conversations with other people in other threads. Doesn't it occur to you that this is a possible direction to move, or are you just dead set against it? If so that's fine but I think we're talking apples and oranges here.

Yeah. Nobody likes losing. I recall how the fan base was reacting early in the season under Green when we were losing, and losing badly. PK sucked, PP sucked, everything sucked. Nobody on these boards were happy at that time. 

 

It was kinda depressing to be honest. 

 

And then things turned around under Bruce, and you could feel the mood just being lighter around these boards. Fans were having fun discussing about their favorite team again. 

 

We all love the Canucks. We want them to do well. Our opinions of the team may differ with respect to what they should do, how they should go about it, etc, etc. But we all love this &^@#ing team and want them to do so well. 

 

But some changes need to happen. Like a possible Miller trade, or even a possible Brock trade. These are times when we can chat about possibilities and what they can do to make the team better so that we can win a damn championship for once in our lives and in this franchise’s life. 

 

 

[Goal:thecup]

20 minutes ago, Gawdzukes said:

I think we've done just fine and we're almost through the worst. Demko and Miller back Tuesday, then Garland next game, then Bo after that I believe.

 

Recent losses and 3 point games haven't hurt as much being against Eastern teams and we should be getting the big boys back just in time to mop up the division.

 

 

 

 

 

[stawns]

42 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

I think this is where shrewd and smart management comes into play. JR and his team and the new GM will need to sell Bo and others on taking slightly less so that management can assemble the best possible team of talent and skill to win championships. Look at Tampa Bay. Yes, they’ve had to make some difficult decisions, but for the most part, many of their players have taken less to remain with a winner, and a cup contending franchise. 

 

Could that be us? 

 

Absolutely, but you need players to agree to that. How badly do you want to win in blue and green colors? if that matters to the player a great deal, then take a little less so that management can do their jobs properly and assemble a team worthy of pushing for a Cup not just once, but several years. 

 

I think that matters to Bo a great deal. Drafted by this team, loving it here, he has even verbally said that he wants to win here (I take it with a grain of salt, because players often say all the right things to the media). 

 

I’d be shocked if JR retains all three, Boeser, Bo and Miller. I think at least one of those guys are gone. And JR probably thinking that out of those three, the one guy that could get us a kings ransom in return is Miller. So as much as I like the player, if he gets us a juggernaut of a haul back, then you gotta do that deal. Who knows? Maybe he gets to UFA, regardless even after he’s been traded, at that point, the Canucks, like any other team, would have an opportunity to sign him long term then. Would be an ideal situation given how we get assets back AND possibly retain the services of a player that netted us those assets? Yes &^@#ing please. 

 

Is that the likeliest scenario? I say no. I think a pretty good chance is that he resigns in NY, if that’s where he’s traded to. Who doesn’t like the Big Apple? They are in their window now of competing for a Cup. The road will go through Tampa Bay, since they’re the back to back Cup champions. So if you’re NY, you’re looking at Tampa Bay - and think - do we have enough skill here and talent to beat out that team in a seven game series? Adding a player like Miller would boost their chances remarkably. 

 

Bo hasn’t produced as much offensively as Petey has (minus this season for Petey). I think he gets 7M, but not sure if he gets more than that. Again, if he wants to win here….

 

 

 

Bo took a deal like that last time and he'll be UFA this time.  Hes not taking a discount, he's coming into his prime money making years.

 

I'm not sure why people keep knocking on this door when it never opens.  Every player in the league will go where the best contract is.

[stawns]

2 hours ago, Coconuts said:

That's just it though, trading Miller isn't committing to a tank. Far from it.

 

Miller is one player. One. Is he a talented player? Absolutely. Important? If he wasn't this debate wouldn't exist. But he's one guy.

 

But what do you have left if you trade Miller? Well, theoretically you've got a top six still featuring Horvat, Garland, Pettersson, Boeser, Pearson, and Hoglander. You've also got Podz, him and Hoglander are far from their peak and will continue to develop. Then you've got Demko, Hughes, and OEL. It's not as if we wouldn't, and don't, have pieces to continue building around. And that'd be the entire point of moving out Miller, building. Miller isn't likely to be moved out for a return focused primarily on picks, if anything Rutherford will be looking to bring back young players who've either been playing in the NHL or who appear ready to step in sooner than later. Rutherford wants to get younger, that doesn't necessarily mean he'll be chasing picks. Could picks be involved in a return? I'd hope so, but they likely wouldn't be what a return is focused around. 

 

Not only that, but you've got cap space and whatever return he brings back. Even if you retain half of his contract for 1.25 seasons you're still freeing up roughly 2.62M in important cap space, and considering how capped out we are that's important. 

 

If we move Miller it's also extremely unlikely it'd be the only move between a Miller trade and the beginning of next season. I don't see any reason why we couldn't be a competitive team that can pursue the playoffs next season without Miller. 

I'm as far from a tank cheer leader as you can get.  Moving Miller is, imo, the opposite of tanking.  If we don't get maximum return for him we are going to be the Jets, the Flames etc etc........stuck at "oh so close to the next step". 

 

Moving Miller and Bowser might be a step back in the now, but in the near future is 2-3 steps ahead and a big move toward the hardest step to take on the road to true contender.  To me it's time to shoot for the moon or decline slowly into another full rebuild in 4-5 years

[Gawdzukes]

14 minutes ago, N4ZZY said:

Yeah. Nobody likes losing. I recall how the fan base was reacting early in the season under Green when we were losing, and losing badly. PK sucked, PP sucked, everything sucked. Nobody on these boards were happy at that time. 

 

It was kinda depressing to be honest. 

 

And then things turned around under Bruce, and you could feel the mood just being lighter around these boards. Fans were having fun discussing about their favorite team again. 

 

We all love the Canucks. We want them to do well. Our opinions of the team may differ with respect to what they should do, how they should go about it, etc, etc. But we all love this &^@#ing team and want them to do so well. 

 

But some changes need to happen. Like a possible Miller trade, or even a possible Brock trade. These are times when we can chat about possibilities and what they can do to make the team better so that we can win a damn championship for once in our lives and in this franchise’s life. 

 

 

Yeah I agree. If you're looking at the obstacles facing the Canucks one of the biggest is that the Canucks will have to choose who goes between Bo, Boeser, and Miller. To make matters more complicated will be what each player is asking for and whether they're even willing to stay. In addition Boeser's QO is $7.5.

 

What are they each worth then becomes another question. In my mind Miller has almost twice as much value as Boeser with his contract value and Bo lies somewhere in between. Then that also begs the question. Is Bo even on the block, does JR have any allegiance to him as the captain, or would he prefer Miller for Captain at perhaps 2 million more.

 

Of course ideally one could also ride Miller to a successful playoff run and then trade him before the draft. However that timeline is pushed if someone like the Rangers who have good young players to offer give us a significantly larger offer than normal at this deadline as it's rumored they're very interested in him. This also accentuated in the case that we're say 10 points out at the deadline.

 

Also the one factor I don't see many considering is whether he even wants to be here long-term. Now as a Canadian we don't care who any of our favorite Canadians play for really. Lemieux in Pittsburgh, Yzerman in Detroit. Bourque in Boston and Colorado. Most teams are in the States. We expect it and they're still portrayed as Canadian heroes, hockey heroes, etc.. However if you're an American will you still get that same respect in America playing in Canada for the bulk of your career? Does Miller want to look back on his career having spent the last 11 years of it in Canada, during which will be another Olympic games? Who knows, maybe, maybe not. Will Rutherford take a chance if it's unknown?

 

Ultimately we have a franchise LD, a franchise G, we have very talented forwards, but we are seriously lacking a high quality RD, and time is running out with Myers, Hamonic, and Schenn. This area needs to be addressed, it's our number one need and this trade would do it.

[Coconuts]

3 hours ago, stawns said:

I'm as far from a tank cheer leader as you can get.  Moving Miller is, imo, the opposite of tanking.  If we don't get maximum return for him we are going to be the Jets, the Flames etc etc........stuck at "oh so close to the next step". 

 

Moving Miller and Bowser might be a step back in the now, but in the near future is 2-3 steps ahead and a big move toward the hardest step to take on the road to true contender.  To me it's time to shoot for the moon or decline slowly into another full rebuild in 4-5 years

Yup, I don't see it as a tanking move at all. You're taking a step back to bolster your roster and take steps forward. But yeah, getting the right return is key. 

 

But I mean, even with Miller there's no guarantee we'll be more than a middling team like the rest over the next few years anyway. I'm certainly not sold on the roster as is. I'd rather take steps back, try and build the roster properly and gradually work towards contention as opposed to chasing the playoff bar. 

[N4ZZY]

1 hour ago, Coconuts said:

Yup, I don't see it as a tanking move at all. You're taking a step back to bolster your roster and take steps forward. But yeah, getting the right return is key. 

 

But I mean, even with Miller there's no guarantee we'll be more than a middling team like the rest over the next few years anyway. I'm certainly not sold on the roster as is. I'd rather take steps back, try and build the roster properly and gradually work towards contention as opposed to chasing the playoff bar. 

The defense definitely need to be better for sure. 

 

Forward group is where we have a little bit of a surplus, so we can afford to subtract there, in order to add to the defense. 

 

[KILLER]

I think Petey is actually another Swedish twin with 1 really good and 1 really bad. Guess which 1 showed up tonight? Lol

[KILLER]

Terrible save percentage.