A lot of talk about a core piece not being here next year.

[Nucker 67]

1 hour ago, -DLC- said:

we have a coach in place now who can get results out of this group

I agree. This makes me think that Bruce will be re-signed and they're going to go for it next year (playoff run). Now thinking: Forget about trading a bunch of key guys for draft picks and prospects. This team under Bruce is a different animal. A full season with him and who knows. 

 

Miller, he's a huge part of the engine that runs the machine. Horvat is too good at faceoffs/C, and I think he accepts a team-friendly deal. Petey will show up on time next year, ready. Boeser is a pickle. I see him in a Devils jersey next year for some reason. 

 

 

[DrJockitch]

3 hours ago, CanucksJay said:

I totally agree with you if we are talking based on this year alone. 

It would be a no brainer to take Pearson at half the price for a 10 point scoring differential + strong physical and dependable 2 way game. 

My question is, what is Brock actually capable of? This year is not his ceiling. The guy is 25. He's just getting into his prime. When did we get Miller for example? The guy was traded twice before he got to us. 

Is Boeser capable of improving his skating and 2 way game? 

He's been averaging approx 0.85 pts/game since coming in as a rookie. This year is clearly a setback at 0.64 pts. 

The concerning thing regarding Brock is 3 things. 

1) He's been stagnant at 0.89 pts / game or less since his rookie season which was 5 years ago. Is 0.9 pts/game / 73 pts his ceiling? 

2) Injury issues.  He's been injured every year. This will be the first  year he's played 70 games. 

3) skating and two way game. If we are building a fast skating team, he is not it. However, can speed throughout the line up create pockets for Boeser where he can find a spot and shoot/score? 

 

The problem is that Boeser is super likeable so it hurts to trade him. Fact of the matter is, the team did not miss a beat when Boeser was out. 

We see what losing a guy like Horvat has done to the team on the other hand. 

 

Boeser's agent did a really good job (or JB failed badly) that the QO is not worth it. If Canucks took Boeser to reverse arbitration, is he worth the 6.375?

 

Side note, miller's career numbers are like a poor man's version of Boeser. I think we got Millsy at 26 years old. Prior season to that, he put up 0.62pts / game in Tampa. His career until then was at best 0.7 pts / game. 

 

What I'm saying is that it might be too early to give up on Boeser. 

 

Really tough call but I think Canucks need to go to reverse arbitration and sign a 2 years 6.375 deal. 

 

 

 

I would agree ideally we would have a bit more time to see with Brock, but we don’t. Choice has come to a head this summer and  unless his agent is a moron he will take the QO or get something 6+ long term which I just don’t think is best use of cap unless PA pulls off a miracle deal to move OEL or Myers but even then they need replacing. 

[Guest]

57 minutes ago, rychicken said:

Would you mind sharing your thoughts please on what ways you feel the team can improve

I'll take the bait... 

 

If you compare the top scorers (very simplistic way, I know) between us and LA Kings, for example, you will find that our top guys are all under 30 and that a lot of them are under 25. LA's main contributors are on the wrong side of 25. 

It's perfectly reasonable to expect improvement from Petey, Quinn, Podz, Hoggy and Garland for next year. 

 

We have enough capspace to make minor tweaks and keep our main players. This team needs a little bit of toughness and that can be acquired for pretty cheap.  

 

Going from a 90 point team to a 100 point team won't be as hard as you think for this group. 

[MrCanuck94]

1 hour ago, -DLC- said:

You can't predict the future and Vegas "will be" is included in that. 

 

You're looking/talking on paper but it's so much more complex than that. Which is what Edmonton showed us over the years....we have a coach in place now who can get results out of this group, that's just been proven in how close they did come to squeaking in to playoffs they had no business even thinking about.

 

There aren't "glaring holes". There are ways we can improve for sure, but you ignore all that they have done and you've thought this team was trash from square one this season. I think you miss a whole lot of good stuff that happened being blinded by that. The team that started the year is much different than the one that finished it and they've learned a lot about themselves with Bruce a the helm. 

Vegas was missing most of their top players for the majority of the season, they're a playoff team at health. Other than 2 superstar players carrying them, EDM never was or is a great team on paper, but they will continue to improve with their depth slowly building. LA and Anaheim are both on upward trajectories. Calgary is one of the best teams in the league right now.

 

The Canucks have a few glaring holes, an effective 3C, a couple of middle 6 tweeners and two top 4 right handed d men.

 

Next season is a fresh slate, we can't just use this seasons point totals to say we'll be a playoff team. We're building a team that can compete for the cup, not a team that is going to get bounced in the first round every year.

 

Love the passion and we need that moving forward, but it's important not to be blinded ourselves from the reality of where the team actually is and where we need to get to.

[sassbs]

13 hours ago, Gnarcore said:

I'll consider getting rid of the DJ the biggest win of the off season. 

[Guest]

16 minutes ago, MrCanuck94 said:

Vegas was missing most of their top players for the majority of the season, they're a playoff team at health. Other than 2 superstar players carrying them, EDM never was or is a great team on paper, but they will continue to improve with their depth slowly building. LA and Anaheim are both on upward trajectories. Calgary is one of the best teams in the league right now.

 

The Canucks have a few glaring holes, an effective 3C, a couple of middle 6 tweeners and two top 4 right handed d men.

 

Next season is a fresh slate, we can't just use this seasons point totals to say we'll be a playoff team. We're building a team that can compete for the cup, not a team that is going to get bounced in the first round every year.

 

Love the passion and we need that moving forward, but it's important not to be blinded ourselves from the reality of where the team actually is and where we need to get to.

Conversely...

 

Vegas is an aging team without much help coming and they need to shed 15 million in contracts (guesstimate, probably off on the number). 

 

Anaheim is a 76 point team.  

 

Calgary has Tkachuk, Gaudreau, and Mangiapane coming up for a contract. They will have to lose some players.  

 

LA is pretty dependent on their older players but I definitely see them staying a consistent 90-100 point team as long as Kopitar and Danault keep playing as well as they have this year. 

 

I do believe that Edmonton will keep on getting better and better as long as they get a good goalie to take over from the 40 year old Smith.  

 

Pacific will be a very tight division for the foreseeable future. San Jose is the only team that's in trouble IMO. 

[-DLC-]

1 hour ago, MrCanuck94 said:

Vegas was missing most of their top players for the majority of the season, they're a playoff team at health. Other than 2 superstar players carrying them, EDM never was or is a great team on paper, but they will continue to improve with their depth slowly building. LA and Anaheim are both on upward trajectories. Calgary is one of the best teams in the league right now.

 

The Canucks have a few glaring holes, an effective 3C, a couple of middle 6 tweeners and two top 4 right handed d men.

 

Next season is a fresh slate, we can't just use this seasons point totals to say we'll be a playoff team. We're building a team that can compete for the cup, not a team that is going to get bounced in the first round every year.

 

Love the passion and we need that moving forward, but it's important not to be blinded ourselves from the reality of where the team actually is and where we need to get to.

We're missing Bo, Pearson, Demko. Hoglander.

 

Petey was injured from the start. Sutter's been missing and that's to be factored in.

 

Every team has their story so if we discount ours, then why do we care about theirs? "Good teams find a way" stuff. Passion and blinded huh? Or is it that some refuse to accept the reality of where we are because they decided long ago and aren't moving off that stance? Because points do indicate we're trending upward. And can beat teams that we'd need to. 

 

We CAN use the way the team plays in the here and now to suggest they're not far off from being playoff contenders. I love that some feel their opinion somehow is more objective or "reality" when the reality is we're starting to see some pretty impressive stuff that can't be denied. Petey. Bo. Miller. Podz. Hughes. Demko. Don't sell this team short because you're fixed on a narrative that isn't changing along with the team.

[-DLC-]

2 hours ago, rychicken said:

Would you mind sharing your thoughts please on what ways you feel the team can improve

I didn't see this right away as I've tuned some out and my ignore list is long (better for me and those I ignore).

 

I don't need to give a list....I trust in the coach/management enough to address improvements and I'm not an x's and o's gal and make no claim to be. Never have. 

 

My list is a general, sweeping observation and not specific. I see what I see as an overall team and it's clear, at times, that we rely on some too heavily and that takes a toll over time. Exhaustion and fatigue lead to overuse injuries. We need a bit more grit but, with that, the team's been playing a bit edgier lately. I don't think a team needs fighters but they need to be able to fight back. To not get pushed around.

 

The team needs to be more consistent, that's not something you can really pinpoint (even Bruce is having trouble with that). That's a big deal...getting off to those horrible starts and having to dig out of holes. Although, they've been fairly resilient and shown a good ability to do so (like last night). 

 

My comment was more geared toward what we do have than what we don't have. But I take this as an attempt to have me highlight how much I don't know...but the thing is, I don't proclaim to. Some here do but I'm not convinced.

 

I do know this team's worth more than what some value them at.

[MrCanuck94]

1 hour ago, -DLC- said:

We're missing Bo, Pearson, Demko. Hoglander.

 

Petey was injured from the start. Sutter's been missing and that's to be factored in.

 

Every team has their story so if we discount ours, then why do we care about theirs? "Good teams find a way" stuff. Passion and blinded huh? Or is it that some refuse to accept the reality of where we are because they decided long ago and aren't moving off that stance? Because points do indicate we're trending upward. And can beat teams that we'd need to. 

 

We CAN use the way the team plays in the here and now to suggest they're not far off from being playoff contenders. I love that some feel their opinion somehow is more objective or "reality" when the reality is we're starting to see some pretty impressive stuff that can't be denied. Petey. Bo. Miller. Podz. Hughes. Demko. Don't sell this team short because you're fixed on a narrative that isn't changing along with the team.

Comparing Vegas not having 4 of their top 6 forwards, one top 4 d man, and #1 goalie for over half the season to us not having Bo and Demko for a couple weeks? C'mon lol.

 

Like I said in other threads, I agree with some of the things you said, like keeping Miller. 

 

Reality is, this team is a few pieces away from being a true contender. As mentioned, an effective 3C, a couple of middle 6 tweeners and two top 4 right handed d men. We also need to accumulate younger players and impactful ELCs that will push us over the edge in 3-4 years time to maintain the window and keep us cost efficient.

 

However, I'm extremally confident in our management group and wouldn't be surprised if they have a huge offseason and bring us closer to contention fast.

[Johnny Torts]

Good afternoon,

 

 

I think my whole point was that I didn’t think we were in any sort of cap hell and could retain our core at the very least.

 

Now trades and cap dumping to make more room and free agent signings all could happen, but we do currently have the room to give our guys the money they deserve in both Miller and Horvat at the very least. Especially with Hughes locked up, and Myers expiring when EP40 + Podz contract needs renewing. 
 

 

After a Boeser extension, is there a possibility of Dick and Poolman being dumped to create more room? Of course.

 

[CanadianRugby]

Changes made to the core will be to increase team speed and change locker room chemistry as much as they will be for cap flexibility.  

 

The chemistry to me looks fine, but we don't know what's happening in the locker room.  Reading between the lines, to me it appears there's a feeing in management that some of the players don't hate losing enough.

[Alflives]

2 minutes ago, CanadianRugby said:

Changes made to the core will be to increase team speed and change locker room chemistry as much as they will be for cap flexibility.  

 

The chemistry to me looks fine, but we don't know what's happening in the locker room.  Reading between the lines, to me it appears there's a feeing in management that some of the players don't hate losing enough.

Which guys are our core?

Demko, Petey, Hughes, Miller, Bo OEL, Boeser?

So which core are maybe gone?  Miller or Boeser?  

Any other changes don't really change the core, but rather the support group, no?

[CanadianRugby]

2 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Which guys are our core?

Demko, Petey, Hughes, Miller, Bo OEL, Boeser?

So which core are maybe gone?  Miller or Boeser?  

Any other changes don't really change the core, but rather the support group, no?

Yeah I'd say that's the core except I wouldn't include OEL.  He's just getting paid like he's part of the core.  

Miller or Boeser seem to make the most sense to move.

Boeser because he is the least important part of the core, but will still cost a lot of money.

Miller because he could bring in a huge return in prospects/picks, and his peak value is right now.  A time that this team isn't ready to win the cup.   

 

But you're right the support group will probably see even more change. 

 

 

[JM_]

5 minutes ago, Alflives said:

Which guys are our core?

Demko, Petey, Hughes, Miller, Bo OEL, Boeser?

So which core are maybe gone?  Miller or Boeser?  

Any other changes don't really change the core, but rather the support group, no?

according to Dhaliwal, they are going to try hard to get something done with Brock, and Allvin seems to really like Miller. Plus we don't have to move Miller. 

 

Petey and Hughes aren't going anywhere. 

 

Bo? can't see it, that would be a shocker. 

 

So that leaves OEL. Where would he agree to go to? 

 

I think its most likely Myers, that or iMac is full if iPoop. 

[Jester13]

6 hours ago, hammertime said:

I think you'd be surprised at how big a hole it would create to trade Myers without replacing him which will cost more than 6m going by what D are getting these days. 

I think just as easily you'd be surprised at how little it would affect the team, as the cap savings should also free up enough to sign our key guys and still sign a serviceable Hamonic-type dman. 

[rychicken]

2 hours ago, -DLC- said:

I didn't see this right away as I've tuned some out and my ignore list is long (better for me and those I ignore).

 

I don't need to give a list....I trust in the coach/management enough to address improvements and I'm not an x's and o's gal and make no claim to be. Never have. 

 

My list is a general, sweeping observation and not specific. I see what I see as an overall team and it's clear, at times, that we rely on some too heavily and that takes a toll over time. Exhaustion and fatigue lead to overuse injuries. We need a bit more grit but, with that, the team's been playing a bit edgier lately. I don't think a team needs fighters but they need to be able to fight back. To not get pushed around.

 

The team needs to be more consistent, that's not something you can really pinpoint (even Bruce is having trouble with that). That's a big deal...getting off to those horrible starts and having to dig out of holes. Although, they've been fairly resilient and shown a good ability to do so (like last night). 

 

My comment was more geared toward what we do have than what we don't have. But I take this as an attempt to have me highlight how much I don't know...but the thing is, I don't proclaim to. Some here do but I'm not convinced.

 

I do know this team's worth more than what some value them at.

Thanks for the detailed reply.....am I on the tuned out list or the ignore list?

I was not expecting you to reply with a list - I was not challenging your knowledge, but my feeling in reading your posts has been that you are "quick" to challenge people who say things like "trade Miller" etc, in an effort to better the team but I can't recall seeing any posts from you indicating any specifics around potential areas of improvement. Your reply helps me understand your view of the team - thanks again for the reply, and I do hope you are feeling better 

PS- take me off ignore - sometimes I post funny stuff lol. 

[hammertime]

37 minutes ago, Jester13 said:

I think just as easily you'd be surprised at how little it would affect the team, as the cap savings should also free up enough to sign our key guys and still sign a serviceable Hamonic-type dman. 

Ya I guess we'll agree to disagree. 

 

IMO Myers is getting the Edler treatment. As soon as he's gone it will be OEL. Then if Hughes faulters.... Nux fans are getting a bit of a rep for undervaluing guys like Tanev Edler playing OEL Myers mins. 

[zduck14]

I actually agree with Petey being in the 10-11 range. I know he started slow but after the all-star break he really started to look like the player we were all expecting. He had 44 points in 34 games (106point pace) and I honestly believe that is the player we'll see going forward. An elite top line C/W. There's a reason him Hughes and Demko are the 3 untouchable guys that this team needs to build around. 

[Guest]

18 hours ago, rychicken said:

PS- take me off ignore - sometimes I post funny stuff lol. 

I'd say rarely, but it does happen. 

 

[Alflives]

Bo to the Avs (after they lose again in the playoffs early) for Byram.