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[PROPOSAL] All in on Draft day 2022


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I like it!  Well at least the draft day trades.  Those two prospects fit holes we have pretty well.   These sorts of posts show how we could retool without taking a big step back.

 

Minor quibbles in that we could probably find a better 3C than Bjugstad.  Retain on Miller and not Myers so we are out from that cap hit next season to afford a Horvat raise.
 

Jiricek also wouldn’t likely be ready right away, at least in a top 4.

 

With the spare cap space, I get OEL and our Swedish front office mafia to lean on Klingberg to sign here.

 

Forsberg-Petterson-Podkolzin

Kuzmenko-Horvat-Garland

Slafkvoksy-Tierney-Lazar

Brendan Smith-Lammikko-Highmore

 

Hughes-Schenn

OEL-Klingberg

Dermott-whoever 

 

Edited by Provost
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3 hours ago, S N Y P E R S 7 said:

Why in the world would you go all in on THIS year's draft...

The sad thing about drafts is that the media focuses in on the highest end talent only (and ranks the quality of the draft based on that, they love the juiciest stuff)...this draft may be weak on high-end talent but is VERY deep on potential 2nd liners and top 4D...we already have high-end talent that will cost us 8 figures in the future, we need to balance that with some 3-6 million dollar talent, why not get some of the best depth players available? That's how you build a Stanley Cup winner. Look at TML and EDM...loads of top end talent, taking up a high percentage of their payroll, but not enough good middle 6F and top 4D to run with the big dogs.

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Your first two deals actually seem pretty plausible to me, but I'm not sure if the third one gets done, as I think the Coyotes wouldn't give that much up for mostly cap dumps.

 

Nice armchair GMing though!

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57 minutes ago, -AJ- said:

Your first two deals actually seem pretty plausible to me, but I'm not sure if the third one gets done, as I think the Coyotes wouldn't give that much up for mostly cap dumps.

 

Nice armchair GMing though!

Yep it probably costs to get rid of those guys… but a minor part of the post overall.

 

If we could even get one of those two draft prospects I would be pretty happy.  We need an extra couple ELC contracts providing meaningful contributions over the next 3-5 years.

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3 hours ago, ABNuck said:

The sad thing about drafts is that the media focuses in on the highest end talent only (and ranks the quality of the draft based on that, they love the juiciest stuff)...this draft may be weak on high-end talent but is VERY deep on potential 2nd liners and top 4D...we already have high-end talent that will cost us 8 figures in the future, we need to balance that with some 3-6 million dollar talent, why not get some of the best depth players available? That's how you build a Stanley Cup winner. Look at TML and EDM...loads of top end talent, taking up a high percentage of their payroll, but not enough good middle 6F and top 4D to run with the big dogs.

Very much agree that you need depth, depth, and depth. Draft as many players as you can. Are they all going to make the team? Obviously not, however the more darts you have, the better chance to hit a bullseye. Also Edm could have ran with the big dogs. There mid to slightly less than average bottom six would have been enough. Look how they handled a very well put together playoff success built team like Calgary. If they had a goalie that just didn't sign in the Swiss league and the other almost as old as the Canucks no cup streak, they could have at least taken Col 6-7 gms. Anyway glad it will be Van to end the Canadian Stanley cup drought, as the foreseeable Canadian teams are staying pat, or getting worse. Minus Ottawa, but were a 2 years up on em. 

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9 hours ago, S N Y P E R S 7 said:

Why in the world would you go all in on THIS year's draft...

I get the following one is worth tanking for ...  but we won't have the same assets then either.    Miller is trade this season or not at all ... I think by doing these trades we likely don't make the playoffs either - none of guys from this draft are going to come in and make an impact, and only maybe 2 actually make it out of the gate.    Every year threads pop up about selling the farm for the next shiny new toys.   It can be fun for sure ... for quite a while it was about all we got to look forward to as well lol..

 

.   OP made a team that should be competitive a couple years down the road and might make the playoff's, but it's definitely not a huge improvement right away either.   Forsberg is going to get more then that on a short term deal ... having some cap space to weaponize would be nice so this could work well as a two year tank anyways - get our cake and eat it too!    Maybe 2-3 guys from this years draft make their teams right away ... the year after is supposed to be the best draft since McDavids.   We could weaponize the cap and develop the picks next year ... and get decent odds on Bedard or whomever.   COL did that and ended up with Makar and Byram (Barrie and Duchene)...

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10 hours ago, ABNuck said:

Deal #1: Miller & Myers (50%retained) to NJD for #2 OA

Deal #2: Boeser (signed) & our 2023 2nd to PHI for #5 OA

Deal #3: Dickinson & Poolman & our 2023 4th to ARI for #45 OA (they have 4 - 2nd round picks...this is their lowest)

 

2022 Picks:

#2 Slafkovsky (top 6F)

#5 Jiricek (2nd pair RHD to replace Myers, eventually replace Schenn on D1)

#15 Chesley or Luneau or Lamoureux (3rd pair RHD, eventually replace Jiricek on D2)

#45 Centreman to eventually become 3C or LHD

 

With Cap savings - UFA's:

Forsberg (5-6yrs x 8.25-8.50mil)

Bjugstad (2-3yrs x 2.25-2.50mil)

 

Forsberg - Pettersson - Podkolzin

Slafkovsky - Horvat - Garland

Pearson - Bjugstad - Hoglander

Highmore - Lammikko - Dowling - Chiasson

 

Hughes - Schenn

OEL - Jiricek

Dermott - whatever RHD we pick at #15 OA

Rathbone - Keeper

 

Demko - Martin

 

23 man roster cap hit = ~ $70mil ... leaves lots of space at the TDL to decide if we want any rentals for a deep run, or if we just play out the year and wait for our shot in 2023/24.

 

Everyone is learning together, growing together on the same page, building chemistry for the future...maybe a slight step back in 2022-23 but will be a major step forward for 2023 onward...at least 4+ seasons at least as a top contender.

I really liked this thread, it's creative.   Realistic?   Well where's the fun if we can't start somewhere and NJ is willing to trade that pick - usually those aren't available.    This draft is a lot like EPs, nobody is really a huge step above the rest, except the guys they floated back then which were Patrick (consensus number one until the WJ's) and Hirscheir ... at the time they said then there were a dozen or so guys that could go anywhere and were almost interchangeable.    Of course nobody knew that Makar would become a once in a generation D.    That draft was considered very underwhelming after McDavids/Mathews etc ... turned out it certainly was not, Makar looks to be just as valuable as both those guys.     EP is no longer the best player from that draft and hasn't been for two years now.    I wouldn't slot anyone from next years draft into the lineup.   That's a good way to kill their development.    Kakko.  Puljajarvi.   Patrick.   Not all high picks should be in the NHL right away.   Sure maybe he can get a spot out of camp, but we can't slot them in unless they've earned it.   Laffy.   Even Joe Thornton took some time, and we all know about the Sedins (and they did get some time). 

 

As for the trade value.   NJ isn't looking to contend next season, rather a young roster player that fits into their group.    Sure you never know, but i doubt Miller is going to get it done, not on his own and especially not by adding Myers with or without retaining.   Still think NYR is the most reasonable destination for him. But that said maybe Miller plus our 15th and something else.    
 

On Forsberg.   That deal isn't going to happen as is either.   Some team is going to have to pay him full term.   Should that be us?   I'm not sure it should be.    But it wouldn't be the end of the world either.    From that viewpoint we'd have to weigh that against just re-signing Miller.    I always get worried around UFAs that have a career year just before free agency.   At least Miller has done it 3 years in a row now and still has one more year left.    Forsberg x 7 vs Miller x 5/6 years ....  Miller is a center and has more intangibles, Forsberg scores more goals ... close to a wash IMO.  Yes Forsberg has higher end skill set which is appealing, but i'm not sure EP is ready for first line center attention yet either.   My gut says Forsberg will go to the highest bidder, that means closer to 10 for us then 9,  those darn taxes.   Miller is way more likely to take a discount then Forsberg.    He is getting a huge pay bump because we are the team that gave him opportunity.   And he's acknowledged that more then once.  Of course in this situation it's about what Miller can also get us back - sorry it's not the second.    Maybe Miller and Brock 50% retained would do it.    If it doesn't hurt us a lot - it's not a fair trade.   That would hurt us a lot.   And we most definitely would need Forsberg this summer unless a full tank is where we are going....so expect something like 9.75 x 7 for Forsberg to play in a 53% tax market.    

 

Picks:   I have zero issue with your picks...both guys with proper development should be core players coming up behind QHs and EP.   Get that's the entire point.    Just that the values are off.   And that we can't just slot them in either.    Myers won't be going anywhere in this situation.    Not a chance any of these D's will play right away.   And if they do, third pairing, and very sheltered.   QHs, Heisneken, Makar, Fox...all these guys took at least one year.   Seider did too. 

 

 

 

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10 hours ago, Provost said:

I like it!  Well at least the draft day trades.  Those two prospects fit holes we have pretty well.   These sorts of posts show how we could retool without taking a big step back.

 

Minor quibbles in that we could probably find a better 3C than Bjugstad.  Retain on Miller and not Myers so we are out from that cap hit next season to afford a Horvat raise.
 

Jiricek also wouldn’t likely be ready right away, at least in a top 4.

 

With the spare cap space, I get OEL and our Swedish front office mafia to lean on Klingberg to sign here.

 

Forsberg-Petterson-Podkolzin

Kuzmenko-Horvat-Garland

Slafkvoksy-Tierney-Lazar

Brendan Smith-Lammikko-Highmore

 

Hughes-Schenn

OEL-Klingberg

Dermott-whoever 

 

I also agree that a re-set should be definitely considered at this point.   With the amount of raises that are coming up, this team just isn't built for long term contending level success.   Maybe at best a tidy run of playoffs.   Know it's tough given how well we played down the stretch to rip it up a little - and it wouldn't be easy on the team either. 

 

I'm actually fine with just going with mostly what we had last year and giving this team a shot at making the playoffs and seeing how that goes as well.   We don't know until we see it again, and the first crack at it both MIN (top defensive team that year) and STL (cup champs) showed us some things, and of course Vegas really showed us some things.   We have a very different team now ... guys are older and better players.   That has to be weighed against any Miller trade.  

 

My preference though is to re-set thing, in a delicate manner as to not screw up too much of that positive energy Bruce brought in.   That means a major overhaul like this ... likely isn't on the table.   They've said as much ... this thread hinges on Forsberg signing with us.    Right there ... that's going to cost us a lot more to win the sweepstakes.  Klingberg has been offered a good deal apparently wants free agency ... Dallas is part of the FAB 5, teams with no state tax.    I suppose the Swedish connection might be appealing, but he'd be leaving at least 1.25 million per year on the table on a similar deal in Dallas.   Miller has lost over 800k per year since being traded.  

 

Klingberg to me is just another OEL but on the right side.   Is he going to get the PP time to bump his stats?  Guess it comes down to the contract, but it definitely would end up another anchor one for us.   Overpaying to fix JBs lack of foresight on that side.  

 

The meat and potatoes of this thread is creating a re-set and building behind EP which i like a lot.   Horvat getting re-upped is fine ... I think we've got a decent foundation but it's for sure missing some footings ... not having any young D's ... yes QHs but it's not enough ugh.   Going to have to jack up the house and make the repairs.    Sakic did this in COL five years ago when he drafted Makar.   Look at them now.    I'd be even more happy is we traded enough guys to tank the team both this and next season.    Demko.   He's the pickle isn't he?    We aren't going to be the worst team without trading him.   COL was the worst team the year they drafted Makar.   By a long shot. 

 

It's impossible to know which way the teams going to lean.   The easy thing is actually just let them play more and keep assessing and it's not necessarily the wrong thing either.   With some core ascension on top of how we played down the stretch .... well.   Man that would be a pretty good team.    For one year anyways. 

 

Edit: For Deb (DLC).   I love Miller too.   He's exactly the type of player I want on my team.    A few neat stats.   We had the best power play the last 25ish games in the league.  Not COL.  Not TB.   Not EDM.   Amazing.   Also EP exploded ... those last 25ish games on pace for 45 goals and 95 or so points.   Even Brock went back to his career norm production (not the rest of his game so much - just the points) under Bruce.    There is always hope.   Personally i feel we are a lopsided trade away from putting this team into the conversation of becoming a really good team for awhile as is.   Re-signing Miller isn't the worse thing in the world either is it?! 

Edited by IBatch
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4 hours ago, VanCan2023 said:

Very much agree that you need depth, depth, and depth. Draft as many players as you can. Are they all going to make the team? Obviously not, however the more darts you have, the better chance to hit a bullseye. Also Edm could have ran with the big dogs. There mid to slightly less than average bottom six would have been enough. Look how they handled a very well put together playoff success built team like Calgary. If they had a goalie that just didn't sign in the Swiss league and the other almost as old as the Canucks no cup streak, they could have at least taken Col 6-7 gms. Anyway glad it will be Van to end the Canadian Stanley cup drought, as the foreseeable Canadian teams are staying pat, or getting worse. Minus Ottawa, but were a 2 years up on em. 

I like your optimism!   OTT for sure has a nice crew, a ton of young assets and a bright future ahead of them.   They've also got flexibility with their cap.   One thing the don't have is a Demko.   IF they are lucky enough to have a goalie in their system come up and do that ... then they'd be the front runner of up and coming Canadian teams.    WNP got boned hard.   Tough being WNP lol...lost their entire right side and still managed to be decent,    Feel WNP won't ever see a cup parade.    They should have been the team to do it in Canada ... instead everyone got traded or wanted to be traded or just quit lol.   Tough luck.  

 

On that ... TO is fun to pick on and always will be, but wow ... every year they can't get out of the first round and the team that beats them goes to the final or so it seems lol.   So far they've been the closest to beating Tampa.   COL looks to be the one to surpass that - but what they know is Tampa always makes adjustments based on whom they play so wouldn't write them off yet. 

 

CAL.   Was a contender - EDM spanked them.    Vancouver is not as good as either team right now.    EDM is a Demko away from being a contender themselves ... good luck prying a number one goals off anyone but you just never do know.   If they can do that then ... they've got a few more cracks at it for sure.    Conference finals is an accomplishment.    Think McDavid might lead the playoffs in scoring after 16 games...has that ever been done before?     

 

Unfortunately the Canucks have issues.  Cap ones and lack of guys coming up on ELCs (and the two for sure are connected).    That blows.   But it is what it is.     At least there is always hope.    Not to be a downer, but realistically it was always going to be parts of this core and the one behind it coming up, that would give us the best odds of actually contending again when JB took over.    We were spoiled for 14 years, and this is the hand were given.   Absolute best case is we win a cup in 2023.   It's hockey and you never just do know.   Our division isn't an easy one.   ANA and LA are becoming real threats.   Vegas, EDM and CAL are peaking and will continue for a few more years.   We are a team that's going to go through some changes ...  and realistically still has quite a bit of work to do.   It's a good core,  but it's not enough yet.    The way i look at it we need to start building a new team behind the current one.   There are some similar things with this team and when Luongo first arrived. 

 

That's cool.  When we played COL at the end of the year their fans left the building hoping they wouldn't have to play us in the first round.  Why?  Because we were the better team that game.   It's razor thin right now between a playoff team and some that don't get in (we played well enough to get a spot).... i'm fairly bullish we can do some serious damage before we have to make some big decisions too.   But am also ok if we make them as well.   The goal is to be a good team for a long long time.    That most likely means we have to make changes. 

Edited by IBatch
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I do hope for something like this. Though as highlighted acquiring assets for next years draft may be better but is riskier and delays the rebuild more.

If we burn the JTM asset then it needs to be for Quinn’s partner and ideally not an 18 year old. 
Would also somewhat begrudgingly accept something like the 2nd and a second if not finding the right guy for Q. 
 

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Would be nice to get/have 2 22 & 23 1sts in addition to getting a 22 2nd cause it's very risky to go all in on 1 draft. I say load up on picks for the next 2-3 drafts.

 

Big mistake by rushing the prospects to put them in the lineup as 18 year olds with all the pressure that goes along with being a high draft pick besides the learning curve of being a pro, let them develop and learn how to be pros first. Only a select few can make the jump and learn everything on the fly.

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