J.I.A.H.N Posted July 23, 2022 Author Share Posted July 23, 2022 Just now, JM_ said: I was thinking 5x5 for Klingberg, lots of bonus money. I would like that very much.............other than signing bonus's, I don't think we can give him point bonus's (has to be 35+) I think?????? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 1 minute ago, J.I.A.H.N said: I would like that very much.............other than signing bonus's, I don't think we can give him point bonus's (has to be 35+) I think?????? nope just the signing bonuses, but 20 mil guaranteed (4 mil signing bonus per year) buys a lot of Räkmacka. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 34 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said: I don't think I ever said we were a bad team as in past years.......... I am just not sure that RHD holds up like you think I also don't know how you get Peeke without giving part of you plan up? And this just kills me everytime I see this.............LHD are LHD.......RHD are RHD..............yes some can play the other side, but rarely as good as their natural side. I'm fine with a shut down LHD Gavrikov or a like would at least go a long way to getting OEL, Hughes off the PK. If it costs us a Hoglander/Rathbone and a sweetener so be it. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted July 23, 2022 Author Share Posted July 23, 2022 1 minute ago, hammertime said: I'm fine with a shut down LHD Gavrikov or a like would at least go a long way to getting OEL, Hughes off the PK. If it costs us a Hoglander/Rathbone and a sweetener so be it. Hmmmmm? Not sure about Rathbone.............Hoglander I am good with Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 8 minutes ago, hammertime said: I'm fine with a shut down LHD Gavrikov or a like would at least go a long way to getting OEL, Hughes off the PK. If it costs us a Hoglander/Rathbone and a sweetener so be it. We need to be more aggressive to dump cap. Using Hogs, Bone, Dipietro, as sugar is what we should be doing to dumperoo Dickinson, Pearson, Poolman. Trade Garland for picks and that opens up 13 mil in cap space. Get ‘er done JR! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 52 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said: I know they are in win now mode, with some very old players playing 2nd fiddle, but the truth is, with the other teams building "young" strong teams, NYI are falling the way side. IMO, Pulock becomes very redundant on a maximum .500 club, and he can be replaced by Mayfield as Dobson jump up to 1st pairing. Hughes is >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>better than Romanov, who incidentally can play both sides Yep but I still think NYI will stick with the team they've got and try and win a cup in the next 2 seasons. I don't think they will get there. And in 2 seasons will probably need to rebuild due to the all the aging vets on their roster. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BigTramFan Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 38 minutes ago, hammertime said: I'm fine with a shut down LHD Gavrikov or a like would at least go a long way to getting OEL, Hughes off the PK. If it costs us a Hoglander/Rathbone and a sweetener so be it. Gavrikov would be awesome but CBJ probably keeping him if they can - he's UFA in 1 more season, maybe our Russian players entice him to come to VAN... 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted July 23, 2022 Share Posted July 23, 2022 19 minutes ago, Alflives said: We need to be more aggressive to dump cap. Using Hogs, Bone, Dipietro, as sugar is what we should be doing to dumperoo Dickinson, Pearson, Poolman. Trade Garland for picks and that opens up 13 mil in cap space. Get ‘er done JR! Dickinson is a good checking winger. why pay to dumperoo Dicki when if we need to we can send him to AHL for 1.25m cap savings If someone picks him off waivers no loss. But I'm not paying to get rid of him at this time. Poolman can hang out on LTIR. If we move Garland I want a big return he is huge bang for buck on his contract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 On 7/17/2022 at 10:08 PM, J.I.A.H.N said: Quinn Hughes to NYI for Pulock, 2023-1st, and Pageau Elias Pettersson, Hoglander and Poolman to Arizona for Chychrun, Crouse, and 2024-1st Sign John Klingberg 7 years @ 7.25 per Sign Tyler Motte 3 years @ 1.5 per Sign Juho Lammikko 3 years @ 1.5 per Trade Pearson for a 2023-3rd Trade Dickenson plus 2025-2nd for future Considerations Trade Myers for a 2024-2nd Kuzmenko (1) Miller (8) Podkolzin (1) Big strong line, fast and intense...........hard to handle Crouse (3) Horvat (7) Boeser (7) Another big strong line, a little slower, but still a solid Mikheyev (5) Pageau (5) Garland (5) This is a fast, tenacious line, who will be able to our score their opposition Tyler Motte (1.5) Lazar (1) Lockwood (1) These 4 players are all about pressure and physical contact Lammikko (1) Chychrun (4.6) Pullock (6.1) These guys can play offense and defense, both strong skaters, with a physical element OEL (7.3) Klingburg (7.25) These grizzly old veterans, still have lots in the tank, and offensively compare to any pairing in the league Dermott (1.5) Schenn (1) Pairings 3/4 inter change, until some comes out of the pack, aggressive and defensive Rathbone (1) Burroughs (1) Rathbone has the potential to become OEL's replacement, sooner than later, can you imagine Demko (5) This is the best contract on the Canucks (Thank you JB) Top 5 goalie in the league...under paid! Martin (1) I hope he can hold it together until Silvos is ready! Another steal, and could be a trading chip down the line. Total Cap.............81.25 million (rounded up) (probably closer to 80.00 million) 2023 Draft 2024 Draft Prospects (Loose rankings-Silvos out of place) NYI 2023-1st Arizona 2024-1st #1 Lekkerimaki RW...................Offensive RW, ready in 2 years Vancouver 2023-1st Vancouver 2024-1st #2 Klimovich RW.......................2/3 RW, still needs to develop, has potential Vancouver 2023-2nd Myers 2024-2nd #3 Karlson C.............................Good snipper, slow a foot Pearson 2023-3rd Vancouver 2024-2nd #4 McDonough RW...................Good snipper Vancouver 2023-3rd Vancouver 2024-3rd #5 E. Pettersson LHD...............Has potential NYRangers 2023-4th Vancouver 2024-4th #6 Woo RHD............................Needs to pick it up Vancouver 2023-4th Vancouver 2024-5th #7 Silvos G...............................Goalie of the future ???? Vancouver 2023-5th Vancouver 2024-6th #8 Jurmo LHD..........................Needs time in the SHL, undetermined Vancouver 2023-6th Vancouver 2024-7th #9 Myenburg RHD....................Shows good in a lesser league, undetermined #10. Truscott LHD......................Long, Long, Long shot *Note Boeser to be traded in 3 years Lekkerimakki scheduled to replace for picks and prospects Garland to be traded in 2 years Klimovich scheduled to replace for picks and prospects NYI does this to build with new talent............Hughes/Dobson for the next 10 years.............we might have to add Arizona does this for cap and talent...............Pettersson for the next 10 years...............I don't think we need to add, but maybe Vancouver does this because, we are close, Miller is our best player not named Demko, who is on a killer contract right now. This puts us top 25% of the league, with a full 3 years before anything big needs to happen, and then we will have prospects to start filling in. Edited* Forgot Myers trade Honestly a wild proposal. anything that trades Hughes will probably get a hard no from me but that’s just not good enough. He’s in a very high and small tier of elite young puck moving dmen. And he’s already the most exciting dman we’ve ever had in franchise history. He’s not going anywhere unless he ever wants to leave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted July 24, 2022 Author Share Posted July 24, 2022 48 minutes ago, R3aL said: Honestly a wild proposal. anything that trades Hughes will probably get a hard no from me but that’s just not good enough. He’s in a very high and small tier of elite young puck moving dmen. And he’s already the most exciting dman we’ve ever had in franchise history. He’s not going anywhere unless he ever wants to leave That is ok R3aL You can have Hughes I'll take a Stanley Cup Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
R3aL Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 3 hours ago, J.I.A.H.N said: That is ok R3aL You can have Hughes I'll take a Stanley Cup I don’t think it’s a Stanley cup roster. top 4 d is very interesting. Chychrun-Pulock would be a cool pairing OEL-Klingberg I’m not sure of but as a second pairing they’d be very strong without a doubt. I don’t really see those trades happening though. your proposal is hard to digest because you trade our two best young players outside of Demko. Two players that have the most potential for growth as well on our roster. Hughes is a PPG dman and Petey is a 100 pt value player. Once he gets a little stronger and he has the weight and strength to play with some edge not be bambi/ Disney on ice his two way game is going to really shine. He also showed he can hold his own on face offs now consistently last year down the stretch. And what I mean by 100pt value player is even if he gets like 80 pts in a season he’s the kind of player who will save you 20 goals as well with his two way play and high end ability in disrupting breakouts / reading plays and with takeaways. I like abstract thinking and creativity though because it really gets you thinking. I do agree their post bridge deals are going to be and issue if all things go well. if Hughes gets even better and Petey is a 40+ goal scorer with a strong two way game as a top line C we are going to have to give them big contracts. But every team pays their stars. This bridge is for them to show they cns be the stars we need to win a Stanley cup and to build around with demko. your proposal kinda means you don’t believe in them to be those players or you thinking theirs a more cost effective way to building a champion without them. your top line is riding on: 1 - JT MILLER to be a top line C. not his natural position. The league views him more as a winger. Any game he played with pettersson he’d play wing and EP would take care of C responsibilities. even when Miller took draws he’s slot back out on the boards and Petey rotated and took the C responsibilities. he had stretches with other wingers where he looked good offensively but defensively he’s an adventure at C. He needs another season for me to believe he can be a 1C. 2 sophomore PODS to not take a step back. 3 an unproven kuzmenko to be a top line winger. That’s a lot to ask if someone new to the league with his skill set, questioned conditioning and skating. for the second line. really counting on Horvat as speed to be enough to carry Crouse and Boeser as they aren’t the fastest. so in our top 6 you have: horvat miller podz then boeser crouse kuzmenko 50% of them aren’t known to be fast skaters. joshua is probably making the team too staff are really high on him to play a fourth line role and PK and motte / lammikko contract and term aren’t a fit imo. I don’t see this forward group being good enough and it puts so much pressure on Miller and Horvat. Also having Pulock traded would be like us asking edler to waive right after signing his last extension. It’s also kind of similar circumstances as Pulock loves being there just like edler loved Vancouver. We did sour the relationship but he stayed the whole contract. I don’t see that trade happening and hoenstly inwoudkt want it too. I truly believe our best chance of winning a cup ion the next 3-5 years ia with Demko continuing his stellar play Hughes getting stronger and as close to makar level possible Pettersson becoming stronger And all hitting their ceilings and building the best supporting squad possible around them. so fundamentally we won’t agree but I do appreciate the creativity and I do see how you put together a deeper defence and a heavier team. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted July 24, 2022 Author Share Posted July 24, 2022 (edited) 6 hours ago, R3aL said: I don’t think it’s a Stanley cup roster. top 4 d is very interesting. Chychrun-Pulock would be a cool pairing OEL-Klingberg I’m not sure of but as a second pairing they’d be very strong without a doubt. I don’t really see those trades happening though. your proposal is hard to digest because you trade our two best young players outside of Demko. Two players that have the most potential for growth as well on our roster. Hughes is a PPG dman and Petey is a 100 pt value player. Once he gets a little stronger and he has the weight and strength to play with some edge not be bambi/ Disney on ice his two way game is going to really shine. He also showed he can hold his own on face offs now consistently last year down the stretch. And what I mean by 100pt value player is even if he gets like 80 pts in a season he’s the kind of player who will save you 20 goals as well with his two way play and high end ability in disrupting breakouts / reading plays and with takeaways. I like abstract thinking and creativity though because it really gets you thinking. I do agree their post bridge deals are going to be and issue if all things go well. if Hughes gets even better and Petey is a 40+ goal scorer with a strong two way game as a top line C we are going to have to give them big contracts. But every team pays their stars. This bridge is for them to show they cns be the stars we need to win a Stanley cup and to build around with demko. your proposal kinda means you don’t believe in them to be those players or you thinking theirs a more cost effective way to building a champion without them. your top line is riding on: 1 - JT MILLER to be a top line C. not his natural position. The league views him more as a winger. Any game he played with pettersson he’d play wing and EP would take care of C responsibilities. even when Miller took draws he’s slot back out on the boards and Petey rotated and took the C responsibilities. he had stretches with other wingers where he looked good offensively but defensively he’s an adventure at C. He needs another season for me to believe he can be a 1C. 2 sophomore PODS to not take a step back. 3 an unproven kuzmenko to be a top line winger. That’s a lot to ask if someone new to the league with his skill set, questioned conditioning and skating. for the second line. really counting on Horvat as speed to be enough to carry Crouse and Boeser as they aren’t the fastest. so in our top 6 you have: horvat miller podz then boeser crouse kuzmenko 50% of them aren’t known to be fast skaters. joshua is probably making the team too staff are really high on him to play a fourth line role and PK and motte / lammikko contract and term aren’t a fit imo. I don’t see this forward group being good enough and it puts so much pressure on Miller and Horvat. Also having Pulock traded would be like us asking edler to waive right after signing his last extension. It’s also kind of similar circumstances as Pulock loves being there just like edler loved Vancouver. We did sour the relationship but he stayed the whole contract. I don’t see that trade happening and hoenstly inwoudkt want it too. I truly believe our best chance of winning a cup ion the next 3-5 years ia with Demko continuing his stellar play Hughes getting stronger and as close to makar level possible Pettersson becoming stronger And all hitting their ceilings and building the best supporting squad possible around them. so fundamentally we won’t agree but I do appreciate the creativity and I do see how you put together a deeper defence and a heavier team. Great post! I always address my proposals as pure fantasy, and look at everyone elses the same way, so do I see this happening? No. But, what it does do, is show you how you can balance your roster, and still have a very competitive team starting know, and into the future! I totally love Hughes and Pettersson, but they alone do not win a cup, and waiting for them to do so, ignores that you need a deep team to move up the league standings. Take a look at Edmonton, who have 2 of the very best players in the who league, but lack depth. Look how long and how many drafts it took to find players, that in maybe 2 or 3 years, might be good enough (Broberg and Bouchard), and then they have to still go out and find a above average Goalie, and then to cap it all off, you have to fit them all under the cap. We are not complete enough, and in some of he cases.....aka RHD, we are not one RHD player away, but at minimum, 2 top 4, especially if you think we do not start being competitive for another 2 -3 years, which is after Myers contract expires. (We have not even drafted replacements, and will not have cap space if we do go out and sign a couple of UFA's) I am not saying it won't happen, only that, I do not see it happening, at this point, with this cast. Also, getting back to my dream, yes, I agree there is some unproven aspects......totally true! But you suggest we are too slow, but yet we have them in our line up now. Also, I suggest that some of them are replaced in my proposal within 3 years from within......aka Lekkerimakki for Boeser........and a polished Klimovich for ????. That is not even mentioning McDonough if he develops his skating more. I love making proposals and I think this is one of my better ones, but they are purely fantasy, as mention before., but aren't hey all? But! And I want to point out it is a big but! I absolutely hate when posters lock onto team players as if they are gods, aka Sedin's, which never brought us a Stanley Cup, and had a pretty damn good team in front of them. And if that is not the only thing, as you have to have team chemistry and players that will take discounts.....aka Kesler not so good, and Tampa players who will. ( I don't blame any of then for wanting their money, it only illustrates how difficult it all is) You will notice, that in my trades, most if not all, have signed long term contracts at good cap rates. This is important as it gives you multiple years of contention and it gives you time to develop your prospects. So, at the end of the day, do you want to keep 2 very good players or do you want a team that competes now, and in the future? Thanks for responding, it was a very good thought provoking post and brought up some good issues. (But again, I take this as fun, fantasy!) Cheers! Edited July 24, 2022 by J.I.A.H.N Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
qwijibo Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 On 7/22/2022 at 6:17 PM, JM_ said: I was thinking 5x5 for Klingberg, lots of bonus money. You can’t add bonuses to a standard player contract. You can only do them on an entry level contract or a +35 contract. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 1 hour ago, J.I.A.H.N said: Great post! I always address my proposals as pure fantasy, and look at everyone elses the same way, so do I see this happening? No. But, what it does do, is show you how you can balance your roster, and still have a very competitive team starting know, and into the future! I totally love Hughes and Pettersson, but they alone do not win a cup, and waiting for them to do so, ignores that you need a deep team to move up the league standings. Take a look at Edmonton, who have 2 of the very best players in the who league, but lack depth. Look how long and how many drafts it took to find players, that in maybe 2 or 3 years, might be good enough (Broberg and Bouchard), and then they have to still go out and find a above average Goalie, and then to cap it all off, you have to fit them all under the cap. We are not complete enough, and in some of he cases.....aka RHD, we are not one RHD player away, but at minimum, 2 top 4, especially if you think we do not start being competitive for another 2 -3 years, which is after Myers contract expires. (We have not even drafted replacements, and will not have cap space if we do go out and sign a couple of UFA's) I am not saying it won't happen, only that, I do not see it happening, at this point, with this cast. Also, getting back to my dream, yes, I agree there is some unproven aspects......totally true! But you suggest we are too slow, but yet we have them in our line up now. Also, I suggest that some of them are replaced in my proposal within 3 years from within......aka Lekkerimakki for Boeser........and a polished Klimovich for ????. That is not even mentioning McDonough if he develops his skating more. I love making proposals and I think this is one of my better ones, but they are purely fantasy, as mention before., but aren't hey all? But! And I want to point out it is a big but! I absolutely hate when posters lock onto team players as if they are gods, aka Sedin's, which never brought us a Stanley Cup, and had a pretty damn good team in front of them. And if that is not the only thing, as you have to have team chemistry and players that will take discounts.....aka Kesler not so good, and Tampa players who will. ( I don't blame any of then for wanting their money, it only illustrates how difficult it all is) You will notice, that in my trades, most if not all, have signed long term contracts at good cap rates. This is important as it gives you multiple years of contention and it gives you time to develop your prospects. So, at the end of the day, do you want to keep 2 very good players or do you want a team that competes now, and in the future? Thanks for responding, it was a very good thought provoking post and brought up some good issues. (But again, I take this as fun, fantasy!) Cheers! What if we trade two of our cap dumps (Poolman and Dickinson) to the Habs for one of their cap dumps - Anderson? The money works out to the same. There is the concern about Anderson’s contract length, so the Habs could add a second? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hammertime Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 Speaking of Fantasy. What if Tucker Poolman comes back healthy. He was a great fit with Morrisey in WPG what if he just had a bad season concussions are tricky. IMO there is a real possibility that he and Rathbone click. If Rathbone hasn't learned not to bleed high danger chances against by x mas we gotta pump n dump him. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 1 hour ago, qwijibo said: You can’t add bonuses to a standard player contract. You can only do them on an entry level contract or a +35 contract. sorry meant signing bonus money - guaranteed salary is a powerful motivator. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted July 24, 2022 Author Share Posted July 24, 2022 48 minutes ago, Alflives said: What if we trade two of our cap dumps (Poolman and Dickinson) to the Habs for one of their cap dumps - Anderson? The money works out to the same. There is the concern about Anderson’s contract length, so the Habs could add a second? I like Anderson, unfortunate, it's my understanding that Habs fans do too! I think we have enough forwards anyways Alf, but maybe what you propose works from our end, but again probably not theirs Have you heard differently? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alflives Posted July 24, 2022 Share Posted July 24, 2022 1 minute ago, J.I.A.H.N said: I like Anderson, unfortunate, it's my understanding that Habs fans do too! I think we have enough forwards anyways Alf, but maybe what you propose works from our end, but again probably not theirs Have you heard differently? Habs have several cap dumps and Snderson is obviously one of them. Sure he only averages 27 points per year over his career but he’s big and fast. So we dump two shorter term contracts and take on their longer term dump. You’re right though. Bringing Anderson’s contract in, even with two cap dumps going out, is something Benning would do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted July 24, 2022 Author Share Posted July 24, 2022 3 minutes ago, Alflives said: Habs have several cap dumps and Snderson is obviously one of them. Sure he only averages 27 points per year over his career but he’s big and fast. So we dump two shorter term contracts and take on their longer term dump. You’re right though. Bringing Anderson’s contract in, even with two cap dumps going out, is something Benning would do. I do like Anderson's game though......but isn't he injured a lot? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted July 24, 2022 Author Share Posted July 24, 2022 @Alflives So just as a side question to our current cap, and how we need to get at least one RHD, which we can not because of our Cap What if Kuzmenko score 60 points this year? He is a UFA at the end of the year, so what do we do about that and trying to fix our RHD at the same time? IMO, this cap problem is such an important part of the problem and the answer.............same goes for Horvat's ask, and what Pettersson's asks 1 year later To build a top 10 team mean getting depth players on great deals and stars that can carry teams...........do you see Hughes or Pettersson carrying this team? I don't! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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