Where do we get a RHD from? (Discussion)

[JM_]

43 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Maybe the intention was to sign Miller from the beginning and all of the trade rumours were BS so he was never really on the trading block to begin with...

BS.... in the VANCOUVER media???? 

 

it can't be 

[JM_]

14 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Younger, different type of player, cheaper, etc..............

hmm, yeah that could be. I just worry that for the first time Bo may have two regular stud wingers with him and we lose out on seeing the best of Bo. 

 

I mean look at some of the players he's carried over the years and he still produced consistently. 

 

I'd rather burn some mid-round picks moving Dickie and Pearson to make the cap space for Severson than lose Bo. 

[Angry Goose]

If only Judd Brackett hit on Jet Woo before leaving

[bigbadcanucks]

So much time spent worrying about having enough RHD on the CDC.

 

Check out the rosters of the Habs, Islanders dynasties and other championship teams and you'll find they only had 1 or 2 RHD on their roster, with the second RHD being the 7th d-man.  You can win with 6 lefties as long as they are good enough.  The problem with the Canucks is not whether a d-man is right or left handed.  The problem is that after Hughes and OEL, there is a big drop off in skill level.

[WCE]

Offer Subban a PTO or Sign him for what Poolman was getting paid. 2yr/2.5 per

 

 

 

 

[Devron]

10 minutes ago, WCE said:

Offer Subban a PTO or Sign him for what Poolman was getting paid. 2yr/2.5 per

 

 

 

 

Poolman is better than Subban defensively. I don’t know why people don’t give the guy a chance. He’s at training camp. Let’s see if he can stay healthy and what he can bring 

[wildcam]

7 hours ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Ok, there have been countless trade proposals where we get a RHD in the deal, yet we are always trading a valuable piece that weakens our forward group. So where do we get our much needed RHD?

 

Why are we in this dilemma?

 

1. Trade..........weakens our forward group

2. Draft...........we wait 4 years for him to "possibly" develop

3. UFA............well, usually too expensive, with too much cap hit.

 

First off, you are not getting a blue chip Dman without trading Pettersson, and even yet, if they are truly blue chip, I don't see the trading team, making that deal. The Makar, Fox's, Seider's of the league, are way too valuable. Which takes me to the next level, which are the undeveloped bluechippers...........Drysdale, Nemec, Jiricek, Clarke type, these guys are great, but will they develop into the Makars, Fox's etc?

 

Then there is the next step down....Schneider's, Durzi's, Faber's types...........these are players that the trading teams, want as they are young cap controlled, and have potential to be very good young Dmen.

 

This leads me to the older Dmen, who may be available, but at big trading cost and big cap. Do we want to spend a young asset on a Trouba, Dumba, Piece, Severson, type player, who will be near the end of their contract and wanting a big pay day? Even a player like Mayfield, who is at the end of his contract will want a bump up from his current contract, or will just go to free agency to get his pay day.

 

There is no easy fix................there is no RHD in the pipeline, and what ever we do to acquire one will cost...............be ready!

 

I will pose this to you, though.............IMO, we will wait to see how Kuzmenko will do this year, as he is unproven, and if he has done well by christmas, then you will see Alvin pull a big trade, especially if Podkolzin steps it up and Boeser plays to his past abilities.

 

Right now there are alot of moving parts, and with Horvat not signed, I do not see the Canucks making a move to acquire the needed part.............I would think that what ever player we move, it will not bring in a player of equivalent ability, as RHD are so rare............

 

I also want to say, that a Hughes, OEL LHD side are as good as any, and we do not need to tinker with that side for 3/4 years.....just leave it! Rathbone is a potential gem, and we should wait to see what we have, as "IF" he shows well, he will be a great addition or a great trading piece, but his value will be in "IF" he develops. Certainly there are potential prospects behind him on the left side that "may" be a good fit at LHD.................which just leads me to that glaring hole on the right side. I truly believe it is 3 ready RHD away from us being a long term contender. That includes prospects as well.

 

What well does Alvin go to? Where are our strengths, where can we move a player to get what we need and not be too affected by the move?

 

These are the questions we have tried to answer all summer............

Someone might have to clear waivers to get sent to minors? Keep fingers crossed RD under 28..

[wildcam]

4 hours ago, The_Rocket said:

has to be through trade. outside of #1 Dmen, contending teams build their D-core through trade

 

Tampa: McDonogh, Sergachev, Cernak all acquired via trade

Colorado: Toews, Girard, Johnson, Manson all acquired via trade

Florida: Montour, Forsling (technically waivers), Chiarot all acquired via trade

Toronto: Muzzin, Girodano Acquired via Trade,

Carolina: Skjei, Bear acquired via trade (add burns and coughlin this season)

Calgary: Hanafin, Zadorov (add weegar this year)

Rangers: Trouba, Fox, Lindgren

 

Pretty much any contending team as at least 2 Dmen aquired via trade. The Canucks have OEL and Dermott. aquiring one more top 4 dman is their best bet and the best way to do it is via trade. you already have hughes, you dont need another #1. just a coupla #3s. 

 

NYR also have stud RD Schneider 21, 6'2 - played regular in playoffs this past season..

1. Fox  24-RD   2. Trouba 28 - RD 3. Schneider 21 - RD

1. Lingren 24 LD -- 2.Miller 22 -LD

I sure like Rangers top 5 Defence and all so young..

[Junkyard Dog]

Trade is tough to do because teams that could move a RD might not like what we have to offer in terms of forward assets and could prefer to free up cap considering how much cap is a premium.

 

Might have to get a 3rd team involved. 

[Ghostsof1915]

1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds in the draft?

[Elias Pettersson]

1 hour ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 5th, 6th, and 7th rounds in the draft?

Didn’t some team in the NFL try that one year?  Did it work out for them?

[Ghostsof1915]

5 minutes ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Didn’t some team in the NFL try that one year?  Did it work out for them?

Football is not hockey.

But Seattle for years didn't bother drafting even in the later rounds a need in getting an offensive lineman.

So no idea.

[Coconuts]

We'll probably try via the draft but that'll take a while, realistically we're probably going to have to move a forward and acquire one from another team. Trying to fish via UFA doesn't guarantee us anything but it is an option if a quality RD actually decides to walk to UFA. 

 

We're too forward heavy, sooner or later we're gonna have to cut away at some of that forward cap to bolster our D. This was a significant part of many trade Miller debates. I never thought moving Garland or Boeser was gonna get it done, but you can't make trades if other teams aren't willing to play ball and here we are. 

 

Time will tell. 

Edited September 11, 2022 by Coconuts

[Elias Pettersson]

43 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

Football is not hockey.

But Seattle for years didn't bother drafting even in the later rounds a need in getting an offensive lineman.

So no idea.

I thought you meant to trade the entire draft for a RHD. 
 

I believe an NFL team did that one year. Traded their entire draft for the number 1 overall pick. 

[HighOnHockey]

14 hours ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Ok, there have been countless trade proposals where we get a RHD in the deal, yet we are always trading a valuable piece that weakens our forward group. So where do we get our much needed RHD?

 

Why are we in this dilemma?

 

1. Trade..........weakens our forward group

2. Draft...........we wait 4 years for him to "possibly" develop

3. UFA............well, usually too expensive, with too much cap hit.

 

First off, you are not getting a blue chip Dman without trading Pettersson, and even yet, if they are truly blue chip, I don't see the trading team, making that deal. The Makar, Fox's, Seider's of the league, are way too valuable. Which takes me to the next level, which are the undeveloped bluechippers...........Drysdale, Nemec, Jiricek, Clarke type, these guys are great, but will they develop into the Makars, Fox's etc?

 

Then there is the next step down....Schneider's, Durzi's, Faber's types...........these are players that the trading teams, want as they are young cap controlled, and have potential to be very good young Dmen.

 

This leads me to the older Dmen, who may be available, but at big trading cost and big cap. Do we want to spend a young asset on a Trouba, Dumba, Piece, Severson, type player, who will be near the end of their contract and wanting a big pay day? Even a player like Mayfield, who is at the end of his contract will want a bump up from his current contract, or will just go to free agency to get his pay day.

 

There is no easy fix................there is no RHD in the pipeline, and what ever we do to acquire one will cost...............be ready!

 

I will pose this to you, though.............IMO, we will wait to see how Kuzmenko will do this year, as he is unproven, and if he has done well by christmas, then you will see Alvin pull a big trade, especially if Podkolzin steps it up and Boeser plays to his past abilities.

 

Right now there are alot of moving parts, and with Horvat not signed, I do not see the Canucks making a move to acquire the needed part.............I would think that what ever player we move, it will not bring in a player of equivalent ability, as RHD are so rare............

 

I also want to say, that a Hughes, OEL LHD side are as good as any, and we do not need to tinker with that side for 3/4 years.....just leave it! Rathbone is a potential gem, and we should wait to see what we have, as "IF" he shows well, he will be a great addition or a great trading piece, but his value will be in "IF" he develops. Certainly there are potential prospects behind him on the left side that "may" be a good fit at LHD.................which just leads me to that glaring hole on the right side. I truly believe it is 3 ready RHD away from us being a long term contender. That includes prospects as well.

 

What well does Alvin go to? Where are our strengths, where can we move a player to get what we need and not be too affected by the move?

 

These are the questions we have tried to answer all summer............

MacKenzie Weegar was long one of my top targets for Canucks. Missed out on him. As I've said before regarding a partner for Hughes we should be looking for a skilled puck-moving defenseman who is also responsible defensively. Last thing we want is a defensive defenseman who can't move the puck. Hughes is at his worst when he's stuck in his own zone playing defense. We want someone who can support him moving the puck up ice but also cover for some of his risk-taking. I did a list based on a combination of factors ranging from talent, likely availability, age/potential, and fit.

 

1. Damon Severson

2. Noah Dobson

3. Dante Fabbro

4. Brett Pesce

5. Alexandre Carrier

6. Henri Jokiharju

7. Matt Roy

8. Sean Walker

9. Helge Grans

10. Brandon Montour

Edited September 11, 2022 by HighOnHockey

[J.I.A.H.N]

6 hours ago, HighOnHockey said:

MacKenzie Weegar was long one of my top targets for Canucks. Missed out on him. As I've said before regarding a partner for Hughes we should be looking for a skilled puck-moving defenseman who is also responsible defensively. Last thing we want is a defensive defenseman who can't move the puck. Hughes is at his worst when he's stuck in his own zone playing defense. We want someone who can support him moving the puck up ice but also cover for some of his risk-taking. I did a list based on a combination of factors ranging from talent, likely availability, age/potential, and fit.

 

1. Damon Severson

2. Noah Dobson

3. Dante Fabbro

4. Brett Pesce

5. Alexandre Carrier

6. Henri Jokiharju

7. Matt Roy

8. Sean Walker

9. Helge Grans

10. Brandon Montour

Love your list...........as always!

 

I wonder hop long this search takes.....meaning, do we go out and make the trade sometime during the season, or do we wait until 2023 free agency?

 

My biggest question is what do we give up?

[JM_]

7 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Love your list...........as always!

 

I wonder hop long this search takes.....meaning, do we go out and make the trade sometime during the season, or do we wait until 2023 free agency?

 

My biggest question is what do we give up?

a lot. It will sting either in picks, prospects or both.

 

Our new mgmt is so damn quiet we have no idea what they are working on, its frustrating 

[J.I.A.H.N]

18 minutes ago, JM_ said:

a lot. It will sting either in picks, prospects or both.

 

Our new mgmt is so damn quiet we have no idea what they are working on, its frustrating 

I wonder "IF" PK Subban could be signed for $1,000,000 per season and get him playing a more defensive role? I mean, up until he played with NJ, that was at the bottom of the league, he was a plus player, this might extend his career, and give Hughes a very good partner. 

 

Yes, he is a big personality, but so what, he has never been a bad team-mate...........which is all that is important.

 

Maybe @HighOnHockey can comment? What are your thoughts Jim?

[HighOnHockey]

34 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said:

Love your list...........as always!

 

I wonder hop long this search takes.....meaning, do we go out and make the trade sometime during the season, or do we wait until 2023 free agency?

 

My biggest question is what do we give up?

Yeah that's the tough part isn't it? For a guy like Dobson we'd have to be looking at a name like Horvat or Podkolzin. For any of the others a package centered around one of Garland or Hoglander might do the trick. Problem is a bunch of the players I listed are of the L.A. Kings, who already have Arvidsson and Fiala in their top 6. Not sure they'll be looking for another small forward.

[Crabcakes]

18 hours ago, Elias Pettersson said:

Maybe the intention was to sign Miller from the beginning and all of the trade rumours were BS so he was never really on the trading block to begin with...

In Rutherford interviews pre-draft he said that his first choice was to re-sign Miller.  Only if he insisted on an unrealistic number for the Canucks would they have to trade him.

 

Since he was not signed back then, it was assumed that the number was far too high so that they were shopping him.