LTIR and ASCL: How it works and a common misconception

[Bad_BOI_pete]

I have noticed mll and I have spent many hours and correcting posters on how LTIR works. I hope to clarify things here

 

What is LTIR?

When a player has an injury of which they are expected to miss a minimum of 10 NHL games and 24 days in the NHL season, the team can place them on long term injured reserve (LTIR). LTIR can be used to exceed the salary cap. LTIR is a very complicated aspect of the NHL operations and the vast majority of details are not specified in the CBA.

When a player is placed on LTIR, thier cap hit remains on the teams cap payroll and it continues to count as it always did. It also does not provide the club with additional cap-space,. Instead, LTIR provides relief if the club's averaged club salary, or payroll, begins to exceed the upper limit. The amount of relief that the club receives is calculated on the day the player is placed on LTIR. 

 

 

 

What this means in Layman terms. LTIR is a rule set in place to allow teams to be competitive even when a player is injured during or to start the season. Under no circumstance will a team be able to exceed the Upper limit of the cap with there 23 man playing roster, until the playoffs where there is no cap limit.   LTIR is simply relief.

 

What is the Accruable Cap Space Limit (ACSL)?

When a team goes into LTIR, their effective salary cap, or upper limit, is changed. This adjusted upper limit is calculated as a function of the teams cap space and the player’s cap hit. This value is the “accruable cap space limit” (ACSL), and is the first value calculated.

The accruable cap space limit is the teams new upper limit excluding their LTIR relief pools. If the team operates below the ACSL, they begin to accrue cap space. A team can operate up to the ACSL without using their LTIR relief pools, once they operate above the ACSL, they begin to use their LTIR relief pools. In the majority of cases, a team using LTIR will be using their relief pools. Only in uncommon circumstances does a team operate below their ACSL.

The ACSL is only calculated when a team first enters LTIR, if a player is placed on LTIR while another player is already on LTIR, the ACSL is not recalculated. In the event that a team stops using LTIR, their ACSL resets to the default upper limit of the active season, upon reentering LTIR, the ACSL is again recalculated.

 

what this means In Layman Terms. ASCL is basically replaces the new upper limit. The ASCL determines the upper limit of player contracts allowed on the 23 man roster. The ASCL will never exceed the Upper salary cap, it will only be lower.

Forget about accruing space, 99.9% percent of the time it doesn't make sense to even use LTIR in this situation.

 

How much can teams exceed the league upper limit by?

Once the team exceeds their ACSL, they start to use their relief pools. They can exceed the upper limit until they have exhausted the necessary relief pools. A rough estimation is as follows:

Exceed value = ACSL + salary relief pool - league upper limit

 

What this means in layman terms: You can exceed the ASCL by the amount of cap thats in the LTIR relief pool. BUT remember this, the injured player still counts against the cap, and the ASCL is always lower than the Upper limit, so you technically never get an advantage in cap space. see below for the BUT BUT BUT section where i concede some points

 

 

Basic ASCL and LTIR relief Equation Example

The league upper limit is $82.5M. A team has an averaged club salary of $81.5M and a player with a contract with an AAV of $5M becomes injured and the team places him on LTIR. The LTIR relief pools are calculated as follows:

1. AAV of LTIR player is $5M
2. Cap space = $82.5M - $81.5M = $1M remaining
3. ACSL = $82.5M - $1M = $81.5M
4. LTIR relief:
   1. salary relief pool: $5M

Once the team operates above the ASCL of $81.5M, they have $5M in relief

 

What this really Means: Because this team did not maximize it's ASCL the team now can only have a 23 man player roster of 81.5m million.  or in other words. This team can have a total cap hit of 86.5 million but only a 23 man player roster equal to 81.5 million.

 

Basic ASCL Equation and LTIR relief Example 2

The league upper limit is $82.5M. A team is already in LTIR. The team  has a ASCL of 81.5M and a player with a contract with an AAV of $5M becomes injured and the team places him on LTIR. The LTIR relief pools are calculated as follows:

1. Total AAV of LTIR players is $10M
2. Total AAV of Newly injured player placed on LTIR is $5M
3. ACSL = $82.5M - $1M = $81.5M it does not get recalculated
4. LTIR relief:
   1. salary relief pool: $10M

Once the team operates above the ASCL of $81.5M, they have $10M in relief

 

What this really Means: Because this team did not maximize it's ASCL the team now can only have a 23 man player roster of 81.5m million.  or in other words. This team can have a total cap hit of 91.5 million but only a 23 man player roster equal to 81.5 million.

What if the team already has a player on LTIR and trade for another LTIR contract?
The teams ACSL remains the same, and their salary relief pool increases by the player’s cap hit.

 

What this means in layman terms. when you trade for a player already on LTIR nothing really changes. Yes you get more relief, but the player still counts against the cap. It's a complete wash.

 

BUT, BUT, BUT. section.

 

I will concede some points here, infact a player on LTIR could be a positive in some circumstances.

 

Scenario 1 A : A player with a terrible contract becomes injured with a career injury. Simply trade for a player with a more cost efficient contract (using picks or prospects) and your team will be better.

 

Scenario 1 B:  A player with a terrible contract becomes injured with a season ending injury and is expected to return in the playoffs. Simply trade for a player with a more cost efficient contract (using picks or prospects) and your team will be better. This scenario has a caveat that it could become a detriment if the player returns during the season. ( see last season's Las Vegas team.)

 

Scenario 2: the "Kucherov" LTIR. Where a team replaces a Star player with contracts and the player only returns in the offseason. This scenario has a caveat that it could become a detriment if the player returns during the season (see last season's Las Vegas team.)

 

 

Source: Capfriendly.

Edited October 9, 2022 by Petey_BOI

[HKSR]

8 hours ago, Petey_BOI said:

I have noticed mll and I have spent many hours and correcting posters on how LTIR works. I hope to clarify things here

 

What is LTIR?

When a player has an injury of which they are expected to miss a minimum of 10 NHL games and 24 days in the NHL season, the team can place them on long term injured reserve (LTIR). LTIR can be used to exceed the salary cap. LTIR is a very complicated aspect of the NHL operations and the vast majority of details are not specified in the CBA.

When a player is placed on LTIR, thier cap hit remains on the teams cap payroll and it continues to count as it always did. It also does not provide the club with additional cap-space,. Instead, LTIR provides relief if the club's averaged club salary, or payroll, begins to exceed the upper limit. The amount of relief that the club receives is calculated on the day the player is placed on LTIR. 

 

 

 

What this means in Layman terms. LTIR is a rule set in place to allow teams to be competitive even when a player is injured during or to start the season. Under no circumstance will a team be able to exceed the Upper limit of the cap with there 23 man playing roster, until the playoffs where there is no cap limit.   LTIR is simply relief.

 

What is the Accruable Cap Space Limit (ACSL)?

When a team goes into LTIR, their effective salary cap, or upper limit, is changed. This adjusted upper limit is calculated as a function of the teams cap space and the player’s cap hit. This value is the “accruable cap space limit” (ACSL), and is the first value calculated.

The accruable cap space limit is the teams new upper limit excluding their LTIR relief pools. If the team operates below the ACSL, they begin to accrue cap space. A team can operate up to the ACSL without using their LTIR relief pools, once they operate above the ACSL, they begin to use their LTIR relief pools. In the majority of cases, a team using LTIR will be using their relief pools. Only in uncommon circumstances does a team operate below their ACSL.

The ACSL is only calculated when a team first enters LTIR, if a player is placed on LTIR while another player is already on LTIR, the ACSL is not recalculated. In the event that a team stops using LTIR, their ACSL resets to the default upper limit of the active season, upon reentering LTIR, the ACSL is again recalculated.

 

what this means In Layman Terms. ASCL is basically replaces the new upper limit. The ASCL determines the upper limit of player contracts allowed on the 23 man roster. The ASCL will never exceed the Upper salary cap, it will only be lower.

Forget about accruing space, 99.9% percent of the time it doesn't make sense to even use LTIR in this situation.

 

How much can teams exceed the league upper limit by?

Once the team exceeds their ACSL, they start to use their relief pools. They can exceed the upper limit until they have exhausted the necessary relief pools. A rough estimation is as follows:

Exceed value = ACSL + salary relief pool - league upper limit

 

What this means in layman terms: You can exceed the ASCL by the amount of cap thats in the LTIR relief pool. BUT remember this, the injured player still counts against the cap, and the ASCL is always lower than the Upper limit, so you technically never get an advantage in cap space. see below for the BUT BUT BUT section where i concede some points

 

 

Basic ASCL and LTIR relief Equation Example

The league upper limit is $82.5M. A team has an averaged club salary of $81.5M and a player with a contract with an AAV of $5M becomes injured and the team places him on LTIR. The LTIR relief pools are calculated as follows:

1. AAV of LTIR player is $5M
2. Cap space = $82.5M - $81.5M = $1M remaining
3. ACSL = $82.5M - $1M = $81.5M
4. LTIR relief:
   1. salary relief pool: $5M

Once the team operates above the ASCL of $81.5M, they have $5M in relief

 

What this really Means: Because this team did not maximize it's ASCL the team now can only have a 23 man player roster of 81.5m million.  or in other words. This team can have a total cap hit of 86.5 million but only a 23 man player roster equal to 81.5 million.

 

Basic ASCL Equation and LTIR relief Example 2

The league upper limit is $82.5M. A team is already in LTIR. The team  has a ASCL of 81.5M and a player with a contract with an AAV of $5M becomes injured and the team places him on LTIR. The LTIR relief pools are calculated as follows:

1. Total AAV of LTIR players is $10M
2. Total AAV of Newly injured player placed on LTIR is $5M
3. ACSL = $82.5M - $1M = $81.5M it does not get recalculated
4. LTIR relief:
   1. salary relief pool: $10M

Once the team operates above the ASCL of $81.5M, they have $10M in relief

 

What this really Means: Because this team did not maximize it's ASCL the team now can only have a 23 man player roster of 81.5m million.  or in other words. This team can have a total cap hit of 91.5 million but only a 23 man player roster equal to 81.5 million.

What if the team already has a player on LTIR and trade for another LTIR contract?
The teams ACSL remains the same, and their salary relief pool increases by the player’s cap hit.

 

What this means in layman terms. when you trade for a player already on LTIR nothing really changes. Yes you get more relief, but the player still counts against the cap. It's a complete wash.

 

BUT, BUT, BUT. section.

 

I will concede some points here, infact a player on LTIR could be a positive in some circumstances.

 

Scenario 1 A : A player with a terrible contract becomes injured with a career injury. Simply trade for a player with a more cost efficient contract (using picks or prospects) and your team will be better.

 

Scenario 1 B:  A player with a terrible contract becomes injured with a season ending injury and is expected to return in the playoffs. Simply trade for a player with a more cost efficient contract (using picks or prospects) and your team will be better. This scenario has a caveat that it could become a detriment if the player returns during the season. ( see last season's Las Vegas team.)

 

Scenario 2: the "Kucherov" LTIR. Where a team replaces a Star player with contracts and the player only returns in the offseason. This scenario has a caveat that it could become a detriment if the player returns during the season (see last season's Las Vegas team.)

 

 

Source: Capfriendly.

Nice job.  I like that you included the last section where there ARE situations where LTIR is valued.  As with everything in life, it's not black and white that LTIR is always a negative thing.

[Ghostsof1915]

I remember Toronto a couple of years ago at end of the season, having to juggle a lot of AHL players in their lineup because they couldn't afford to bring back players from IR.

 

 

[Bad_BOI_pete]

13 minutes ago, Ghostsof1915 said:

I remember Toronto a couple of years ago at end of the season, having to juggle a lot of AHL players in their lineup because they couldn't afford to bring back players from IR.

 

 

I remeber the canucks might have done that too in 2011. Salo was our injured hero that year.

[ilduce39]

So, with Ferland, we don’t get “extra” cap space for the day to day roster but if we’re up against the cap ceiling (capfriendly has us with 60k room)  when he goes on LTIR we can exceed the “cap” by 3.5 mil (but the active roster on any given day can’t be more than the usual 82.5.).
 

That actually makes sense if I have it right - you can go out and spend what you were going to on your team if a guy is out long term.

[Bad_BOI_pete]

3 minutes ago, ilduce39 said:

So, with Ferland, we don’t get “extra” cap space for the day to day roster but if we’re up against the cap ceiling (capfriendly has us with 60k room)  when he goes on LTIR we can exceed the “cap” by 3.5 mil (but the active roster on any given day can’t be more than the usual 82.5.).
 

That actually makes sense if I have it right - you can go out and spend what you were going to on your team if a guy is out long term.

Yup, that is pretty much correct. you can spend up to 82.5 million if the ASCL is calculated perfectly.

as for capfriendly, I don't think they have the roster correct. Di Giuseppe, Aman, Karlsson, rathbone and Joshua are all still with the big team. it's unlikely we will risk waiving Joshua, so likely we will have a ASCL calculation that is not as perfect as Capfriendly has speculated here. its likely we will have a ASCL of 82.39M and DI Giuseppe will start the season on LTIR with ferland .

 

Di Giuseppe, Aman, Karlsson, rathbone will be the first players to be waived when our roster gets healthier, Aman, Karlsson and rathbone all are waiver exempt and Di Guiseppe is likely not claimed and not a huge loss if claimed he's like a 15/16th forward on our team.