J.I.A.H.N Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Well, I have been wanting to make a proposal, but it really isn't the whole picture. No doubt, we need a big high end RHD.....no doubt! But they are hard to find! But just as important is team toughness and character, which I am not seeing! Twice........the Hughes high stick, and last night the Burroughs high stick......................no team reaction! None of any intensity, anyways! You just can not leave these type of incidents unanswered.............it spells out we are soft, to the league Yes, it does not help when the stupid refs under call the penalties, but the league has at least answered the severity issue by revisiting and giving additional punishment But that only underscores the severity of the incident, and the reaction of our team. I wonder how Evander Kane would have re-acted if it had happened to one of his team-mates, I wonder how DeAngelo would have reacted I mention them, because they both are the type of players who would react to these types of things, and who CDC was not remotely interested in......... Even though, both have not made any type of problems with their respective teams.........I mention them, because besides their aggressive nature, they are skilled and add to their teams competitiveness, in a positive way.............well liked? Who knows? Who cares! But I would bet they would have jumped in and I bet their team mates would have loved them for it. Too many on CDC want a gentlemen's team, and not a hard to play against team...............I look down the line up, and feel sorry for Schenn, and Myers, as there are just not enough of the regulars that will answer the call. 1 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 lol...you're asking this knowing it's been absent since 2010-2011 The last time we had this on our team we had a roster that consisted of Albert Lapierre Burrows Hansen Kesler Rome Torres Volpatti You have to go a LONG ways back to find any sort of aggressiveness or the like on this team. hell, I have more tenacity in my stoll than the last decade of canucks line ups. I'm taking fibre for it but you get the idea 3 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 3 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said: Well, I have been wanting to make a proposal, but it really isn't the whole picture. No doubt, we need a big high end RHD.....no doubt! But they are hard to find! But just as important is team toughness and character, which I am not seeing! Twice........the Hughes high stick, and last night the Burroughs high stick......................no team reaction! None of any intensity, anyways! You just can not leave these type of incidents unanswered.............it spells out we are soft, to the league Yes, it does not help when the stupid refs under call the penalties, but the league has at least answered the severity issue by revisiting and giving additional punishment But that only underscores the severity of the incident, and the reaction of our team. I wonder how Evander Kane would have re-acted if it had happened to one of his team-mates, I wonder how DeAngelo would have reacted I mention them, because they both are the type of players who would react to these types of things, and who CDC was not remotely interested in......... Even though, both have not made any type of problems with their respective teams.........I mention them, because besides their aggressive nature, they are skilled and add to their teams competitiveness, in a positive way.............well liked? Who knows? Who cares! But I would bet they would have jumped in and I bet their team mates would have loved them for it. Too many on CDC want a gentlemen's team, and not a hard to play against team...............I look down the line up, and feel sorry for Schenn, and Myers, as there are just not enough of the regulars that will answer the call. I think a few of us have been emphasizing this and I think it has finally come to the realization for many. We have the skill, we just don't have the rest to allow the skill to flourish. You watch Hughes now and he is hesitant where he was not when he first began his NHL career. Same as Petey, Boeser etc. etc. the list goes on. I see Garland getting pummeled almost every shift now and this will affect his play too eventually. Some have mentioned "Pack Mentality" in the past, we need to see that from EVERY MEMBER OF THE TEAM! 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted October 18, 2022 Author Share Posted October 18, 2022 7 minutes ago, Warhippy said: lol...you're asking this knowing it's been absent since 2010-2011 The last time we had this on our team we had a roster that consisted of Albert Lapierre Burrows Hansen Kesler Rome Torres Volpatti You have to go a LONG ways back to find any sort of aggressiveness or the like on this team. hell, I have more tenacity in my stoll than the last decade of canucks line ups. I'm taking fibre for it but you get the idea Well WH, and in there lays the problem............they were basically on the last winning team........lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted October 18, 2022 Author Share Posted October 18, 2022 (edited) Far too often, an aggresive hockey player comes on the market, and CDC, says oh no, we can't take him............. Well, I can tell you first hand that when you have team-mates that will stand up for you, you play bigger, and with confidence Having watch both Kane and DeAngelo early this year, I seen no lack of team support, nor have I heard of any I am on them because A) every body was so down on them a year ago, and B ) they were basically free for the pickings at the time. Edited October 18, 2022 by J.I.A.H.N Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Strawbone Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 (edited) Fair or not, I'm resting this on the captain, and right now Bo is not the guy to lead this team to success. His "turn a blind eye" passive approach to the game is permeated through nearly the whole team. The Canucks are anything but hard to play against, and need new leadership. I do wonder how much coaching plays in to this. Are they being told to play passively to avoid dumb penalties? If a guy gets deliberately high-sticked in the face, I don't mind one bit if we take an extra penalty to show that we're not going to put up with crap like that. Edited October 18, 2022 by Strawbone 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
King Heffy Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 It's been a problem since the NHL's excessive penalty against Bertuzzi for doing what the league should have done by ensuring that Moore would cut out the cheapshots for good. Bert deserved the Masterton, not a suspension. 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
VegasCanuck Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 We have some good players, but we definitely do not have the right mix of players. Even if Myers was back tomorrow, we still don't really have the abrasiveness on defense that we really need. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
chon derry Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Sign some Ukrainians 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 15 minutes ago, Strawbone said: Fair or not, I'm resting this on the captain, and right now Bo is not the guy to lead this team to success. His "turn a blind eye" passive approach to the game is permeated through nearly the whole team. The Canucks are anything but hard to play against, and need new leadership. I do wonder how much coaching plays in to this. Are they being told to play passively to avoid dumb penalties? If a guy gets deliberately high-sticked in the face, I don't mind one bit if we take an extra penalty to show that we're not going to put up with crap like that. I don't know, I have heard that the letter on the jersey means nothing. I always thought that an army needs a general or officers to lead them and have some structure. How else do you get 23+ guys to be on the same page? Torts tried to lead them to War years ago and they all jumped ship. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Warhippy Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Just for reference. Most recent 3rd line for the Detroit Red Wings Soderblom: 21 years old 6'8" 249 pds. Rasmussen: 23 years old 6'6" 209 pds. Sundqvist: 28 years old 6'3" 209 pds Vs Suggested 3rd line for the Vancouver Canucks Kuzmenko: 26 years old 5'11" 194 pds Pettersson: 24 years old 6'2" 176 pds Lazar: 27 years old 6'0" 193 pds When you're facing that 3rd line, a traditional checking line in hockey. meant to grind, wear down and reduce scoring; which of those two third lines would you prefer to send out to achieve that? 1 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coconuts Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 (edited) 1 hour ago, Warhippy said: lol...you're asking this knowing it's been absent since 2010-2011 The last time we had this on our team we had a roster that consisted of Albert Lapierre Burrows Hansen Kesler Rome Torres Volpatti You have to go a LONG ways back to find any sort of aggressiveness or the like on this team. hell, I have more tenacity in my stoll than the last decade of canucks line ups. I'm taking fibre for it but you get the idea I think this post speaks to just how difficult it is to build a roster that has "tenacity", "toughness", "aggressiveness" and "heart" as part of it's culture. When discussions like this pop up the solution is often presented as trading x for x, or bringing in x when it's not enough to have a couple guys on the roster to play policeman. The roster you mentioned have plenty of guys willing to step up in Torres, Rome, Bieksa, and so on but also had guys like Kesler, Lapierre, Hansen, Burrows, and even Samuelsson who were willing to be involved in a tenacious style of play. It was most of the roster really. It's not enough to just parachute a couple of guys in an expect things to change. There were teams with similar cultures to us back then like the Bruins, Kings, and even the Blues. Those Blues teams were feisty, and dirty/favoured or not that Boston team had buy in from the roster. So did the Blues. Additions were made to those teams, including us, over time, but a lot of those players came up together and gradually developed their team culture. It's not something that changes on a dime. If the Canucks want that they'll have to build it, they'll have to develop it. It'll have to factor into drafting, developing, coaching, scouting, and player acquisition. I'm not sure injecting a couple of guys into a team is enough. Though it's worth noting that the game has changed since the mid to late 2000's and even the early 2010's. The game is different, how guys come up in minor leagues and lesser leagues is different, as is the NHL culture itself. Times have changed. Folks mythologize and crave what may have been more commonplace once upon a time but you don't really see teams built like that anymore. I think toughness, heart, and so on might just look different now. Or maybe we as fans have to adjust our expectations to how things have changed more. Edited October 18, 2022 by Coconuts 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
86Viking Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Sadly I don't think the Canucks will ever have that again, the league is different now and our "leader" was mentored by Henrik a former player who was soft as Charmin and hever had pushback. We have Schenn, why didn't he go after Kuz after that blatant baseeball swing to Burroughs face? Or Joshua, he seems to have size but is just another Pylon on the ice. You come to a new team and are suppose to bring grit and willing to fight and don't do it after Hughes gets hit in the face and Burroughs...tells me all I need to know about the team, don't seem to have each others back...or are too scared to go do something and take a penalty? Ya our PK sucks, Mikheyev ain't gonna change that on his own though. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 53 minutes ago, J.I.A.H.N said: Far too often, an aggresive hockey player comes on the market, and CDC, says oh no, we can't take him............. Well, I can tell you first hand that when you have team-mates that will stand up for you, you play bigger, and with confidence Having watch both Kane and DeAngelo early this year, I seen no lack of team support, nor have I heard of any I am on them because A) every body was so down on them a year ago, and B ) they were basically free for the pickings at the time. I don't think its a problem of not wanting an aggressive player, but why does it have to be a scumbag human/problem child? We can do this by finding or drafting more leaders like Getzlaff and Perry, as far as I know they were never accused of being racists or sex offenders. 1 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ghostsof1915 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 19 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Just for reference. Most recent 3rd line for the Detroit Red Wings Soderblom: 21 years old 6'8" 249 pds. Rasmussen: 23 years old 6'6" 209 pds. Sundqvist: 28 years old 6'3" 209 pds Vs Suggested 3rd line for the Vancouver Canucks Kuzmenko: 26 years old 5'11" 194 pds Pettersson: 24 years old 6'2" 176 pds Lazar: 27 years old 6'0" 193 pds When you're facing that 3rd line, a traditional checking line in hockey. meant to grind, wear down and reduce scoring; which of those two third lines would you prefer to send out to achieve that? I've been saying this for years. We're too busy looking for skill. But not for size and speed. Ideally you want all three, but I'll take size and speed, because it will at least make the team miserable to play against. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
J.I.A.H.N Posted October 18, 2022 Author Share Posted October 18, 2022 1 minute ago, JM_ said: I don't think its a problem of not wanting an aggressive player, but why does it have to be a scumbag human/problem child? We can do this by finding or drafting more leaders like Getzlaff and Perry, as far as I know they were never accused of being racists or sex offenders. For the future, Jimmy? Don't look now!!! LOL I have yet to see a game won from the dressing room! Seriously..............character is measure when the chips are down, not sucking on a beer, at an after party Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EdgarM Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 24 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Just for reference. Most recent 3rd line for the Detroit Red Wings Soderblom: 21 years old 6'8" 249 pds. Rasmussen: 23 years old 6'6" 209 pds. Sundqvist: 28 years old 6'3" 209 pds Vs Suggested 3rd line for the Vancouver Canucks Kuzmenko: 26 years old 5'11" 194 pds Pettersson: 24 years old 6'2" 176 pds Lazar: 27 years old 6'0" 193 pds When you're facing that 3rd line, a traditional checking line in hockey. meant to grind, wear down and reduce scoring; which of those two third lines would you prefer to send out to achieve that? This reminds me of Vegas's first team, big strong guys with tenacity who were very difficult to play against. They were pretty successful playing that way. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JM_ Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 1 minute ago, J.I.A.H.N said: For the future, Jimmy? Don't look now!!! LOL I have yet to see a game won from the dressing room! Seriously..............character is measure when the chips are down, not sucking on a beer, at an after party I agree with you on this J. I just don't think we need to scrape the bottom of the barrel. I was really hoping McTavish would drop to us, e.g., there's a kid that looks to be in the mold of what we need. I would have been happy to see Bischel drafted too, e.g. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DrJockitch Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 23 minutes ago, Warhippy said: Just for reference. Most recent 3rd line for the Detroit Red Wings Soderblom: 21 years old 6'8" 249 pds. Rasmussen: 23 years old 6'6" 209 pds. Sundqvist: 28 years old 6'3" 209 pds Vs Suggested 3rd line for the Vancouver Canucks Kuzmenko: 26 years old 5'11" 194 pds Pettersson: 24 years old 6'2" 176 pds Lazar: 27 years old 6'0" 193 pds When you're facing that 3rd line, a traditional checking line in hockey. meant to grind, wear down and reduce scoring; which of those two third lines would you prefer to send out to achieve that? That is a scoring line and picking the biggest line in the league and saying this is where we should be is somewhat dubious logic. We are small if we aren’t the biggest? Literally every other line in the league is small then. ‘Are we lacking size absolutely, big time, and skill and speed and depth. We are just lacking as a franchise atm. ‘it does need to be a draft and develop philosophy and it was one Benning thought he needed when the Kings won, but when the Hawks won we needed to be a skilled team. That man’s plan for the team was like a flag in a hurricane. ‘I don’t see Allvin as any better so far. He has made some moves to enhance these things but no different than Benning. If anything our top 9 looks smaller this year. Tell you Lekkerimaki is not fixing this. we need to prioritize size that can skate and right handed shots as part of our draft rankings and atm that seems way down the list. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nucker 67 Posted October 18, 2022 Share Posted October 18, 2022 Heart of a Lion Miller Pettersson Podkolzin Pearson Garland Hoglander Kuzmenko (?) Mikheyev (?) Hughes Schenn Burroughs Dermott Demko Build around these guys, and go back to the "skate" uniforms. Country Club - They can go anytime Horvat Boeser Myers Ekman-Larsson Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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